And Its Smith Posted August 17, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 2 minutes ago, 29AR said: Why do we need pace up top? If we are playing pass and move football I can see we need someone with decent acceleration, which we've got, not sure we need blistering pace though. We rarely bomb down the middle at sides, and if we did I'm happy enough with Famara who isn't going to be easy to displace or outmuscle in a race. Happy to stick with wide players having the speed and our striker having strength; especially if his job is to hold the ball and release to our CAM or two other wide forward thinking players running in behind. Looking at it from a squad point of view. Nice to have a pace option from the bench or when we face teams like Brentford on Tuesday. Pace up front would have made them more nervous about a counter and wouldn't have pushed so high and with so few players at the back when attacking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 17, 2017 Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 3 minutes ago, RedDave said: Looking at it from a squad point of view. Nice to have a pace option from the bench or when we face teams like Brentford on Tuesday. Pace up front would have made them more nervous about a counter and wouldn't have pushed so high and with so few players at the back when attacking Yeah, I can see the different club in the bag, but I think the way we have built our squad, having a striker take the ball in is most important. One who is quick too would be great, but frankly then you're talking a Premier League player. I think a pacy striker less well built right now would be a square peg in a round hole based on the squad we've built. For instance, I wouldn't put Dwight Gayle in a 4-2-3-1 like we've built. I also think we are perhaps, even myself now, overegging the speed of the average Championship CB. I don't think you'd need to be particularly swift to keep up with most. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
And Its Smith Posted August 17, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 7 minutes ago, JamesBCFC said: Such as? Tomlin Magnússon Giefer GON Moore Taylor Engvall Đurić The above players have either performed below expectation, took longer to get to required level than expected or are now squad players with no hope of becoming first team regulars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LC_ Posted August 17, 2017 Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 I have major concerns about our scouting set up, we seem to bring in players and then realise they're not up to the job we'd brought them in to do, or that they no longer fit the system. Hegeler for example, not mobile enough to be a central midfielder in a two, can only play in a 3 which LJ isn't doing. Taylor Moore, a £1.5m (?) signing, Hörður Magnússon (£2m?), with that outlay you'd expect them to be somewhere near the first team of a lower table championship team, but clearly they're not good enough in LJ's eyes otherwise we wouldn't have gone out and got Wright and Baker. At LJ's own admission the way they found Eliasson was stats driven (football manager??), does he have the necessary attributes to make it in a physical league, or will he go a similar way as Engvall? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesBCFC Posted August 17, 2017 Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 41 minutes ago, RedDave said: Tomlin Magnússon Giefer GON Moore Taylor Engvall Đurić The above players have either performed below expectation, took longer to get to required level than expected or are now squad players with no hope of becoming first team regulars Magnússon and O'Neil I will give you. None of the rest fit your initial "Johnson seems to sign players and then decide those players need improving on. " Engvall is an odd one. He may well end up in that category but it is hard to say. Giefer is a good player, never got going down to his past injuries. Tomlin spent more effort being a disruptive character than being a footballer. Very rightly moved on. Moore has no chance of making it with us, really?! Taylor and Đurić both brought in as squad players and had a terrible time with injuries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numero Uno Posted August 17, 2017 Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 1 hour ago, RedDave said: Lee Johnson has been here for only a short while but in that time we have seen an incredible turnover in players. So much so that it is now fully his squad and he should be judged as such. In his 18 months at the club these are the numbers of comings and goings, if I am correct: Permanent In: 19 Permanent Out: 12 Loans In: 9 Loans Out: 9 49 dealings in 18 months. When is this squad complete and ready for a safe mid table season? People will say we are always looking to improve which is fine but surely we need some time of stability. How many will we 'need' in January? I suggest that we only keep signing players as we are getting so many signings wrong. We have signed another striker today with no pace. In four games time will Johnson realise we need more pace and start scouting another striker for January? Will games like Brentford become quite common and he will realise he needs another midfielder? It does seem incredible that after nineteen permanent signings we still seem short! Or is it the coach can't get the best out of these signings? How many of these signings would fans be unanimous to say are good enough for mid table? Wright and Baker are two. Anyone else? One of the reasons games like Brentford happen is the ball never sticks up top. Diedhou needs a bit more work to get up to speed and Woodrow will presumably be the type of player who can hold it up and give us a breather. Sticking a pace merchant in is no good if you never have the sodding ball because it keeps coming back at you