Q and A tonight

[RumRed]

Ooh you're all out.

[EmersonsRed]

4 minutes ago, RumRed said:

Ooh you're all out.

Mine was light hearted after seeing the other one

[chinapig]

3 hours ago, Up The City! said:

Was he sacked? I thought he wanted to keep a psychologist on board he had recently brought in but was denied permission and that was the tipping point?

He was told missing out on promotion meant the budget had to be cut but wasn't prepared to accept that so didn't have his contract renewed.

Johnson subsequently won promotion on a shoestring in comparison.

[WTFiGO!?!]

9 hours ago, redapple said:

No it wasn't directed at you , it was a slightly tongue in cheek dig at someone equally passionate but equally cynical. I posted it while doing half a dozen early morning chores at the same time and ended up not posting his quote which defeated the point of it ! 

Is the revolution here ? No not really as business classes don't do revolution, but there is a far better organised club, team and management than I recall ever seeing down there and I like what I see and hear, and it all makes good sense. I've been optimistic about different regimes in the past, notably Danny Wilson and Joe Jordan's teams only for it to end badly, but I think this time there's good strength in depth, good quality and they all seem to have bought into his ideas. 

I'm the last person who buys corporate bullshit it's just an irrational passion for that bloody football club. 

Ah, fair play.

There's words that strike 1000 times deeper than Mark Ashton ever can and they are Reading 0-1 Bristol City.

My understanding of LJ is that he has gone down the road of 'evidenced based research',  cyclically used in the education of nurses and teachers.  

My experience of evidenced based research is that it is all good in theory, as is it's nature.

What the reality is, when trendy young students come in on placement armed from their universities with evidence based research (I was one) and a patient is screaming in their face, being spat at or are head butting a wall - their evidence based research is fast forgotten.  Their actual instinct kicks in and they learn a damn lot from the incident.  

The revelation that Paterson is being convinced to occupy the  front or back post because it makes statistical sense - because knoekart scored 15 goals last season for Brighton and we sign the likes of Ellision and Engvar on the basis that they fit with current theory is an expensive and certainly experimental way to go.

And who should score the winner? A no-nonsense centre half.

 

[chinapig]

6 hours ago, WTFiGO!?! said:

Ah, fair play.

There's words that strike 1000 times deeper than Mark Ashton ever can and they are Reading 0-1 Bristol City.

My understanding of LJ is that he has gone down the road of 'evidenced based research',  cyclically used in the education of nurses and teachers.  

My experience of evidenced based research is that it is all good in theory, as is it's nature.

What the reality is, when trendy young students come in on placement armed from their universities with evidence based research (I was one) and a patient is screaming in their face, being spat at or are head butting a wall - their evidence based research is fast forgotten.  Their actual instinct kicks in and they learn a damn lot from the incident.  

The revelation that Paterson is being convinced to occupy the  front or back post because it makes statistical sense - because knoekart scored 15 goals last season for Brighton and we sign the likes of Ellision and Engvar on the basis that they fit with current theory is an expensive and certainly experimental way to go.

And who should score the winner? A no-nonsense centre half.

 

I'm not clear on your point. Are you saying that the fact that Paterson didn't score the winner proves LJ wrong in his approach? It's just that one goal in one game seems a small sample.

It also seems fairly reasonable to suggest that Paterson is more likely to score if he finds good positions in the box than if he tries to half volley a clearance from 20 yards.

It's about probabilities not certainties.

[Ian M]

7 hours ago, WTFiGO!?! said:

Ah, fair play.

There's words that strike 1000 times deeper than Mark Ashton ever can and they are Reading 0-1 Bristol City.

My understanding of LJ is that he has gone down the road of 'evidenced based research',  cyclically used in the education of nurses and teachers.  

My experience of evidenced based research is that it is all good in theory, as is it's nature.

What the reality is, when trendy young students come in on placement armed from their universities with evidence based research (I was one) and a patient is screaming in their face, being spat at or are head butting a wall - their evidence based research is fast forgotten.  Their actual instinct kicks in and they learn a damn lot from the incident.  

The revelation that Paterson is being convinced to occupy the  front or back post because it makes statistical sense - because knoekart scored 15 goals last season for Brighton and we sign the likes of Ellision and Engvar on the basis that they fit with current theory is an expensive and certainly experimental way to go.

