Marina's Rolls Royce Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 OTIB is never more popular than when things are going wrong at BCFC. Not only do we get a good number of newbies but also the return of posters who love to get involved in a witch hunt whilst having no real opinion when things are going right. The problem I have with these newbies and serial dissenters is that I'm really not sure if they are fans of BCFC or just joining in a social media bullying circus. Comments like " if (insert name here) is appointed then I'll vote with my feet" or "if LJ remains then I'll not renew my season ticket" " I'm not supporting City anymore if we go down" are from "fans" who may very well never go near BS3- ever. In fact some of the biggest critics of all things BCFC never actually attend matches or do so once or twice a season depending on league position . I also know ( through their own integrity on here) that some of the most popular posters are not regulars at Ashton Gate or away matches. This is often for geographical , health, work or financial reasons. One thing is for sure- you can't genuinely form an accurate assessment of a player, team , manager or stadium without actually attending matches on a regular basis. And certainly not from listening to the radio , reading BEP and shouting on a forum. Or looking at the league table in isolation. So when we get "beaten" by Derby 3-3 and I see the animosity but then read the excellent @Olé away reports ( who I have to say must be congratulated in his honest assessments) or comments from @Dollymarie who puts her heart and soul into the club along with so many others- I take notice and take it seriously whether I agree or not. When some poster demands this or that - a manager to be sacked, an owner to be hounded out or a player to be dropped then that's fine too....... Provided they actually are a Bristol City supporter and can see with their own eyes what is going on more than just looking at the result after the final whistle. Not just gobbing off about a club they have little association with other than on social media from their bedroom/sofa. 382 "supporters" signing a petition- only the most deluded would take that seriously. How many of those actually attend football matches let alone City matches? My point is this: Surely a genuine supporter/fan will attend matches regularly if they can or better still- hold a Season Ticket? When fan's say " without us there is no club". I agree wholeheartedly but only if those fans actually go to the matches. If you don't or rarely go then why get involved with 'Flint needs a rest' or 'drop Fielding etc' or 'pathetic result and pathetic manager' about a game I've just seen where we played very well but failed to win. How many times have you met a football fan who says" I support ( insert name here)" yet when you ask the last time they attended a match( or even the name of their right back etc).........."errr- well....I don't really get the chance to go". On OTIB we are currently experiencing some pretty polarised opinion- namely that LJ was,is and always shall be a ( insert here) and that SL is, has and always shall be clueless. And if those are the genuinely held opinions of a regular supporter who attends games and/or contributes to BCFC then fair enough. I respect your opinion but don't agree with all of it. But if you never actually go to any matches, or very few- be honest about how you arrive at your opinion- Good or Bad. Or don't bother contributing! So MODS- I've mentioned this before. Why not have a system whereby ST holders are actually indicated as such on OTIB? Or members of City away travel etc. It's about credibility and the ability to help separate the opinion of a match goer to the opinion of a bored keyboard warrior with a personal agenda. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lack of Action Man Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 8 minutes ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said: OTIB is never more popular than when things are going wrong at BCFC. Not only do we get a good number of newbies but also the return of posters who love to get involved in a witch hunt whilst having no real opinion when things are going right. The problem I have with these newbies and serial dissenters is that I'm really not sure if they are fans of BCFC or just joining in a social media bullying circus. Comments like " if (insert name here) is appointed then I'll vote with my feet" or "if LJ remains then I'll not renew my season ticket" " I'm not supporting City anymore if we go down" are from "fans" who may very well never go near BS3- ever. In fact some of the biggest critics of all things BCFC never actually attend matches or do so once or twice a season depending on league position . I also know ( through their own integrity on here) that some of the most popular posters are not regulars at Ashton Gate or away matches. This is often for geographical , health, work or financial reasons. One thing is for sure- you can't genuinely form an accurate assessment of a player, team , manager or stadium without actually attending matches on a regular basis. And certainly not from listening to the radio , reading BEP and shouting on a forum. Or looking at the league table in isolation. So when we get "beaten" by Derby 3-3 and I see the animosity but then read the excellent @Olé away reports ( who I have to say must be congratulated in his honest assessments) or comments from @Dollymarie who puts her heart and soul into the club along with so many others- I take notice and take it seriously whether I agree or not. When some poster demands this or that - a manager to be sacked, an owner to be hounded out or a player to be dropped then that's fine too....... Provided they actually are a Bristol City supporter and can see with their own eyes what is going on more than just looking at the result after the final whistle. Not just gobbing off about a club they have little association with other than on social media from their bedroom/sofa. 382 "supporters" signing a petition- only the most deluded would take that seriously. How many of those actually attend football matches let alone City matches? My point is this: Surely a genuine supporter/fan will attend matches regularly if they can or better still- hold a Season Ticket? When fan's say " without us there is no club". I agree wholeheartedly but only if those fans actually go to the matches. If you don't or rarely go then why get involved with 'Flint needs a rest' or 'drop Fielding etc' or 'pathetic result and pathetic manager' about a game I've just seen where we played very well but failed to win. How many times have you met a football fan who says" I support ( insert name here)" yet when you ask the last time they attended a match( or even the name of their right back etc).........."errr- well....I don't really get the chance to go". On OTIB we are currently experiencing some pretty polarised opinion- namely that LJ was,is and always shall be a ( insert here) and that SL is, has and always shall be clueless. And if those are the genuinely held opinions of a regular supporter who attends games and/or contributes to BCFC then fair enough. I respect