Doing A Swansea...

[spudski]

After watching the masterclass, that was Barcelona last night, it crossed my mind that Swansea took the 'Risky' step of trying to develop their Club by introducing a Spanish/Portugese influence. After a few seasons, it has really benefited them, and by all accounts, the Clubs youth system is being run, to a very similar philosphy to which Barca and many other Spanish Clubs run.

Do you think Bristol City fans would embrace this kind of thing, if it were ever to be contemplated by us?

It may take a few years for any benefits to be seen...but in the long run, who knows?

Personally... I look at us, and we are going down the same route as every other 'wannabe' Club in our division. Using the same sort of style, methods and tactics as everyone else. It's a gamble, that unless we are given a huge injection of money, will see us floating around in this division for a while, hovering between relegation and a play off spot...we could go on for years like this imho.

I admire and applaud what Swansea have tried to do...something different on a limited budget.

I'd love us to do the same, even if it meant a whole new set up.

There are managers out there, that would love to ply their trade over here.

Juan Manuel Lillo is one. There are many others of his ilk.

Do you think it would ever be excepted here?...Swansea fna seem to love what's happening to them.

[Redcliffe 78]

gYou got to have the players to do this, but Barcelona U9 play like the first team and you have to have this at every level, there B team play in the Spanish second division (Championshion our league), they finished third, obviousley they can't go up, i know we can't do thinks like that in this country but teach the kids young and Millen has done all the FIFA badges and he knows the way forward is playing the ball on the floor, pass and move, when i'm with my eight yr nephew pass and move, tackling is natural, the sooner we get this into English football the better.

[Mr Popodopolous]

I'd be very happy for us to go down this road. It would require patience, not the sort of thing which could be implemented overnight but if we stuck at it at youth development level for say a decade, taught the Barcelona way then that would IMO be very desireable.

Things like controlling and distributing the ball in a maximum of 3 touches, pressing in training- i.e. 3, 4 players passing the ball in triangles, with 2 or 3 around them trying to disrupt flow. As I say it'd require a lot of patience but we would surely reap the benefits in the long term.

[glynriley]

Firstly , how do you know that Juan Manuel Lillo wants to manage over here? Could we even attract him if he did?

Anyway , I think most City fans would welcome a system that means the club could develop players from a young age. We really dont know what Keith Millen's philosphy is regarding such a system. He seems very keen on developing the under 21 team so maybe this is a starting point and will gradually filter it's way down through the age groups.

I wasn't keen on KM getting the job initially , but he now has a real opportunity to shape the club and he should be given the chance. I would suggest that bringing Wigley on board was with youth development in mind.

Do we need a foreign coach to do this? Who knows?

[Redcliffe 78]

Firstly , how do you know that Juan Manuel Lillo wants to manage over here? Could we even attract him if he did?

Anyway , I think most City fans would welcome a system that means the club could develop players from a young age. We really dont know what Keith Millen's philosphy is regarding such a system. He seems very keen on developing the under 21 team so maybe this is a starting point and will gradually filter it's way down through the age groups.

I wasn't keen on KM getting the job initially , but he now has a real opportunity to shape the club and he should be given the chance. I would suggest that bringing Wigley on board was with youth development in mind.

Do we need a foreign coach to do this? Who knows?

Millen has been to alot of top clubs in England & aboard to see there training methords, Wigley i think will be a great appointment in the years to come, he has got his ear in, he is coaching with Pearce the cream of the crop coming up, we will be getting good young players on loan, every side who have gone up from this division in the last three years have had good loan players to make this happen.

[spudski]

Firstly , how do you know that Juan Manuel Lillo wants to manage over here? Could we even attract him if he did?

Anyway , I think most City fans would welcome a system that means the club could develop players from a young age. We really dont know what Keith Millen's philosphy is regarding such a system. He seems very keen on developing the under 21 team so maybe this is a starting point and will gradually filter it's way down through the age groups.

I wasn't keen on KM getting the job initially , but he now has a real opportunity to shape the club and he should be given the chance. I would suggest that bringing Wigley on board was with youth development in mind.

Do we need a foreign coach to do this? Who knows?

Through a relationship, I know an agent from Spain that deals with many of the players that come over to here. His father was a friend of Johan Cruyff and he was instrumental in getting him through the door so to speak. One of his first clients was Jordi Cruyff. Through him, he's told me about Lillo and others.

