Aizoon Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 http://www.bristolpost.co.uk/Steve-Cotterill-targets-experienced-youthful/story-21206728-detail/story.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkeh Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 rehash of an ealier story which in turn was copy and pasted from our OS aka the post being lazy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimonR Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 Lets get some players who will get us promoted no matter their age. An old pro or a young rising star, We need to move up the league as soon as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
!james Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 This was first published about a month ago! Slow news summer... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid in the Riot Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 Lets get some players who will get us promoted no matter their age. An old pro or a young rising star, We need to move up the league as soon as possible. Fair enough. If SC's policy is to bring in experienced players who are peaking in their careers and essentially going for the quick fix, then fine. But I will adjust my expectations for next season accordingly, and given our budget and existing squad that will likely be an expectation of a top 6 finish. With good quality loan signings from the C'ship SC achieved play-off form last season so I don't feel this is unrealistic. Sad to read the opening lines of that article but hey ho... BRISTOL City manager Steve Cotteriill has made clear his intention to abandon the club's policy of signing young players who can be sold on for a profit. Lesson learnt...never trust what the club say again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkeh Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 Fair enough. If SC's policy is to bring in experienced players who are peaking in their careers and essentially going for the quick fix, then fine. But I will adjust my expectations for next season accordingly, and given our budget and existing squad that will likely be an expectation of a top 6 finish. With good quality loan signings from the C'ship SC achieved play-off form last season so I don't feel this is unrealistic. Sad to read the opening lines of that article but hey ho... Lesson learnt...never trust what the club say again. never trust what the post says, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bar BS3 Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 Fair enough. If SC's policy is to bring in experienced players who are peaking in their careers and essentially going for the quick fix, then fine. But I will adjust my expectations for next season accordingly, and given our budget and existing squad that will likely be an expectation of a top 6 finish. With good quality loan signings from the C'ship SC achieved play-off form last season so I don't feel this is unrealistic. Sad to read the opening lines of that article but hey ho... Lesson learnt...never trust what the club say again. I would take this article with a pinch of salt. Having spoken directly to SC about his transfer & youth policies in some depth, I can tell you that he would love to encourage and bring through youth, but only if they are good enough. He wants a promotion challenge next season, no two ways about it and it is rare that a major youth policy will bring this. There is no way that he will be scrapping the development of youth, but he wants players in for the here and now, that he sees as better than what we have/have had, to get us back into the Championship asap. Youth will be developed alongside of this and get their chance as & when they are ready for the task, not as a sentimental priority whilst we sit in L1 waiting for them to get upto scratch. SC's job is to get success on the pitch for the 1st team and that is his goal - we have other people at the club who's job it is to produce youngsters to challenge for those 1st team places, IF they are good enough. That is fine by me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamC Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 Rubbish article with negative slant shocker.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aizoon Posted June 9, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 Rubbish article with negative slant shocker.. Hard to believe from the Bristol Post, isn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esmond Million's Bung Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 The only thing that I can see has actually changed is the ridiculous policy of signing 18 to 24 year olds and just throwing them straight into the first team squad, we all saw what happened with that particular master plan last season, SC is talking purely about the first team squad and any younger signings for the development squad and that's the way it should be and if they are good enough they will get their chance or they can go to Arsenal like Amankwah or Everton like Wilson or Chelsea like Krans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1960maaan Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 Hard to believe from the Bristol Post, isn't it? No , no ,no , and I'm sitting waiting for the pictures of the pitch invasion at the Rugby ground naming and shaming the culprits , bringing the good name of the family club into disrepute. It will happen as the EP is an even handed quality new outlet isn't it ??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pickle Rick Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 Lets get some players who will get us promoted no matter their age. An old pro or a young rising star, We need to move up the league as soon as possible. Don't all clubs below the top league? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murraysrightplum Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 CRASH, there goes one of the pillars... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bar BS3 Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 CRASH, there goes one of the pillars... I think that you will find not sticking too strictly to that particular pillar in the 2nd half of last season is what kept us out of L2! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowshed Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 The pillars can be placed alongside ground consultation in the bullshit column. Don't take anything this lot say literally, don't take it at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murraysrightplum Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 I think that you will find not sticking too strictly to that particular pillar in the 2nd half of last season is what kept us out of L2! Agreed, but just pointing out the fact that the pillars seem to have been erected (fnarr) by a family of dodgy gypsies. Or maybe just Cowlin Construction... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkeh Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 Agreed, but just pointing out the fact that the pillars seem to have been erected (fnarr) by a family of dodgy gypsies. Or maybe just Cowlin Construction... i think people read to much into them, after all they said we aim to sign not we will only sign, also the main aim is to get the club making money again, 25-29 yo's still had sell on value if we signed a load of players 33 and over on 5 year deals I'd be worried if we signed 33 + on 1 year deals i wouldn't be bothered at all, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red_Jim Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 Just goes to prove what a total load of rubbish this part of the Five Pillars strategy was from the board. It was a white elephant - you can't just sign players who are aged 18-24 and expect it all to click. All successful football clubs have a balance. Clueless strategic planning once again. Thankfully, they seem to have realised the error of their ways before it was too late. Any success we have at Bristol City seems to come as a result of a decent manager striking the right balance at the right time - it rarely seems to come from coherent thinking from the boardroom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murraysrightplum Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 i think people read to much into them, after all they said we aim to sign not we will only sign, also the main aim is to get the club making money again, 25-29 yo's still had sell on value if we signed a load of players 33 and over on 5 year deals I'd be worried if we signed 33 + on 1 year deals i wouldn't be bothered at all, I don't see why they called them pillars then. And why bother telling us about them anyway if at the first sign of trouble they change their minds? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redcherryberry Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 i think people read to much into them, after all they said we aim to sign not we will only sign, also the main aim is to get the club making money again, 25-29 yo's still had sell on value if we signed a load of players 33 and over on 5 year deals I'd be worried if we signed 33 + on 1 year deals i wouldn't be bothered at all, Ricky Lambert aside give me 3 players within the last few years aged between 25-29 from L1 & 2 who have been sold on for big money and/or alot more than what they were purchased at? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkeh Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 Ricky Lambert aside give me 3 players within the last few years aged between 25-29 from L1 & 2 who have been sold on for big money and/or alot more than what they were purchased at? Leon Clarke Craig mackal-smith Albert adomah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeyb Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 Leon Clarke Craig mackal-smith Albert adomah We signed Adomah when he was 22. Craig Mackail-Smith was signed by Peterborough when he was 23. You have Leon Clarke right however. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spudski Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 Isn't this what pretty much every team in the league does anyway? a mix of youth, older heads and experience. It's what we've done for years...nothing new. As long as you get the right ones in... as we know, gaining promotion can be achieved, it 's just pushing on and getting solid in the Championship we find a problem. Fair enough if SC can achieve it... I hope he does. What I don't like, is the fact a manager seems to be telling our board and owner how the Club is going to run. These sort of decisions should be made by the Club, not one person. If it all goes wrong again...who's to blame... SC or the board? We've been here before haven't we.... If SC were to fail...and we brought another manager in, and he decided to go with youth...would they allow him, or make a decision for the Club? Can you see what I'm saying....who runs this Club...managers who come and go...or the Board? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esmond Million's Bung Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 Isn't this what pretty much every team in the league does anyway? a mix of youth, older heads and experience. It's what we've done for years...nothing new. As long as you get the right ones in... as we know, gaining promotion can be achieved, it 's just pushing on and getting solid in the Championship we find a problem. Fair enough if SC can achieve it... I hope he does. What I don't like, is the fact a manager seems to be telling our board and owner how the Club is going to run. These sort of decisions should be made by the Club, not one person. If it all goes wrong again...who's to blame... SC or the board? We've been here before haven't we.... If SC were to fail...and we brought another manager in, and he decided to go with youth...would they allow him, or make a decision for the Club? Can you see what I'm saying....who runs this Club...managers who come and go...or the Board? it seems to me that the board seeing the shambles of bringing the amount of youth into the first team squad that happened last season, have decided to change direction and quite right to. Bring them into the development squad that's what it's for, i'm sure occasionally a younger player who is signed and deemed ready will break through a la Williams, as I am sure that if younger player like Freeman were viable signings for us they will be made and go straight into the first team squad. in the the main the target age suggested is pretty much spot on, either coming into or in their prime. As for the 'right ones' his record is impressive, Barnett failed (but everybody is allowed one mistake) and El Abd as you have pointed out is actually a Burt signing, last season SC did what was necessary for the problems that faced him when he arrived and for the coming season it would appear that he is targeting mainly younger players than the loans he brought in, that might leave scope for couple prem youngsters, who knows. The real problem with your last sentence is this, if we had an owner who brought in players and presented them to an unknowing manager like Davison did with Ward, that's wrong, if the manager asks for money for a reasonable signing like Jordan (the 2nd time around) did with a young Kevin Davis (150k I believe) and the then board say no, that might as it was at the time be a resigning issue. There has to be a balance and an understanding between the owner and the manager, this time the owner needs to spot earlier than he did with GJ when the wheels are coming off and the manager has to put his hands up when he signs a player in good faith and that player subsequently fails, but part of the whole problem has been for us in the case of GJ and now SC is that when a new guy takes over a disaster zone and turns it around and ultimately