your opinion but don't agree with all of it. But if you never actually go to any matches, or very few- be honest about how you arrive at your opinion- Good or Bad. Or don't bother contributing! So MODS- I've mentioned this before. Why not have a system whereby ST holders are actually indicated as such on OTIB? Or members of City away travel etc. It's about credibility and the ability to help separate the opinion of a match goer to the opinion of a bored keyboard warrior with a personal agenda. Here we go with the super fan mentality... No one fan is any better than any other. I'd love to be more involved with the club but I'm not. I don't get to go to every grand tour of the new facilities, every FAN meeting or even have a ST anymore. Does that make my opinion any less "worthy" than anyone else? No. For the record, I had a season ticket for nearly twenty years and played for the fans team in several different iterations. I don't claim to be any more worthy of recognition on otib than anyone else. But I am a fan, we are all fans and no one fan should ever be valued better than another IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Maesknoll Red Posted February 17, 2017 Admin Share Posted February 17, 2017 How do you think we would validate that? Ask to inspect everyone's season ticket? Maybe not everyone who posts would want their status shown. Hardly practical is it. As for not taking the league table in isolation, it is the only thing that matters, come the last day of the season and in the run up to the end, there is obvious concern at our position- and surely anyone can share that concern whether they are a season ticket holder or occasional attendee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Orns Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 Get the point, but it then leads to the 'superfans' vs the rest And there is a difference between someone who never goes, and I rarely do, forming a judgement on a player, or formation than someone who can't go having an opinion on how the club is run We're all fans (expect the odd one or two, who tend to get weeded out pretty quickly), a ST holders opinion is no less valid than mine, and mine is no less valid than someone who lives in Australia and hasn't been for 20 years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1960maaan Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 7 minutes ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said: So MODS- I've mentioned this before. Why not have a system whereby ST holders are actually indicated as such on OTIB? Or members of City away travel etc. It's about credibility and the ability to help separate the opinion of a match goer to the opinion of a bored keyboard warrior with a personal agenda. But how will the gAss sneak on here pretending to be lifelong fans?? No , it'll never work. If I was a ST holder, member of City away (is there such thing?), and in that lottery thing would I get a Superfan logo Seriously , I get where you're coming from but I'm not sure it would work practically. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornacix the Druid Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 Totally understand what you're trying to get across there MRR, and I agree with your worry in what I see as people only posting to stir up trouble. However, the phrase from Animal Farm comes to mind: All animals are Equal, but some are more Equal than others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTone Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 16 minutes ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said: OTIB is never more popular than when things are going wrong at BCFC. Not only do we get a good number of newbies but also the return of posters who love to get involved in a witch hunt whilst having no real opinion when things are going right. The problem I have with these newbies and serial dissenters is that I'm really not sure if they are fans of BCFC or just joining in a social media bullying circus. Comments like " if (insert name here) is appointed then I'll vote with my feet" or "if LJ remains then I'll not renew my season ticket" " I'm not supporting City anymore if we go down" are from "fans" who may very well never go near BS3- ever. In fact some of the biggest critics of all things BCFC never actually attend matches or do so once or twice a season depending on league position . I also know ( through their own integrity on here) that some of the most popular posters are not regulars at Ashton Gate or away matches. This is often for geographical , health, work or financial reasons. One thing is for sure- you can't genuinely form an accurate assessment of a player, team , manager or stadium without actually attending matches on a regular basis. And certainly not from listening to the radio , reading BEP and shouting on a forum. Or looking at the league table in isolation. So when we get "beaten" by Derby 3-3 and I see the animosity but then read the excellent @Olé away reports ( who I have to say must be congratulated in his honest assessments) or comments from @Dollymarie who puts her heart and soul into the club along with so many others- I take notice and take it seriously whether I agree or not. When some poster demands this or that - a manager to be sacked, an owner to be hounded out or a player to be dropped then that's fine too....... Provided they actually are a Bristol City supporter and can see with their own eyes what is going on more than just looking at the result after the final whistle. Not just gobbing off about a club they have little association with other than on social media from their bedroom/sofa. 382 "supporters" signing a petition- only the most deluded would take that seriously. How many of those actually attend football matches let alone City matches? My point is this: Surely a genuine supporter/fan will attend matches regularly if they can or better still- hold a Season Ticket? When fan's say " without us there is no club". I agree wholeheartedly but only if those fans actually go to the matches. If you don't or rarely go then why get involved with 'Flint needs a rest' or 'drop Fielding etc' or 'pathetic result and pathetic manager' about a game I've just seen where we played very well but failed to win. How many times have you met a football fan who says" I support ( insert name here)" yet when you ask the last time they attended a match( or even the name of their right back etc).........."errr- well....I don't really get the chance to go". On OTIB we are currently experiencing some pretty polarised opinion- namely that LJ was,is and always shall be a ( insert here) and that SL is, has and always shall be clueless. And if those are the genuinely held opinions of a regular supporter who attends games and/or contributes to BCFC then fair enough. I respect your opinion but don't agree with all of it. But if you never actually go to any matches, or very few- be honest about how you arrive at your opinion- Good or Bad. Or don't bother contributing! So MODS- I've mentioned this before. Why not have a system whereby ST holders are actually indicated as such on OTIB? Or members of City away travel etc. It's about credibility and the ability to help separate the opinion of a match goer to the opinion of a bored keyboard warrior with a personal agenda. Why are season ticket holders more credible than anyone else ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lorenzos Only Goal Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 I think you're spot on, I'm stuck in the east of england and quite a chatty chap. When I speak to most people about otib at games they are not members. I'm stuck with highlights and these forums the majority of the time, and sifting the chaff out is hard. I rely on trusted names. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 21 minutes ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said: So MODS- I've mentioned this before. Why not have a system whereby ST holders are actually indicated as such on OTIB? Or members of City away travel etc. It's about credibility and the ability to help separate the opinion of a match goer to the opinion of a bored keyboard warrior with a personal agenda. Without discussing the merits of the suggestion purely from a legal point of view the club and ourselves would be in breach of the data protection act if we started sharing personal info with each other! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cidered abroad Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 If we go down I will show my disapproval by keeping my debit card well away from anything "Bristol City"! That makes me a poor supporter does it? Sixty seven years, eight promotions and now an eighth relegation looming. Two Third Division Championships, four seasons in the First Division and two in the Fourth. The rest of the time split almost equally between bottom end of Division Two and top half of Division Three. A few Mickey Mouse Cup Finals, some won, some lost. Missed only one home game in eleven years when living in Shrewsbury (snowed in) and one in two years while living in Livingston (came home but a spent the Saturday ill in bed while City lost 1-6 to Wolves) Lived eight years in Portugal and one season had a season ticket and saw twelve home games. The other seasons I saw about six games each season. And so to the present; yet another completely messed up season. We are in our annual fight against relegation and I, like thousands of others, am absolutely sick of an under performing squad of decent players and a manager/head coach who appears to have inadequate experience and ability at this level. The results since mid October are the worst in my time as a City supporter. So, please tell me, Marina's Rolls Royce, why I should travel from Burnham on Sea twenty three times a year to watch the dross that is yet again being served up. If I'm so hacked off with it, then there must be many others who feel the same, whether they are long suffering or new young people with a lifetime in front of them. I'll be City til I die but will I commit to a season ticket again while the product is so poor? Highly unlikely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alessandro Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 Not sure the OP is trying to make 'super fan' labels. It's not about super fans. It's about opinions. Everyone is entitled to one - but just because you're entitled to an opinion, doesn't.... I guess what he is trying to say is people who are around the club, watching games regularly etc are more likely to have a more informed opinion. Does it make it more valid? That's a debate, but it's likely to make it a more knowledgable opinion. FFIW - I've always thought of OTIB as a small concentration of City fans and opinions and over the years been amazed when I read that someone who posts in certain way never actually goes to games or lives in Bristol. Often these opinions just aren't reflected at games or in the pub by friends and other fans. I guess it's just the way it is. As I said elsewhere - in a crisis, those who preach fear are the loudest voice. When things are going well those voices disappear and ones over excited about playoffs or the future appear. That's OTIB for you. Can't really change it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midred Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 Would there be extra credibility for bone fide coach 1 passengers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ska Junkie Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 Easy answer, if you want to be seen as a SC holder, just change your avatar to your SC. Sorted! I'm a SC holder and have had one since the mid 70's but I try to appreciate every posters POV and don't think having a SC makes me or anyone else better or worse than someone who doesn't TBH. I won't be changing my avatar but it's an easy solution if people want to do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ska Junkie Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 Just now, Midred said: Would there be extra credibility for bone fide coach 1 passengers? If you manage to escape, respect is definitely warranted! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bristol Rob Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 Don't really see the value in this. If you appreciate the posts and comments from users, use the like button. If you don't like the contributions of others, click ignore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 I think part of the answer is for people to be polite / more polite on here. As stated above, nobody's opinion is worth any more or less than anyone else's, but why does a difference of opinion have to lead to slanging matches? We view the game differently, and those that go, view from different parts of the stadium too, and that can sway views. Personally, I tend to post less about a match I've not been to than one I have. I usually start off with "I wasn't there today". That helps the reader know where my angle is coming from. Of course it is difficult to praise or criticise a player's performance without watching, but you can get a semblance from the radio. I agree with the merging of threads. I've found myself saying the same thing on multiple posts. So what if it's a long thread, there ought to be less of them, and over time, the number of posts ought to go down, because we don't duplicate our opinions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ireneisagavsgod Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 I'm a newbie but have been watching city for 30 years I am also a season ticket holder and my last away game was burnley . I have joined because I like to know what other city fans think . I'm not pro lj not against lj all I want is some moderate success and at the start of the season I thought we had cracked it I'm not so sure now . And I will be renewing my season tickets next season because regardless of what division we are in city is my club and all ways will be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milo1111 Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 Ive got a season ticket and can see with my own eyes what is happening on the pitch- that the players are not fired up enough by the manager. I can also see constant tinkering and over complication leading to the players not being comfortable with what they are