Just Maybe

[samo II]

Anyone not in a coma for the full extend of last season will realise LJ is not out of his depth.

We've got results in two games (three if we count the cup match) were we've played poor, then narrowly lost to a pair of sides who will undoubtably be bothering the top six if not top two in May, limiting them to a goal a piece.

Last year he got the team producing promotion-level form in order to keep us up, and is still working to get this team performing how he wants now he's brought in what I think can be agreed are better quality players (O'Neil certainty can be considered an improvement).

In my mind, I've never thought we would be top half material this season, unless we gelled immediately, and the squad was competely fit and firing (Smith is undoubtably a miss, our forward line is lacking options, and our right back position is a clear weak spot).  I'm pleased we look as coherent as we do, and fully believe that after these trio of games against relegated teams, we'll be a real threat to many sides.

I suspect many already questioning if LJ can cut it as our manager aren't predisposed to giving him an inch, and it's less to do with what is actually happning on the pitch.

[JoeAman08]

4 hours ago, AshtonGreat said:

He was awful first half

Disagree. I thought he was quality all game. Kept possesion on the ball against a physical midfield for the most part. Competed defensively and in the air. Always looked to get the ball forward. Everyone see the game differently and I appreciate that but I thought from a consistency standpoint he was one of our better players. Gary O'Neil, Hordor, Flint, Golbounre and Reid all put in good shifts and I didn't see them make too many mistakes if any. Everyone else was in and out of the game at times. 

[Jack Dawe]

12 hours ago, frenchred said:

Johnson is a little bit out of his depth?

 

Poor starting line up, very poor substitutions, say what you like about Matthews you bought him, you played him and sold our best right back!

Thought we gave Newcastle far too much respect, they were not that oood!

Maybe. Maybe not. Too early to tell, for me at least.

[AshtonGreat]

11 minutes ago, JoeAman08 said:

Disagree. I thought he was quality all game. Kept possesion on the ball against a physical midfield for the most part. Competed defensively and in the air. Always looked to get the ball forward. Everyone see the game differently and I appreciate that but I thought from a consistency standpoint he was one of our better players. Gary O'Neil, Hordor, Flint, Golbounre and Reid all put in good shifts and I didn't see them make too many mistakes if any. Everyone else was in and out of the game at times. 

Fair enough but I didn't get that impression at all. Reid looked lightweight and was continually giving the ball away. I agree with you on the others though

[JoeAman08]

1 minute ago, AshtonGreat said:

Fair enough but I didn't get that impression at all. Reid looked lightweight and was continually giving the ball away. I agree with you on the others though

He got knocked off the ball a few times but not nearly as much as he did against bigger midfielder last year. Last year against Hull and West Brom for example he was physically dominated time and time again. Yesterday much much less and against a physical midfield. You have to take that with Bobby. He's so forward thinking and a good technical footballer. You have to know going in he'll get bumped off it from time to time and yesterday it didn't happen as much as I expected. So it was positive for me. Think it's what helped give us our chances. We may not have created as much with Pack on who I expected to start. Good we can have this debate now though. Last season there was no debate. We had our starters and Bobby on the bench and that's it. 

[EstoniaTallinnRed]

2 hours ago, Iron Man said:

Amazing, absolutely amazing. We lose 1-0 to a team worth over £45 million, match them toe for toe, even their own manager said we played well and will do well this season, praising Johnson before and after the game. I'm sure you know more than Rafa Benitez though.

Matthews, going by Spudski's comments on another thread wasn't bothered about getting fit in pre season and this is what irked Johnson.

Yes, I more or less said this in another thread about Mathews, surely he knew he would probably come to us again this season on loan, so IMHO the fact that he was not fit was very unprofessional on his part.  LJ said on RB after being asked about him,  that he had his own thoughts about the situation and didn't want to comment. Still we all know he was pissed off and who can blame him.

[Sargent Pepper]

Forgetting our play off form with someone else's squad last season we are 4 league games in & have 6 points, only losing narrowly to two massive clubs with performances improving by the week. Not to mention he got us through to the 2nd round of the league cup for the first time in about 100 years, and people are claiming the manager is out of his depth?

This is remarkable even for otib standards. 

[Meh]

12 hours ago, frenchred said:

Happy to be in minority of one, better that than a sheep

I only intended reading this thread as it was highly amusing but have to say - this is a silly comment that does you no favours in your argument.

It is not being a sheep to agree with a popular opinion provided you are following your own thoughts and not just trying to get likes on your post - you just can't seem to accept that the majority think you are wrong.

Enjoyable thread though so all good 

[Eastend]

The day that LJ is out of his depth is the day we sign Ballotelli, Joey Barton, Andre Gray and replace LJ with Moyes.