And who should score the winner? A no-nonsense centre half.

 

Without wishing to scream or spit in your face, where did Pato score from against Villa? 

[WTFiGO!?!]

58 minutes ago, chinapig said:

I'm not clear on your point. Are you saying that the fact that Paterson didn't score the winner proves LJ wrong in his approach? It's just that one goal in one game seems a small sample.

It also seems fairly reasonable to suggest that Paterson is more likely to score if he finds good positions in the box than if he tries to half volley a clearance from 20 yards.

It's about probabilities not certainties.

 - No !!  They were indeed very select samples (Pato and Flint) to support a very general point!  

My general point is, as I was walking home last night it struck me like a flash of light - Lee Johnson is a blimmin' 21st century vocational graduate!  

Despite the obsessiveness certain quarters seem to get with evidence based research (EBR), it has its limitations and is only appropriate to a point.  Patient A is an entirely different individual to Patient B.  One size doesn't fit all.  As a very, very general example, if we are playing a team with a defence who are particular good at defending their front and back posts but are really poor at defending the edge of the box then we may wish to not go with what LJ's computer is telling us to do.

I'll give LJ the benefit of the doubt in that he appreciates the difference between real life and the text books but I know first hand just how seriously EBR takes it's own authority and how obsessed some people can get with it.  LJ does seem the sort that would get wholly rapped up in it, a textbook manager.  Let's hope he's not.

Football is far from an exact science or a mathematical equation.  I'd suggest teaching players how to think for themselves and how to assess situations as they find them, with some EBR in mind.

Beware the new false gospel !!

21 minutes ago, Ian M said:

Without wishing to scream or spit in your face, where did Pato score from against Villa? 

That's a very hand-selected example Ian M, you little tinker  

[pongo88]

1 hour ago, Ian M said:

Without wishing to scream or spit in your face, where did Pato score from against Villa? 

Being slightly pedantic, he scored as a result of an almighty goalmouth scramble following a free kick. This isn't the same thing as his potential scoring position in open play being alluded to by LJ. 

[chinapig]

3 minutes ago, WTFiGO!?! said:

 - No !!  They were indeed very select samples (Pato and Flint) to support a very general point!  

My general point is, as I was walking home last night it struck me like a flash of light - Lee Johnson is a blimmin' 21st century vocational graduate!  

Despite the obsessiveness certain quarters seem to get with evidence based research (EBR), it has its limitations and is only appropriate to a point.  Patient A is an entirely different individual to Patient B.  One size doesn't fit all.  As a very, very general example, if we are playing a team with a defence who are particular good at defending their front and back posts but are really poor at defending the edge of the box then we may wish to not go with what LJ's computer is telling us to do.

I'll give LJ the benefit of the doubt in that he appreciates the difference between real life and the text books but I know first hand just how seriously EBR takes it's own authority and how obsessed some people can get with it.  LJ does seem the sort that would get wholly rapped up in it, a textbook manager.  Let's hope he's not.

Football is far from an exact science or a mathematical equation.  I'd suggest teaching players how to think for themselves and how to assess situations as they find them, with some EBR in mind.

Beware the new false gospel !!

That's a very hand-selected example Ian M, you little tinker  

Thanks for the reply.

As a number cruncher by trade I find there are some that want a statistical model to make their decisions for them, some who ignore evidence because they are convinced that they know everything because their gut tells them and those that understand that analysis is an aid to judgement not a replacement for it.

The first group will need to wait a hundred years for AI to mature, the second will do what they do because they always have, regardless of results. The third are the ones most likely to succeed.

My sense, and hope, is that LJ is in the third group.

[Phileas Fogg]

4 minutes ago, pongo88 said:

Being slightly pedantic, he scored as a result of an almighty goalmouth scramble following a free kick. This isn't the same thing as his potential scoring position in open play being alluded to by LJ. 

Hmm, I see what you're saying - but he wouldn't have got the goal if he'd been on the edge of the box.

Depends when an attacking free kick/corner 'ends'. For me, a goalmouth scramble from a set piece is still part of a set piece.

[WTFiGO!?!]

