Boris Throws His Hat In The Ring......

[Red-Robbo]

The population of Cuba - living under rigid socialism - was near to starving when the old USSR collapsed. It was the good old Capitalists of Canada that bailed them out and stopped them from starving.

Very poor example.

Cuba has the longest life expectancy and best literacy rate in the Caribbean. If it was not economically blockaded by the US and its Central American stooge regimes it would be thriving.

Capitalist Haiti - by contrast - is the poorest country in the western hemisphere.

[Mr Mosquito]

Very poor example.

Cuba has the longest life expectancy and best literacy rate in the Caribbean. If it was not economically blockaded by the US and its Central American stooge regimes it would be thriving.

Capitalist Haiti - by contrast - is the poorest country in the western hemisphere.

 

....it's not a poor example, go to Cuba and they'll tell you themselves that it was Canada that saved them. Likewise, the immediate post war socialist regime of Labour (1945-50) was helped by massive donations of beef from Capitalist Argentina. The worst food shortages always seem to occur under socialist regimes with the worst I can think of being in the USSR during the 1930s.

[Mike Litoris]

Here you are Mos, my very last post because the last few have been so difficult not to bite at...

 

Sign up to something like this, you might finally learn something about history and be able to make statements based on accepted fact, sources and considered historical consensus.

 

http://www.open.ac.uk/courses/qualifications/q01

[Red-Robbo]

....it's not a poor example, go to Cuba and they'll tell you themselves that it was Canada that saved them. Likewise, the immediate post war socialist regime of Labour (1945-50) was helped by massive donations of beef from Capitalist Argentina. The worst food shortages always seem to occur under socialist regimes with the worst I can think of being in the USSR during the 1930s.

Russia had massive famines under the Tsar too. The reasons are more complex than just saying "it was a command economy".

Cuba has been blockaded for 53 years, by its biggest market - the regional super-power. They were angry that Castro closed the Mafia-owned casinos.

I've visited both when the Russians were buying sugar and more recently. As I've said, there are many poorer (capitalist) states in the Caribbean, and none with as good health and education provision as Cuba.

[Mr Mosquito]

Russia had massive famines under the Tsar too. The reasons are more complex than just saying "it was a command economy".

Cuba has been blockaded for 53 years, by its biggest market - the regional super-power. They were angry that Castro closed the Mafia-owned casinos.

I've visited both when the Russians were buying sugar and more recently. As I've said, there are many poorer (capitalist) states in the Caribbean, and none with as good health and education provision as Cuba.

 

....don't forget also that the Cubans were going to allow the Russians some bases from which to point missiles at the U.S. Good universal health provision is a great hallmark for the British Labour Party regime of 1945-50 and Castro's regime - I'm not disputing that. What I'm disputing is your reply to EMB relating to Capitalism feeding the world when it's obvious that Capitalism perhaps does too good a job at feeding people - beer bellies and fat arses in the Capitalist West seem to indicate that Capitalism does a good job in feeding people. 

[chipdawg]

....it's not a poor example, go to Cuba and they'll tell you themselves that it was Canada that saved them. Likewise, the immediate post war socialist regime of Labour (1945-50) was helped by massive donations of beef from Capitalist Argentina. The worst food shortages always seem to occur under socialist regimes with the worst I can think of being in the USSR during the 1930s.

Surely donating products or finance from your acquired resources is by definition a socialist enterprise?

[Red-Robbo]

....don't forget also that the Cubans were going to allow the Russians some bases from which to point missiles at the U.S. Good universal health provision is a great hallmark for the British Labour Party regime of 1945-50 and Castro's regime - I'm not disputing that. What I'm disputing is your reply to EMB relating to Capitalism feeding the world when it's obvious that Capitalism perhaps does too good a job at feeding people - beer bellies and fat arses in the Capitalist West seem to indicate that Capitalism does a good job in feeding people.

Not many beer bellies and fat arses in Africa or Latin America (or much of Asia for that matter). They are part of the capitalist world too. That was my point, Gobbers.

