Doing A Swansea...

[Robbored]

Your criticism was unfounded and lies. There isn't a forum member who agrees with, surely the self professed "sage" can do the math there?

Lies and unfounded that he was an abrasive bully? Lies and unfounded that he blamed everyone but himself? Lies and unfounded that he signed all those crap loanee's, lies and unfounded that he didn't strenghthen after the play-off final. Lies and unfounded that for almost two season's the football was dull, predicable and turgid?

Don't think so.....

[Jordan Tansley]

Lies and unfounded that he was an abrasive bully? Lies and unfounded that he blamed everyone but himself? Lies and unfounded that he signed all those crap loanee's, lies and unfounded that he didn't strenghthen after the play-off final. Lies and unfounded that for almost two season's the football was dull, predicable and turgid?

Don't think so.....

Alex Ferguson is a "bully", Danny Wilson is a "nice guy"

Johnson changed the entire ethos of the club, he gave us a winning mentality, gave us a club to be proud of. You were the only one whining like a spoilt child.

As someone who has a heightened sense of self importance, how does it feel to know that the man you hate so much is loved by the vast majority of City fans and has done more good for this club than you could ever? Infact, the only influence you have ever had on the club you love is a damaging and fractious one.

Your Children must be very proud.

[spudski]

Out of interest, why did you use Lillo as an example? Although he started his managerial career well, hes been pretty unremarkable since the mid 90's? Not having a dig or anything, just thought it was a funny example? As for your original point, i personally feel we are making the right steps with the academy at the minute, but we really do need to make better use of it. Going to a 'continental' style of management at the club could well be good in the future, at the moment, Millen is doing fine, but if/when he goes it could be a good change of pace for the club.

Only because as i said in an earlier post in this thread, that he was mentioned in conversation with someone I know. He like's a challenge and has taken over at Clubs who were often struggling in the first place. He is well thought of amongst managers in Spain.

I see no reason why the Academy could not be set up and run by Spanish coaches using Spanish training methods. A gradual introduction could be used. It can't be any worse than what we've been doing for the last 30 years. Why not try something new? It's not working at the moment and hasn't been for a long time. It's working at Swansea and the British lads there have benefited from the training methods. All done on a budget too.

Arsenal have implemented a fusion of traditional English play, with a 'Faster' Continental style...and argueably it's one of the most attractive forms of football to watch and gets a certain amount of results. I know i'd rather watch Arsenal every week than Manure or Chelsea.

And the same for Swansea at this level...for me they are a delight to watch. At least they are trying something different and it's great to watch it's evolution.

[glynriley]

Spudski , not sure what your fascination with foreign coaches is ,are you an agent?

By the way ,Swansea's youth coach is Tony Pennock ,the ex Yeovil goalkeeper.

http://www.thisissouthwales.co.uk/news/Pennock-defends-club-s-youth-set/article-2325081-detail/article.html

[InCider]

Riaz, Some have compared your constant critism of Millen as on par with my critism of Johnson in the past. However I see a big difference. My critism of Johnson was based on what I saw on the pitch and information that was coming from the dressing room and how GJ behaved behind the scenes. In other words my critism of Johnson was based on facts and nothing else.

Not so with your critism of Millen which its clear to see is based on nothing more than he wasn't your choice of manager.

Why don't you just look at what he achieved last season in from a difficult start, with most agree was an under strength squad. He developed a side capable of holding its own in the Championship despite a horrendous injury list for virtually all of the season and yet, despite evidence to the contrary you still believe that he's not capable of making City into a good team.

His metal will tested next season when all the summer dealings are sown up and he has the players to build and improve from last season.