3 minutes ago, chinapig said:

Thanks for the reply.

As a number cruncher by trade I find there are some that want a statistical model to make their decisions for them, some who ignore evidence because they are convinced that they know everything because their gut tells them and those that understand that analysis is an aid to judgement not a replacement for it.

The first group will need to wait a hundred years for AI to mature, the second will do what they do because they always have, regardless of results. The third are the ones most likely to succeed.

My sense, and hope, is that LJ is in the third group.

We're probably all a mix of the two.  I'm probably 75% intuitive, 25% EBR.  Hence my stance here.  

I only hope LJ isn't too unbalanced one way or the other, I get the sense he may be.

[chinapig]

6 minutes ago, WTFiGO!?! said:

We're probably all a mix of the two.  I'm probably 75% intuitive, 25% EBR.  Hence my stance here.  

I only hope LJ isn't too unbalanced one way or the other, I get the sense he may be.

I'm with you in being wary of fashion but intuitive for me means having sound judgement based on accumulated experience, providing you have learned from that experience and you are open minded enough to take on board evidence that suggests you might be wrong.

Sounds like your approach in fact.

Me, I'm 63 but still look to learn new things that might make me better at my job. You can teach an old dog new tricks. Even footballers.

I don't think LJ is saying for instance that Paterson should never do anything intuitive but that he should be aware that getting into certain positions more often will increase his chances of scoring.

It seems like we have players, and coaches, who are open to learning, which can only be a good thing. I'd much rather have that than a bunch of old pros who think they know it all.

[BobBobSuperBob]

26 minutes ago, WTFiGO!?! said:

We're probably all a mix of the two.  I'm probably 75% intuitive, 25% EBR.  Hence my stance here.  

I only hope LJ isn't too unbalanced one way or the other, I get the sense he may be.

In fairness to LJ ,WTFIGO  he made clear the other night that there is a place for both

He cited when and if to make substitutions as one and recruitment as another

As I see it , and I hope / think LJ does , and as you do , there is a place for both and if the evidence emanating from both gives the same reading I think you'd agree that this makes decision making more informed and provides confidence in those decisions

The problem often comes in the dilemma , when intuitive doesn't match the EBR

[pongo88]

10 hours ago, WTFiGO!?! said:

Ah, fair play.

There's words that strike 1000 times deeper than Mark Ashton ever can and they are Reading 0-1 Bristol City.

My understanding of LJ is that he has gone down the road of 'evidenced based research',  cyclically used in the education of nurses and teachers.  

My experience of evidenced based research is that it is all good in theory, as is it's nature.

What the reality is, when trendy young students come in on placement armed from their universities with evidence based research (I was one) and a patient is screaming in their face, being spat at or are head butting a wall - their evidence based research is fast forgotten.  Their actual instinct kicks in and they learn a damn lot from the incident.  

The revelation that Paterson is being convinced to occupy the  front or back post because it makes statistical sense - because knoekart scored 15 goals last season for Brighton and we sign the likes of Ellision and Engvar on the basis that they fit with current theory is an expensive and certainly experimental way to go.

And who should score the winner? A no-nonsense centre half.

 

 

1 hour ago, chinapig said:

Thanks for the reply.

As a number cruncher by trade I find there are some that want a statistical model to make their decisions for them, some who ignore evidence because they are convinced that they know everything because their gut tells them and those that understand that analysis is an aid to judgement not a replacement for it.

The first group will need to wait a hundred years for AI to mature, the second will do what they do because they always have, regardless of results. The third are the ones most likely to succeed.

My sense, and hope, is that LJ is in the third group.

Evidence based research and statistical analysis!  Football is definitely changing, so I'll chuck something else into the hat, Honey and Momford's learning styles,  which identifies four distinct learning styles or preferences: Activist, Theorist; Pragmatist and Reflector. Activists are those people who learn by doing things. Theorist like to understand the theory behind the actions. Pragmatists need to be able to see how to put the learning into practice in the real world. Reflectors learn by observing and thinking about what happened. 

