Galatasaray / Eastend Surfer Flag

[sbred]

They are doing a high vis thing too, whos idea was it first?

Our safety officer....

[Cliftonville]

Barrow fans have worn hi-viz jackets to games.

Wouldn't doing something similar to the Gas be as appealing as wearing a tramps clothes?

[cider head]

Ok below is Email feedback i have had today from Bristol city, David Lloyd which i have asked permission to post.

I hope this answers some peoples questions?

To clarify our policy re surfers:

• Everyone here absolutely supports and recognises the notion of surfing the flag. Our only concern is that it is done safely for all concerned. This has nothing to do with H & S fascism, PC correctness or Nazi Stewards, simply a need for us to do our jobs properly and ensure that everyone at Ashton Gate can watch the game as safely as possible, whilst also conforming with Football League ground regulations and the requirements of the Council’s safety group.
  

• If you want to surf a flag in any stand, before the game or at half time, please let a steward know so that they can check with the control room that it’s OK.
  

• The answer will be yes 99% of the time. The sort of occasion when we might say no would be if there was an incident in the stand (paramedics attending etc).
  

• Once you get the go ahead – within a minute - then you’re free to start. For sake of argument, let’s say you want to surf in the Dolman Stand.
  

• ·You would take the flag from it’s box – however many of you may be needed. It would help if you were wearing something simple to identify yourselves to the stewards, that would help ease your passage from one stand to the other, and also help the stewards know exactly who is responsible. There is absolutely no need for this to be a high vis jacket –this was simply presented as one option in early discussions. It could be a simple arm band or badge, or maybe a specially designed t shirt?
  

• You would then take the flag to the upper (or lower) aisle in Dolman G block and start it surfing. Your team could then walk along the walkway at the front of the upper tier, following the flag as it surfs and making sure there are no problems. Stewards would keep an eye, but only intervene if the flag got stuck, or if someone was taken ill etc.
  

• You would then need to be at the far aisle, next to block A, to recover the stand and then return it to the box in the EE.
  

• We are very keen that this remains a fan-led and fan-organised initiative. Stewards have no need or desire to get involved unless absolutely necessary, nor will they.
  

Regarding the other comments about a change of policy or a sanitisation in the East End, this is not the case. Stewards got involved with lads who were standing on seats and breaking them. There will also be a zero tolerance of any racist or homophobic chanting, as is the case in the rest of the ground and I am sure you would support this.

Please contact me if you want more information. I have always tried to be fair and honest and supportive with you over every aspect of the EE, and would welcome any thoughts by email.

[Bryans Left Peg]

Ok below is Email feedback i have had today from Bristol city, David Lloyd which i have asked permission to post.

I hope this answers some peoples questions?

To clarify our policy re surfers:

• Everyone here absolutely supports and recognises the notion of surfing the flag. Our only concern is that it is done safely for all concerned. This has nothing to do with H & S fascism, PC correctness or Nazi Stewards, simply a need for us to do our jobs properly and ensure that everyone at Ashton Gate can watch the game as safely as possible, whilst also conforming with Football League ground regulations and the requirements of the Council’s safety group.
  

• If you want to surf a flag in any stand, before the game or at half time, please let a steward know so that they can check with the control room that it’s OK.
  

• The answer will be yes 99% of the time. The sort of occasion when we might say no would be if there was an incident in the stand (paramedics attending etc).
  

• Once you get the go ahead – within a minute - then you’re free to start. For sake of argument, let’s say you want to surf in the Dolman Stand.
  

• ·You would take the flag from it’s box – however many of you may be needed. It would help if you were wearing something simple to identify yourselves to the stewards, that would help ease your passage from one stand to the other, and also help the stewards know exactly who is responsible. There is absolutely no need for this to be a high vis jacket –this was simply presented as one option in early discussions. It could be a simple arm band or badge, or maybe a specially designed t shirt?
  

