Sod To Liverpool?

[Cowshed]

The question EMB has asked you've not answered at all.

And for every Swansea or Southampton there's& four or five clubs that cannot shake it off in spite of relegations... Leeds, Pompey, Bradford, Luton, Plymouth etc etc etc. SOD was not stopping the rot and;had we not gotten rid I think we would have faced the exact same fate as those in that list, certainly not Swansea or Soton.

The question was uneven as is with respect your post.

Bristol City was being ran like Pompey e.g 120% and more past its income.

The five pillars while having a degree of cod project about it moved City away from hemorrhaging money to manageable debt / restructured debt via Mr Lansdown and a more pragmatic view of the clubs playing overheads.

So City could not have faced the very same fate as Pompey because Portsmouth imploded due to the financial stupidity of its owners. It is not credible to suggest Mr Lansdown would do the same to Bristol City.

I was unaware that the other clubs you have mentioned have also adopted the model used at Southampton because no club in the UK has from its development centres e.g Bath/Keynsham to the Staplewood Campus to the sci fi like black box and its study of player performance.

[Guest]

Erm....first sentence...

 

How the hell can you compare us with that list of teams....have you seen how they've tried to come back? I despair sometimes....no offence....but have you followed their recent history compared with ours?

 

You take stock and fix it... .cheers for that.

 

Spudski, you should note at no point I drew any comparisons. Not one. Just highlighting that relegation does not always lead to a shedding of the skin and starting again.

 

Equally I despair sometimes.... no offence... but Soton? We have never been able to produce players regularly to stand on our own feet. Do you know their history to ours? How could we drop down to league one like they did and expect our academy to produce stars to get money like Bale or Walcott or players like Lalana to stick with us to the top.... Plus they already had their shiney new stadium built and corporate facilities. One club city.

 

You didn't compare us to Soton either you just used them as an example. Hence why I never stated the above...

[Guest]

The question was uneven as is with respect your post.

Bristol City was being ran like Pompey e.g 120% and more past its income.

The five pillars while having a degree of cod project about it moved City away from hemorrhaging money to manageable debt / restructured debt via Mr Lansdown and a more pragmatic view of the clubs playing overheads.

So City could not have faced the very same fate as Pompey because Portsmouth imploded due to the financial stupidity of its owners. It is not credible to suggest Mr Lansdown would do the same to Bristol City.

I was unaware that the other clubs you have mentioned have also adopted the model used at Southampton because no club in the UK has from its development centres e.g Bath/Keynsham to the Staplewood Campus to the sci fi like black box and its study of player performance.

 

See my response. I did not compare.

 

It's not credible to suggest Mr Lansdown would do the same, equally like Warner at Blackburn, equally like Whelen and Wigan and what awaits them around the corner.

[John Galley]

To all Liverpool fans, "you think things are bad now, you wait". I get sick and fed up of fans saying, he was turning things around. The man had no charisma and for a so called coach he had no man management skills, he said in the media Flint was not worth the money we paid for him, that is not how to build a players confidence and how wrong he was!! The man dished up the worst football I have seen in my 55 years watching the club and take it from me there were some bad times.

[AshtonGreat]

Like anything....you look at where it's failing and try to fix it.

 

You only have to look at the like of Swansea and Southampton to see that taking one step back, can lead to many steps going forward.

 

Personally, I think relegation was the best thing for us. We are far stronger now since relegation.

 

It enabled us to change many things and rebuild....something we would have struggled to do if we had stayed up and continued in the same vein.

 

We were a rudderless ship, with overpaid pros who were just going through the motions, as well as staff.

Throwing money at it regardless.

 

At least when SoD came here, he, the Board and SL went about a way of rectifying the situation, and put a plan in practice...a blueprint if you like.

 

Burt and Pemberton were brought in and successfully work with SC now. Tinnion, also in now for recruitment. New Scouts... etc. The likes of Wade Elliott being persuaded to give his experience to the under 21's....all good things.

 

Of course results matter...but it's making them sustainable and creating a platform to keep going. Results don't matter if they only last for a couple seasons, and you end up spiralling out of control....which we were.

 

You ask any Swansea or Southampton fan as to whether they enjoyed relegation at the time and they would have said 'No'.

But ask them now....having seen how they made changes and made a plan of action....then they would have welcomed it, if they knew it would lead to where they are now.

 

Shouldn't that say 'since SOD left'?

