Who The Hell Do You Think You Are?

[Aizoon]

Well probably the best discussion I have read on this forum in ages. It is usually filled with self opiniated drivel. So for all those involved please take a bow

 

And you agree with this, so it's not self-opinionated drivel. That's just the points you disagree with, right?

[Aizoon]

And why haven't I got my daily ration of Likes?

[red panda]

[Aizoon]

The OP asks who I am. I'm a City supporter who's supported this club through 53 years of a little bit of thick and a whole wodge of thin. My commitment has been consistent and, at times, bloody painful.

 

I accept that the Lansdowns have spent a lot of money on this club. Although some of it was thrown away foolishly, hell, it's their money. It is not, however, their club. It was our club before the Lansdowns arrived and, if it survives their reign, it will be our club when they've gone. I would hope that they would pass it on in at least as good a state as they found it.

 

I believe I have the right to criticise their stewardship and not to be lied to by its officials. We were told that the appointment of SC had been carefully considered, that many applicants had been considered and so forth. SC, bless him, has told us that this is simply untrue. He was the only man interviewed and no others were considered.

 

I appreciate that the OP and his clique believe that the club is the Lansdown's toy, to play with as they will. Even if that were so, it wouldn't give them the right to lie to its supporters.

 

But I don't believe that BCFC is the Lansdown's toy - I believe it also belongs to the supporters, the community, and the City of Bristol. I think that some things are too important to be the sole property of rich investors, no matter how well-intentioned. That applies whether those investors are from Bristol, Guernsey, Malaysia or Mars.

[Mr Wendall]

Who do I think I am? I'm a Bristol city supporter, worried about how OUR club is run. It's not the owners/boards they are just custodians looking after it until they pass it on.

It's our job as fans to point out what's going wrong and what could be done better. If we don't and things go wrong we have nobody to blame but ourselves. This is OUR club.

[spudski]

I very much agree with Jordans and Aizoons posts.

 

I find it intolerable that fans will sit back, and allow the Lansdowns to make mistake after mistake, just because they are like us... 'fan's, but with bags of money they are willing to invest in the Club'... That doesn't make them the best option.

 

They are experts in finance... not football.

 

There are plenty of other people, even on this forum, that are experts in their field... the only difference being, they haven't got the disposable income to waste on a football Club.

 

The Lansdowns are like any other fan taking over a football Club. They have had to learn on the job. And they are still learning and making mistakes.

 

If they ran their financial business's like they do BCFC then they would be bankrupt.

 

How can you make so many simple mistakes... not just on the field but even down to the simple things like the ticketing and PR.

 

I have no problem with the Lansdowns as people or their desire to do well.

 

What I have a problem with is their poor footballing judgement and decision making.

 

I am also starting to think they are buiding a board of family and friends... not people who have some expertise in running a football club.

 

However much they beat around the bush, this whole affair with SC not being 'personal' friends with Dawe is a joke.

 

Even radio stations and media and football experts are astounded at SC being given a 3 1/2 year deal in this day and age.... especially when our record shows we sack 1 manager nearly every year of late. For whatever reason that smells really fishy to me...

 

I'm sorry... I just don't trust their judgement anymore and am starting to believe they have a hidden agenda with how they are setting up the board.

 

I'm willing to risk a new owner and board... just as they are willing to risk one manager after the other.

 

As one eminent football reporter tweeted yesterday... 'there is hope for all other Joke Clubs out their'....

 

That's how we are now viewed....

[cider_dog]

[Sargent Pepper]

Agree completely with OP. Yes the board have made mistakes, but it's been honest / naive mistakes trying to do what's best for the club.

I'm not convinced by current appointment or the process of selecting him but I'm not up my own ass enough to take it as a personal insult.

As for previous appointments, bar Millen I don't think there was much disagreement of any of the recent managers from the fan base. Their failure is somehow down to SL yet someone the other day classed the successful appointment of GJ as "lucky". Sorry you can't have it both ways.

It seems the done thing nowadays to call for the board to resign (especially when you get through so many managers as we do) and if we were Coventry, Hull or Malasiyan Dragons FC I could see why. No one was moaning when we rolled in to Wembley park tube station back in 2008. Only afterwards when SL was tarred with not being ambitious enough. So he then was ambitious & naively chased the dream. Until the last couple of years when he realised this couldn't continue & looked to make us self sustainable by making long term plans & a new stadium out of his pocket. I don't see many owners doing that.

I think week minded people are easily led by the more militant on here. All I'll say is be carefull what you wish for. We could soon be returning to the days of Russe, Kew or the calamitous board post 1st division days. With so many threatening not to go again recently we could be returning to 4/5k at home with so many jumping ship when it gets tough, dreaming of when we were lucky enough to have the lansdowns.

[Red-Robbo]

Wow someone woke up full of self importance this morning and made an assault on the moral high ground.

Surprised you've found time to post BCR.

You'll have to nip off down Sports Direct sharpish; Those extra small Arsenal shirts aren't going to last forever with Christmas coming up.

