Sleepy1968 Posted December 29, 2013 Report Share Posted December 29, 2013 I do find it mad how fans were pulling their hair out at how shit we were doing, we start to turn a corner and our players perform and some fans still need reason to have a go. The man scored 2 and set up one today along with the previous and we are only half way through the season! If we were top of the table, I bet he would be the hardest working player in the league in all you complaining fans opinions.Just get behind the bloody team and it's players and let's have some positivity. Quite. We've just won two games. JET scored a sublime goal and set one up. Baldders scored from free play and worked extremely hard to engineer a goal for JET. Yes there's ample room for improvement but FFS just enjoy the bloody win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pongo88 Posted December 29, 2013 Report Share Posted December 29, 2013 Sounds to me that they just want him to put a shift in. This is a fair request i would sayIt depends on how you define putting in a shift. We've had quite a few players who have run around a lot without really contributing much - e.g. Jamal Campbell Rice. Gary Johnson used to say that he wanted players who " affected the game". JET definitely did that today and has done so on many previous occasions. That, to me, is another definition of putting in a shift. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formerly known as ivan Posted December 29, 2013 Author Report Share Posted December 29, 2013 Strange, but it appears SC shares the same views as me with regards to jet, apart from the cashing in part... Ok, I will hold my hands up. Maybe that part in wishing we sell our top goal scorer and creator in January was a bit rash. Glad to hear SC telling it how it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
054123 Posted December 29, 2013 Report Share Posted December 29, 2013 Mate I honestly understand your frustration with jet, but you must be able to see that the positives outweigh the negatives by a long way. Simply the most talented player in a generation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylor10 Posted December 29, 2013 Report Share Posted December 29, 2013 Not sure SC has been overly impressed with his apparent lack of running since he's been here. Going by his radio Bristol interview after. I thought JET was quality again today. Not for the full 90 but ultimately as often is the case was our match winner. Great second goal and unlike him to be in the 6 yard box for his first!! Still don't get why people moan and slate him. Utter morons. Probably the same people as those in the crowd that shout to launch it forward or 'get rid' only to moan when we lose possession. As has been mentioned, let's seriously get behind the boys now and enjoy the win! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex_BCFC Posted December 29, 2013 Report Share Posted December 29, 2013 Just read SC's comments and they do worry me a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesBCFC Posted December 29, 2013 Report Share Posted December 29, 2013 I am a fan of jet but he was poor today for large parts of the game, but shine when it mattered and provided an assist and scored 2, he's a fantastic player and if he was like that (the good part) all game every game, he would be a top premier league player and not with us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Rollason Posted December 29, 2013 Report Share Posted December 29, 2013 Strange, but it appears SC shares the same views as me with regards to jet, apart from the cashing in part... Ok, I will hold my hands up. Maybe that part in wishing we sell our top goal scorer and creator in January was a bit rash.Glad to hear SC telling it how it is. Just read SC's comments and they do worry me a bit. From the gist of his comments he seems to be hoping that JET will morph into Marlon Harewood. "He scored two and laid on another and thats great but..." but what Steve?? if he ran around a bit more and stayed more central he'd do what? score 5 lay on 7 ?? doubt it. I have this horrible feeling that SC just wont "fancy" him unless he gets his "work rate" up , hes already talking about no free roles. Facts are that in a bottom four team he's scored 17 and set up what 12 is it? Christ Steve whatever he's doing just let him get on with it mate ffs.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Port Said Red Posted December 29, 2013 Report Share Posted December 29, 2013 Just read SC's comments and they do worry me a bit. only a bit? He is talking abut shackling the most creative player in the team and turning him into a straightforward target man, it's shocking. The idea that if he ran around a bit more he would be a better player is complete bollocks, it simply doesn't work that way. And as for the quote that "all the good teams don't have free roles" its one of most fatuous and outmoded comments I have read in years. Any decent manager would take a look at what JET offers and work out how they can build a team around him, not work out how he can make him as average as the rest of the group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Rollason Posted December 29, 2013 Report Share Posted December 29, 2013 Sounds to me that they just want him to put a shift in. This is a fair request i would say he did put a shift in. his shifts just dont look like everyone elses.... and seeing as he scored two and set up another thats a good shift ..imho. And its nonsense to say he doesnt work, he does track back and he does help out and he does try and win aimless punts forward but his JOB is to create and to score is it not?? in which case... job done nest pas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red-Robbo Posted December 29, 2013 Report Share Posted December 29, 2013 Rather than worrying about what SC 'might ' do to JET- worries based on your incredibly jaundiced view of a manager who has already delivered as many league wins as SOD this season - why not just chill out and see what actually happens. You SOD diehards write as if you won't be happy unless we lose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRock Posted December 29, 2013 Report Share Posted December 29, 2013 'Any decent manager would take a look at what JET offers and work out how they can build a team around him' Isn't that what SoD tried to do for 6 months..... and failed? Don't get me wrong, love the chap.... but if only he could give us another 10%, which he can do, as we saw at