You can't really compare your and Riaz's respective views of the 2 managers. Riaz is sceptical that we will do well under Millen. Of course I hope he will be proven wrong, but that's his view based on tactics chosen by Millen over the season. It is not a personal dislike of the man. I'm sure Riaz would also want to be proven wrong and if we were making significant progress that he would be open to a change of mind. Your situation with GJ though was a personal dislike almost from the start of his reign. Did you change your opinions when he took us from relegation contenders to just missing out on the play-offs? Did you change your mind the following season when we gained promotion to the Championship? Did you change your mind when we almost made it into the Prem after our first season in the Championship? You seem oblivious to these facts, which are arguably the most important ones. I think most people accept that by the time he was sacked, it was probably time for him to leave, but please don't feel that you can completely re-write history and ignore his many achievements here.

[mozo]

Strange though it sounds, the best passing football by City in recent times came during the Danny Wilson era.

Wilson arrived having a reputation of making Barnsley play like 'Brazil' and we were delighted to have a manage to continue the philosophy of playing football that we were proud of (despite Pulis' best efforts to ruin this).

Being a big club in league one meant that most opponents would come and defend, hoping for a point. We would dominate possession and pass our way around them, hoping for a breakthrough. Often fans would moan that we weren't direct enough.

Gary Johnson turned us into a winning team, which we should all be eternally grateful for, but he never instilled attractive football.

Now, it seems like we play a bit ad-hoc.

I remember how we used to pass it around the back, then Tinnion would send a 40 yard cross-field ball to Murray who would hare in and do some damage...

[Redcliffe 78]

Of out know for a pint of the black stuff, Shane Long first goalscorer, shit i should of put that in general sport. Wish you all a good afternoon fellow reds.

[Mr Popodopolous]

Real Madrid tried buying up all the great players not so long ago with their 'Galactico's' team. It didn't work.

Agree with the rest of your post, but on this- where Real Madrid went wrong was sacking Del Bosque- because he wasn't flashy enough, wasn't a big enough name. He was the most successful manager they'd had in 50 years at least. The second big mistake was to sell Makelele, again as the board deemed him to not be spectacular enough.Totally wrecked the balance of that side etc.

[Tony Montana]

The way Swansea play is brilliant, at Ashton Gate they were just patient knocking the ball around back and forth a bit like Barcelona. If we could emulate this it would be amazing, i would love to watch us! However at times last season when we were passing the ball around nicely in midfielder but not really threatening the opposition goal, you get fans moaning at the team to 'Get it up there', why do some fans think you should have to try and score as soon as you get the ball, i think they love the long ball hoof game with some fat guy up front to knock it down- how boring is that!

People say we havnt got the players to play like Swansea, the guy who gets the ball being passed around in midfield is Leon Britton, they bought him for £60,000, whatta bargain huh?

[spudski]

[Mr Popodopolous]

I have my doubts. While complaining about our defenders hoofing the ball hopefully forward (and rightly so) if we pass the ball backwards or sideways a few times in order to keep possession the moans and cries of "get rid of it" soon start (and where else but England would fans want a player to get rid of the ball for the sake fo it?). In more general terms there is the English obsession with the big centre forward, regarded as essential by many. However we do not really know what Keith's philosophy is. Would he like to emulate Swansea (and why would he not given it works and is good to watch?) or is a he conventional, wanting a rigid 4-4-2, lots of high balls hoping for knockdowns and breaks in the box? It would be interesting to know. If we want to play the Swansea way we would have to replace most of our defence imo as they are not comfortable with the ball; ironically James Wilson is probably the best in that respect but will have little chance of getting a game I suspect; which perhaps tells us something about Keith's approach after all.

But the whole project would need someone of real quality running the Academy; unfortunately it has been a case of Buggins' turn up to now. That is a role where splashing out big wages to get a really good person would pay off long term. I find it ironic when Steve demands more of the Academy but employs any old jobsworth to run it. It's the most importamt job in the club for our long term future but you wouldn't think it.

Agree totally with this post.

[Mr Popodopolous]

Could you imagine the fans reaction when the team prepares for kick off,

'Goal keeper...ok, Left Back, two centre backs, right back good, good.... wait - what the ****, get a grip where's our ***** strikers, get a ****** clue, ******* **** manager, seriously 2 high wide players and a packed midfield, who the **** do you think we are you **** stupid ****** ******, go and **** off, I can't beleive this ****"

best stick to the 4-4-2 as I can guarantee your average fan aint for change....