and lumping it over the top and hoping he gets on the end of it won't fool Championship defences for too long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alessandro Posted August 17, 2017 Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 1 hour ago, RedDave said: Tomlin Magnússon Giefer GON Moore Taylor Engvall Đurić The above players have either performed below expectation, took longer to get to required level than expected or are now squad players with no hope of becoming first team regulars I think you need to take loans out of the equation, that's always hit and miss, and temporary by nature. The key for me is when LJ starts selling LJ signings. That's when you can ask the question. So far that's been one (if I'm right) and we all know that was somewhat of a 'special' case. That's not me defending anyone BTW. Magnussen and GON (when not injured) are in and around the squad and important squad players. You need those, right? You can't just have 11 players. Taylor and Đurić have both had injury issues, but IMO played important roles in our turn around of form last season, so you could hope they kick on this season when fit. Taylor Moore is in the youth bracket and was bought with that label, so he cannot be written off or used in that argument, IMO. Engvall - I'll give you that one. The reality is though we judge the success of the signings on the pitch, and it's just too early to judge this season. But the squad is settled, it's LJ's squad and it's good enough to compete, so to be honest, there are no more excuses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midred Posted August 17, 2017 Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 Hope we'll carry on building with Taylor/Woodrow... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolman_Stand Posted August 17, 2017 Report Share Posted August 17, 2017 LAst year was about padding out the squad given how light we were, aslo trimming some of those not deemed good enough. This year should really be about bringing in quality players that will make a significant difference, if that doesn't prove to be the case then we will be in trouble!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkeh Posted August 18, 2017 Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 20 hours ago, RedDave said: Tomlin Rightly so, stole a wage Magnússon Disapointed with how he's been treated Giefer Never our player was only on loan GON Has only been 80% fit but disapointing Moore Always been one for the future Taylor Injured at the moment but he helped us stay up very harsh Engvall Hasn't settled Đurić injured so you are being harsh, looked good when fit The above players have either performed below expectation, took longer to get to required level than expected or are now squad players with no hope of becoming first team regulars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cidered abroad Posted August 18, 2017 Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 20 hours ago, Red Army 87 said: Still think last summer was 2 windows in 1 to make up for the summer of 2015. Now we are seeing fewer moves and I would have thought a quiet January providing we are doing ok in the league. It was also to build a very depleted Under 18/23 Academy squad. Some on here haven't caught up yet with the fact that to buy an 18/19 year old with good potential is now likely to cost a seven figure transfer fee. That's football inflation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
And Its Smith Posted August 18, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 1 hour ago, Monkeh said: Tomlin Rightly so, stole a wage (so was a poor signing) Magnússon Disapointed with how he's been treated (deemed not good enough) Giefer Never our player was only on loan (signed to see if he was good enough for permanent and wasn't) GON Has only been 80% fit but disappointing (so another poor signing) Moore Always been one for the future (signed for future but now pathway to first team blocked by Johnson's other signings) Taylor Injured at the moment but he helped us stay up very harsh (Clearly not a first team player) Engvall Hasn't settled (poor signing) Đurić injured so you are being harsh, looked good when fit (signing a player who is injury prone is a poor signing) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC_Dan Posted August 18, 2017 Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 22 hours ago, RedDave said: When is this squad complete and ready for a safe mid table season? We had a safe mid-table season last season. It just didn't feel like it for a few months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
And Its Smith Posted August 18, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 1 minute ago, BCFC_Dan said: We had a safe mid-table season last season. It just didn't feel like it for a few months. It's not a safe season if you are in bottom three in March is it!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkeh Posted August 18, 2017 Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 Just now, RedDave said: It's not a safe season if you are in bottom three in March is it!! It was august last time i checked Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
And Its Smith Posted August 18, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 4 minutes ago, Monkeh said: It was august last time i checked What are you on about? Talking about last season, obviously Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkeh Posted August 18, 2017 Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 Just now, RedDave said: What are you on about? Talking about last season, obviously that never happened like the SoD year its gone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