[Cowshed]

See my response. I did not compare.

It's not credible to suggest Mr Lansdown would do the same, equally like Warner at Blackburn, equally like Whelen and Wigan and what awaits them around the corner.

I do not understand your post.

"I think we would have faced the exact same fate as those in that list" was a comparison.

Mr Lansdown has stated he will not do anything to endanger Bristol City = Sell to a nutcase.

[Northern Red]

The 'stupid question' clip is generating much comment from Liverpool fans on social media.

[GodEmperor Palpatine]

No he never. Lets not rewrite history. SoD wad an abject failure at this club.

Him and Rogers are suited together, they are a pair of footballing pseudo intellects, Rodgers in particular thinks that by talking slowly and in a media trained way gives him an air of superiority. Him and Sod are footballing fraudsters who have taken in gullible fans who read the broadsheets and think they are a cut above other fans and yet these fans have probably never kicked a ball in their lives and no absolute nothing about the game, yet they can write a blog and they convince themselves that they some sort of footballing oracle.

 

Rogers is a very good manager, how can he and SOD be taking in 'gullible' fans?

 

His overall win record is 45%, with Liverpool  51% (2nd place finish to boot) and led Swansea to the PL by playing very good football. Not bad for a footballing fraudster.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

Rogers is a very good manager, how can he and SOD be taking in 'gullible' fans?

 

His overall win record is 45%, with Liverpool  51% (2nd place finish to boot) and led Swansea to the PL by playing very good football. Not bad for a footballing fraudster.

 

All very true and then the ego took over and he believed he could be the messiah who tamed Blooper Mario, you know where Mourhinho and Mancini failed and he spunked over 100 mil on mainly rubbish and took them backwards and couldn't take 4th spot from a mainly awful Manu side.

[GodEmperor Palpatine]

All very true and then the ego took over and he believed he could be the messiah who tamed Blooper Mario, you know where Mourhinho and Mancini failed and he spunked over 100 mil on mainly rubbish and took them backwards and couldn't take 4th spot from a mainly awful Manu side.

 

Can't entirely agree on this Es, while he did gamble on Mario (and failed) and did spend 100M, for me he signed some talented young players who have plenty of scope to become world class (Markovic and Can spring to mind) 

 

I just think labelling him a football fraudster is very OTT considering he has with the exception of Reading been very successful.

 

Liverpools big problem was after selling Suarez, they lost Sturridge for the majority of the season and of course a 50 goal partnership... gone.

[Slippin cider]

Was possibly THE most boring human being I've encountered! ....his monotone interviews used to send me into a coma after 2.3 seconds! ....his style .... If you can call it that .....was mundane and uninteresting ....like him!

[Guest]

I do not understand your post.

"I think we would have faced the exact same fate as those in that list" was a comparison.

Mr Lansdown has stated he will not do anything to endanger Bristol City = Sell to a nutcase.

I don't really know how I can explain it any differently without coming across patronising, which is certainly not the intention.

I am talking about fate. You are talking about cause. They're very different things. The fate I was talking about was years of failing to make up the lost ground. The cause for the fall will be different, just as it was for each of those clubs.

Again I stand by it, there was no comparison of causes so that someone's cause was financial default whereas ours may have been mismanagement is a total irrelevance to the post I made.

[GodEmperor Palpatine]

Was possibly THE most boring human being I've encountered! ....his monotone interviews used to send me into a coma after 2.3 seconds! ....his style .... If you can call it that .....was mundane and uninteresting ....like him!

 

Boring yet a very good coach, probably will be rarely in front of the media.

[Red-Robbo]

Boring yet a very good coach, probably will be rarely in front of the media.

 

If he was such a good coach, DWC, how come we couldn't organise ourselves to save our lives under him?

 

Defending or taking set pieces, keeping possession at throw ins, even basic man marking and ability to trap the bloody ball - no one knew WTF they were supposed to be doing during the SOD era.  Yet the same lackadasical, disorganised mess suddenly did look organised under Cotterill.

 

A good coach improves players' skill sets, yet players at City seemed to go backwards under Sean.

 

Brendan Rodgers can believe what he likes. We saw just how good a coach SOD was week-in, week-out - and the results were as lacklustre as his personality. 

[GodEmperor Palpatine]

If he was such a good coach, DWC, how come we couldn't organise ourselves to save our lives under him?