saves us from relegation, it immediately puts him in a very strong position, the difference hopefully will be that SC will be more prudent with the owners money than GJ was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedBrizzleRobin Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 Signing 18 - 24 year olds, right idea wrong implementation. As EMB said some should be going into the development squad, ideally the 18 - 21 year olds with a view to them being involved in the first team within 1 - 2 years. The 22 - 24 year olds should however be good enough to be in the squad which hopefully they'll improve to the point where their regulary starting games. Anyway as a few said early on in the season too much too soon of young players thrown into the matchday squad. A more relaxed approach of putting them in when ready rather than them being put in because 'Pillars' is far better. Personally I think SC is going in the right direction with it - balance out the youth with more experienced players in their prime years and with time on there side. SC has given more confidence in that he knows what he's doing since we had GJ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redcherryberry Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 Leon Clarke Craig mackal-smith Albert adomah So despite being on here every minute of the day & taking over an hour to reply you've come back with one player - Leon Clarke. Fact is you rarely make money Monkeh on players aged 25-29 from the lower leagues. I can fully appreciate SC ignoring 18-20 yr olds like Grimes for example. It's a big summer for him whose under presure to deliver next season thus his recruitment needs to be spot on. Every signing's a gamble especially so when its kids 18-20 with barely 40/50 League games under there belt. What annoys me though & what I find naive from SC is him ruling out 21-23 yr olds. There are loads of players in L2 like Curtis Nelson, Jack Redshaw & Scott Bennett who all continue to impress at that level & deserve a chance to step up. All these are experienced for their age, would enhance our squad, are getable, cheap & come with potential re sell value. I really hope an Academy kid or two comes through next season as Im already beginning to feel for SC's eventual successor filling this squad with 25-27 yr olds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcofisher Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 The only thing that I can see has actually changed is the ridiculous policy of signing 18 to 24 year olds and just throwing them straight into the first team squad, we all saw what happened with that particular master plan last season, SC is talking purely about the first team squad and any younger signings for the development squad and that's the way it should be and if they are good enough they will get their chance or they can go to Arsenal like Amankwah or Everton like Wilson or Chelsea like Krans. I can't see why its such a ridiculous policy, the players we signed aged 18 -24 for the first team were Derrick Williams, JET, Wagstaff, Pack, Parish and Flint. With the exception of Parish all featured under Coterill a fair bit even Flint before he picked up his injury. JET was a shrewd notching many goals and assists and Derrick Williams was young player of the year. The only two players we signed that were decent that were not in this age group were Osbourne & Fielding. Both being 25 years of age when we signed them. Yet we also signed Harewood (33), Shorey (32), El-Abd (29), Barnett (28) and boy what a breath of fresh air they were. We should be looking at players who have more than two years match experience aged 21-25 in my humble opinion for next season, for example Luke Freeman, even though it is very unlikely now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esmond Million's Bung Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 I can't see why its such a ridiculous policy, the players we signed aged 18 -24 for the first team were Derrick Williams, JET, Wagstaff, Pack, Parish and Flint. With the exception of Parish all featured under Coterill a fair bit even Flint before he picked up his injury. JET was a shrewd notching many goals and assists and Derrick Williams was young player of the year. The only two players we signed that were decent that were not in this age group were Osbourne & Fielding. Both being 25 years of age when we signed them. Yet we also signed Harewood (33), Shorey (32), El-Abd (29), Barnett (28) and boy what a breath of fresh air they were. We should be looking at players who have more than two years match experience aged 21-25 in my humble opinion for next season, for example Luke Freeman, even though it is very unlikely now. it was a ridiculous policy because it wasn't working until, Elliott and Nosworthy were brought in and they combined to bring the best out of Osbourne and Gillett and especially Baldock, there were no leaders in defence and midfield until Elliott and Nosworthy arrived. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcofisher Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 it was a ridiculous policy because it wasn't working until, Elliott and Nosworthy were brought in and they combined to bring the best out of Osbourne and Gillett and especially Baldock, there were no leaders in defence and midfield until Elliott and Nosworthy arrived. I wouldn't say it's a ridiculous policy signing these players as we are better off for having them now, with a years more experience in them they will only likely to be better this year, problem we had last year was signing the wrong experienced players. Sc needs to only look at a couple of experienced players one and midfield and one in defence as you say to add some experience to the spine, pref elliot and nosworthy on one year deals providing they are affordable then start looking at younger talent like Curtis Nelson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esmond Million's Bung Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 I wouldn't say it's a ridiculous policy signing these players as we are better off for having them now, with a years more experience in them they will only likely to be better this year, problem we had last year was signing the wrong experienced players. Sc needs to only look at a couple of experienced players one and midfield and one in defence as you say to add some experience to the spine, pref elliot and nosworthy on one year deals providing they are affordable then start looking at younger talent like Curtis Nelson. if you fully read my original post I am saying exactly what you are and also referenced Freeman, if their good enough their old enough, but the way the policy was implemented last season was utterly ridiculous and it was never going to work and could have ended in relegation from a cesspit into a shithole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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