red panda

Really pleased with this, but OTIB is excelling itself tonight.  I think we've collectively forgotten what a loan means.  I don't recall it being a problem that we didn't have an option on Tammy, or lots of other players we've had on loan in the past.  And as for all the negative speculation about ulterior motives, desperation, etc - just get over yourselves.  We've signed a good player.  Even if we only have him for the rest of this seaons, it's a step forward.  

11 tickets on the OS

54 minutes ago, Andy082005 said:

I genuinely think it has already. We will finish between 12th-15th this season - which I think is completely unacceptable considering what Tweedle Dum and Tweedle Dee keep spouting on about 

8 seasons back in this league isn’t it? And it’s delivered absolutely no progress on the pitch whatsover

I know I’m a negative poster, and I know some times I can let my emotions rule my gob and I can spout some bollocks - but the way senior people at this club has behaved this season has absolutely infuriated me to the point that I genuinely don’t give a shit if it implodes and we tumble down to League 1 (please don’t get “I want” and “I don’t care “ mixed up. I don’t want us to go to League 1, I simply wouldn’t give a shit if we did)

They treat the fans like plebs. The fans of this club deserve so much better then what they have been given 

 

It's easy to forget that 8 seasons in the Championship is progress.  We've spent the last 40 years yo-yoing between the second and third tiers (or lower), spending more time in the third tier than the second, and sometimes surviving only a single year when we did manage to get into the second tier

6 hours ago, redkev said:

Going on our attendances over the last year or so and our away support especially this season at most ( not all games ) I have to admit I personally think it’s been pretty impressive

When you take into consideration how poor our form has been over the last 2-4 years with the club in the same division and pretty much treading water our attendances have held up very well . Any big game now be it cup , localish Derby ( as we ain’t had a proper Derby against the other lot for ages now ) the tickets seemed to be snapped up pretty much before getting to general sale every time ( take note if we ever get to prem ) why has our support held up and if not held up improved without taking steps forward on the pitch. Is Ashton gate a more pleasant match day experience for the average fan ( not the hardcore we want our east end back fan Ashton gate will never be the same for them me included ) or are we gaining more fans that would have gone to the blue few as we deffo seem higher profile than them now and obviously get better teams come to Ashton gate with better players and quality players . I’m pretty sure the way things are with our current fan base IF we did ever get to the prem in the near future all games would be a sellout and full allocation would be taken for every away game.
Your thoughts fellow reds 

 

As well as the stadium obviously, and even though it seems like some of the football hasn't been great, it's still Championship standard and we are playing against Championship teams.  It's easy to forget that between 1980 and 2015 we were yo-yoing between the second and third tiers (or worse ), spending more time in the third tier than the second.  As recently as 2014/15 we were playing league matches against the likes of Colchester, Rochdale, Scunthorpe, Fleetwood, Walsall and Crawley.  For potentially wavering supporters, we're still a much more attractive proposition than we were only a few ago 

13 minutes ago, chinapig said:

From Nick Ames in The Guardian:

Liam Manning has been talked about for some time as one of the country’s most promising young managers and the 38-year-old, a former manager of West Ham’s Under-23 side, gave a taste of his style on his return to east London. After a tentative start Bristol City were ambitious, slick and inventive, causing serious problems with their overloads out wide and rotations in the middle. It remains to be seen whether Manning, whose players clearly heeded his half-time call for bravery, can lead the Robins into the top six of a typically madcap second tier in which five points separate sixth spot from 14th, and there is certainly the sense they require more cutting edge. But Tommy Conway’s wonderfully worked equaliser seemed a sign of things to come and if Manning is backed, then perhaps he is the man to turbo-charge a club that routinely falls short of its considerable potential.

On a similar note, the BBC website report said "Liam Manning is still settling into the hot seat with Bristol City, taking charge in November, but the players appear to be taking well to his change in style".

Amazing how many Bristol Sport employees have infiltrated the mainstream media 

3 minutes ago, cidercity1987 said:

Cup game against lower league opposition, cheap tickets to fill the ground, there was inevitably more families than would otherwise be the case.

 

There were lots of excited small kids in West Ham kit with one or both parents in the Westfield shopping centre before the match. Tickets probably easier to get hold of (as well as cheaper), and probably thought they'd see lots of West Ham goals

Arrived 

4 hours ago, Sir Geoff said:

That's a myth. Show me a single Premier League club that doesn't lose money.