 

Defending or taking set pieces, keeping possession at throw ins, even basic man marking and ability to trap the bloody ball - no one knew WTF they were supposed to be doing during the SOD era.  Yet the same lackadasical, disorganised mess suddenly did look organised under Cotterill.

 

A good coach improves players' skill sets, yet players at City seemed to go backwards under Sean.

 

Brendan Rodgers can believe what he likes. We saw just how good a coach SOD was week-in, week-out - and the results were as lacklustre as his personality. 

 

Scoring wasnt an issue though Robbo, scored plenty. Defending was a problem and yes individual mistakes cost us points but some of our build up play was impressive. O'Driscolls biggest problem was he set us up not to lose rather than go for the juggular of teams (that's my take anyway)

[Red-Robbo]

Scoring wasnt an issue though Robbo, scored plenty. Defending was a problem and yes individual mistakes cost us points but some of our build up play was impressive. O'Driscolls biggest problem was he set us up not to lose rather than go for the juggular of teams (that's my take anyway)

Hmmmmm - scoring less than the opposition, that I believe was his problem.

My take as I've said before, is O'Driscoll enjoyed moderate success with his first managerial job and a reasonable though not spectacular level of success in his second.

These slight triumphs led to him being over-praised - so over-high expectations were piled on him, and that praise also went to his head. He came to regard himself as a football savant and disregarded even the evidence of his own eyes at matches. "It should work in theory - I just need plugging away in the same vein. I WILL be proved right."

So I'm not one of those who say he is a shit manager. He clearly was a half-decent manager who lost his way and his mojo.

He was shit for us. We got him at the wrong time.

Whether he's learned from his mistakes - Pulis style - remains to be seen.

[spudski]

[Cowshed]

I don't really know how I can explain it any differently without coming across patronising, which is certainly not the intention.

I am talking about fate. You are talking about cause. They're very different things. The fate I was talking about was years of failing to make up the lost ground. The cause for the fall will be different, just as it was for each of those clubs.

Again I stand by it, there was no comparison of causes so that someone's cause was financial default whereas ours may have been mismanagement is a total irrelevance to the post I made.

Fate and luck does not come into it. It is not fate that gets clubs spending wildly beyond their means and losing tens of millions like Bristol City did.

It is also not fate that Southampton can come back from the dead as they did. Southampton had a structure in place that meant they could still consistently provide quality academy graduates for the XI post administration.

City created their own lost ground by having no long term strategy beyond throwing money around at often mediocre players. That type of thinking hopefully has now ended.

[Guest]

Fate and luck does not come into it. It is not fate that gets clubs spending wildly beyond their means and losing tens of millions like Bristol City did.

It is also not fate that Southampton can come back from the dead as they did. Southampton had a structure in place that meant they could still consistently provide quality academy graduates for the XI post administration.

City created their own lost ground by having no long term strategy beyond throwing money around at often mediocre players. That type of thinking hopefully has now ended.

Sigh. Clearly I was not using fate in the sense of mythical preordained luck, if there was any doubt it was rather bloody clear when I mentioned our cause would be mismanagement. I was using fate in the colloquial.

I shall not respond to you further on this as rather than acknowledge a misunderstanding of the point, perhaps through my mistake in writing conversationally rather than concisely, you seem intent to put words in to my mouth to suggest I was saying something entirely different, even when I'd already further explained myself, twice.

[GrahamC]

No surprise to see the usual suspects out to support their messiah.

I think he'll be a good fit with Rodgers, who is also thought by many to be far smarter than he clearly actually is.

I'm just very grateful we now have a manager who is far smarter than he appears, as opposed to the other way around...

[Slippin cider]

Scoring wasnt an issue though Robbo, scored plenty. Defending was a problem and yes individual mistakes cost us points but some of our build up play was impressive. O'Driscolls biggest problem was he set us up not to lose rather than go for the juggular of teams (that's my take anyway)

Set us up not to lose??? ....2 wins from 18 games....says it all...he wasn't for us, that's not to say that he might not be right for another team ...hmmmm.

[spudski]

No surprise to see the usual suspects out to support their messiah.

I think he'll be a good fit with Rodgers, who is also thought by many to be far smarter than he clearly actually is.

I'm just very grateful we now have a manager who is far smarter than he appears, as opposed to the other way around...

Likewise....it's the usual suspects talking rubbish about the fella.