Tamworth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Port Said Red Posted December 29, 2013 Report Share Posted December 29, 2013 No. Thats just conjecture and completely ignoring what SC actually said. He said he'd prefer JET not to wander out wide as it leaves Baldock on his own which, in turn, results in long passes to Baldock where he's marked by two big defenders. He's simply saying that JET needs to be just a bit more disciplined and not wander out wide. Its a bloody big leap from that to making him into a target man FFS. No it's not. look at how JET has created many of the chances this season, he goes wide to find or create space, then exploits that by a clever pass or a run. He has been at his most effective when he is freer, not playing as part of two up top and it's hardly his fault that everything that he has done has been cancelled out by a leaky defence. If he stays in January and SC gets his way, I will be willing to bet that he will score and create less in the second half of this season, because he will be discouraged from playing his natural game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red-Robbo Posted December 29, 2013 Report Share Posted December 29, 2013 No it's not. look at how JET has created many of the chances this season, he goes wide to find or create space, then exploits that by a clever pass or a run. He has been at his most effective when he is freer, not playing as part of two up top and it's hardly his fault that everything that he has done has been cancelled out by a leaky defence. If he stays in January and SC gets his way, I will be willing to bet that he will score and create less in the second half of this season, because he will be discouraged from playing his natural game. As most of your other warnings about Cotterill's intentions have been wrong, I won't lose much sleep worrying about this one. Remember how SOD's post match comments were minutely analysed on here and those who kept faith with him always said: "Don't try and pull apart everything he says and cast it all in as negative a light as possible!" Well that! (Oh the irony....) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Port Said Red Posted December 29, 2013 Report Share Posted December 29, 2013 As most of your other warnings about Cotterill's intentions have been wrong, I won't lose much sleep worrying about this one. Remember how SOD's post match comments were minutely analysed on here and those who kept faith with him always said: "Don't try and pull apart everything he says and cast it all in as negative a light as possible!" Well that! (Oh the irony....) Glad you can tell I am wrong after a month. Another example of the short term view on here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aizoon Posted December 30, 2013 Report Share Posted December 30, 2013 And if we dont push up the table and the goals and assists dry up What then will you still be happy?? No. But I also won't be happy if he turns into a giant fruit bat and flies off to the Moon. That is possibly the silliest question of the year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aizoon Posted December 30, 2013 Report Share Posted December 30, 2013 For me, the acid test for SC will be how he handles JET, far and away our most talented player. From what I've seen, from match reports that I've read and from what JET has achieved, I reckon SC's done a pretty good job so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red-Robbo Posted December 30, 2013 Report Share Posted December 30, 2013 Glad you can tell I am wrong after a month. Another example of the short term view on here. I believe you were one of the "it'll all be long-ball from now on" soothsayers at the time of Cotterill's appointment & yes, you've been proven wrong. As for your fears re the post match interview, has it not occured to you that if Steve wanted a tall conventional "target man" he'd not try to turn JET into Harewood, he'd just play Harewood! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redsquirrel Posted December 30, 2013 Report Share Posted December 30, 2013 I believe you were one of the "it'll all be long-ball from now on" soothsayers at the time of Cotterill's appointment & yes, you've been proven wrong. As for your fears re the post match interview, has it not occured to you that if Steve wanted a tall conventional "target man" he'd not try to turn JET into Harewood, he'd just play Harewood! exactly,proves he knows jets qualities and picks him first Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petehinton Posted December 30, 2013 Report Share Posted December 30, 2013 Read a really interesting article about Pirlo a few weeks back, and how Carlo Ancelotti was constantly questioned about the fact that Pirlo doesn't tackle. He's arguably the best CM ever, and had a ratio of about 1 tackle every 2 games. JET can be seen as this sort of player (obviously not on the same scale!). Some players fit different styles of play, and JET is one of those that has the flair to change games, not run around like a headless chicken like Marvin Elliott or the likes. It's just wasting his talent. If Ancelotti had shut up shop and told Pirlo that he had to make at least 4 or 5 tackles a game and become more ruthless or he'd be out the side because he isn't ''working hard enough'', then he arguably would've ruined their best player. Think we may be going down that route with JET. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formerly known as ivan Posted December 30, 2013 Author Report Share Posted December 30, 2013 Read a really interesting article about Pirlo a few weeks back, and how Carlo Ancelotti was constantly questioned about the fact that Pirlo doesn't tackle. He's arguably the best CM ever, and had a ratio of about 1 tackle every 2 games. JET can be seen as this sort of player (obviously not on the same scale!). Some players fit different styles of play, and JET is one of those that has the flair to change games, not run around like a headless chicken like Marvin Elliott or the likes. It's just wasting his talent. If Ancelotti had shut up shop and told Pirlo that he had to make at least 4 or 5 tackles a game and become more ruthless or he'd be out the side because he isn't ''working hard enough'', then he arguably would've ruined their best player. Think we may be going down that route with JET. Difference is tackling is an art form. Many of the best players are unable to tackle, scholes being one of the obvious ones. Work rate and running is possibly the most basic requirements in football. I cant see how anyone could argue that asking jet to do this would ruin the talent he has. Surely this would push him to being the top player we know he could be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