Usually people are a mix of these styles with one or two of them dominating and one or two lacking. LJ seems to be an interesting mix, with perhaps the theorist style being the dominant one.  He seems to adapt and integrate observations from his StatsBomb and WyScout software into complex but logically sound, to him,  theories. His weakness is probably being too strong on the reflector aspect. Reflectors  ponder experiences and observe them from many different perspectives. They  postpone reaching definitive conclusions for as long as possible and tend to be  too cautious. Last season was a good example, as results were diabolical for a long period, but it took him a long time to react.  I'd say he's  weak on the pragmatist side, because he's slow in reacting when the theories go wrong on the pitch. Instead of thinking this isn't working, he sticks with the theory for too long.  A pragmatist would say  "There is always a better way" and "If it works it's good and stuff the theory".

By the way, if you're reading this LJ, I'm happy to pop into Ashton Gate and provide a bit of management consultancy to help you at the discounted rate of £750 per day. I'm quite happy to do this sitting in bed with you and your laptop if it would help

Also, this analysis of LJ and his team is unlike the usual forum style, so perhaps we should go back to the standard mix of personal observations with a few  insults thrown in for good measure

 

[chinapig]

7 minutes ago, pongo88 said:

 

Evidence based research and statistical analysis!  Football is definitely changing, so I'll chuck something else into the hat, Honey and Momford's learning styles,  which identifies four distinct learning styles or preferences: Activist, Theorist; Pragmatist and Reflector. Activists are those people who learn by doing things. Theorist like to understand the theory behind the actions. Pragmatists need to be able to see how to put the learning into practice in the real world. Reflectors learn by observing and thinking about what happened. 

Usually people are a mix of these styles with one or two of them dominating and one or two lacking. LJ seems to be an interesting mix, with perhaps the theorist style being the dominant one.  He seems to adapt and integrate observations from his StatsBomb and WyScout software into complex but logically sound, to him,  theories. His weakness is probably being too strong on the reflector aspect. Reflectors  ponder experiences and observe them from many different perspectives. They  postpone reaching definitive conclusions for as long as possible and tend to be  too cautious. Last season was a good example, as results were diabolical for a long period, but it took him a long time to react.  I'd say he's  weak on the pragmatist side, because he's slow in reacting when the theories go wrong on the pitch. Instead of thinking this isn't working, he sticks with the theory for too long.  A pragmatist would say  "There is always a better way" and "If it works it's good and stuff the theory".

By the way, if you're reading this LJ, I'm happy to pop into Ashton Gate and provide a bit of management consultancy to help you at the discounted rate of £750 per day. I'm quite happy to do this sitting in bed with you and your laptop if it would help

Also, this analysis of LJ and his team is unlike the usual forum style, so perhaps we should go back to the standard mix of personal observations with a few  insults thrown in for good measure

 

Evidence based insults only please. 

[BobBobSuperBob]

Questions & Answers

Part Four

 

After the explanation by LJ  of how software / data / analysis is used in both recruitment and player development a question from the floor was asked whether in essence we were following a moneyball type approach

 

MA answered saying 'Moneyball' was worked better with baseball as it is much more a statistical sport and that we operated on a objective and subjective basis and that watching a player was as important as the data 

 

MA explained that sometimes the data will lead them to a player and the player would go through a process including being watched and sometimes a player would be spotted in person in which the case the data and analysis research would then be done

 

From the floor it was put to MA that to make this philosophy succeed either our recruitment and / or our  coaching / development of the players recruited surely had to be exceptional to climb to the top of the tree as we were competing with numerous clubs who were trying to do the same thing using the same tools and MA was asked how we would make sure we were the best or near to the best of those batch of clubs at succeeding in this philosophy

 

(MA was also asked if we had replaced our head of recruitment)

 

MA said this was an interesting question and agreed that we were fishing in ponds lakes and rivers in competition with a whole number of clubs and said that they had to persuade TA, HM, NE , EP etc to 'Come to Bristol City' and one of the challenges they faced , was that some people don't realise that this is the new Bristol City and part of their jobs was to 'market' the club around the world explaining to people what the Club is now and how we are moving forward, how the stadium and infrastructure has changed and what they are trying to do with the training ground etc

 

MA said he then wanted to show one of the tools they use around the world that they send to agents , players , clubs along with written professional brochures

 

The video , (in essence showcasing the Club) was then shown

 

