CyderInACan Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 Just read these. First Oscar* explaining how he’s fallen out of love with City then our very own @Davefevs explaining how he, well, hasn’t. https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/sport/football/ive-fallen-out-love-bristol-3823109 https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/sport/football/bristol-sport-given-bristol-city-3823160 Intetsting viewpoints from both. But who’s right!? Or are they both correct? *apologies if you’re on here mate, feel free to let me know your nom de plume. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 5 minutes ago, CyderInACan said: Just read these. First Oscar* explaining how he’s fallen out of love with City then our very own @Davefevs explaining how he, well, hasn’t. https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/sport/football/ive-fallen-out-love-bristol-3823109 https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/sport/football/bristol-sport-given-bristol-city-3823160 Interesting viewpoints from both. But who’s right!? Or are they both correct? *apologies if you’re on here mate, feel free to let me know your nom de plume. Fiiiiiiiiiight!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CotswoldRed Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 Which one is correct? Both to a certain extent. If I fall into one camp, it's definitely Oscar's. Sorry Dave! I'll not point the finger too much at City though. Every club is a shadow of its best days imo. Best days of fan involvement and care for the community it works within. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 I hate you @CotswoldRed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearded_red Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 Don’t think there is any right or wrong in such a debate, but my feelings would fall completely in line with Oscar’s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
And Its Smith Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 Oscar’s point of view is very idealistic. It would be hard for the club to progress without most of the changes that have happened. He keeps stating on twitter that match day prices have doubled. Season tickets can be bought for £17 per game. I can’t remember them being £8.50 per game. Finally, a lot of memories are rose tinted ones as well I reckon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big C Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 I'm with you @Davefevs football (like life) moves on. People need to keep up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Isewater Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 There are elements of truth in both opinions but essentially the world moves on and if you support your club and want the best players in the highest division then you have to accept the downside which is that the chances are slim that the best players all come from Bristol and catch the bus with the fans on matchdays. The club is in my heart since my grandad used to share his Sunday paper with me and we discussed the matches and gossip surrounding Ashton Gate . I, sadly , never went to the ground with him but it was our club and despite everything it still is . If you cut me I bleed red. You can still experience much of what we have lost , at the Mem or non league if it is that you want but City is into the 21st century and surviving whilst many clubs go to the wall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berkshire Red Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 19 minutes ago, Davefevs said: Fiiiiiiiiiight!!! Harry Hill, is that you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 Could not find one thing I agreed with in what that Oscar says! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spudski Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 Oscar hasn't fallen out of love with City... he's fallen out of love with football in general, the majority of Sport and pretty much the Entertainment 'business'...everything in this country is now inclined to be like it. It's a catch 22. The only way of change is supporting with your feet and your pocket. More people are now likely to watch sport via TV and be entertained the same way. They also don't want to shop and now do so more online. It's a viscous circle. I still get a buzz from going to games...I don't think the Club can be blamed. It's the world changing. These types of conversations were also happening in the 70s...people moaned back then saying football had become more commercial. Clubs changed badges left right and centre trying to be more business like. Think Leeds did it 5 times in the 70s. Players had bigger contracts, sponsored cars, had their hair Permed looked more like girls than now It's all a bit rose tinted imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledAjax Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 You could write a book on this subject but ultimately it comes down to what you think the role of Bristol City Football Club is in life, perhaps even the role it plays in your life. At the smaller end a football club can fulfill many of the things that other "clubs" in society do. That is they provide a time and place for like-minded humans to come together and take part in the same activity. Simultaneously these people will socialise with each other and from bonds as they share in the successes and failures of their endeavour. Golf clubs, working mens' clubs, the WI, Cubs and Brownies, even fan clubs all fulfill this spot in a human's life. Many of the greatest names in football were formed for precisely this reason - to help maintain in winter the team bond that a Cricket club built in the summer, to provide some recreation for the men of a particular industry or town, or simply as the sporting activity that a certain church group did. Over the last 100+ years the popularity of football has seen it's scale and scope increase to the point where we now have nations effectively sponsoring teams. Fueled by rivallry, competition and money these teams have grown far beyond their original purpose of bringing together a local community. Through this process some things that are good have faded, but surely some that are bad have rotted away as well (remember the Dolman toilets). Some positives have also come from it: just one example is how young men (and to an extent women) with natural talent are able to convert the fortunes of themselves and their families and create wealthy dynasties that would otherwise have