You're probably right, but it would be nice.

[Lita For Congo]

Only because as i said in an earlier post in this thread, that he was mentioned in conversation with someone I know. He like's a challenge and has taken over at Clubs who were often struggling in the first place. He is well thought of amongst managers in Spain.

I see no reason why the Academy could not be set up and run by Spanish coaches using Spanish training methods. A gradual introduction could be used. It can't be any worse than what we've been doing for the last 30 years. Why not try something new? It's not working at the moment and hasn't been for a long time. It's working at Swansea and the British lads there have benefited from the training methods. All done on a budget too.

Arsenal have implemented a fusion of traditional English play, with a 'Faster' Continental style...and argueably it's one of the most attractive forms of football to watch and gets a certain amount of results. I know i'd rather watch Arsenal every week than Manure or Chelsea.

And the same for Swansea at this level...for me they are a delight to watch. At least they are trying something different and it's great to watch it's evolution.

Thats fair enough mate i did go back and saw that post you mentioned. I just feel that he's flattered to decieve for a good few years now and although i agree with your point, i just felt it was a strange example although someone of that ilk, although a risk, could turn into a master stroke.

Im very interested in Glenn Hoddle's project with Jerez and how we could maybe get involved with their methods and getting a player link up with them. We English are tactically niave i feel, any young lad playing today only knows the basic 4-4-2 and when asked to play, for example, the 'vogue' formation at the moment of 4-2-3-1, some youngsters wouldn't be able to grasp what was needed of them in this system because of the rigid way coaches teaches young lads in this country, something i have noticed 1st hand.

I do agree with your point of going down the 'continental' way of thinking. It seems like a successful way of doing things. It would be quite difficult and time consuming to implement it from say, under 9's to 1st team, but if the costs involved were realistic, it would go a long way to being 'self-sufficient' as SL and now CS wants us to be. I think personally that for all the potiental we have with our academy, we get very little use out of it, i hope that will now change and we can have a clear out of our academy staff, with maybe Clayton staying, and all the 'jobs for the boys' attitude stopped, so like you say, we can maybe hire the calibre of 'continental' coach you mention.

If you look at the German model of doing things, rather than perhaps the Spanish way, it could well be a realistic way of doing things for not only clubs like us, but through the FA as a whole. On a side note, something that bothers me about the mentality of English players, why do youngsters who get released not have a go abroad? They would learn alot about themselves and the way the game is played. Maybe it the money involved or lack of ambition, but its something that has well and truelly puzzled me for a good while.

[Mr Popodopolous]

We English are tactically niave i feel, any young lad playing today only knows the basic 4-4-2 and when asked to play, for example, the 'vogue' formation at the moment of 4-2-3-1, some youngsters wouldn't be able to grasp what was needed of them in this system because of the rigid way coaches teaches young lads in this country, something i have noticed 1st hand.

I think it's improving, but yeah 4=4-2 still seems pretty dominant over here, save for a few top sides. Grass roots clearly needs changes.

If you look at the German model of doing things, rather than perhaps the Spanish way, it could well be a realistic way of doing things for not only clubs like us, but through the FA as a whole. On a side note, something that bothers me about the mentality of English players, why do youngsters who get released not have a go abroad? They would learn alot about themselves and the way the game is played. Maybe it the money involved or lack of ambition, but its something that has well and truelly puzzled me for a good while.

Spanish or German way, why not, hell the Dutch way is hardly a failure either. Any of these models would be pretty good IMO. Agree about our players and going abroard too, they could learn so much. Same could go for coaches too- credit to McClaren and Hodgson for this, but more going abroard- say to a Napoli, a Valencia, a Bayer Leverksen- good sides but not entirely top tier- could boost their development, tactical expertise etc.