[glynriley]

Fair enough. However , looking at his record I think I'd rather stick with Millen.

It would be interesting to know the thoughts of others based on his record. Quite a few sackings and relegations on his CV.

It's not clear what his idea's are regarding youth development , but he doesn't seem to stay anywhre for long enough.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juan_Manuel_Lillo

[redsince1994]

Who of our players (this season) could play in that way though.

I think only:

Spence and Caulker.

Skuse. I know he isn't loved on here but he could definitely play a Busquets-esque role.

Adomah.

Maynard and Pitman. I think that they would benefit from it (especially Pitman).

[Robbored]

Who of our players (this season) could play in that way though.

I think only:

Spence and Caulker.

Skuse. I know he isn't loved on here but he could definitely play a Busquets-esque role.

Adomah.

Maynard and Pitman. I think that they would benefit from it (especially Pitman).

Its not a question of what players could play that way, its a complete change of philosophy and takes not only commitment from all the football people at the club but also a belief that its the way forward and an understanding that it won't work overnight. Its taken the Jacks 5 years to get where they are now. I hope they get promoted.

Personally I'd be delighted if Millen wanted to adopt a more continental philosophy throughout the club. That said, Millen has spent his entire football career in the English league's and although he's a bright cookie I do wonder whether he'd have the belief to try and change the system in the way Martinez did at Swansea. Martinez is a Spaniard after all and understands the 'continental way' better than any English manager.

[Fiale]

I was going to make a thread on something similar - how would most City fans like to see the team play ?

Whilst watching Barca play is exciting, if for example two Barca teams were to meet it would essentially be like Italian top flight football in the 90's. Lots of movement, standing off, pressing in key parts of the pitch, passing back, keeping possession, try again - when one team plays like this and creates chances it's great stuff, when 2 do it becomes a snore fest.

I would like to see us play a more possession game, simply keeping the ball, nothing on ? pass back to the defender/keeper and try again, I hate these 20yard + plus balls forward hoping for a 50-50 touch to possible retain the ball.

Do we have the players for this ? Possibly some, but the only way to find out is to change the style, can they play, adapt to it ? If so great, if some cannot then we need to look for replacements, if the philosophy is in the academies, then we should have young players coming through, able to slot in when current struggling players contracts expire in 2-3 years time.

Will we do this ? I have no idea, I still am not 100% of Millen's chosen style. I see a 3 at the back mentality at times which I feel is a mistake, four at the back with 2 wide players very high up the pitch and the rest dominating the centre of midfield is the way to go.

Anyway - will be interesting to see, Champions league here we comeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

[chinapig]

After watching the masterclass, that was Barcelona last night, it crossed my mind that Swansea took the 'Risky' step of trying to develop their Club by introducing a Spanish/Portugese influence. After a few seasons, it has really benefited them, and by all accounts, the Clubs youth system is being run, to a very similar philosphy to which Barca and many other Spanish Clubs run.

Do you think Bristol City fans would embrace this kind of thing, if it were ever to be contemplated by us?

It may take a few years for any benefits to be seen...but in the long run, who knows?

Personally... I look at us, and we are going down the same route as every other 'wannabe' Club in our division. Using the same sort of style, methods and tactics as everyone else. It's a gamble, that unless we are given a huge injection of money, will see us floating around in this division for a while, hovering between relegation and a play off spot...we could go on for years like this imho.

I admire and applaud what Swansea have tried to do...something different on a limited budget.

I'd love us to do the same, even if it meant a whole new set up.

There are managers out there, that would love to ply their trade over here.

Juan Manuel Lillo is one. There are many others of his ilk.

Do you think it would ever be excepted here?...Swansea fna seem to love what's happening to them.

I have my doubts. While complaining about our defenders hoofing the ball hopefully forward (and rightly so) if we pass the ball backwards or sideways a few times in order to keep possession the moans and cries of "get rid of it" soon start (and where else but England would fans want a player to get rid of the ball for the sake fo it?). In more general terms there is the English obsession with the big centre forward, regarded as essential by many. However we do not really know what Keith's philosophy is. Would he like to emulate Swansea (and why would he not given it works and is good to watch?) or is a he conventional, wanting a rigid 4-4-2, lots of high balls hoping for knockdowns and breaks in the box? It would be interesting to know. If we want to play the Swansea way we would have to replace most of our defence imo as they are not comfortable with the ball; ironically James Wilson is probably the best in that respect but will have little chance of getting a game I suspect; which perhaps tells us something about Keith's approach after all.