being asked to do. There may be some doom mongerers who come on here for a whinge and dont go to the games. But lets be honest the results over such a long period show that the manager isnt up to the job. Lets not try and deflect from this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Septic Peg Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 33 minutes ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said: So MODS- I've mentioned this before. Why not have a system whereby ST holders are actually indicated as such on OTIB? Or members of City away travel etc. It's about credibility and the ability to help separate the opinion of a match goer to the opinion of a bored keyboard warrior with a personal agenda. I'm not a ST holder as I have a young son who on a Tuesday night game with school the next day, wouldn't get into bed until gone 10.30pm (though now he is getting older, I've told him if his work improves at school - he is just a bit behind in maths - we can look at getting STs). So I'm curious @Marina's Rolls Royce. Do my posts lack credibility on account of my non attendance? Not that I particularly give a toss what you or others think about my opinion on here, I'd be interested to see why you've tarred all non ST holders and non away dayers with the same brush? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marina's Rolls Royce Posted February 17, 2017 Author Share Posted February 17, 2017 I guess when I posted, I thought it may suddenly be highjacked to super fan debate. That's not my point at all. My point is that if you don't go to watch BCFC then an opinion on a player/ manager should be taken with a pinch salt. Yes I completely believe that someone who has attended a match has more credibility in their assessment than someone who doesn't. If anyone thinks that someone who never/rarely attends matches has a "supporter's right" to attack the club whilst hiding behind a monica is ,imo. not a fan merely a commentator. I suspect this post might offend more fans who don't go than those who do. 12 minutes ago, Tomarse said: Without discussing the merits of the suggestion purely from a legal point of view the club and ourselves would be in breach of the data protection act if we started sharing personal info with each other! You share the fact that I'm an "OTIB Supporter" and you hold my personal details. Adding a further status with my permission breaches nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ska Junkie Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 Does this mean Terry from Shirehampton won't be on the radio anymore? 'I didn't go to the game Geoff but...' That used to wind me up I will admit, now I find that type of call quite amusing. I admire the fellas passion and I'm sure he was a BS3 regular at some point in the past so he, and his like, deserve to have an opinion. We're all in this together,young, old, SC holder, non SC holder, regular attendee and not so regular. We're crap but we're in the crap together! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 25 minutes ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said: So MODS- I've mentioned this before. Why not have a system whereby ST holders are actually indicated as such on OTIB? Or members of City away travel etc. It's about credibility and the ability to help separate the opinion of a match goer to the opinion of a bored keyboard warrior with a personal agenda. Agree with some of your sentiments but at the end of the day this is an Internet forum - it's a magnet for trolls. There is no proof that some of the posters even support football, let alone BCFC. It's either an open forum or it's not and that's the crux of the matter: Do people want subscription (that requires management, incurs cost and therefore might need monetary backing either through subscription (I wouldn't subscribe) OR advertising (something that would drive me away). And you are right, we have some great posters. 18 minutes ago, OddBallJim said: Here we go with the super fan mentality... Yawn 9 minutes ago, BigTone said: Why are season ticket holders more credible than anyone else ? Didn't you know? Us ST holders are worth 10 x a normal fan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marina's Rolls Royce Posted February 17, 2017 Author Share Posted February 17, 2017 That's not what I said @Septic Peg. Not at all. I'm not tarring any non ST with any brush. Just breath and read the OP more carefully . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin phantom Posted February 17, 2017 Admin Share Posted February 17, 2017 2 minutes ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said: You share the fact that I'm an "OTIB Supporter" and you hold my personal details. Adding a further status with my permission breaches nothing. Can you really not see the difference @Marina's Rolls Royce? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marina's Rolls Royce Posted February 17, 2017 Author Share Posted February 17, 2017 Just now, phantom said: Can you really not see the difference @Marina's Rolls Royce? Funnily enough- I mentioned this very subject to YOU two seasons ago and you quite liked it then! As for seeing the difference- yes of course I can and that's another subject! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Isewater Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 25 minutes ago, BigTone said: Why are season ticket holders more credible than anyone else ? I think ' gullible ' is the word you meant . Calm down Ladies just a jokette. You are the backbone of the club and I applaud you all . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 4 minutes ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said: You share the fact that I'm an "OTIB Supporter" and you hold my personal details. Adding a further status with my permission breaches nothing. You speak of it being validated though. That is sharing data. If everyone can just pop in that they are a ST holder without it being validated then it proves nothing more than saying you are a ST holder in a post surely? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Septic Peg Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 2 minutes ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said: That's not what I said @Septic Peg. Not at all. I'm not tarring any non ST with any brush. Just breath and read the OP more carefully . I have done and it was this I've selected from a further post that reiterates what I mean... Yes I completely believe that someone who has attended a match has more credibility in their assessment than someone who doesn't. So by that, I have less credibility as I don't go to a match often than someone like @Dollymarie who has a ST and goes to all home games. Like I said, I couldn't give a toss what you think but others might not be so agreeable. And FWIW, Dolls is a much better woman than I. Not because she has a ST, but because she keeps all you lot in check, whereas I don't have the patience or tolerance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marina's Rolls Royce Posted February 17, 2017 Author Share Posted February 17, 2017 1 minute ago, Tomarse said: You speak of it being validated though. That is sharing data. If everyone can just pop in that they are a ST holder without it being validated then it proves nothing more than saying you are a ST holder in a post surely? Sharing Data is fine with permission. Validation by OTIB of a member giving and allowing the sharing of info is fine. I'm not suggesting name and address but those who wish to validate a ST or similar status have a different icon or whatever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Isewater Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 My counter argument is that from a distance I can see that RESULTS are not good enough . There is no LJ or player love in to get in the way of the cold hard facts. I succumb to those close to the club who have a different take on things . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 18 minutes ago, Tomarse said: Without discussing the merits of the suggestion purely from a legal point of view the club and ourselves would be in breach of the data protection act if we started sharing personal info with each other! DPA... often misunderstood and problematic. I suspect that it's the management of DPA compliance that kiboshes this more than anything e.g. who'd volunteer be a data controller for OTIB? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marina's Rolls Royce Posted February 17, 2017 Author Share Posted February 17, 2017 1 minute ago, Septic Peg said: I have done and it was this I've selected from a further post that reiterates what I mean... Yes I completely believe that someone who has attended a match has more credibility in their assessment than someone who doesn't. So by that, I have less credibility as I don't go to a match often than someone like @Dollymarie who has a ST and goes to all home games. Like I said, I couldn't give a toss what you think but others might not be so agreeable. And FWIW, Dolls is a much better woman than I. Not because she has a ST, but because she keeps all you lot in check, whereas I don't have the patience or tolerance. That is a sentiment I utterly believe and always will. If you attend a match you can better assess than if you do not. There was a thread about breaking point. Mine was after reading @Olé match report at Forest. I know he was there, I know he goes to most ( if not all) games and for me, has great deal of credibility. The fans who were insulting LJ/SL after losing v ( insert match) but not having attended- do not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS4 on Tour... Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 35 minutes ago, BigTone said: Why are season ticket holders more credible than anyone else ? Exactly, and having a season ticket doesn't automatically mean that ST holders go to every game. I know some who live miles away but have a ST through habit and hope that we'll draw Man Utd away in the Cup and they'll get the chance of a ticket. Highlighting who is a ST or regular fan on here will be very divisive and will lead to "I'm better informed than you" tit for tat arguments. I don't want to see this. (and yes I'm a ST holder, but my opinion doesn't matter more than anyone else's) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marina's Rolls Royce Posted February 17, 2017 Author Share Posted February 17, 2017 7 minutes ago, Major Isewater said: My counter argument is that from a distance I can see that RESULTS are not good enough . There is no LJ or player love in to get in the way of the cold hard facts. I succumb to those close to the club who have a different take on things . But Major- you never make out you attend matches- you freely admit to living on the Abroad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nogbad the Bad Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 4 minutes ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said: But Major- you never make out you attend matches- you freely admit to living on the Abroad. Norfolk? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
handsofclay Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 I usually manage to see City about five times in the flesh each season as well as on TV whenever we are on and listen to every radio commentary even when I am watching Mangotsfield United. I cannot afford a ST and, quite frankly, refuse to pay the inflated prices. I used to attend virtually every home game years ago as well as some away when football was more affordable and value for money. If you study my posts I never make out that I know more about our style of play and the performances of individual players than others who attend week in week out and I bow to their greater judgement. I acknowledge that their insight is better qualified than mine so tend to steer clear of such debates. Unfortunately, as the OP states, there are many on here who aren't so circumspect with their judgement and contribution to debates and thus a false sense of reality can be conveyed if one assessed purely from reaction on here. Thus, I can see where the OP is coming from as it is annoying and those who want to stir trouble use it as a stick to beat the others with and stir further trouble. But I can also see that it would be difficult to administer and what makes one fan's views more valuable than anothers would be hard to evaluate. For instance, a blind supporter would be reliant on commentary either from the radio or a friend even if they did attend AG. But would that mean their opinions would be ranked with those who only ever listen to Radio Bristol for their match coverage. I might never have had a season ticket in my life but I was amongst the first people to buy shares in 1982. The prospectus hadn't even been printed and I was simply given a receipt. I recall Peter Divine being in the office when I went in as soon as it was announced the club needed fans to buy shares. However, as aforementioned, I can see where the OP is coming from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marina's Rolls Royce Posted February 17, 2017 Author Share Posted February 17, 2017 14 minutes ago, BS4 on Tour... said: Exactly, and having a season ticket doesn't automatically mean that ST holders go to every game. I know some who live miles away but have a ST through habit and hope that we'll draw Man Utd away in the Cup and they'll get the chance of a ticket. Highlighting who is a ST or regular fan on here will be very divisive and will lead to "I'm better informed than you" tit for tat arguments. I don't want to see this. (and yes I'm a ST holder, but my opinion doesn't matter more than anyone else's) Oh dear.... ( and for the last time) I never said a season ticket holder is more credible- it's not about flipping ST holders. It's about the credibility of a " fan" whether on OTIB or anywhere else calling for changes through social media who actually doesn't actually go to any games. Yes : I believe that someone supporting a team by actually attending any number of matches not only is more likely to have a better take on a club/team/managers progress than someone who doesn't go to any matches but also has a more credible right to criticise. P.S I'm feel the same about people who complain about Brexit yet didn't vote either way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Isewater Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 9 minutes ago, Nogbad the Bad said: Norfolk? I left Norfolk sixteen years ago , do try to keep up Noggers . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTone Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 3 minutes ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said: Oh dear.... ( and for the last time) I never said a season ticket holder is more credible- it's not about flipping ST holders. It's about the credibility of a " fan" whether on OTIB or anywhere else calling for changes through social media who actually doesn't actually go to any games. Yes : I believe that someone supporting a team by actually attending any number of matches not only is more likely to have a better take on a club/team/managers progress than someone who doesn't go to any matches but also has a more credible right to criticise. What constitutes "credible" ? You can have 2 people watching every match and then have completely different opinions on what they've just seen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marina's Rolls Royce Posted February 17, 2017 Author Share Posted February 17, 2017 1 minute ago, BigTone said: What constitutes "credible" ? You can have 2 people watching every match and then have completely different opinions on what they've just seen. My genuine answer is both. They watched the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phileas Fogg Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 I can see the reasoning in the OP but it's not practical. You're a regular poster like me @Marina's Rolls Royce, I think for people like us who use this forum most days we can see who's credible and who's not. I know who's posts to scroll past, who's to take time to read etc I can totally see what you're trying to say, and I don't think it's a 'super fan' vs regular fan thing, I just can't see a way in which it'll work in reality. I guess that's part of the beauty of a forum, it allows people to be completely anonymous if they wish and be totally over the top if they so wish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTone Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 3 minutes ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said: My genuine answer is both. They watched the game. So really its about opinions and not credibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Orns Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 Just to help out MRR here - I didn't read this as MRR claiming to be a super fan or his / her POV being more valid than others It's just the point that we've been here before, and this is how it always turns out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Portland Bill Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 1 hour ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said: OTIB is never more popular than when things are going wrong at BCFC. Not only do we get a good number of newbies but also the return of posters who love to get involved in a witch hunt whilst having no real opinion when things are going right. The problem I have with these newbies and serial dissenters is that I'm really not sure if they are fans of BCFC or just joining in a social media bullying circus. Comments like " if (insert name here) is appointed then I'll vote with my feet" or "if LJ remains then I'll not renew my season ticket" " I'm not supporting City anymore if we go down" are from "fans" who may very well never go near BS3- ever. In fact some of the biggest critics of all things BCFC never actually attend matches or do so once or twice a season depending on league position . I also know ( through their own integrity on here) that some of the most popular posters are not regulars at Ashton Gate or away matches. This is often for geographical , health, work or financial reasons. One thing is for sure- you can't genuinely form an accurate assessment of a player, team , manager or stadium without actually attending matches on a regular basis. And certainly not from listening to the radio , reading BEP and shouting on a forum. Or looking at the league table in isolation. So when we get "beaten" by Derby 3-3 and I see the animosity but then read the excellent @Olé away reports ( who I have to say must be congratulated in his honest assessments) or comments from @Dollymarie who puts her heart and soul into the club along with so many others- I take notice and take it seriously whether I agree or not. When some poster demands this or that - a manager to be sacked, an owner to be hounded out or a player to be dropped then that's fine too....... Provided they actually are a Bristol City supporter and can see with their own eyes what is going on more than just looking at the result after the final whistle. Not just gobbing off about a club they have little association with other than on social media from their bedroom/sofa. 382 "supporters" signing a petition- only the most deluded would take that seriously. How many of those actually attend football matches let alone City matches? My point is this: Surely a genuine supporter/fan will attend matches regularly if they can or better still- hold a Season Ticket? When fan's say " without us there is no club". I agree wholeheartedly but only if those fans actually go to the matches. If you don't or rarely go then why get involved with 'Flint needs a rest' or 'drop Fielding etc' or 'pathetic result and pathetic manager' about a game I've just seen where we played very well but failed to win. How many times have you met a football fan who says" I support ( insert name here)" yet when you ask the last time they attended a match( or even the name of their right back etc).........."errr- well....I don't really get the chance to go". On OTIB we are currently experiencing some pretty polarised opinion- namely that LJ was,is and always shall be a ( insert here) and that SL is, has and always shall be clueless. And if those are the genuinely held opinions of a regular supporter who attends games and/or contributes to BCFC then fair enough. I respect your opinion but don't agree with all of it. But if you never actually go to any matches, or very few- be honest about how you arrive at your opinion- Good or Bad. Or don't bother contributing! So MODS- I've mentioned this before. Why not have a system whereby ST holders are actually indicated as such on OTIB? Or members of City away travel etc. It's about credibility and the ability to help separate the opinion of a match goer to the opinion of a bored keyboard warrior with a personal agenda. So, having two sons ( who I watch) now involved in football on a Saturday afternoon, takes away my credibility on here ? Should I just go and buy a ST, even though I can't get to a lot of games, just so I can have an opinion! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honiton Tony Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 My God when did this become a pissing contest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bristol Rob Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 Just now, Honiton Tony said: My God when did this become a pissing contest I knew the club were wrong to leave the Fanzone a toilet free environment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marina's Rolls Royce Posted February 17, 2017 Author Share Posted February 17, 2017 2 minutes ago, Woodsy said: Just to help out MRR here - I didn't read this as MRR claiming to be a super fan or his / her POV being more valid than others It's just the point that we've been here before, and this is how it always turns out Yep- I guess you're right, Woodsy. I think what it all boils down to is that I'm really peed off about people constantly attacking everything about our club- many of whom are very happy to do so yet avoid the current discomfort of watching our team lose! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTone Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 2 minutes ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said: Yep- I guess you're right, Woodsy. I think what it all boils down to is that I'm really peed off about people constantly attacking everything about our club- many of whom are very happy to do so yet avoid the current discomfort of watching our team lose! we've been losing ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1bristolcity Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 Good Lord what a load of tripe, the OP even mentioned those dedicated few that give everything the club, how cosy and nice. Of course we would never achieve anything if we all agreed, that God there are those that upset these few who seem to think they represent the fans club or whoever, City fans come in all shapes and sizes, and we all deserve a voice. Why even Dolly famously once stated she wouldn't relish promotion to the top flight as it would distract from the 'family' feel of the club. She is entitled to that opinion, as I am mine, cobblers, what the point in not trying to achieve success to the top flight...winning everything you can...it's called SPORT, and not some cosy little club for those that treat it as their little muse!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marina's Rolls Royce Posted February 17, 2017 Author Share Posted February 17, 2017 6 minutes ago, Portland Bill said: So, having two sons ( who I watch) now involved in football on a Saturday afternoon, takes away my credibility on here ? Should I just go and buy a ST, even though I can't get to a lot of games, just so I can have an opinion! I refer the Rt Hon Gentleman for Portland to my several previous answers on that precise subject. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ciderhead433 Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 1 hour ago, BigTone said: Why are season ticket holders more credible than anyone else ? Dont they have halos to tell them apart Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 3 minutes ago, 1bristolcity said: Good Lord what a load of tripe, the OP even mentioned those dedicated few that give everything the club, how cosy and nice. Of course we would never achieve anything if we all agreed, that God there are those that upset these few who seem to think they represent the fans club or whoever, City fans come in all shapes and sizes, and we all deserve a voice. Why even Dolly famously once stated she wouldn't relish promotion to the top flight as it would distract from the 'family' feel of the club. She is entitled to that opinion, as I am mine, cobblers, what the point in not trying to achieve success to the top flight...winning everything you can...it's called SPORT, and not some cosy little club for those that treat it as their little muse!!! What family feel to the club? For better or for worse- undoubtedly commercially better- does the club under Bristol Sport or even in general have a family fee? With a Supporters Liason Officer (not Adam Baker but the other half of that pair) who is basically a mystery- what family feel? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin phantom Posted February 17, 2017 Admin Share Posted February 17, 2017 47 minutes ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said: Funnily enough- I mentioned this very subject to YOU two seasons ago and you quite liked it then! As for seeing the difference- yes of course I can and that's another subject! I'm not sure I should be flattered you recall something I said (I have no idea - but will take your word for it), or be spooked Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin phantom Posted February 17, 2017 Admin Share Posted February 17, 2017 45 minutes ago, Septic Peg said: And FWIW, Dolls is a much better woman than I. Not because she has a ST, but because she keeps all you lot in check, whereas I don't have the patience or tolerance. Brownie points are not awarded for arse kissing on here ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Isewater Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 1 minute ago, phantom said: I'm not sure I should be flattered you recall something I said (I have no idea - but will take your word for it), or be spooked Phantom ' spooked ' ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTone Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 1 minute ago, phantom said: Brownie points are not awarded for arse kissing on here ! and remember it belongs to me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Septic Peg Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 I think what you mean is that someone who was present at a game, can give a more honest assessment of said match than someone who wasn't. I agree with that. However, like someone else said, two people sat side by side can watch the game and have two very differing opinions. Let's take the dubious pen at Derby. I watched it with Hubby on Channel 5. I thought Golbourne had just clipped the Derby player. Hubby swore blind he didn't touch him. Who has the more valid opinion? Both watched the same thing. Two different opinions. So whether a regular attendee or an expat listening on player, all opinions are valid. It's called healthy debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Septic Peg Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 3 minutes ago, phantom said: Brownie points are not awarded for arse kissing on here ! I don't need to arse kiss. Dolls loves me anyway. Jealous Phants? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Army 75 Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 Plenty of season ticket holders ain't got a clue . Just open you're ears up and listen . Everyone is entitled to an opinion. I haven't been away in a couple of months. But IMO we've been shit . Season ticket holder mind Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marina's Rolls Royce Posted February 17, 2017 Author Share Posted February 17, 2017 1 minute ago, Septic Peg said: I think what you mean is that someone who was present at a game, can give a more honest assessment of said match than someone who wasn't. I agree with that. However, like someone else said, two people sat side by side can watch the game and have two very differing opinions. Let's take the dubious pen at Derby. I watched it with Hubby on Channel 5. I thought Golbourne had just clipped the Derby player. Hubby swore blind he didn't touch him. Who has the more valid opinion? Both watched the same thing. Two different opinions. So whether a regular attendee or an expat listening on player, all opinions are valid. It's called healthy debate. That's precisely what I was trying to say. In respect of personal attacks on all things BCFC by posters who have no real interaction with the club other on social media- I don't agree that their opinion is valid- whether or not they listen on Player! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1bristolcity Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 6 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said: What family feel to the club? For better or for worse- undoubtedly commercially better- does the club under Bristol Sport or even in general have a family fee? With a Supporters Liason Officer (not Adam Baker but the other half of that pair) who is basically a mystery- what family feel? You have just restated my point, it's now just about success, I agree the family club thing had been scuppered, we are all kept in the dark, and have to tolerate all this rubbish on the pitch, whilst witnessing the worst run in our History, and still they want more...whilst some on our OTIB want to cut loose and become Utra supporters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Langford Red Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 How is deciding with your feet bullying! Everybody has the right to go to Ashton Gate or shoping etc I do not like hidden foul langage But if somebody does not like the manager that is their right A 3.0 lead then 3.3 is a loss to me other games where we could have killed the game when winning but the manager takes best players off and sits back with nonody up fromt to relieve the pressure does not deserve to be manager I can not believe a manager makes the record for the wrong reasons and keeps his job learning is in the lower divs not the championship there is to much quality in this div to make mistakes Div 1 here we come I hope I am wrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abraham Romanovich Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 Let,s be honest this board is no different to any othe board or radio phone in,- the team loses and OTIB goes into meltdown the world and his wife have an opinion- win and it's very few new threads. Tht's just the way it is everyone who contributes has a genuine affection for Bristol City Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marina's Rolls Royce Posted February 17, 2017 Author Share Posted February 17, 2017 5 minutes ago, Bicester Red said: How is deciding with your feet bullying! Everybody has the right to go to Ashton Gate or shoping etc I do not like hidden foul langage But if somebody does not like the manager that is their right A 3.0 lead then 3.3 is a loss to me other games where we could have killed the game when winning but the manager takes best players off and sits back with nonody up fromt to relieve the pressure does not deserve to be manager I can not believe a manager makes the record for the wrong reasons and keeps his job learning is in the lower divs not the championship there is to much quality in this div to make mistakes Div 1 here we come I hope I am wrong Haha! It's taken 51 posts to change this to a LJ out / we're going down thread. A record, surely? Mods merge ...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Hunt-Hertz Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 1 hour ago, Maesknoll Red said: How do you think we would validate that? Ask to inspect everyone's season ticket? Maybe not everyone who posts would want their status shown. Hardly practical is it. As for not taking the league table in isolation, it is the only thing that matters, come the last day of the season and in the run up to the end, there is obvious concern at our position- and surely anyone can share that concern whether they are a season ticket holder or occasional attendee. Superfans could be branded or tattooed. Just post a pic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTone Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 2 minutes ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said: Haha! It's taken 51 posts to change this to a LJ out / we're going down thread. A record, surely? Mods merge ...... I had to happen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lack of Action Man Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 1 hour ago, bcfcfinker said: Yawn how drole. Top use of a post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ska Junkie Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 5 minutes ago, Mike Hunt-Hertz said: Superfans could be branded or tattooed. Just post a pic. or taken out and shot for arrogance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REDOXO Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 1 hour ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said: That's not what I said @Septic Peg. Not at all. I'm not tarring any non ST with any brush. Just breath and read the OP more carefully . Yes the last line is needlessly sanctimonious. Yes ok you are a season ticket holder. There are many, none of whom thought they would see the worst run in our history. Results are what matters now and have been pretty much the only thing that matters for a while. If we get one on Wednesday I'll be over the moon, if we don't our position becomes massively more precarious. Yes I agree there is drivel written on here by a number of different view points and there are some who just come here to have a winge. That is really not that shocking in view of the funds pushed in to support the manager and the results. Engval back in Sweden, Magnusson back in the stands, no clear role for Tomlin, our only fit experienced right back struggling with injury....Oh lord the list is endless! While I value your opinion and you are one of only a few, particularly after you took the Matt Smith stuff on the chin, you don't have to be a season ticket holder to see the issues, however perhaps a season ticket holder sub forum might help. Either way people get upset as you have in the past. Fingers crossed for a home win. Many will see you down there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Orns Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 55 minutes ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said: Yep- I guess you're right, Woodsy. I think what it all boils down to is that I'm really peed off about people constantly attacking everything about our club- many of whom are very happy to do so yet avoid the current discomfort of watching our team lose! I'm still scarred by the Russell Osman era - that was real discomfort! I find it interesting, if I've listened to a game and think we've done ok I soon get shot down by a certain poster on here who was actually at the game. The other side of that is I'm (just about) still in the 'LJ in' camp, my mate is very much in the 'LJ out' camp Does that make a difference, more than whether you were at the game? No one likes seeing their team lose, but if you've lost the faith already it probably feels different to those of us (I presume it's not just me!) that haven't? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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