[Lita For Congo]

I think it's improving, but yeah 4=4-2 still seems pretty dominant over here, save for a few top sides. Grass roots clearly needs changes.

Spanish or German way, why not, hell the Dutch way is hardly a failure either. Any of these models would be pretty good IMO. Agree about our players and going abroard too, they could learn so much. Same could go for coaches too- credit to McClaren and Hodgson for this, but more going abroard- say to a Napoli, a Valencia, a Bayer Leverksen- good sides but not entirely top tier- could boost their development, tactical expertise etc.

The Dutch is also a good model, although not the most succesful club in Holland, our supporters have a good relationship with Willem II. I think its something the club hasn't utilized to their advantage as some of their lads who are found in BS3 boozers 3 or 4 times a year seem to be in the 'know'. We should try and link up with them, send some players and coaches over to learn what they are doing.

Agree tottally, even say someone like Gavin Williams. I dont know the details of his personal life but wouldn't it be benificial for a clever player like himself to go to say Xerez in the 2nd division in Spain for a season or 2? The experiance would be valuable.

[Jordan Tansley]

I think there is a massive problem at grass roots, and the FA should be making the training of Coaches it's absolute priority with unlimited funding.

I'm twenty, and played for a couple of youth teams to no particular standard, We played for the enjoyment of football as much as anything, I'm not saying any of us would have made it, far from it, But the coaching was terrible.

I played as a right winger originally and the only positional coaching I got was a bollocking for not tracking back, in my last few years I went up front and played one of two roles, Hold up the ball when drilled into you and wait for the other players to run past and give them a simple pass to feet or to play on the shoulder and chase balls over the top. Both sound tactics and I understood the role of striker pretty well. What shocked me was one game in the season I was asked to drop into the hole behind the striker and was told NOTHING about the position. I couldn't really tell you now what was expected of me that day, But I felt like a rabbit in headlights out there and ended up just looking bewildered as the game flew past me.

Coaching and training sessions were always fitness based, with the occasional "shooting" practice. That's a disgrace in my opinion. How are the kids in this country ever going to be able to understand a fairly simple sport if they aren't told early on what they are expected to do?

What I find most disturbing is that ever **** and their dog can see the fundamental flaws in grass roots football are the standard of coaching and facilities, yet the men in power, the people who are meant to be the guardians of our national sport, the visionaries, They can't see the wood from the trees.

Revamp the lot, fund coaching, give financial incentives for youth coaches, use the Premier League money properly and improve the ******* game.

[spudski]

Thats fair enough mate i did go back and saw that post you mentioned. I just feel that he's flattered to decieve for a good few years now and although i agree with your point, i just felt it was a strange example although someone of that ilk, although a risk, could turn into a master stroke.

Im very interested in Glenn Hoddle's project with Jerez and how we could maybe get involved with their methods and getting a player link up with them. We English are tactically niave i feel, any young lad playing today only knows the basic 4-4-2 and when asked to play, for example, the 'vogue' formation at the moment of 4-2-3-1, some youngsters wouldn't be able to grasp what was needed of them in this system because of the rigid way coaches teaches young lads in this country, something i have noticed 1st hand.

I do agree with your point of going down the 'continental' way of thinking. It seems like a successful way of doing things. It would be quite difficult and time consuming to implement it from say, under 9's to 1st team, but if the costs involved were realistic, it would go a long way to being 'self-sufficient' as SL and now CS wants us to be. I think personally that for all the potiental we have with our academy, we get very little use out of it, i hope that will now change and we can have a clear out of our academy staff, with maybe Clayton staying, and all the 'jobs for the boys' attitude stopped, so like you say, we can maybe hire the calibre of 'continental' coach you mention.

If you look at the German model of doing things, rather than perhaps the Spanish way, it could well be a realistic way of doing things for not only clubs like us, but through the FA as a whole. On a side note, something that bothers me about the mentality of English players, why do youngsters who get released not have a go abroad? They would learn alot about themselves and the way the game is played. Maybe it the money involved or lack of ambition, but its something that has well and truelly puzzled me for a good while.