But the whole project would need someone of real quality running the Academy; unfortunately it has been a case of Buggins' turn up to now. That is a role where splashing out big wages to get a really good person would pay off long term. I find it ironic when Steve demands more of the Academy but employs any old jobsworth to run it. It's the most importamt job in the club for our long term future but you wouldn't think it.

[redsince1994]

Its not a question of what players could play that way, its a complete change of philosophy and takes not only commitment from all the football people at the club but also a belief that its the way forward and an understanding that it won't work overnight. Its taken the Jacks 5 years to get where they are now. I hope they get promoted.

Personally I'd be delighted if Millen wanted to adopt a more continental philosophy throughout the club. That said, Millen has spent his entire football career in the English league's and although he's a bright cookie I do wonder whether he'd have the belief to try and change the system in the way Martinez did at Swansea. Martinez is a Spaniard after all and understands the 'continental way' better than any English manager.

Yeah I agree with you. I'm not against the idea at all. I'm just trying to make the point that we'd need to completely remake our team. I mean imagine trying to make Marv play like Iniesta....

[Chappers]

I thought that was the plan when the Academy was set up many years ago, but a combination of short-term needs, an open Chairmans wallet, and a manager who had no interest in the Academy put paid to that. It is obviously the way to go, and many of us have been banging on about it for years, it's a pity that it takes so much wasted money and so many wasted years for the penny to finally drop. The other aspect of Swansea is that they have made some very shrewd purchases, and made the best of the players they have.

It is beginning to look like we are finally looking at Plan B, now that the plan of packing the squad with experienced, but limited journeymen on high wages, has finally been found to be unsustainable. Let's just hope that Club and fans have the patience needed.

[Robbored]

However we do not really know what Keith's philosophy is. Would he like to emulate Swansea (and why would he not given it works and is good to watch?) or is a he conventional, wanting a rigid 4-4-2, lots of high balls hoping for knockdowns and breaks in the box? It would be interesting to know. If we want to play the Swansea way we would have to replace most of our defence imo as they are not comfortable with the ball; ironically James Wilson is probably the best in that respect but will have little chance of getting a game I suspect; which perhaps tells us something about Keith's approach after all.

I think we saw enough last season to know that Millen likes to play entertaining, attacking football and that the remorseless long balls 'into the channels' we saw under Johnson became less and less of a feature. He used two wingers in almost every game and had he had better quality in midfield and defence then City could have been a top six team. So far he hasn't signed a 'target man' which as far I'm concerned is a good sign. It certainly shows a different way of approaching the game.

He publically endorsed youth development and I'm optimistic we'll see more inexperienced players given the opportunity to force their way into the starting 11.

What players he brings in this summer will be an indication of how he plans to play next season but I'm confident we'll see much the same style as last season but with a stronger defence and midfield.

[chinapig]

I think we saw enough last season to know that Millen likes to play entertaining, attacking football and that the remorseless long balls 'into the channels' we saw under Johnson became less and less of a feature. He used two wingers in almost every game and had he had better quality in midfield and defence then City could have been a top six team. So far he hasn't signed a 'target man' which as far I'm concerned is a good sign. It certainly shows a different way of approaching the game.

He publically endorsed youth development and I'm optimistic we'll see more inexperienced players given the opportunity to force their way into the starting 11.

What players he brings in this summer will be an indication of how he plans to play next season but I'm confident we'll see much the same style as last season but with a stronger defence and midfield.

The long hoof forward is still the default option for our defenders. Sure there have been some positive developments, but to my knowledge Keith has never explicitly set out his philosophy. I'd like to hear him do so. But I wouldn't bank on the young players bit, Keith having offered Carey a new deal and thereby further blocking Wilson's route into the starting lineup still baffles me and contradicts the approach he said he would take to reducing the squad and making it younger. So another reason why I'd like to hear of a clear and consistent philosophy.

[Jordan Tansley]

am I the only one who finds the "Barca way" rather dull? I only ever feel my arse lift off my seat when Messi goes on a mazy run or when Villa slots one in the top corner.