At the conclusion of the video MA reiterated it was one tool they use to market the Club as they needed to persuade agents and players to come here , that this was the right club for them , and they could develop the player here either to be part of success with us or with us being a stepping stone for the player a la JK

 

MA explained TA and Leko were good examples where they had managed to beat off stiff competition from a number of Clubs , to persuade the player to come to us

 

MA said coming back to the original question (about being the best at the philosophy) MA said there were only certain elements you can control and you can have all the data and fancy tools but you needed to have the ability to be understand the data and apply the data and the work ethic to try and put it in place

 

MA said they could control the work ethic and culture in the club

 

MA said that they had worked extremely hard over the summer working on their 'culture , our rule settings , our discipline , how we operate' and how they intended to progress and move forward

 

MA said that there could be 'No excuses from anyone in the Football Club this season as everyone knows their jobs on and off the pitch' , added to the discipline thought and processes and action added to the technology added to the intelligence we've got ,and to the people they've recruited *

 

• (MA said he didn't mean players but said that he'd worked with some really good staff over the years and really good and successful managers but hadn't worked with a group that work longer harder and more passionately than LJ / JM / DH (and some not there on the night) and said they were as talented as anyone he'd worked with) 

 

MA said add all this to the mix and what else was going on around the platform he genuinely believed we were like 'a rocket ship that's off the platform'

 

 

 

Mods - would you be kind enough to adjust the text size again please - Thanks 

 

 

[Phileas Fogg]

13 minutes ago, cynic said:

 

I wonder what Bill Shankly or Brian Clough would make of all this EBR, Moneyball, etc etc ?

I can hazard a guess  followed by 

I wonder what William The Conquerer would've made of the notion that the world is spherical?

Things move on, concepts and ideas evolve

[Lrrr]

The actual concept of moneyball itself is difficult to apply to football as the game is based upon open skills as opposed to the elements of baseball being focused on closed skills. However you can take the concept of value for money from it and combine it with data analysis, similar but not quite the same. 

[Mr Popodopolous]

@pongo88 Great post.

@cynic Unsure the style of an all powerful autoautocratic manager works these days.

Plus the rise of player power, agents- they may not take this all on but they would need to evolve with it, at least partially. Meet it halfway etc.

One thing is I think increasingly true, way the game has evolved- both on the pitch and off it- football is no longer a simple game made complex etc.

[JamesBCFC]

2 hours ago, pongo88 said:

 I'd say he's  weak on the pragmatist side, because he's slow in reacting when the theories go wrong on the pitch. Instead of thinking this isn't working, he sticks with the theory for too long. 

But that isnt the case

LJ isnt afraid of swapping what is happening on the pitch if something isnt working.

There were games last season where we changed formation 4-5 times and he was chastised for it on here.

[Bristol Rob]

What is Moneyball?

[WTFiGO!?!]

5 minutes ago, Bristol Rob said:

What is Moneyball?

A fantastic film based on a true story: https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/moneyball/

[Davefevs]

38 minutes ago, WTFiGO!?! said:

A fantastic film based on a true story: https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/moneyball/

A fantastic book based on a true story made into a decent film 

[BobBobSuperBob]

Part Five

 

Following up on his belief that we were ' like 'a rocket ship that's off the platform'.....

 

MA said that they needed to work harder , smarter , engage with fans better and said that he felt the atmosphere v Villa was the best he'd witnessed at AG and if they could replicate that on and off the pitch 'we've got something special' 

MA said again coming back to the original question , they needed to find all the little gaps and marginal gains

The supporter who,posed the original question said he did have concerns over recruitment and that across the signings over the last 18 months , and accepting there were a number we are yet to see the result of , that probably , most supporters would see the recruitment as a mixed bag, accepting their was an element of a gamble as we weren't in the market for Dwight Gayle etc , and asked for example how we were / intending to beat the market to the right players , and asked if any other clubs had  identified Eliasson for example

MA said that on the eve of us signing NE they had a call from a Premiership Club to ask whether we were signing NE, we asked why they were asking and they stated they were very interested in him. MA tells them we are signing NE and that they said 'Fine you take him , if he does well for you , we'll be after him'