Tbh...I'm not that versed on the German model. I'll have to look into it more.

It is intersting to note, that during pre season Summer Camps, a lot of youth teams from Britain do reasonably well in these Summer Tournements. The difference you notice, is that the British kids are all more fully developed, faster and bigger and basically win games through this advantage. It's when you get to the 18 year olds and above, that fortunes change, as the Continental kids have caught up physically and can use this along with their technical skills to win games.

I know the Ajax Academy plays their kids in every position, so they feel comfortable on the ball, and also understand what each position does and what is expected of each player. That understanding transcends onto the pitch in full matches. Again a philosophy of Cruyff and Louis van Gaal in their 'Total Football' philosophy.

As for British kids going abroad...who know's. Perhaps they are too comfortable over here. Some of them can make a decent living playing Semi Pro football, whilst upholding a normal job and still going out with the lads for a few bevvies. The best of both worlds so to speak. Maybe a cultural thing?

What Hoddle is doing at Jerez Industrial is amazing. I think as a player he suited that technical side of the game. Having British lads get a second chance and develop further under him and other coaches is fantastic imho. I noted that he try's to play technically with the ball on the floor, with player rotation on the field. Great stuff...

Do you know whether Tinmans academy is still going in Spain? http://www.costafutbolacademy.com/

[chinapig]

The Dutch is also a good model, although not the most succesful club in Holland, our supporters have a good relationship with Willem II. I think its something the club hasn't utilized to their advantage as some of their lads who are found in BS3 boozers 3 or 4 times a year seem to be in the 'know'. We should try and link up with them, send some players and coaches over to learn what they are doing.

Agree tottally, even say someone like Gavin Williams. I dont know the details of his personal life but wouldn't it be benificial for a clever player like himself to go to say Xerez in the 2nd division in Spain for a season or 2? The experiance would be valuable.

I was also wondering about such a tie up but I don't see that the people running our club have this kind of vision. The Academy will continue to fail if our only approach is to keep changing who is in charge. A radical change in philosophy and strategy is needed; if you always do what you've always done you'll always get what you've always got. I am not about to hold my breath though.

[Jordan Tansley]

THIS IS BRISTOL CITY RELATED. WHAT THE UTTER ****?!

[chinapig]

THIS IS BRISTOL CITY RELATED. WHAT THE UTTER ****?!

Quite. I have no problem with having non-City related stuff in a separate place; most forums do that. But despite the title this topic was not about Swansea but how we might emulate them and extended into a very good discussion about coaching at City and in general, the two being inevitably related.

[Jordan Tansley]

sense has prevailed.

[screech]

Seems like someone really has a bee in their bonnet. No prize for guessing who.

[CiderArmyy]

Do a swansea by scoring 2 goals in 30 seconds against the run of play?

[cider head]

THIS IS BRISTOL CITY RELATED. WHAT THE UTTER ****?!

Thread got box ticked in muti move job.

Back now....

[Jordan Tansley]

Thread got box ticked in muti move job.

Back now....

Thanks

It could also be argued that the FIFA thread is city related as BCFC is a football club who falls under the direct influence of the decisions it makes.

[Lita For Congo]

<br>I think there is a massive problem at grass roots, and the FA should be making the training of Coaches it's absolute priority with unlimited funding.<br>I'm twenty, and played for a couple of youth teams to no particular standard, We played for the enjoyment of football as much as anything, I'm not saying any of us would have made it, far from it, But the coaching was terrible.<br>I played as a right winger originally and the only positional coaching I got was a bollocking for not tracking back, in my last few years I went up front and played one of two roles, Hold up the ball when drilled into you and wait for the other players to run past and give them a simple pass to feet or to play on the shoulder and chase balls over the top. Both sound tactics and I understood the role of striker pretty well. What shocked me was one game in the season I was asked to drop into the hole behind the striker and was told NOTHING about the position. I couldn't really tell you now what was expected of me that day, But I felt like a rabbit in headlights out there and ended up just looking bewildered as the game flew past me.