At City however there are plenty of fifty fifty challenges, counter attacking fast flowing football, crosses into the box, wing play, mistakes and long distance strikes. I would much rather watch that, in all honesty. Love the british game, the rough and tumble of lower league football is what the game is all about, none of this namby pamby diving and waving fake cards about.

Be nice if a few of our lads could pass the ball 5 yards though, but beggars cant be choosers!

[Chivs]

I cannot tell you how frustrated I get with this concept of "continental football". Is it really continental to be able to control the ball first time and pass it to a team mate with the second touch which is always along the ground. I see this as the basis of football. The absolute fundamental principles on which all football should be played.

But our team, and all teams in the UK apart from the top 4 in the Premiershit, can't manage to control a football, and feel obliged to launch it 60 yards at every opportunity.

What are the youth academies in this country doing? And why are so called experts letting them get away with it? England will never get remotely close to winning a tournament if we continue to "hoof it".

I've mentioned before that I cannot understand why Elliot's first touch is so poor. Surely this is the first skill a professional footballer needs?

It all seems so blindingly obvious that I guess I am missing something....

[Garland-sweden]

After watching the masterclass, that was Barcelona last night, it crossed my mind that Swansea took the 'Risky' step of trying to develop their Club by introducing a Spanish/Portugese influence. After a few seasons, it has really benefited them, and by all accounts, the Clubs youth system is being run, to a very similar philosphy to which Barca and many other Spanish Clubs run.

Do you think Bristol City fans would embrace this kind of thing, if it were ever to be contemplated by us?

It may take a few years for any benefits to be seen...but in the long run, who knows?

Personally... I look at us, and we are going down the same route as every other 'wannabe' Club in our division. Using the same sort of style, methods and tactics as everyone else. It's a gamble, that unless we are given a huge injection of money, will see us floating around in this division for a while, hovering between relegation and a play off spot...we could go on for years like this imho.

I admire and applaud what Swansea have tried to do...something different on a limited budget.

I'd love us to do the same, even if it meant a whole new set up.

There are managers out there, that would love to ply their trade over here.

Juan Manuel Lillo is one. There are many others of his ilk.

Do you think it would ever be excepted here?...Swansea fna seem to love what's happening to them.

[Garland-sweden]

After watching the masterclass, that was Barcelona last night, it crossed my mind that Swansea took the 'Risky' step of trying to develop their Club by introducing a Spanish/Portugese influence. After a few seasons, it has really benefited them, and by all accounts, the Clubs youth system is being run, to a very similar philosphy to which Barca and many other Spanish Clubs run.

Do you think Bristol City fans would embrace this kind of thing, if it were ever to be contemplated by us?

It may take a few years for any benefits to be seen...but in the long run, who knows?

Personally... I look at us, and we are going down the same route as every other 'wannabe' Club in our division. Using the same sort of style, methods and tactics as everyone else. It's a gamble, that unless we are given a huge injection of money, will see us floating around in this division for a while, hovering between relegation and a play off spot...we could go on for years like this imho.

I admire and applaud what Swansea have tried to do...something different on a limited budget.

I'd love us to do the same, even if it meant a whole new set up.

There are managers out there, that would love to ply their trade over here.

Juan Manuel Lillo is one. There are many others of his ilk.

Do you think it would ever be excepted here?...Swansea fna seem to love what's happening to them.

I think that Millen is on the right track. Some goals have come from quick passes and overlaps on the floor. And after the game KM said thats the way we wants to play.

[Robbored]

What are the youth academies in this country doing? And why are so called experts letting them get away with it? England will never get remotely close to winning a tournament if we continue to "hoof it".

I've mentioned before that I cannot understand why Elliot's first touch is so poor. Surely this is the first skill a professional footballer needs?

It all seems so blindingly obvious that I guess I am missing something....

Its youth academies that churn out players with the aim of finding them a professional club which means that they hone the skills that will be attractive in the English game.. Good, basic skills, strength and stamina. Cute balls skills are desired but not essential.

I read somewhere recently that Dutch and Spanish youth players ( aged 8-14) often train with a ball thats smaller and heavier than a regular ball. It doesn't bounce as much. They also don't wear different strips during practice games. They all wear the same. The reason? To encourage them to look up with the ball at their feet. They have to recognise their team mates. Simple but brilliant.

Do we do the same in England? Not as far I know.