 

in other words....a silly statement at this moment in time

[cidered abroad]

Johnson is learning about management and tactics at this level. Pemberton continues to increase his knowledge of coaching today's players.

The squad is learning every game what/when to do, what/when not to do. Everybody has good days at work and bad days when one should have stayed in bed.

If a manager never changes anything such as formation, he will never know if it's better or worse. We are in a period of transition and building for the future. We have players who may not be consistent or talented enough to succeed at this level, but one thing is not in doubt. To my eyes, we have a management team and a squad of players that are trying all the time to do their best.

Unfounded rants about the Head Coach or any individual player are unwarranted and unwelcome.

Did Frenchred expect us to outplay Newcastle? Were we outplayed by Newcastle? No, we were not but Newcastle are experienced and talented enough to get a goal in front and then close up the game so that we had only rare glimpses of their goal in the second half. Frustrating but not entirely unexpected. My greatest comfort from yesterday is that if this game had been played twelve months ago, we would have been hammered unmercifully in the way that even a poor Fulham team did.

So I'm disappointed as I always am when City lose, but certainly not discouraged that we will be around mid table come the end of April 2017. And Lee Johnson will still be making decisions and choices at Bristol City that some don't like and others think are brilliant.  

[Northern Red]

1 hour ago, samo II said:

I suspect many already questioning if LJ can cut it as our manager aren't predisposed to giving him an inch, and it's less to do with what is actually happning on the pitch.

Almost certainly. 

[Alessandro]

12 hours ago, frenchred said:

Happy to be in minority of one, better that than a sheep

Classic! Yep, the majority of people don't jump off buildings for a reason. Stupid sheep, all following each other and not jumping off buildings.

You go ahead and be an individual. Jump, but at least you won't be a sheep. 

[Chairman Mao]

13 hours ago, frenchred said:

Johnson is a little bit out of his depth?

 

Poor starting line up, very poor substitutions, say what you like about Matthews you bought him, you played him and sold our best right back!

Thought we gave Newcastle far too much respect, they were not that oood!

**** me. We lose 1-0 to a side with £££ of parachute payments, managed by someone who is a Champions League winner, La Liga winner, FA Cup winner with a £12m signing comming off the bench. Our record signing is £2.25m... And and our manager is out of his depth

What tops it off is your probably one of those defending Cotts during January. Last season we had 7 points after 10 games with an abject transfer window to boot and inept displays.

This year we have 6 points after 4, win in the cup, good players in, and we've already played 2 of the best teams in the division. You are clueless and probably need to take a break from the forum for a few weeks.

 

 

 

[Alessandro]

LJ has got us organised.

LJ is building a team that is comfortable in possession and can be tactically flexible.

We didn't fully gel against Wigan or Burton, but got the results. We've improved greatly against Norwich and Newcastle, but came up against better teams. You can be the best tactician in the world, but we simply don't have the quality to match those two sides YET.

Signs are good and I expect us to beat Villa next weekend. 

[Merrick's Marvels]

Just maybe the OP doesn't know his fundament from his olecranon. Just maybe.

[Lanterne Rouge]

4 hours ago, Merrick's Marvels said:

Just maybe the OP doesn't know his fundament from his olecranon. Just maybe.

Just maybe it`s the usual suspects crawling out of the woodwork after we`ve lost two on the bounce. Just maybe.

[bs3]

18 hours ago, frenchred said:

Johnson is a little bit out of his depth?

 

Poor starting line up, very poor substitutions, say what you like about Matthews you bought him, you played him and sold our best right back!

Thought we gave Newcastle far too much respect, they were not that oood!

Let's see where we are at Christmas. 

New players and new team selection takes a while to settle in.

However I don't  totally agree with folks who say LJ is still learning , yes he  his a young manager and can and will improve but this is his 3rd job.

I wouldn't go as far to say he is out of his depth but he still had a lot of work to do to make a success of things.

 

[Phileas Fogg]

2 minutes ago, bs3 said:

Let's see where we are at Christmas. 

New players and new team selection takes a while to settle in.

However I don't  totally agree with folks who say LJ is still learning , yes he  his a young manager and can and will improve but this is his 3rd job.

I wouldn't go as far to say he is out of his depth but he still had a lot of work to do to make a success of things.

 

I bet you still learned things in your third job. Management is a job where you get better with age, learning what works and what doesn't. 

[bs3]

Just now, Phileas Fogg said:

I bet you still learned things in your third job. Management is a job where you get better with age, learning what works and what doesn't. 

Of course your right, I was just pointing he he not totally new to this management job. 

Its not like a Tinion or Milen situation where it was their first jobs in management .