[Mr Mosquito]

[Mr Mosquito]

 .....

Not many beer bellies and fat arses in Africa or Latin America (or much of Asia for that matter). They are part of the capitalist world too. That was my point, Gobbers.

 

......I was in Mexico last month and they looked well fed as were the South Americans that were holidaying there. With regard to fat female arses - highly rated in Brazil - you'd know that if you paid more attention to the BCFC ziderheads forum.   Linky, linky....."Any volunteers to be a judge?"   ............

 

http://www.ziderheads.co.uk/ch/index.php?/topic/1769-any-volunteers-to-be-a-judge/

[Red-Robbo]

......I was in Mexico last month and they looked well fed as were the South Americans that were holidaying there. With regard to fat female arses - highly rated in Brazil - you'd know that if you paid more attention to the BCFC ziderheads forum. Linky, linky....."Any volunteers to be a judge?" ............

http://www.ziderheads.co.uk/ch/index.php?/topic/1769-any-volunteers-to-be-a-judge/

Hmm, so your contention is that, say, the average Haiti or Honduran or Bangladeshi is doing alright. And you base this assertion on the fact that you saw a dew fatties when you were at a Mexican holiday resort. Somewhere, 95% of Mexicans could never afford to stay at....

[Mr Mosquito]

Hmm, so your contention is that, say, the average Haiti or Honduran or Bangladeshi is doing alright. And you base this assertion on the fact that you saw a dew fatties when you were at a Mexican holiday resort. Somewhere, 95% of Mexicans could never afford to stay at....

 

It was a 5* hotel - that's the benefit of credit card Capitalism. At the end of the day, the living standards or, rather, calorific intake of the average Haitian or Honduran or Bangladeshi has more to do with themselves and their lifestyles and their own government than Capitalism.

[Red-Robbo]

[chipdawg]

[chipdawg]

It was a 5* hotel - that's the benefit of credit card Capitalism. At the end of the day, the living standards or, rather, calorific intake of the average Haitian or Honduran or Bangladeshi has more to do with themselves and their lifestyles and their own government than Capitalism.

So it's their own fault that the people of Haiti or Bangladesh or Sudan are poor?

[Mr Mosquito]

So it's their own fault that the people of Haiti or Bangladesh or Sudan are poor?

 

....why is it a 'fault'?

[chipdawg]

....why is it a 'fault'?

You implied that they are desperately poor through their own actions and lifestyle choices. Ergo, you implied it was their 'fault'

[Mr Mosquito]

That's not really a reply to what I said, nor to the wider point which is there isn't really any such thing as a 'capitalist' or 'socialist' society in the western world. To be honest, I don't think you actually read anything that anyone actually posts in response to you and if you do you ignore it. We just get a constant stream of the same old drivel you always post. Obviously you're entitled to your opinions but I pity your lack of perspective or ability to actually consider anything outside your narrow and (it has to be said) extreme world view

 

Your perceptions/perspectives seem different to mine. For instance, I didn't say it, I wrote it.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

"Socialism" is a fairly broad term though Es, in the same way that "Capitalism" is. I'm not sure that either can be entirely dismissed in a contrite sentence

 

Well you will have take that up with Winston Churchill, it's his quote not mine.

[Mr Mosquito]

You implied that they are desperately poor through their own actions and lifestyle choices. Ergo, you implied it was their 'fault'

 

If you're that bothered in the affairs of other countries then why don't you do something about it? You could start by ringing their respective embassies first and give your views on the way you believe they should be running their countries and how you believe they should be living their lives. You could get over there with BBC Red-Robbo and a camera crew. Lots of delightful options for you there.

[chipdawg]

Your perceptions/perspectives seem different to mine. For instance, I didn't say it, I wrote it.

What a purile response

[chipdawg]

Well you will have take that up with Winston Churchill, it's his quote not mine.