MA reiterated that in the ponds we are fishing in , unless we are signing eleven proven Knockhart types there was always going to be an element of risk

MA was asked how we get to players like Eliasson first ahead of other Clubs

MA said when they identified NE ,there were probably 3 or 4 other Clubs at the same stage and they spent six hard weeks trying to persuade the agent and player and said that some they will win and some they will lose, some because other clubs will offer twice or three times what we are able to offer financially and they simply need to use every tool at their disposal to persuade the player to come to Bristol City but reiterated that there was always an element of risk

MA said that 'normally' the amount you spend (wages) the less the risk, as you are buying 'tried and tested' but 'we are not in that market'

 

From the floor , it was then put to MA that following on from TAs successful stay here MA had said that a number of Premier League Clubs were looking at City to loan players to , and asked why the Club had not been entrusted with young Premier League loanees this season and why we'd had to go fishing in the said pond

Lee said the truth was , we had , and that every single 'Top Club' had offered us something and the dilemma they always faced was 'What do we want' and said the perfect scenario was putting out eleven Bristolians who had come through the academy and working right back from there they'd prefer to have one of our own academy players in than a loanees where we are developing another Clubs talent but there were occasions when there were extreme talents that they felt could benefit our team as in Jonathan Leko who he said has the ability to 'light the game up' and is the equivalent in West Brom's eyes as Tammy is to Chelsea's and the fact WBA have trusted us with him / his development was a massive credit, and people wouldn't believe the work that goes into that

Lee repeated the story how he and head of recruitment had been up to London on a wet wild night and had meetings at Chelsea and met a couple of agents and were returning to Bristol and were back near Swindon when LJ got a call at 9.30 at night saying they could meet Tammy if they wished to , Lee said they needed to grab the opportunity and drove back to Cobham and were talking with Tammy and his family until 1 in the morning selling the Club and explaining the philosophy to them and that personal connection got them Tammy

LJ  said this was also the case with Leko who he'd met with 6/8 weeks ago and explained the philosophy to him, explained it was a young squad that he would get on with and said ever since then Leko had been 'hooked' and had been asking for recordings of our games and even our training sessions to see what we are doing

Lee said that he and his staff needed to commit to these young players development and they do that , with a young staff and the hours they put in , particularly after training with extra sessions for players

Lee said it wasn't an exact science and all sorts of things can effect a player - he pointed out that young players can become overnight millionaires in this division and that can cause problems , or domestic issue etc etc can all affect a player and his development 

 

tbc

 

 

 

[chinapig]

Thanks Bob for your Herculean efforts. Fascinating stuff and so well written.

[Lanterne Rouge]

If the stuff about Leko is right then it says a lot about him as a player too. He obviously wanted to make sure he was coming to the `right` club at an important stage in his development and was prepared to put in the research to help him decide.

I`m sure he and WBA would have had many other offers but we were their choice which all sounds good to me.

[BobBobSuperBob]

Part Six

the next question from the floor , was to Lee , and was 

'Purely in terms of league position, what constitutes success this season ?'

 

Lee said it was a difficult one to answer and asked an open question whether the glass was half full or half empty at the moment , pointing out we had a tough , if exciting September coming up and that he genuinely believed in the team and said that he believed we have a fantastic group, and a good solid  number and a good mix of youth and experience but reiterated that if you stand still in Championship you fall behind and pointed out that some sides that were competing with us last season like Birmingham had spent millions in the summer and millions on wages 

LJ said the Championship is a tough league with each individual game a challenge and fine margins proving a difference

Lee said that he felt we were better equipped and pointed out on recruitment there had been some earl success stories like Josh Brownhill  and that Joe Bryan had improved , that they believed that COD just needed the platform to come good,  and Eliasson they rate , that to remember Famara is only 24, and Bobbys success as a striker and somebody they had turned down bids for in the window

He said there were so many positives and he wasn't sure the Club had ever had a stronger balance / asset sheet (Assume he meant in terms of players) and that the key was , and the strength of the Club lay in the fact that we have a owner who says  we don't have to sell and that should mean we have the opportunity to work with and develop these players and as they gain experience and push into the top six / top two over the next 2/3 years, hopefully earlier but it depends on how they develop