never happened. As the clubs have grown so more people are drawn to it. Whether they come to the club becasue they move to North Street, find the twitter page, or because they're Bermudian and just support whoever Nakhi Wells plays for, they will come and there's little you can do to stop them. Naturally these newcomers will be from a different place, a different time, or simply a different social demographic than those who "founded" the club or are from it's core area (geographic or otherwise). Here you will, through difference, find resentment. Oscar talks about this when he discusses the gentrification of Bedminster and how the Club reflects this. It isn't an unfounded concern but it is also not one that is driven by the club. There is some argument that the club should reflect the area that it is in. If that area, and its inhabitants, has changed then surely so should the club? If it stubbornly clings to the past then in some way doesn't it cease to fulfill it's role as a place to socialise for those who need it? Personally I would have to say that if offered a Bristolian club staffed by Bristolians, with Bristolians on the pitch: but playing in non-league, the idealist in me would take it. However, Dave is bang on that to survive in the world that exists the club must adapt. In this case I guess if I must align myself then apologies to @Davefevs but I am with Oscar as well. Then again there's a part of me that says if I want that low-key homeliness so badly then I may as well buy a plastic garden chair, a blue and white quartered shirt and a subscription to Babestation. Bristol City is the club I am part of and so I follow wherever it may lead (but I'd absolutely bring back "One for the Bristol City"). Has any club managed to achieve success without morphing into a cold corporate behemoth? Burnley? Sheffield Utd? Bournemouth? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 For info, I was given Oscar’s full copy to look at / respond to. There were some bits I agreed with, also some bits of both of ours that couldn’t be published either!!!! Its about opinions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ashton_fan Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 37 minutes ago, CyderInACan said: Just read these. First Oscar* explaining how he’s fallen out of love with City then our very own @Davefevs explaining how he, well, hasn’t. https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/sport/football/ive-fallen-out-love-bristol-3823109 https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/sport/football/bristol-sport-given-bristol-city-3823160 Intetsting viewpoints from both. But who’s right!? Or are they both correct? *apologies if you’re on here mate, feel free to let me know your nom de plume. Oscar's article says how the club is only interested in making money yet it's losing money nearly every season, SL is putting money in not taking it out the commercial initiatives are just so the club can keep it's head above water Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcfc01 Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 3 minutes ago, Davefevs said: For info, I was given Oscar’s full copy to look at / respond to. There were some bits I agreed with, also some bits of both of ours that couldn’t be published either!!!! Its about opinions. Indeed it is. And my opinion is that a young bloke who has only supported since 2004 has no idea of what football was like in the "good old days." 2004 ! get some in, then tell us about it. I'm with Fevs. 100%. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledAjax Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 1 minute ago, Davefevs said: For info, I was given Oscar’s full copy to look at / respond to. There were some bits I agreed with, also some bits of both of ours that couldn’t be published either!!!! Its about opinions. It's interesting for me how it's the younger man looking back to the past with warmth. Whereas the (relatively of course) older guy is the one happy with the changes. Possibly this isn't what some would expect? Obviously your experience with your son is a huge part of your Bristol City experience and has great influence on your view of the Bristol Sport project. You're also pretty open about how you watch the Flyers as well as City so that must colour your view a little as well? What one needs from City changes through one's life just as much as anything else. Do you think you'd have the same views if you were in your early 20's and had no children? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 31 minutes ago, RedDave said: Oscar’s point of view is very idealistic. It would be hard for the club to progress without most of the changes that have happened. He keeps stating on twitter that match day prices have doubled. Season tickets can be bought for £17 per game. I can’t remember them being £8.50 per game. Finally, a lot of memories are rose tinted ones as well I reckon. I can remember when they were less than £8.50 a season young pup Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoystonFoote'snephew Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 They're both right.... For them. For me it's a bit of both. There are times when I fall out of live with football but then I get excited again about the progress being made. I do find the club a little more impersonal than it was. Many who work at the club don't appear to be supporters like they used to be, and I bemoan the end of FAN which gave supporters a voice direct with the faces of the club. I would also prefer to sort out my season ticket at the club and collect personally, but it's naive to believe that we could progress in this day and age with everything staying the same. We now have a club, a ground and facilities that could grace the Premiership, we just have to get there. That may or not be this year but I believe it will be sooner rather than later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