If only I could

[chipdawg]

If you're that bothered in the affairs of other countries then why don't you do something about it? You could start by ringing their respective embassies first and give your views on the way you believe they should be running their countries and how you believe they should be living their lives. You could get over there with BBC Red-Robbo and a camera crew. Lots of delightful options for you there.

Again, a bizarre response which bares no resemblance to the thread of the conversation and makes no sense

[Mr Mosquito]

[Red-Robbo]

If you're that bothered in the affairs of other countries then why don't you do something about it? You could start by ringing their respective embassies first and give your views on the way you believe they should be running their countries and how you believe they should be living their lives. You could get over there with BBC Red-Robbo and a camera crew. Lots of delightful options for you there.

I'm not sure who BBC Red Robbo is, Civil Service Goblin? Pray elucidate...

[Esmond Million's Bung]

Could not disagree more.

 

Socialism is the philosophy of fairness, the creed of equality and the gospel of community. Capitalism is the philosophy of greed, of manipulation, of self interest and conspiracy to defraud.

 

The constant references to New Labour do little for your argument either. Nobody with any ounce of political or historical knowledge would ever describe the Labour party of Tony Blair and Gordon Brown as socialist. Labour socialism was dealt a huge blow following the death of Smith. Ed Milliband is an improvement on Blair, but is also too concerned with pandering to the tabloid generation where appearance and image replaces policy as important. 

 

Genuine socialists are interested in fairness, equality, providing services to all those who require it. Why anyone has a problem with those aims is so far beyond anything I can comprehend. 

 

Capitalism is what turned football into the tragic, self obsessed, full of 'diving pussies' game it has become... Capitalism is what encouraged the greed of the banking sector that led to a worldwide financial meltdown that is now seeing over a million British people using food banks. Capitalism and market forces have ensured that huge numbers who are in work are now in poverty and forced to claim additional support from the Welfare state.

 

Capitalism works for the 1% and lets the rest of us squabble over gruel and stale bread. 

 

Well a man far more intelligent than me an a one time organiser of the boiler makers union at Charlie Hill's shipyard in Bristol and devout marxist once told me, 'marxism is a great dream that will never work because by it's very nature it invites corruption and eventually that corruption will end in violence. Socialism is another failed dream because it needs the support of big business to succeed and that will never happen, there is only one place on earth where socialism is alive, well and working and that is in Israel in it's Kibbutz communities".

 

As for your new labour defence, i'm sorry re-writing history won't change anybody's perception of labour new or old, because too many of them still hold positions of power in Ed's labour party including Ed himself, he and his cronies attempting to show that they have suddenly re-found their socialist mojo won't wash because most people don't believe them and know that Ed is only the leader because of the unions and if he doesn't win the next election will be replaced by somebody Blair like who might, sadly too many still have blood on their hands.

[Mr Mosquito]

What a purile response

 

It's 'puerile' not purile. Go get an education.

[Red-Robbo]

Or bring in socialism for them and after a bloody civil war no doubt they'll still be picking through shit on a rubbish dump. With regard to you being the caring face of capitalism - well good for you and well done - you're a decent free market entrepreneur.

I merely point out that capitalism is a flawed system from many people's perception.

Hard to dispute that,I'd have thought, and hard, when you look through things like the Sunday Times rich list to argue that many there actually deserve (still less need) the capital they've accumulated.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

I merely point out that capitalism is a flawed system from many people's perception.

Hard to dispute that,I'd have thought, and hard, when you look through things like the Sunday Times rich list to argue that many there actually deserve (still less need) the capital they've accumulated.

 

it's all flawed, tories feed their rich buddies, socialists try to become rich so that they can be fed by the rich buddies who are fed by the tories and liberals are happy as long as it's not them being murdered in their homes by the hordes of criminals whose human rights they have protected.

[Red-Robbo]

it's all flawed, tories feed their rich buddies, socialists try to become rich so that they can be fed by the rich buddies who are fed by the tories and liberals are happy as long as it's not them being murdered in their homes by the hordes of criminals whose human rights they have protected.

I think we might have something we agree upon there, my friend.

[chipdawg]