Leave the guy alone........

[Dr Balls]

As far as I can gauge, the situation appears to be this:

1. A small minority of people on here, and more widely, dislike LJ so much that they want us relegated just to be rid of him. Also perhaps to teach SL a lesson.

2. The majority on here, and probably amongst the wider group of supporters who attend matches, want us to stay up but want Johnson gone ASAP and definitely not here next season. Whether this option is available is very questionable and it's this group that have probably lost most trust in the club and SL. This group support the team when playing but remain very unhappy at the way they perceive things have been mismanaged. 

From these 2 groups come those who will not renew their season ticket as long as LJ remains in charge. This is the worrying scenario for the club. Once lost, it will not be easy to get them back or replace them. Ask any business that starts losing a significant proportion of its loyal customers what happens next and the answer is that it doesn't usually end well. 

3. There are those who feel that if we want the club to stay in this division that we need to back LJ for now, because they perceive that the manager and team need our support to succeed. However they remain sceptical of LJ & probably wouldn't be upset at the thought of him leaving at the end of the season even if we stay up. They represent a minority on here, but there may be more of these amongst our wider more apathetic supporters. Many of them would consider themselves to be loyal supporters of the club "through thick and thin", unlike the more vocal second group who would say it was a case of their own loyalty being "through thin and thinner"!

4. Finally we come to that very small minority that I would describe as "LJ-apologists", who trot out the guff about him "being a young manager" and "still needing to learn", and don't seem to see any problem in the way things have been handled this season. As I have said before in other threads, loyalty is a great quality but when it's misplaced it's  a complete folly. Unfortunately our owner appears to be in this group, and it's this group that the first 2 find so hard to understand.

Look, I am always going to be happy when we win, but I remain fearful of the drop given our poor form over such a long period. I am also just as fearful that whatever happens that LJ stays in charge, for reasons that do not seem to stack up when judged purely in footballing terms. What I want is for us to stay up and get rid of LJ, but unfortunately those 2 things may be mutually exclusive.

 

[JHAGa]

2 minutes ago, BCFC_Mike said:

Head to the match thread at the time the goal went in if you want to see some positiveness. 

I didn't claim nobody was being positive, just that those intent on their agendas are determined to focus on negativity even after the win.

[David Brent]

5 hours ago, Northern Red said:

True, but that works both ways. There's a few who've been very quiet since full time yesterday yet would been all over the forum like a rash if we hadn't won.

Last night was the quietest it's been on here after a match for months. Not particularly surprising, but it was noticeable. 

Sorry, it was a poor joke. A play on what happened when we started losing.

You're right though.

[BobBobSuperBob]

4 minutes ago, JHAGa said:

 

I've not stated that I'm happy, just that I don't believe the club to be in crisis. I blame the board for this season not LJ, so I just find it unnecessary to see abuse aimed at him even after a vital win.

 

A significant minority means a vocal minority. Which has probably been proven to be the case already going by the protests etc that people wanted on here.

What are your reasons for blaming The Board and not Johnson ?

 

[BanburyRed]

10 minutes ago, JHAGa said:

 

Ok, sure. But why not keep quiet then instead of asking a manager to resign and other abuse aimed at him (not on about you personally btw) after a massively vital win in a relegation six-pointer?

I think the bigger question to ask is why do we find ourselves in this unholy mess? It can't be a coincidence that LJ has suffered bad sequences of defeat with Barnsley and us..?

I've posted previously and said that with the backing we have, the stadium we have, the support we have - we should be comfortably, and i mean comfortably, midtable......but we're not. Why?

If you asked LJ what his best team and/or formation was/is, he couldn't tell you. Why?

Buy Matt Taylor & Milan Djuric then drop them both to the bench or at best impact players. Why?

Hegeler seemingly now disappeared (although on the bench yesterday). Why?

Continually persisting with Joe Bryan at LB. Why? And why hasn't he addressed the FB issue full stop?

I could go on but i wouldn't want to be seen as negative......

[Esmond Million's Bung]

1 minute ago, JHAGa said:

 

I've not stated that I'm happy, just that I don't believe the club to be in crisis. I blame the board for this season not LJ, so I just find it unnecessary to see abuse aimed at him even after a vital win.

 

A significant minority means a vocal minority. Which has probably been proven to be the case already going by the protests etc that people wanted on here.

There you go again, in one breath you say that the board has supported LJ and in the next it's not LJ's fault. Perhaps relegation will wake you from your sleep walk.

Has there been abuse after this vital win? by the significant/but vocal minority LJ abusers again? or has there been even more praise from the significant/but vocal minority LJ glee club?. Both camps hold a totally minority view and cannot be held up as in anyway supporting the overall and overwhelming majority view of the fanbase and should be treated as such and not held up as some sort of pathetic smoke screen either way.