Coaching and training sessions were always fitness based, with the occasional "shooting" practice. That's a disgrace in my opinion. How are the kids in this country ever going to be able to understand a fairly simple sport if they aren't told early on what they are expected to do?

What I find most disturbing is that ever **** and their dog can see the fundamental flaws in grass roots football are the standard of coaching and facilities, yet the men in power, the people who are meant to be the guardians of our national sport, the visionaries, They can't see the wood from the trees.

Revamp the lot, fund coaching, give financial incentives for youth coaches, use the Premier League money properly and improve the ******* game.

I agree Jordan, having witness this 1st hand at pro clubs, players who were good on the ball being knocked out of them to 'run around alot'. The style of play of the EPL means you do have to be super fit, to make any sort of impact, but what is sad is that players with skill who arent physically imposing are promoted and pushed while those with a bit of craft are just dumped or deemed 'too small'. Its something that bothers me.

Currently the worlds best (some might argue ever) Xavi, Iniesta and Messi of Barcelona are all under 5'8, yet if they were english, they would be brickys or sparkys playing for Clevedon or Weston! Maybe it sounds extreme but the coaching methods here in England would mean they got dumped and probably forced out of the game, ive seen it with a fair few players of this kind.

The FA and EPL should be spending millions and millions on our youth set up, make coaching courses relevant, affordable and realisitic, get those who are dumped over to an academy in Spain, Italy, Germany or wherever in a lower league side and develop them that way. They then would have a choice to stick at it, go abroad and try something new, or go and play for a local side, have a few bevvies ect. thats been mentioned on here. I promise you, we would see not only more English players in the EPL but within 10 years, improved national team results at big tournaments.

Obviously it all boils down to greed in the EPL and thats why they are digging their heels in, as short term it might affect the EPL as a spectacle, no matter what the long term benifits would be.

Tbh...I'm not that versed on the German model. I'll have to look into it more.<br><br>It is intersting to note, that during pre season Summer Camps, a lot of youth teams from Britain do reasonably well in these Summer Tournements. The difference you notice, is that the British kids are all more fully developed, faster and bigger and basically win games through this advantage. It's when you get to the 18 year olds and above, that fortunes change, as the Continental kids have caught up physically and can use this along with their technical skills to win games. <br><br>I know the Ajax Academy plays their kids in every position, so they feel comfortable on the ball, and also understand what each position does and what is expected of each player. That understanding transcends onto the pitch in full matches. Again a philosophy of Cruyff and Louis van Gaal in their 'Total Football' philosophy.<br><br>As for British kids going abroad...who know's. Perhaps they are too comfortable over here. Some of them can make a decent living playing Semi Pro football, whilst upholding a normal job and still going out with the lads for a few bevvies. The best of both worlds so to speak. Maybe a cultural thing?<br><br>What Hoddle is doing at Jerez Industrial is amazing. I think as a player he suited that technical side of the game. Having British lads get a second chance and develop further under him and other coaches is fantastic imho. I noted that he try's to play technically with the ball on the floor, with player rotation on the field. Great stuff...<br><br>Do you know whether Tinmans academy is still going in Spain? <a href="http://www.costafutbolacademy.com/" class="bbc_url" title="" rel="nofollow">http://www.costafutbolacademy.com/</a><br>

I was aware it was still going, although i have very little info on how he was doing, thanks for the link. What you say about taking a chance abroad is correct. Its the path i certainly took, but had that option been available to me or one of my peers? Who knows?

Im angered that The FA doesnt step in and help Hoddle or at least set up a similar model in a smaller European League, its a wonderful idea and maybe they are still sour with how his England reign ended.

We do tend to do well at youth tournements for exactly that reason. When you reach a certain age and your facing fully grown men rather than boys, being big and quick just isnt good enough and thats why plenty fall by the way side.