[Port Said Red]

14 hours ago, bs3 said:

Of course your right, I was just pointing he he not totally new to this management job. 

Its not like a Tinion or Milen situation where it was their first jobs in management .

No but he wont have come up against Champions League winning Managers or teams that can bring England internationals off the bench to shore things up for the last 10 minutes.

[Super]

I don't think he is out of his depth but selling Ayling and keeping Little as well as persisting in Freeman are crazy decisions.

[Port Said Red]

12 minutes ago, Super said:

I don't think he is out of his depth but selling Ayling and keeping Little as well as persisting in Freeman are crazy decisions.

But how does it work if Ayling wants to leave and there is a buyer that is willing to pay for him and that Little is happy to stay/nobody is willing pay a decent price for him? I don't think it's like buying and selling an item of furniture. And I thought Freeman showed signs of improvement on Saturday (clearly contrary to those who have already decided he's crap), I think both just need more confidence which comes from playing.

[Andy082005]

On Saturday, August 20, 2016 at 23:13, 29AR said:

You've had a 'mare here mate.

maybe you could have said Johnson had a bad day at the office, maybe - but you'd be wrong, but to say out of his depth is up there with Thatch and his booing. 

To be fair....I still think its to early to tell whether he is out of his depth. 

Lets see where we are come the end of the season

[Super]

3 minutes ago, Port Said Red said:

But how does it work if Ayling wants to leave and there is a buyer that is willing to pay for him and that Little is happy to stay/nobody is willing pay a decent price for him? I don't think it's like buying and selling an item of furniture. And I thought Freeman showed signs of improvement on Saturday (clearly contrary to those who have already decided he's crap), I think both just need more confidence which comes from playing.

Signs of improvement for about 20 minutes his second half display was embarrassing.

[Ian M]

On 20 August 2016 at 22:56, frenchred said:

Johnson is a little bit out of his depth?

 

Poor starting line up, very poor substitutions, say what you like about Matthews you bought him, you played him and sold our best right back!

Thought we gave Newcastle far too much respect, they were not that oood!

@frenchred I sense you are warming to "Little Lee". You started off pretty convinced he was the cheap option, worse than Cotts and definitely not the right man for the role and now you merely think he is "maybe" out of his depth. Can't wait to see the thread you start in another 6 months calling him an average Championship manager

 

[Port Said Red]

2 minutes ago, Super said:

Signs of improvement for about 20 minutes his second half display was embarrassing.

So, signs then, lets hope his performance improves for another 20 minutes beyond that and so on........

[Super]

1 minute ago, Port Said Red said:

So, signs then, lets hope his performance improves for another 20 minutes beyond that and so on........

Don't you think he's had enough chances? Not like it's just 4 games is it?

[Port Said Red]

1 minute ago, Super said:

Don't you think he's had enough chances? Not like it's just 4 games is it?

No I don't, he has had years of playing a certain way, perhaps through youth level etc and then he hits a new level that requires, and has a Manager who wants, something different. He has to unlearn everything, which I see signs of, but it is human nature to revert to your old habits in certain circumstances, what we need is those 20 minute spells to become the norm for the whole game.

I have seen similar things with players before, Alan Walsh and Mark Gavin are prime examples, when they stepped up through the leagues they found they couldn't beat players with a run, they learned how to create space in a couple of strides. I am sure if forums like this had been around at the time there would have been posters begging us to get rid of them too.

[flipflopcity]

IMO LJ is NOT out of his depth... if you listen to some of his talks to the press etc, some of his inovations in training are impressive. As others have said, his management allowd us to stay up last year and I think we will do OK this. We certainly are not the finished article but are learning on the hoof.

It would be interesting to know where  the posters on the forum sit as I think we all get different perspectives depending on where we view the game from. For instance, last year I was in the SS having been moved from the WS ( before that I was a DS sth.) I am now back in the WS Lower but chose to try out the Upper against Newcastle. My mate was in the SS and sid we should have had a Pen.. I couldn't see it, so I think this why we all have contrasting views.

For what its worth.. I thought we played better than previous games this season against a tight defenceive team. My two critcical points was that we didn't cross the ball enough from the wings when we got free, and the goal was conceeded because Matthews was unable to track his runner(Gayle) who scored because he was not fit enough. (not the Matthews from last year).

COYR ..onwards and upwards.. support is what the team and management need .

[Buckeyed]

I know it's normal for OTIB to have a meltdown after a defeat, however can we remember that we played team that is full of players who wouldn't look out of place in a premier league team. Newcastle's defence alone cost them close to £30m, the midfield even more - is it any surprise that we struggled to break them down. 

If we were told before the season started that we would be mid-table after playing the top teams I am sure many of us would have been happy.