• You would then take the flag to the upper (or lower) aisle in Dolman G block and start it surfing. Your team could then walk along the walkway at the front of the upper tier, following the flag as it surfs and making sure there are no problems. Stewards would keep an eye, but only intervene if the flag got stuck, or if someone was taken ill etc.
  

• You would then need to be at the far aisle, next to block A, to recover the stand and then return it to the box in the EE.
  

• We are very keen that this remains a fan-led and fan-organised initiative. Stewards have no need or desire to get involved unless absolutely necessary, nor will they.
  

Regarding the other comments about a change of policy or a sanitisation in the East End, this is not the case. Stewards got involved with lads who were standing on seats and breaking them. There will also be a zero tolerance of any racist or homophobic chanting, as is the case in the rest of the ground and I am sure you would support this.

Please contact me if you want more information. I have always tried to be fair and honest and supportive with you over every aspect of the EE, and would welcome any thoughts by email.

Good club response.

[Jordan Tansley]

For clarifications sake, I did lambast the decision but qualified it with a 'if this is true'. Thankfully it clearly wasn't.

With that in mind, I assume we'll be seeing Scotty surfing on Saturday against wolves.....

[NickJ]

Ok below is Email feedback i have had today from Bristol city, David Lloyd which i have asked permission to post.

I hope this answers some peoples questions?

To clarify our policy re surfers:

• Everyone here absolutely supports and recognises the notion of surfing the flag. Our only concern is that it is done safely for all concerned. This has nothing to do with H & S fascism, PC correctness or Nazi Stewards, simply a need for us to do our jobs properly and ensure that everyone at Ashton Gate can watch the game as safely as possible, whilst also conforming with Football League ground regulations and the requirements of the Council’s safety group.
  

• If you want to surf a flag in any stand, before the game or at half time, please let a steward know so that they can check with the control room that it’s OK.
  

• The answer will be yes 99% of the time. The sort of occasion when we might say no would be if there was an incident in the stand (paramedics attending etc).
  

• Once you get the go ahead – within a minute - then you’re free to start. For sake of argument, let’s say you want to surf in the Dolman Stand.
  

• ·You would take the flag from it’s box – however many of you may be needed. It would help if you were wearing something simple to identify yourselves to the stewards, that would help ease your passage from one stand to the other, and also help the stewards know exactly who is responsible. There is absolutely no need for this to be a high vis jacket –this was simply presented as one option in early discussions. It could be a simple arm band or badge, or maybe a specially designed t shirt?
  

• You would then take the flag to the upper (or lower) aisle in Dolman G block and start it surfing. Your team could then walk along the walkway at the front of the upper tier, following the flag as it surfs and making sure there are no problems. Stewards would keep an eye, but only intervene if the flag got stuck, or if someone was taken ill etc.
  

• You would then need to be at the far aisle, next to block A, to recover the stand and then return it to the box in the EE.
  

• We are very keen that this remains a fan-led and fan-organised initiative. Stewards have no need or desire to get involved unless absolutely necessary, nor will they.
  

Regarding the other comments about a change of policy or a sanitisation in the East End, this is not the case. Stewards got involved with lads who were standing on seats and breaking them. There will also be a zero tolerance of any racist or homophobic chanting, as is the case in the rest of the ground and I am sure you would support this.

Please contact me if you want more information. I have always tried to be fair and honest and supportive with you over every aspect of the EE, and would welcome any thoughts by email.

Instructions on how to surf a flag. Makes I laugh.

[Jordan Tansley]

Instructions on how to surf a flag. Makes I laugh.

Or clubs demanding some level of organisation in a society where suing for anything is acceptable.

Cover their own asses, what's the problem?

[chalky]

Does seem a bit OTT, the first time the surfer was brought out (and only time I have seen it) we just did it off the cuff. No one really knew what we were doing but in the end it went over the 3 EE blocks quite well. Not sure if we need people wearing stuff that stand out etc.???

[chalky]

Fair enough about giving a minutes notice though...