The biggest question is and has yet to be answered why should LJ be afforded different status to the other 91 managers in the 4 leagues?.

[JHAGa]

6 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

What are your reasons for blaming The Board and not Johnson ?

 

Because the same outcome prevails no matter who is in charge.

 

These two threads I've made probably cover the majority of my views -

 

 

[JHAGa]

11 minutes ago, BanburyRed said:

I think the bigger question to ask is why do we find ourselves in this unholy mess? It can't be a coincidence that LJ has suffered bad sequences of defeat with Barnsley and us..?

I've posted previously and said that with the backing we have, the stadium we have, the support we have - we should be comfortably, and i mean comfortably, midtable......but we're not. Why?

If you asked LJ what his best team and/or formation was/is, he couldn't tell you. Why?

Buy Matt Taylor & Milan Djuric then drop them both to the bench or at best impact players. Why?

Hegeler seemingly now disappeared (although on the bench yesterday). Why?

Continually persisting with Joe Bryan at LB. Why? And why hasn't he addressed the FB issue full stop?

I could go on but i wouldn't want to be seen as negative......

 

Again though, I've not claimed LJ has done no wrong, far from it. I just don't see the need to concentrate on such negativity when we've been making positive strides. It genuinely does baffle me.

[BobBobSuperBob]

7 minutes ago, JHAGa said:

Because the same outcome prevails no matter who is in charge.

 

These two threads I've made probably cover the majority of my views -

 

 

Very confusing -

In one you say it's the boards fault for not getting rid

In the other you blame the board for putting the pressure on Johnson

Think the board have more than backed him with 19 !!! Signings this season

 

Oh and all the nonsense about them selling Kodja and leaving Johnson stranded 

Nonsense is what it is

You do realise WHO made the decision to accept the bid from Villa do you ?

[JHAGa]

1 minute ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Very confusing -

In one you say it's the boards fault for not getting rid

In the other you blame the board for putting the pressure on Johnson

Think the board have more than backed him with 19 !!! Signings this season

 

Ih and all the nonsense about them selling Kodja and leaving Johnson stranded 

Nonsense is what it is

You do realise WHO made the decision to accept the bid from Villa do you ?

The board have let down numerous managers including Johnson, which is why I see it as short-sighted to think it's the manager's fault every single time. I don't think I said it was the board's fault for not getting rid, I said it was their fault for the fans who are opposed to LJ that blame him for our position, as it was their decision to stick with him.

 

I don't see how them selling Kodjia and leaving him with a far weaker squad that what he envisaged is nonsense. Losing your best player tends to damage any team especially when it's last minute and you have no replacement.

[Mike Hunt-Hertz]

2 hours ago, Red-Robbo said:

All true, but it won't destroy the club. That was my point. That is just being melodramatic. 

I think we have to shrug our shoulders now and say he's here for the rest of the season minimum. 

 

Surely someone on the forum has mesmeric talents, could hypnotise the little bugger, and make him join the priesthood?

[Red-Robbo]

3 minutes ago, Mike Hunt-Hertz said:

Surely someone on the forum has mesmeric talents, could hypnotise the little bugger, and make him join the priesthood?

I reckon LJ has hypnotised Lansdown tbh...

[BobBobSuperBob]

5 minutes ago, JHAGa said:

The board have let down numerous managers including Johnson, which is why I see it as short-sighted to think it's the manager's fault every single time. I don't think I said it was the board's fault for not getting rid, I said it was their fault for the fans who are opposed to LJ that blame him for our position, as it was their decision to stick with him.

 

I don't see how them selling Kodjia and leaving him with a far weaker squad that what he envisaged is nonsense. Losing your best player tends to damage any team especially when it's last minute and you have no replacement.

I'll ask again WHO made the decision to accept the bid

[Mike Hunt-Hertz]

1 minute ago, Red-Robbo said:

I reckon LJ has hypnotised Lansdown tbh...

I think he has swished his magic wand....

[JHAGa]

5 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

I'll ask again WHO made the decision to accept the bid

 

The owner.

[BobBobSuperBob]

1 minute ago, JHAGa said:

 

The owner.

WRONG

See how easy it is making assumptions and even worse , getting them wrong and using them as a major argument

 

From Johsons own mouth- 

SL Made MA & LJ aware of bid but made the decision to accept it or keep him to them

So as I said Nonsense and one less argument to defend Johnson and blame 'The Board'

[Norn Iron]

2 hours ago, Mike Hunt-Hertz said:

At times like these, I just wonder..."what would Jesus do?" 