You Do The Dziekanowski Posted December 30, 2013 Report Share Posted December 30, 2013 The only problem I see with JET is he slows the game down... But looking at some of his goals this season, He has the ability to speed it back up in the blink of an eye When he gets it he takes 2 defenders out the game, He slows the play down, Allowing team mates to run into these spaces, He then tries to pick them out. As a fan base we are too critical (I admit I am of Baldock) If he does one thing wrong we get on his back, Even if in doing that one thing wrong he's done 4 things right in the build up He is one of a kind and should not be sold in January, Him and Baldock have unique partnership, Don't use each other that often but play so well off each other. Going back to critical, If I could change one thing about both players I would make Baldock more clinical and JET have better distribution (timing) They are both good players and should be kept in January for our team to push forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cider red Posted December 30, 2013 Report Share Posted December 30, 2013 Without wanting to read the last few pages in detail, I will admit I was wrong, thought he did well first half then started the second half badly, I was calling for him to be taken off then up he pops with two goals again. The problem is when he is on his game like yesterday he is unplayable, it took 3/4 players to get the ball of him yesterday. I also noticed he seemed to be more of a 'team player' yesterday, did his fair bit of back tracking, and his partnership with baldock seems to be coming along too. I have been calling for him to be dropped recently to see if it does the team any better, but if he continues to play like that, I will happily be proved wrong! Keep it up jet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
You Do The Dziekanowski Posted December 30, 2013 Report Share Posted December 30, 2013 Without wanting to read the last few pages in detail, I will admit I was wrong, thought he did well first half then started the second half badly, I was calling for him to be taken off then up he pops with two goals again. The problem is when he is on his game like yesterday he is unplayable, it took 3/4 players to get the ball of him yesterday. I also noticed he seemed to be more of a 'team player' yesterday, did his fair bit of back tracking, and his partnership with baldock seems to be coming along too. I have been calling for him to be dropped recently to see if it does the team any better, but if he continues to play like that, I will happily be proved wrong! Keep it up jet. I do see your point, But we're not in a position to take risks, He creates and scores so keep him on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eco Posted December 30, 2013 Report Share Posted December 30, 2013 Without wanting to read the last few pages in detail, I will admit I was wrong, thought he did well first half then started the second half badly, I was calling for him to be taken off then up he pops with two goals again. The problem is when he is on his game like yesterday he is unplayable, it took 3/4 players to get the ball of him yesterday. I also noticed he seemed to be more of a 'team player' yesterday, did his fair bit of back tracking, and his partnership with baldock seems to be coming along too. I have been calling for him to be dropped recently to see if it does the team any better, but if he continues to play like that, I will happily be proved wrong! Keep it up jet. We're now almost in Jan, he's been scoring/creating goals for fun since August so not sure what else he can do to convince you ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cider red Posted December 30, 2013 Report Share Posted December 30, 2013 We're now almost in Jan, he's been scoring/creating goals for fun since August so not sure what else he can do to convince you ! If you've seen my previous posts you will see im a big jet fan, think he is probably the best player I have seen in my 15 years of watching city. I just wasn't sure whether the team was at a detriment due to his lack of work rate. As cotteril said on the radio yesterday he put a shift in and we got a performance out of him- 'hes good when hes running around'. If he carries on like yesterday in the next couple of games then he will no doubt be off to a championship or dare I say it bottom half prem team next month anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ciderbeans Posted December 30, 2013 Report Share Posted December 30, 2013 Christ even if jet won the ballon d'or people would still find faults in him. One of the reasons he didn't fair too well at Ipswich was because fans got on his back about his work rate and McCarthy couldn't see beyond that and what he can really do. Would be ridiculous for that to happen again here as to date he has had his best ever season as a pro with us and it's only half way through. Give the guy a break Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aizoon Posted December 30, 2013 Report Share Posted December 30, 2013 As I said earlier, how he handles JET will be the acid test of SC's management skills. So far he's done it well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrizzleRed Posted December 30, 2013 Report Share Posted December 30, 2013 Difference is tackling is an art form. Many of the best players are unable to tackle, scholes being one of the obvious ones. Work rate and running is possibly the most basic requirements in football. I cant see how anyone could argue that asking jet to do this would ruin the talent he has. Surely this would push him to being the top player we know he could be? So you can't see a scenario that he begins running around like a headless chicken and is ****** by half time? There are plenty of less talented players who's only talent is to run about, so why not let them get on with that and let JET do what HE does best??? I just can't get my head round this fixation with some of our fans that he's only going to be a complete player if he runs around a lot. This idea is why the English national side hasn't progressed since 1966 FFS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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