And Its Smith Posted August 18, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 1 minute ago, Monkeh said: that never happened like the SoD year its gone Don't know what you are on about to be honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yipikiaye Posted August 18, 2017 Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 The squad is almost complete were mid table . 3 games 1 win 1 draw 1 lose . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC_Dan Posted August 18, 2017 Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 15 minutes ago, RedDave said: It's not a safe season if you are in bottom three in March is it!! It's a safe season if you're not in the bottom three in May. It doesn't really matter where you are at any point prior to that. I agree with you though that we need to aim to do better this season and that we should ideally not be in or near the bottom 3 at any point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
And Its Smith Posted August 18, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 33 minutes ago, BCFC_Dan said: It's a safe season if you're not in the bottom three in May. It doesn't really matter where you are at any point prior to that. I agree with you though that we need to aim to do better this season and that we should ideally not be in or near the bottom 3 at any point. I think it does matter where you are prior. If we finish in the same place but are never lower than 16th then it will be a more successful season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WolfOfWestStreet Posted August 18, 2017 Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 If johnson cant get something decent out of the most expensively assembled squad ever assembeled here then he needs to go. We've spent decent money no excuses now. Top half finish 10-12. 5th/6th round FA cup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted August 18, 2017 Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 When is any squad complete? By their very nature they're constantly revolving and evolving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marina's Rolls Royce Posted August 18, 2017 Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 On 8/17/2017 at 16:41, David Brent said: As complete as can be. Cogito ergo sum, there is no completion. But the squad shouldn't need an overhaul each season. That's all we need on this forum- someone quoting Greek proverbs w Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Brent Posted August 18, 2017 Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 1 hour ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said: That's all we need on this forum- someone quoting Greek proverbs w It's all Greek to me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AppyDAZE Posted August 18, 2017 Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 2 hours ago, JonDolman said: Lansdown said he wants 2 teams of first team players. So assuming we get this goalie or some other goalie in, we will just be a midfielder short. So would not be surprised if a new midfielder is brought in. I heard him say that and I can understand it to a degree BUT that = either alot of unhappy "1st teamers" not in the side and/or alot of tinkering. Yeah, on reflection i suppose you're looking at something around 20 players... just would rather the likes of Taylor Moore and other young players being the ones chomping on the bit to get a chance. Less unhappy players that way and a tighter knit group Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivorguy Posted August 18, 2017 Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 2 hours ago, JonDolman said: Lansdown said he wants 2 teams of first team players. So assuming we get this goalie or some other goalie in, we will just be a midfielder short. So would not be surprised if a new midfielder is brought in. The real worry is that we have largely two teams of reserve players at present ( i.e. Most of our players would be back up ones at other Championship clubs). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wendyredredrobin Posted August 18, 2017 Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 The squad will be complete when the 5 year plan comes to an end. Only problem is that I don't know when the 5 year plan started. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RumRed Posted August 18, 2017 Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 3 hours ago, Yipikiaye said: The squad is almost complete were mid table . 3 games 1 win 1 draw 1 lose . Great, now let me grab the bunting... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted August 18, 2017 Report Share Posted August 18, 2017 39 minutes ago, JonDolman said: Really disagree with that Agree. I think people expect us to have a squad like Boro, or Newcastle (from last season), and therefore try to relate to how many of our players would get in theirs. But there are many if our players who other Champ teams see as being decent performers at this level. I always though Derrick Williams was a player who as he got older would mature into a decent player at this level. We sold him to Blackburn and lot on here suggested he wouldn't get a game, League One at best, the weak link in our promo team, etc, yet he played 39 games and was voted POTY. So what, they got relegated, it wasn't only down to him, and judging by the fact he got POTY, I'd suggest there were many worse performers than him, and perhaps a few more like Williams might've meant we went down instead! You could probably go through our squad and rank them as "top six team", 'middle twelve", "bottom six". We might not have many in the first category, but would have a load in the middle category. Of course we'd have a few in the final category too. You might argue there's a fourth category of "not good enough" and yes a few would fall into that too. But two reserve sides as Ivor suggests is so wide of the mark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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