 

There is a phobia by many football fans, and life in general....of managers who speak eloquently and intelligently. It scares them...makes them feel inadequate, because they don't understand what they are talking about or trying to do.

 

You've only got to read comments about Brendan Rogers by Liverpool fans....similar to what certain fans thought of SoD.

Similar can be said about Wenger, Laudrup, Mancini, Moyes,Villas Boas to name a few...

 

It's very apparent, that many football fans in this Country are still living in the dark ages when it comes to how football clubs are run and how squads are created.

 

They read the Sun and football forums, and think they know better than those who are working in the game 24/7.

 

As long as you've got players and managers showing 'passion' then it's all ok it seems.

 

You could have the football equivalent of Da Vinci, Newton, Galileo, Michelangelo and Hawkin as your manager, and still football fans would be saying....'I can't understand a ******* word he's talking about, and he has no bloomin personality....and why don't they just hump it into the box ffs'  

 

I really do get the impression many fans are scared of intelligent managers who try to communicate what they are trying to do.

 

Just an observation.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

Likewise....it's the usual suspects talking rubbish about the fella.

 

There is a phobia by many football fans, and life in general....of managers who speak eloquently and intelligently. It scares them...makes them feel inadequate, because they don't understand what they are talking about or trying to do.

 

You've only got to read comments about Brendan Rogers by Liverpool fans....similar to what certain fans thought of SoD.

Similar can be said about Wenger, Laudrup, Mancini, Moyes,Villas Boas to name a few...

 

It's very apparent, that many football fans in this Country are still living in the dark ages when it comes to how football clubs are run and how squads are created.

 

They read the Sun and football forums, and think they know better than those who are working in the game 24/7.

 

As long as you've got players and managers showing 'passion' then it's all ok it seems.

 

You could have the football equivalent of Da Vinci, Newton, Galileo, Michelangelo and Hawkin as your manager, and still football fans would be saying....'I can't understand a ******* word he's talking about, and he has no bloomin personality....and why don't they just hump it into the box ffs'  

 

I really do get the impression many fans are scared of intelligent managers who try to communicate what they are trying to do.

 

Just an observation.

 

if only we all had your insight.

[GrahamC]

[Guest]

Passionate managers sacked in the last few months with borderline nil support: Paul Lambert, Gus Poyet, John Carver, Malky Mackay, Shaun Derry, Holloway.

Passionate football persons who have nil support roundly: Paul Ince, Dean Saunders and the man widely known mainly for his passion, Stuart Pearce.

You're wrong Spudski. Football fans fear incompetence, not intelligence and passion gets you nowhere without substance.

[Red Rag]

The bloke was bloody useless, talked in riddles, never accepted responsibility for the sh1te that was produced on the pitch week in week out and allowed a team to whimper its way to relegation with 10 games to go.

Just an observation.

[spudski]

[Red Exile]

[spudski]

Passionate managers sacked in the last few months with borderline nil support: Paul Lambert, Gus Poyet, John Carver, Malky Mackay, Shaun Derry, Holloway.

Passionate football persons who have nil support roundly: Paul Ince, Dean Saunders and the man widely known mainly for his passion, Stuart Pearce.

You're wrong Spudski. Football fans fear incompetence, not intelligence and passion gets you nowhere without substance.

What has football managers being sacked, got to do with football mangers not being liked by fans.

 

How can fans fear the likes of Rogers when he has a win rate for the Club of 51%...it doesn't make sense.

 

I know i'm not wrong, as I can see many comments just made on this forum, that back up my thoughts.

 

More comments were made about SoD's comments and his personality than the lack of points....people just didn't like him. He was never going to win here.

[Guest]

Spudski, just another point I'd be interested in your thoughts. You had a line above along the lines of 'who is the average fan to question professionals working in the game'. It's a fair point.

However bear in mind football isn't a science and it's beauty is its simplicity. Because Sir Bobby Robson, a man I hold in highest regard, shunned the sort of view you preach about fans' ability to understand the game we have Jose Mourinho and Andre Villas Boas. I'm not making the point that anyone here has that potential, far from it, just that your instant rebuttal is in my opinion very short sighted.

Furthermore, of those 'in the game' overwhelmingly they come from a pool of ex professionals. Do you consider those better placed than say someone who has a sports management degree and some related experience? Of most interest to me,

do you think listening to the average pro's post match interviews and press interviews that you couldn't have a reasonable debate or conversation with them?