In the 1960s there was a Church in Liverpool that was well known for having a big signboard in a prominent position for the traffic to see it's regularly updated messages. 

One week, the signboard said, What Would Jesus Do?

Soon after a piece of graffiti was placed underneath the WWJD. It merely said, Put St.John On The Wing.

Unfortunately this excellent response would be lost on those under a certain age!

[Mike Hunt-Hertz]

1 minute ago, Norn Iron said:

In the 1960s there was a Church in Liverpool that was well known for having a big signboard in a prominent position for the traffic to see it's regularly updated messages. 

One week, the signboard said, What Would Jesus Do?

Soon after a piece of graffiti was placed underneath the WWJD. It merely said, Put St.John On The Wing.

Unfortunately this excellent response would be lost on those under a certain age!

Yes, I have heard that one, and am old enough to understand. Whether it was apocryphal or not?

[Atticus]

4 hours ago, Bar BS3 said:

Sadly, it seems like many on here wouldn't even be happy if he was able to turn things around. 

I'm not saying that he has or will, I'm saying that IF LJ was to suddenly find the formula to a decent end to the season which keeps us safe, comfortably, then I'd be delighted. 

Sadly, I doubt many of the trolls on here would be. 

Thankfully, I think that most who actually attend games would be happy to see recovery and stability. It's got to be better than yet another change (risk)

As I said, I'm not saying that he will, but if he does, then great. 

Complete nonsense.

Not a case of not wanting him to turn it around at all. Its just the belief through performances and clueless selections/formations that the guy is incapable of turning it around like that.

We all surely want what's best for BCFC, and bar the few rabid fervent defenders of him, we can see, through evidence of the last few months that he doesn't have a clue what he is doing.

The very best I can see happening is we scrape survival. Now this may be deemed a success and/or acceptable to the LJ fanboys but after spending god knows how much on players, with the so called "talent" at his disposal imo having a worst season then last isn't acceptable.

[BS4 on Tour...]

6 minutes ago, Norn Iron said:

In the 1960s there was a Church in Liverpool that was well known for having a big signboard in a prominent position for the traffic to see it's regularly updated messages. 

One week, the signboard said, What Would Jesus Do?

Soon after a piece of graffiti was placed underneath the WWJD. It merely said, Put St.John On The Wing.

Unfortunately this excellent response would be lost on those under a certain age!

There was also a top bit of graffiti near Liverpool's ground in the '60s - someone painted 'God Saves' and a while later someone else added underneath: "But St.John nets the rebound..."

[1960maaan]

2 hours ago, Red-Robbo said:

All true, but it won't destroy the club. That was my point. That is just being melodramatic. 

I think we have to shrug our shoulders now and say he's here for the rest of the season minimum. 

 

I think in the heat of the moment it feels like he's destroying the club, over dramatised maybe. But I feel as low now as in '82 , because we should never be in this position. 
It will be an unnecessary relegation it Johnson finishes the job off.

33 minutes ago, JHAGa said:

He may have achieved a relegation fight but he was also responsible for that great start to the season. From February to October he did a good job. From October to February he did a bad job. The board have gambled in sticking by him, but we've started to show more positive signs in recent weeks but people still will focus on the negativity because of their views on LJ.

The end of last season we won 5 of the last 15 ( that equals 18 from 45 points) and the good work had already been started by our ex coach. The start of the season was pretty good , results wise , though some of the football was not so great. First 15 games we won 7 ( 24 from 45 ) to aggregate 42 from 30 games . If we had carried that average on (63 points) I would say it was ok, we din't , we lost 11 of 12 and the points taken from a 'full' season would be about 50 , poor by many's standards and sadly we need a very good run to get that in this very real season.

22 minutes ago, Esmond Million's Bung said:

I am glad you are happy and don't think that there is a crisis, people being dismissed and bullshit interviews masquerading as explanations, must win games (where even a draw is not good enough) that within 48 hours become just another game, 5 months of utter embarrassing dross punctuated with the odd 'slight' improvement and millions of pounds apparently spunked on players that were going to re-invigorate our season now apparently deemed not good enough and that are probably not worth a **** now bleeding the life out of the club with debt and high wages and all this maybe in the first division, no crisis here then.

A significant minority what does that mean?.

Significant minority could be 49% , minority but sizeable 

19 minutes ago, JHAGa said:

 

I've not stated that I'm happy, just that I don't believe the club to be in crisis. I blame the board for this season not LJ, so I just find it unnecessary to see abuse aimed at him even after a vital win.

 

A significant minority means a vocal minority. Which has probably been proven to be the case already going by the protests etc that people wanted on here.