And Its Smith Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 4 minutes ago, glos old boy said: I can remember when they were less than £8.50 a season young pup Not in 2012 ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CotswoldRed Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 44 minutes ago, Davefevs said: I hate you @CotswoldRed Plenty in common with my missus then Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fordy62 Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 I wonder how much Oscar wouldn’t have fallen out of love if the home games hadn’t been such a nailed on tugid affair for the last 2 years? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wendyredredrobin Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 54 years supporting City now and will always support City. Whether I keep a season card or just pick my games, I will still support City. I don't like the way football has gone in general from a financial perspective, but if we want to survive and progress, we have to go with the flow. We have been very lucky to have owners like Harry Dolman and Steve Lansdown over the years and would not be here today without either of them. Oscar makes fair points and so does Dave, but on balance, I would have to side with Dave I think (if only because I'm to old to fight ). CITID Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 5 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said: It's interesting for me how it's the younger man looking back to the past with warmth. Whereas the (relatively of course) older guy is the one happy with the changes. Possibly this isn't what some would expect? I thought exactly the same, the general thought would be the older guy resistant to change. Obviously your experience with your son is a huge part of your Bristol City experience and has great influence on your view of the Bristol Sport project. From a pure football point of view, it’s our “father and son” time. Mrs Fevs doesn’t understand why we have to go to every game. For me it’s our equivalent of my dad managing my junior team, and you were committed every week. I’m the same with Joe and City home games. I’d go to away games with him too if I didn’t have a wife and daughter! I think the Bristol Sport ‘support’ is through an understanding of the business side of football, and it’s objectives in today’s football-business world. Reading stuff by David Conn, Simon Jordan etc has given me an appreciation of the money side, and how without commercial-sense, it would be a tougher battle than it is...and it’s tough enough. You're also pretty open about how you watch the Flyers as well as City so that must colour your view a little as well? Interesting one. I played basketball at school, and had a season playing in the Bristol leagues, before I started playing a better level of football and the commitment increased, meaning I could no longer play. I honestly think had I gone to The Flyers off my own back (rather than through Gareth Torpy - City’s DSLO, who I got to know), I would have loved it all the same, Bristol Sport led, or not. In many ways the proposed move to Ashton Gate is bitter-sweet....living in Downend. What one needs from City changes through one's life just as much as anything else. Do you think you'd have the same views if you were in your early 20's and had no children? I don’t think it’s a age or kids thing....I think it’s a partly a knowledge thing (the football business), perhaps the age thing does come into because I lived through 1982. I don’t think Bristol Sport, or City FC get it all right either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exAtyeoMax Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 I don’t think Oscar is being particularly nostalgic but bemoaning recent changes to personnel and club branding which he could relate to. Regarding using White Stripes instead of The Wurzels, yes the players requested it but were they asked if the club should change the song or were they just asked to choose a song because the club wanted a change? Why weren’t the fans consulted? After all, it is more our club than the players’ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 14 minutes ago, ashton_fan said: Oscar's article says how the club is only interested in making money yet it's losing money nearly every season, SL is putting money in not taking it out the commercial initiatives are just so the club can keep it's head above water but who gets what in the way things are set up, transfer fees/ST`s/fan zone outlets/players cost/manager, coaches costs? who pays what and who gets what? When you say the club do you mean just us or the grounds other users as well and where are Bristol Sport in all this who pays them, the concerts etc? When the redevopement to the ground was done it was supposed to give our club more income, has it and from what/where exactly? A few questions I know but what are the answers, gen dont know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanterne Rouge Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 I`m with @Davefevs in the main. There is lots I do miss from the old days in the 70s and 80s but a lot I don`t. TBH nothing much has changed really since 2004, the really immense changes happened a good ten years before that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 12 minutes ago, RedDave said: Not in 2012 ! Sorry I miss-understood, apologies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhistleHappy Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 49 minutes ago, Major Isewater said: There are elements of truth in both opinions but essentially the world moves on and if you support your club and want the best players in the highest division then you have to accept the downside which is that the chances are slim that the best players all come from Bristol and catch the bus with the fans on matchdays. The club is in my heart since my grandad used to share his Sunday paper with me and we discussed the matches and gossip surrounding Ashton Gate . I, sadly , never went to the ground with him but it was our club and despite everything it still is . *** If you cut me I bleed red. You can still experience much of what we have lost , at the Mem or non league if it is that you want but City is into the 21st century and surviving whilst many clubs go to the wall. *** Thats gotta be a good sign for a start!! Hopefully we all agree with that one... COYR's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judda Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 Davefevs for me. Times change and looking back with rose tinted glasses doesn't include all the shit times we've endured over the years... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhistleHappy Posted February 11, 2020 Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 27 minutes ago, glos old boy said: I can remember when they were less than £8.50 a season young pup My first season ticket cost £5 ( brand new Dolman Stand .. Juvenile U16 ticket) Good old days! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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