[sodburyred]

It does seem alot of people will look for anything to beat the club with.

That Email seems petty but is what is to be expected in this day and age. Like Jordan said all it would take is someone getting knocked over by the flag and no win no fee will be knocking on the door. They are just trying to cover there backs by being organised.

[Frome Valley]

For clarifications sake, I did lambast the decision but qualified it with a 'if this is true'. Thankfully it clearly wasn't.

To be fair the words may, new measures and clarification were clearly mentioned. Fans at Ashton gate did not previoulsy need these meaures in the Atyeo.

[WolfOfWestStreet]

Get it out against Wolves across the Dolman as the teams come out. Great way to start the game

[Forza Revolution]

Would be great to see it again! Pre Wolves ?

[WolfOfWestStreet]

Would be great to see it again! Pre Wolves ?

Ideal timing, we've got the go ahead so no reason not too. Wolves can be a noisy bunch lets show them what we've got.

Make sure you wear your arm bands mind

[NickJ]

Or clubs demanding some level of organisation in a society where suing for anything is acceptable.

Cover their own asses, what's the problem?

Whats wrong with a policy of officialdom organisation to put a piece of coloured material in the air?

Where do I start.

Well thankyou Bristol City, for telling us that if we want to surf a flag we have to seek permission via the control room, take the flag out of its box wearing a specially designed arm-band or t-shirt, start surfing from the back of the stand, while following its progress from a walkway, keeping an eye out in case it gets stuck (how does a flag get stuck?), all the time looking out for paramedics and anyone being taken ill, recover the falg when its journey has finished, and put it back in the box.

There is not one single part of that which is not either obvious or stupid, nothing really in between.

Presumably if god forbid we wish to surf more than once the whole farcical process starts again.

But lets be clear, there is absolutely no policy of killing spontaneity or sanitisation of the East End.

I dont really care if this is complying with H&S or jobsworths at the club, I just find it hilarious.

[NickJ]

It does seem alot of people will look for anything to beat the club with.

That Email seems petty but is what is to be expected in this day and age. Like Jordan said all it would take is someone getting knocked over by the flag

Hadnt thought of that. Anything could happen couldn't it. Probably best to have the a paramedic stood between each aisle, just in case.

Or it could spontaneously combust of course.

So I would also recommend specially trained volunteers wearing distinctive clothing (not necessarily hi-viz jackets) to be on hand with fire extinguishers.

[PhilC]

Or clubs demanding some level of organisation in a society where suing for anything is acceptable.

Cover their own asses, what's the problem?

It does seem alot of people will look for anything to beat the club with.

That Email seems petty but is what is to be expected in this day and age. Like Jordan said all it would take is someone getting knocked over by the flag and no win no fee will be knocking on the door. They are just trying to cover there backs by being organised.

Well I said I wanted an explaination, I have one, and it all seems pretty reasonable to me too, and really not worth kicking up a fuss about. so that's it from me on this matter - Apart from: Hope to see it against Wolves!

COYR!

[cider head]

Would be great to see it again! Pre Wolves ?

Could be a game too early as we now need to see what is to be used in the quote below as ID and people willing to do this

You would take the flag from it’s box – however many of you may be needed. It would help if you were wearing something simple to identify yourselves to the stewards, that would help ease your passage from one stand to the other, and also help the stewards know exactly who is responsible. There is absolutely no need for this to be a high vis jacket –this was simply presented as one option in early discussions. It could be a simple arm band or badge, or maybe a specially designed t shirt?

To be fair this email is for clarification for ANY surfer that meets this new club policy for surfer use inside Ashton gate as a whole, not just the murray surfer, which also includes the flag the ST are raising funds for.

Some stands at AG the murray surfer can't be used due to it being sized for the Eastend blocks, it is just too big to go through the williams (middle pillars) and akward for the Atyeo stand due to the splits in the middle of the stands, this was looked in to by the ST for the past home game vs Cardiff.