LJ said that we needed to get these players on good contracts , that they need to be hungry and mobile and pointed out how we competed with Villa and the age and wage bill of their size and that this excited him as he likes to see the young players develop 

He said the inclusion of Lloyd Kelly in England U20"squad was largely due to them (Mainly JM) badgering the England staff to have a look at LK and what a prospect he was 

MA then said it was not the recruitment that worried him but keeping hold of players as 'Be under no illusions ' people were looking at Bristol City , at Joe Bryan , Bobby Reid , at Josh Brownhill, Lloyd Kelly etc etc and said they felt they'd done a good job to get LK signed on a new 3 year contract before the Watford game as the their was a lot of interest in him after that game

MA said on signings they will get some right , some wrong but that people within the club and at the academy should take great credit for Kelly , Vyner , O'Leary and Woolacott etc

MA also,pointed out that LJ should be credited for moving BR to a 'Nine and a half role' as there had been a discussion about this at the end of last season and that it was LJ who made the decision that he was going to do this and that he believed in him (BR)

 

The next question from the floor concerned the signing of Matty Taylor and whether we did anything 'special' to sign him

Lee explained no , and that a lot of what was alleged at the time was nonsense , that he (LJ) is not signed up to an agent and that Championship Clubs were waiting to see if MT could perform in League One and that we had been looking at him for a while , particularly Brian Tinnion 

(Lee joked that he couldn't go to Rovers himself very often as they sing nasty songs about his wife and recounted a funny account of a stressful visit to Rovers v Cardiff when he found himself trapped in his car with Cardiff and Rovers fans all around him)

 

The next question from the floor concerned Brian Tinnion role at the club and JM answered saying that the work BT does and has done in the last 5 years was unbelievable explaining just how many games he watches from U15 through to first team level and that BT had taken on the role of monitoring the loanees as they saw loans as a integral part of player development as U23 football was in comparison to Championship football and that they wanted to try and bridge the gap between U23 and Championship football and they wanted players to experience first team / competitive football and all that entails

JM explained that BT watches as many of the loanees games and. Produces reports on them and clips of them and was doing a fantastic job

JM pointed out that both BR and JB had been out on similar loans and 2/3 years down the line were established Championship players worth millions and that with LJ in charge the lads could see there was a pathway for them to the first team

JM said it was good to see how the lads who have been out on loan last season have developed and speaking to them when they came back , what an eye opener it was for them and how they'd benefited from it 

 

 

Tbc

[Port Said Red]

7 hours ago, pongo88 said:

Being slightly pedantic, he scored as a result of an almighty goalmouth scramble following a free kick. This isn't the same thing as his potential scoring position in open play being alluded to by LJ. 

 

7 hours ago, Phileas Fogg said:

Hmm, I see what you're saying - but he wouldn't have got the goal if he'd been on the edge of the box.

Depends when an attacking free kick/corner 'ends'. For me, a goalmouth scramble from a set piece is still part of a set piece.

His best chance yesterday was from getting into the kind of positions LJ wants and being picked out by Bobby Reid. He pulled that one wide, but it shows that he is trying want the coach wants.

[BCFC Rich]

I know others have already said it but thanks BobBobSuperBob. What an amazing effort to write all this up. You are obviously better at note taking than I was! I'd finish lectures at uni go back and read my notes and not understand a thing I had written. 

[BobBobSuperBob]

21 minutes ago, RichardEdd said:

I know others have already said it but thanks BobBobSuperBob. What an amazing effort to write all this up. You are obviously better at note taking than I was! I'd finish lectures at uni go back and read my notes and not understand a thing I had written. 

Thanks - no problem - glad it's of interest benefit to otheres

What the best of the forum is about

Wasn't sure about going but thought it might be interesting and the number of people who were interested but unable to go made my mind up that it would be worth going and to take full notes 

Glad I did as I found the evening very interesting - thought you could get a good feel for those answering in that environment , and really glad I made all the notes as going back through them I remembered lots of bits I'd forgotten and I found it doubly interesting going back through , with the added benefit of others knowing exactly what was said and discussed 

Id highly reccomend people going to the next one , if we are lucky enough that they continue them occasionally - for me it was not just what was said but for the feel / impression you got of those speaking