[Garland-sweden]

Its youth academies that churn out players with the aim of finding them a professional club which means that they hone the skills that will be attractive in the English game.. Good, basic skills, strength and stamina. Cute balls skills are desired but not essential.

I read somewhere recently that Dutch and Spanish youth players ( aged 8-14) often train with a ball thats smaller and heavier than a regular ball. It doesn't bounce as much. They also don't wear different strips during practice games. They all wear the same. The reason? To encourage them to look up with the ball at their feet. They have to recognise their team mates. Simple but brilliant.

Do we do the same in England? Not as far I know.

Also in Brazil.

[Redcliffe 78]

Its youth academies that churn out players with the aim of finding them a professional club which means that they hone the skills that will be attractive in the English game.. Good, basic skills, strength and stamina. Cute balls skills are desired but not essential.

I read somewhere recently that Dutch and Spanish youth players ( aged 8-14) often train with a ball thats smaller and heavier than a regular ball. It doesn't bounce as much. They also don't wear different strips during practice games. They all wear the same. The reason? To encourage them to look up with the ball at their feet. They have to recognise their team mates. Simple but brilliant.

Do we do the same in England? Not as far I know.

8-14 train with smaller and heavier balls than the regular ball, i give up on you good luck.

[Riaz]

One thing is for sure, Millen wouldn't be capable of producing such football

[Nibor]

One thing is for sure, Millen wouldn't be capable of producing such football

Nor's Alex Ferguson. Give it a ******* rest.

[Robbored]

One thing is for sure, Millen wouldn't be capable of producing such football

He's far more likely to at least try to produce such football than any of his predecessors.

You always overlook the fact that Millen is a bright and forward thinking young manager who has the full backing of the clubs chairman and owner.

One day you'll actually have to admit that Millen has done a good job

[NOTR]

am I the only one who finds the "Barca way" rather dull? I only ever feel my arse lift off my seat when Messi goes on a mazy run or when Villa slots one in the top corner.

At City however there are plenty of fifty fifty challenges, counter attacking fast flowing football, crosses into the box, wing play, mistakes and long distance strikes. I would much rather watch that, in all honesty. Love the british game, the rough and tumble of lower league football is what the game is all about, none of this namby pamby diving and waving fake cards about.

Be nice if a few of our lads could pass the ball 5 yards though, but beggars cant be choosers!

This

[Redcliffe 78]

He's far more likely to at least try to produce such football than any of his predecessors.

You always overlook the fact that Millen is a bright and forward thinking young manager who has the full backing of the clubs chairman and owner.

One day you'll actually have to admit that Millen has done a good job

With balls that don't bounce the same, City take on players now at ten, but the balls bounce different. Millen will lead us to the Prem i think with Wigley in THREE years we can do this.

[Riaz]

He's far more likely to at least try to produce such football than any of his predecessors.

You always overlook the fact that Millen is a bright and forward thinking young manager who has the full backing of the clubs chairman and owner.

One day you'll actually have to admit that Millen has done a good job

You may spunk in your pants every game - but I havent been impressed by the football - which has largely been........ give the ball to albert.

He has done a decent job thus far, but he is tatically inept...... I certainly dont think he's forward thinking...

Time will tell though.... one thing is for sure - if YOU rate him, he's not likely to be any good!

[Matty-H]

I don't buy into this continental way myth at all. Someone has jumped on this and ran with it as if it's some sort of fundamentally different way of playing the game. It isn't. It's just good football; passing, moving, using the whole pitch and bringing your team mates into the game.

To do the above you need a side of good passing players. Intuitive players with a good footballing brain. It's not some new formation or style, it's just good sides full of good individuals playing football the way it's meant to be played. We can sit here and over-analyse it because someone gave it a name (continental) but the facts are its just basic football carried out to the best standard

[Riaz]

am I the only one who finds the "Barca way" rather dull? I only ever feel my arse lift off my seat when Messi goes on a mazy run or when Villa slots one in the top corner.

At City however there are plenty of fifty fifty challenges, counter attacking fast flowing football, crosses into the box, wing play, mistakes and long distance strikes. I would much rather watch that, in all honesty. Love the british game, the rough and tumble of lower league football is what the game is all about, none of this namby pamby diving and waving fake cards about.

Be nice if a few of our lads could pass the ball 5 yards though, but beggars cant be choosers!

agreed jordan.

clearly they are by far the best team in the world - but I find the slow tempo boring at times.