Sorry to be boring, but broadcast revenues are so high that many PL clubs are profitable.  So it's not a myth.

This research paper is quite recent but only uses data from the 2021/22 season and the general picture has improved quite a lot since then (I'm sure other posters can elobarate).  Fig 4 shows seven clubs with a positive "adjusted EBIT" in that particular year.  

It doesn't show a similar table for Championship clubs, but you can compare Figs 2 and 3 which show wages as a % of income (or Figs 5 and 6 which also take account of amortisation) and these clearly show Championship club finances in a far worse state than PL clubs.  The authors note that "overspending on wages is a prevalent strategy in a league whose successful teams get promoted to the Premier League".

22 minutes ago, pj76 said:

I have limited experience of this, but at Hull away this season people sat in their allocated seats. 

With this being a sell-out, and the likelihood of families attending I imagine people will be sitting in their allocated seats, especially with the rails. 

With a big away section completely sold out, it will be chaos if people don't sit in their allocated seats.  Groups arriving at the last minute will be looking for empty seats together, or eventually any empty seat at all (probably squeezed between two fat blokes).  Some might say it's their fault for not getting there earlier, but I doubt they'll see it that way (and nor should they) 

4 minutes ago, johnheadbcfc said:

Mehmeti getting the Fontaine and skuse treatment again I see 

Eh? He's indisputably had a poor first half, aren't we allowed to say that? 

33 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

I mean, all the evidence is on my posting history about my concerns of his playing style...

Ignore! 

I'm not sure what's the point of this thread.  As well as Alex Scott, could we have Brownhill, Decordova-Reid, Kelly and Semenyo back?  And perhaps Szmodics as well?

MANNING OUT!  Data are plural   Apart from that I don't see any problem at all

12 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

You're literally attempting to rewrite history. I know exactly the role Pearson played in that win against Boro. 

But even if we don't include the Boro game which would be ridiculous, but lets say we don't, it's then 2 wins and a draw from his first 5 games. Better than Manning and with a far inferior team. However this isn't about NP Vs LM. I used Pearson as an example that many managers go into clubs and deliver results instantly. 

Isn't an fa cup 5th round against Sheffield Utd a competitive game? 

Often this is simply due to mean reversion (look it up!) rather than anything to do with the new manager.  And when clubs are battling relegation they will often look specifically for a manager who they think can get quick results, even though they might not be the best long term option for the club.

In our case there was no burning platform, so no need for instant results.  What matters is whether LM is a good long term option for us, and it's far far far too early to tell,

With Neil gone, LM is now the 20th longest serving manager in the Championship!  Mark Robins is the only current manager who was appointed before Dec 2021.

18 minutes ago, Sir Geoff said:

Absolutely disagree with this. If you are leaving a successful job for a position elsewhere, it is on you to do your homework on the company you're about to join. Surely you would have someone researching what the opinion of the fans was regarding the sacking of the previous incumbent. You wouldn't rely solely on what your new bosses are saying. That is outright negligence.

If potential managers looked at fans forums before accepting a post, I'm not sure any club anywhere would ever manage to appoint a manager!

More seriously, even if LM was aware of the strong feelings of some fans, I would hope that he only accepted the job because he thought he could be a success here (otherwise why move from a job that's going well so early in his career?).  If he does reasonably well (and let's not extend the tedious debate about what that means), then that should get most fans on his side (perhaps not all - we can guess some of those who will never be converted).

This was probably too good an opportunity for him to turn down - an underperforming club with lots of potential, patient owners, a good base on which to build.  Not in any way negligent in my view.

8 hours ago, REDOXO said:

You say what you think fella. We have free speech and you can say what you think where you like

The overwhelming majority agree with you. Only Bristol city can bring in an untried lower league manager, throw money at him, which is clearly what is going to happen for Manning to get “his team” AGAIN and expect a different result. 

You are right. However they typically find a better club to get over it at!