Yes the murray flag works in the Eastend as it was sized up over the blocks but best results to surf it when there is not a large following of away fans that push the home following in to the corner giving less space to use it.

The murray flag size wise is ok for the Dolman stand.

So anyone in the future wanting to get their own surfer would have to take in to account the stand they are in and flag size and with this in mind the current flag which the ST are raising money for might have to be resized for use in the Atyeo but the ST will have to clarify that here themselves.

Point to all this is now we have some answers for those who have dontated money and future fans who may donate to the ST surfer and there is something for fans to work with.

The pic below is an idea of just how big the murray surfer is when over the Dolman seats

[Cambridge Batch Red]

An arm band? How about a fetching red one with a white circle and a black swastika?

[Cambridge Batch Red]

How about a t shirt that you can print 'my nan went to Weston and all she got me was this lousy surfer" ?

[Cambridge Batch Red]

Howzabout a gold badge with a white loop that goes round your neck saying "Jim fixed me for it"

Now then now then boys and girls.

[Sixtyseconds]

Instructions on how to surf a flag. Makes I laugh.

Don't laugh this flag is just like a jumbo jet taking orf.

[thatcham red]

_{As someone who has usually been at the forefront of discussions with various safety officers and who actually placed the order for the flag, I should probably add some balance to this debate.}

_{I welcome the clarification and the greater flexibility shown in the statement. What, of course people should realise is that it doesn't start at that point. It does not take account of prior conversations about signed risk assessments, fire safety certificates, how certain stands are open to different wind directions, about notifying safety officers a few days before, about stewards not being able to be involved or distracted by flags,etc}

_{Yes, high vis jackets have been mentioned and only push back and alternative solutions suggested by fans has resulted in this finally being dropped. It looks like we will have to produce an alternative at some point.}

_{As Ciderhead says, we are currently fundraising for a second flag, which will be portrait rather than landscape and will better suit the tiers in the atyeo and lower Dolman. You can look out for the buckets on Saturday or donate via this site.}

_Stu

[Cowshed]

Or clubs demanding some level of organisation in a society where suing for anything is acceptable.

Cover their own asses, what's the problem?

A simple fans iniative has had it's nature changed. It is stated that these are new arrangements. They appear over zealous.

[Jordan Tansley]

A simple fans iniative has had it's nature changed. It is stated that these are new arrangements. They appear over zealous.

Right, and if something happens (god knows what, but there's always a possibility) who is culpable?

If this is a fans initiative as you say then surely they should take all responsibility if something was to happen and should be financially and criminally liable in such an event?

No?

Well the club demanding some level of organisation, showing due diligence is unfortunately a by-product of the society we live in. Reading what Dave has posted it hardly seems the most damaging of requests. But, some like thinking they're victimised....

[Cowshed]

Jordan reading the supporters trust board members post it is clear that a thorough level of organisation has been discussed.

As a new club policy, not an existing football ground regulation it looks over zealous.

[beijing red]

Industry is being choked with Rules and Regulations nowadays.

Unfortunately, City just can't ignore them.

You can't even pass wind nowadays without doing a Risk Assessment. (No pun intended).

[Cowshed]

Industry is being choked with Rules and Regulations nowadays.

Unfortunately, City just can't ignore them.

You can't even pass wind nowadays without doing a Risk Assessment. (No pun intended).

I think it is fair to say that reading Thartchams Red's post regarding previous discussions nobody is suggesting that current rules and regulations be ignored. It appears new layers of officialdom are being applied which do not apply elsewhere?

[Harry]

Sorry to resurrect this thread but a couple of things caught my attention.

1) Am I right in thinking that Derby fans had a surfer flag on the go in the away end on Saturday? I couldn't really see properly from the East End? Or was this just my imagination?

2) Not sure if we'll ever get permission to surf again, but do you reckon we'll ever get one like this at Millonarios from Colombia? :

[luke_bristol]

there was a surfer in the derby blocks. didn't see any of them in high vis vests though