No a vocal minority mean a vocal minority, sizeable minority could be not quite half . Not in the majority, but sizeable 

 

[Bobfish]

12 minutes ago, JHAGa said:

 

The owner.

 

8 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

WRONG

See how easy it is making assumptions and even worse , getting them wrong and using them as a major argument

 

From Johsons own mouth- 

SL Made MA & LJ aware of bid but made the decision to accept it or keep him to them

So as I said Nonsense and one less argument to defend Johnson and blame 'The Board'

Poor guy is having some trouble, so I thought I would help him out. 1 min 35 here makes it quite clear, “Both mark and lee recommended to me that we should accept the offer.”

 

[Esmond Million's Bung]

5 hours ago, Bar BS3 said:

Sadly, it seems like many on here wouldn't even be happy if he was able to turn things around. 

I'm not saying that he has or will, I'm saying that IF LJ was to suddenly find the formula to a decent end to the season which keeps us safe, comfortably, then I'd be delighted. 

Sadly, I doubt many of the trolls on here would be. 

Thankfully, I think that most who actually attend games would be happy to see recovery and stability. It's got to be better than yet another change (risk)

As I said, I'm not saying that he will, but if he does, then great. 

I think 'many' is a total over reaction, it is an extreme minority view by mainly the same few and usually wound up by the same minority view of LJ's glee club?, both are minority views.

And so would I be delighted, in fact I would be ecstatic, my problem would be more of the same next season.

There are trolls in both 'minority camps'.

[Wellspokenman]

22 minutes ago, Mike Hunt-Hertz said:

I think he has swished his magic wand....

I swished my magic wand....

Quite frankly, it got me into all sorts of trouble....

[BobBobSuperBob]

11 minutes ago, Bobfish said:

 

Poor guy is having some trouble, so I thought I would help him out. 1 min 35 here makes it quite clear, “Both mark and lee recommended to me that we should accept the offer.”

 

And Johnson said same in RB interview at the time

@JHAGa Sounds like if your argument about starting the season with a weakened squad is justified , it is in fact , yet just another mistake from Johnson

[JHAGa]

Oh yeah, people take SL's word for it now and of course LJ isn't going to go against what SL wants. SL said we wouldn't sell Kodjia to a club in the Championship, I'm sure what he says has to be true...

[BobBobSuperBob]

4 minutes ago, JHAGa said:

Oh yeah, people take SL's word for it now and of course LJ isn't going to go against what SL wants. SL said we wouldn't sell Kodjia to a club in the Championship, I'm sure what he says has to be true...

So you're now suggesting SL and LJ both lied ?

Blimey

Desperate

Were you aware of what they said about it before you used it as a excuse for LJ ?

[JHAGa]

1 minute ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

So you're now suggesting SL and LJ both lied ?

Blimey

Desperate

 

No different to those people that claim Ashton was lieing in a recent interview. SL has a record of lying relating to that exact case so it's hardly a preposterous claim. I believe he thought the offer was too good to turn that, LJ isn't really going to dissent against his employer and that interview was done to save face after SL's initial claim of not selling to a divisional rival.

 

Someone like SC was less happy to stand for the boards' antics and that's why the board got rid of him. I like LJ and am defending him here but he is very much a yes man and that's likely the reason he's still here. There is a history of our board letting down pretty much every manager that comes in. If you think it's the manager at fault every time, more fool you.

[BobBobSuperBob]

1 minute ago, JHAGa said:

 

No different to those people that claim Ashton was lieing in a recent interview. SL has a record of lying relating to that exact case so it's hardly a preposterous claim. I believe he thought the offer was too good to turn that, LJ isn't really going to dissent against his employer and that interview was done to save face after SL's initial claim of not selling to a divisional rival.

 

Someone like SC was less happy to stand for the boards' antics and that's why the board got rid of him. I like LJ and am defending him here but he is very much a yes man and that's likely the reason he's still here. There is a history of our board letting down pretty much every manager that comes in. If you think it's the manager at fault every time, more fool you.

Where and when have I said that - it was you using (incorrect) assumptions in your defence of Johnson 

And when it's pointed out , instead of accepting it , turn it into a conspiracy 

No agenda there then

[JHAGa]

3 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Where and when have I said that - it was you using (incorrect) assumptions in your defence of Johnson 

And when it's pointed out , instead of accepting it , turn it into a conspiracy 

No agenda there then

 

Not a conspiracy, just putting it into context and using common sense. Want conspiracies? Look at the anti-Johnson brigade on here pretending Gary is in charge of how things are run and all that other crap posted which people support because of their agendas.