Please do look at the german model, they have some fantastic techniques, which we as a club and a nation could also benifit from.

<br>I was also wondering about such a tie up but I don't see that the people&nbsp;&nbsp;running our club have this kind of vision. The Academy will continue to&nbsp;&nbsp;fail if our only approach is to keep changing who is in charge. A&nbsp;&nbsp;radical change in philosophy and strategy is needed; if you always do&nbsp;&nbsp;what you've always done you'll always get what you've always got. I am&nbsp;&nbsp;not about to hold my breath though. <img src="http://www.otib.co.uk/public/style_emoticons/default/disapointed2se.gif" class="bbc_emoticon" alt=""><br>

<br><br></div><div>100% agree. At the end of the day with a bit of investment in that rather than the signings of say Stern John and Patrick Agyemang, we would of now been seeing some return on our investment but we as a club think very short term i sometimes feel.<br><br>

<br>THIS IS BRISTOL CITY RELATED. WHAT THE UTTER ****?!<br>

<br><br><br>

<br>Quite. I have no problem with having non-City related stuff in a separate place; most forums do that. But despite the title this topic was not about Swansea but how we might emulate them and extended into a very good discussion about coaching at City and in general, the two being inevitably related.<br>

Really? Was it neccisary to move? It was Bristol City related and because it had 'Swansea' in the title rather than read the topic it has been moved. i support what the mods are trying to do here, they have a thankless task at times with some of our more 'difficult' members but you really don't do yourself any favours sometimes with your somewhat odd choices for this board. Its Pre Season, theres nothing to talk about so why not relax the rules?

EDIT: I do apoligize Sean i also have to apoligize for for some of my shocking spelling today. my heads not with the races after last nights shananigans

[cider head]

Thanks

It could also be argued that the FIFA thread is city related as BCFC is a football club who falls under the direct influence of the decisions it makes.

It is still a globle thing with fifa that it is under a heading of pretty much every club or international team, unless it's directly a comment from fifa about Bristol city.

Sometimes the header of posts need thinking ''doing a swansea'' may needed ''can city'' under it, some posts get repoerted by the headings.

[Lita For Congo]

It is still a globle thing with fifa that it is under a heading of pretty much every club or international team, unless it's directly a comment from fifa about Bristol city.

Sometimes the header of posts need thinking ''doing a swansea'' may needed ''can city'' under it, some posts get repoerted by the headings.

Who are these people?

Do they really have nothing better to do than report that theirs a wrong topic on the main city forum? Sad.

[chinapig]

I agree Jordan, having witness this 1st hand at pro clubs, players who were good on the ball being knocked out of them to 'run around alot'. The style of play of the EPL means you do have to be super fit, to make any sort of impact, but what is sad is that players with skill who arent physically imposing are promoted and pushed while those with a bit of craft are just dumped or deemed 'too small'. Its something that bothers me.

Currently the worlds best (some might argue ever) Xavi, Iniesta and Messi of Barcelona are all under 5'8, yet if they were english, they would be brickys or sparkys playing for Clevedon or Weston! Maybe it sounds extreme but the coaching methods here in England would mean they got dumped and probably forced out of the game, ive seen it with a fair few players of this kind.

True of course but the Barca players are also phenomenally fit even if not big. Their game involves constant movement when in possession and constant pressing when not. Not only were Man U outplayed but Barca's work rate left them knackered. So much for the superior fitness of English clubs.

[Lita For Congo]

True of course but the Barca players are also phenomenally fit even if not big. Their game involves constant movement when in possession and constant pressing when not. Not only were Man U outplayed but Barca's work rate left them knackered. So much for the superior fitness of English clubs.

A genuine point i admit, how ever, the point i was getting at was that unless your big and strong, rather than fit, which of course is an absolute must, they would probably of got dumped years ago.

As i type, Readings pulled one back, 3-1 now, this could be a brilliant 2nd half.