[djb6162]

Who do I think I am? I'm a Bristol city supporter, worried about how OUR club is run. It's not the owners/boards they are just custodians looking after it until they pass it on.

It's our job as fans to point out what's going wrong and what could be done better. If we don't and things go wrong we have nobody to blame but ourselves. This is OUR club.

And so this is the dichotomy with football today.

Running Professional football clubs is a very unusual businesses, a clubs performance as judged by the fans is measured by what they do on the field of play, yet their future, structure and finances depends just as much upon what happens off the field of play. 

 

You say its your club, the law says its a Limited liability company and as such needs to adhere to all the restrictions and expectations of the share holders of which i suspect you are not one of.

It may be your club in your heart, but certainly not on the balance sheet ( you may be grateful for that small mercy i suspect)

Whether we like it or not the club has to operate within the same legal and governance framework as companies in other areas of the UK economy.

I say its an unusual business, because unlike other business, owners often make decisions based on emotional reasons

 

for example the objectives of football clubs, in particular the desire for on the field success, is always likely to have implications for business decision making and perhaps explains why all of a sudden the five pillars we were being sold just recently seem to have stalled in recent days.

 

Therefore i tend to show sympathy when i see a change in short term decisions not reflecting what we all believe is the long term message

but you know that's the difference between tactics (short term decisions aimed at getting you where you want to be) the path provided by tactics is seldom a straight line by the way, compared with

strategy ( a companies overall long term vision) in our case the five pillars.

i am not criticising you by the way, just perhaps lending a view of why football chairman and boards behave in the way they do

 

 

[spudski]

In reply to Sargent Cider' ed.... so you think honest and niave is ok then?

 

If Lansdown employed a Director for his financial business, who made mistake after mistake, would he just pat him on the head and say 'never mind... it's just honest and niave mistakes'....

 

There are plenty of people out their that would be willing to take this Club on.

 

It's so tied up now, with Bristol Rugby and other Lansdown businesses, that it's pretty hard to sell as a football club alone.

 

I've still not worked out the agenda... but I'm sure they have one. Bristol United is something that keeps cropping up... I don't want to believe in it... but who knows...

[Red-Robbo]

I very much agree with Jordans and Aizoons posts.

I find it intolerable that fans will sit back, and allow the Lansdowns to make mistake after mistake, just because they are like us... 'fan's, but with bags of money they are willing to invest in the Club'... That doesn't make them the best option.

They are experts in finance... not football.

There are plenty of other people, even on this forum, that are experts in their field... the only difference being, they haven't got the disposable income to waste on a football Club.

The Lansdowns are like any other fan taking over a football Club. They have had to learn on the job. And they are still learning and making mistakes.

If they ran their financial business's like they do BCFC then they would be bankrupt.

How can you make so many simple mistakes... not just on the field but even down to the simple things like the ticketing and PR.

I have no problem with the Lansdowns as people or their desire to do well.

What I have a problem with is their poor footballing judgement and decision making.

I am also starting to think they are buiding a board of family and friends... not people who have some expertise in running a football club.

However much they beat around the bush, this whole affair with SC not being 'personal' friends with Dawe is a joke.

Even radio stations and media and football experts are astounded at SC being given a 3 1/2 year deal in this day and age.... especially when our record shows we sack 1 manager nearly every year of late. For whatever reason that smells really fishy to me...

I'm sorry... I just don't trust their judgement anymore and am starting to believe they have a hidden agenda with how they are setting up the board.

I'm willing to risk a new owner and board... just as they are willing to risk one manager after the other.

As one eminent football reporter tweeted yesterday... 'there is hope for all other Joke Clubs out their'....

That's how we are now viewed....

I can't see how you can blame them for mistakes on the field, Spud. That's the manager's terrain.

As for appointments, up until now they were pretty popular choices. People might query Millen, but there was at least some logic there.

Off-field, yes, I agree it has been a blunderfest.

Ultimately though I. don't think. they are much different from most football boards. How many have football "experts" on them?

[spudski]

Because they interfere with the managers mate... it's not the managers.

[no_merde]

[no_merde]

No BCFC belongs to the majority shareholder, so get over it! We just pay to watch football matches.

 

Eactly.

[no_merde]

well done needed to be said and i commend you for doing so

 

unless you have run a business and put your own "proverbials" on the block you will have no idea about commercial decision making on a day to day basis.

And even if you have, it doesn't automatically gain you the right to get all those decisions correct. Life isn't like that unfortunately.

what it does buy you...... is the right to make those decisions in conjunction with those, with whom you choose to assist you in the day to day running.

that is the same in any well run business.

No modern business can truly and effectively be run by "trade union" or common consent and neither can you hope to please all those who choose to associate themselves with it.

As soon a s football and fans generally grow up and realise that the same forces which govern every enterprise also applies to football the better.

we may not like it, but its a fact.