Sorry to pick on this one, I could have picked many of the posts on here, most of which are nonsense on stilts.  Yes many fans were disappointed by Nige's departure, but the hyperbole on here is ridiculous and depressing:

• describing LM as an "untried lower league manager" makes it sound scary - but Oxford were only a handful of places below us, and he was only "untried" as he hadn't yet managed in the Championship (which was surely just a matter of time, whether with Oxford or another club).  And "only Bristol City" is so wrong that the error is visible from space, clubs do it all the time.  Millwall appointed Joe Edwards to his first real managerial appointment.  And think of Leeds taking Dave Hockaday from Forest Green if you want a really bad example of a genuine untested lower league manager!
• the idea that we are some sort of outlier is equally ridiculous.  As I've said on other posts, the stats show that compared to most other clubs we have a good record giving managers time, and that includes Nige.  Many feel hurt by his departure, but can you really deny that progress was slow, at least some of the football was pretty tedious, and Nige was talking to the press about internal matters - whether or not you agree with his points, going public was always going to hasten his exit.  And who knows whether or not his health problems were part of the story
• it's barely December, and we've already seen some much more ridiculous sackings by other clubs, Birmingham and Sunderland are the obvious examples.  Nine championship clubs have already sacked their managers this season.

LM wants to change some things, and that will take time.  I really wish we'd have a bit of patience.  It's absolutely true that changing managers is part and parcel of modern football.  And it actually happens here less often than at many clubs.

3 minutes ago, Fordy62 said:

Can’t argue with a finish like that. 

Hmm, James backed off him

42 minutes ago, Super said:

In fairness if its 0-0 tonight in injury time do you think we won't be wasting some time?

I hope not.  And please leave fairness out of it, this is OTIB FFS 

Karma for a keeper playing silly buggers and a pretty pathetic team.  Totally his fault for letting go of the ball after throwing himself to the ground.  Why were Wycombe time wasting in injury time when the score was still 0-0?  Imagine if you travelled all the way up to Barnsley on a freezing midweek evening to watch your team give up trying to win.  Is a bore draw at Oakwell really the height of their ambitions??  Deserve everything they got 

2 minutes ago, Silvio Dante said:

Well. That was an odd old game.

First things first - three points against Boro is an undoubted good result. However, there is a large part of me that sees it as achieved in spite of what we were doing as opposed to what we were doing.

That first 35 minutes were as bored as I’ve been at Ashton Gate for years - I’m talking Osman era bored. I have no objection to, and am more than happy to, play out from the back. But that wasn’t that. It was safe, 90-10 risk balls across the back line (and even then we got caught a couple of times). Two incidents epitomised that period - when TGH turned and played backwards and was roundly booed, and when Sykes, on the right and looking for a pass, threw his arms up in exasperation as there were no options. Literally, our only out option appeared to be a Dickie carry, and it was awful with no penetration even in the middle let alone the final third.
Tactically, I’m not sure that a plan is for your CM to hit a 30 yard worldie every game, but post that it was positive because we played front foot pressing for the last 10 - and were a better side because of it.

Half time in the ground the consensus was that we were lucky. And when the two goals came in quick succession (again by some bad playing out from the back) there was another muted shout against Lansdown.

The base issue is this. We have a side and squad built for a high tempo pressing game. When we do that - and when we did that today - we can be very good. However, we tried to play a passive, stand off game which is nowhere near our strength- and other sides are better than us at it. Boro waited first half and just picked off the errors as we played far too slow.

In the end, sheer bloody mindedness got us through (and a quality Sykes finish). But it wasn’t great. Safe for the bits we did what we’re good at.
 

Liam is getting used to the team and the club. The club historically have never accepted negative football which is what that was to start with and against QPR - so hopefully he’s learnt that. More pertinently, hopefully he’s learnt that as a coach you may have a philosophy but if other teams have the same philosophy- and players more versed in executing that - you end up with that 35 minutes. However, if you play to the squad strengths, there is a real chance of success.

 

I'm not sure we played a stand off game - when we didn't have the ball I thought we were pressing.  The big difference is what we do when we have the ball - more emphasis on keeping possession rather than hoofing in the general direction of Bell or Sykes.  It will take time for us to get better at attacking under this new approach.  Hopefully we'll get there, and it's probably a better basis for us to progress long term (it's pretty risky to rely on counterattacking when you're playing against decent teams)

8 minutes ago, Bristol Rob said:

He isn't that convincing a subject when faced with a microphone.

Not sure what you want him to say, thought he was quite sensible

4 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

What defines what a top 6 side should play and look like? 

Are we top 2? No. Top 4? No. 5th and 6th tho? 

1.5 points per game was enough to get Sunderland and Coventry in the play offs last season. 

Give it a rest Nige