 

i have said already that i think the decision to sack SOD was wrong (IMO), however i accept that i am not entrusted nor have earned the right to make those decisions on behalf of the club.

As has been mentioned by the OP, it could be worse eg i don't here the owner demanding to change the name to Bristol "Pirates" as part of this new shake up.

 

Great post. 

[Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan]

Because they interfere with the managers mate... it's not the managers.

So, it's not the players or managers fault that we are sh1t on the field, it's Lansdowns fault?

[no_merde]

Umh, because it's not 2008 it's 2013 that's why.  Shall we look at the Governments record - I know, let's choose 1905 cos we ruled the world then!  It's not arbitrary - it's comparing the start of his reign with now.

 

But his reign hasn't ended now - the point being you have to take the rough with the smooth. Life is a roller coaster - just got to ride it.

[pongo88]

Merde alors - someone has made a sensible post about the Lansdowns! Well done Mr Merde.

There are far too many people on the forum who think City is some sort of hippy commune where we all sit around holding hands, talking about what needs to be done and then taking a vote. The reality is City, and 99% of other clubs, are run by the board / major shareholder. Steve Lansdown has made a few mistakes as has his son but both have admitted their mistakes and are trying to change.

Some people also forget that the ground redevelopment will cost millions. Where is this money coming from ? None other than Steve Lansdown the same person who gets constant abuse on the forum

[Andy Horsman]

[spudski]

How how are they trying to change Pongo88?

 

This pillars mullarky is just basic stuff that all football clubs adhere too... it's basics.

 

As for the Academy and scouting... that's all basics that should have been done years ago... and has only been forced because of FFP.

 

Tell me how it is acceptable for a football club to be nearly 120 years old, and only sort out a basic scouting system this year?

[no_merde]

[Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan]

As for appointments, up until now they were pretty popular choices. People might query Millen, but there was at least some logic there.

Spot on, likewise with funds for new players. The Board have done exactly what we have always demanded of our owners...put your money where your mouth is.

Even Millen's appointment, whilst disappointing after Coppell, had a large degree of common sense about it. Millen took us to a 10th place finish the season before after things started going wrong under Johnson.

As I've said in the past our board are not perfect and not above scrutiny from the fans (it's us that put our money where our mouths are by purchasing ST's or match day tickets) but we have to recognise that SL has done what WE in the past have expected from him. Imagine the uproar in the seasons after the Hull Play Off Final if the board had said "right, that's it, no more cash, we gave it a go but tough sh1t,".

They're damned if they do and damned if they don't.

[no_merde]

[no_merde]

Because they interfere with the managers mate... it's not the managers.

 

You should read this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Umbrella_Man_(JFK_assassination)

[Jordan Tansley]

I have never claimed the Lansdown family are without fault and have never claim you shouldn't criticise him. Read my posts above I have made this point numerous times.

 

What I do claim is that you have no right to demand he runs his business in any way other than he chooses. If you wan that right raise the money and buy it off him.

 

With regard to your point about shares - do you understand how capital flows into a business? The price of the company's equity is set by the market (i.e. who is prepared to pay for it). When BCFC needed investment funds to pay for the investment that the club needed and fans wanted Lansdown made the best offer for equity that was issued. Therefore his shareholding of the club increased. How were you expecting that to be prevented from happening?

 

Do you understand how capital flows into a business? The price of the shares 

 

If Vincent Tan came to to this club instead of Cardiff you'd have been one of those who bent over and took it right up the shitter, Wouldn't you?

[no_merde]

[pongo88]

How how are they trying to change Pongo88?

This pillars mullarky is just basic stuff that all football clubs adhere too... it's basics.

As for the Academy and scouting... that's all basics that should have been done years ago... and has only been forced because of FFP.

Tell me how it is acceptable for a football club to be nearly 120 years old, and only sort out a basic scouting system this year?

Steve Lansdown can't be held responsible for the entire 120 year history of the club 's poor scouting system. I think his big mistake was the same as most big businessmen who get involved in football clubs - too much trust due to lack of football knowledge. Gary Johnson got some early success and as a result SL trusted his policy of spend big and we will get to the Premiership. I personally don't think that SL has changed just because of the financial fair play rules. He' s just come to his senses. A bit late but better late than never

[no_merde]

If Vincent Tan came to to this club instead of Cardiff you'd have been one of those who bent over and took it right up the shitter, Wouldn't you?

 

If Vincent Tan came to this club it would turn me homosexual? I don't get it?

 

Is this supposed to be a personal insult?

[spudski]

In reply to Peter Hanrahan..... Do you think with all the money spent, all the players we've had, and all the managers we've had, that they have all failed because of the managers appointed by the board?

 

Think about it for a moment.... 50 million in debt and we are bottom of the 3rd Division.

 

All these players we've signed are poor?

 

All these managers we've signed are poor?

 

As for No_ Italian Sh1t's reading reference... no thanks mate... I'd rather listen to people in the professional game, who including previous managers of this Club, have enlightened me to make up my own mind from first hand experience.