TdF 2023

[RoystonFoote'snephew]

I hope I'm proven to be wrong but the Ineos Grenadier's line-up for this year Tour looks weak to me. Bernal is still battling back to fitness and is no match for the likes of Vingegaard and Pogacar, so unless young Carlos Rodriguez or Dani Martinez springs a surprise I feel Ineos needs to change tack from being all out for the GC and look for stage wins. Pidcock and Castroviejo could be ideal for that. 

[tin]

If he goes the distance, it’s Vingegaard’s to lose once again. They’ve added Kelderman, who was Bora’s Giro leader, as domestique and anyone with Van Aert working for them is onto a winner IMO.

That said, Pogacar is an out and out racer; the best I’ve even seen in more than 30 years of watching the Tour. I hope he wins again, but he’ll need a lot of luck in running. 

Ineos are a spent force IMO and the fact they’re going with three leaders (Bernal, Martinez, Rodriguez - who is a real talent) will be their undoing. I hope Pidcock nicks a stage, though. 

I rode Saturday’s first stage in May last year and it was one of the best routes I’ve ever done, even if it was a pootle as part of a top mate’s stag do. 

Edited June 28, 2023 by tin

[Rob k]

1 hour ago, RoystonFoote'snephew said:

I hope I'm proven to be wrong but the Ineos Grenadier's line-up for this year Tour looks weak to me. Bernal is still battling back to fitness and is no match for the likes of Vingegaard and Pogacar, so unless young Carlos Rodriguez or Dani Martinez springs a surprise I feel Ineos needs to change tack from being all out for the GC and look for stage wins. Pidcock and Castroviejo could be ideal for that. 

I was surprised to see Bernal make the line up, Ineos will definitely be stage hunting this year i think. 

[MichaelRobartes]

Would love Cav to get one more stage win.

[Rob k]

28 minutes ago, MichaelRobartes said:

Would love Cav to get one more stage win.

Same here, im not sure it will happen but i really really hope it does 

[Lanterne Rouge]

I`ve just been looking at the route and it looks brutal this year. I can`t remember there being as many summit finishes in previous years. Should make for some great TV coverage though. I`m looking forward to seeing Biniam Girmay as well, he looks the real deal and a black African cyclist doing well would be a great thing.

Bring it on!

[Norn Iron]

Am I the only one who having read the first post had no idea what it was about and couldn't think what TdF stood for? These thoughts come in cycles!

[Harry]

Agree re Ineos. I think stage wins is their target this year. 
Vingy & Pog to battle it out for 1 & 2. 
Should be decent battle for the final podium place - Be interesting to see what Carapaz can do now he’s released from the Ineos shackles and has a pretty decent EF team around him. Can Gaudu go one better than last year for the French? Will Mas ever step out of his comfort zone. Could Hindley be consistent enough to challenge the podium? Wide open for 3rd place for me. 
 

As for Cav, can’t see it myself. His team are not built around him and there’s stronger sprinters and sprint teams. In the early season stuff, aside from a couple of stages at the Giro he was never in the mix and often found himself well down the peloton coming into the crucial last K. 

Will also be interesting to see Wout and Van Der Poel potentially battling each other for stages. 
 

Looking forward to this one. 

[Merrick's Marvels]

Good luck Cav. 

[Harry]

2 hours ago, Harry said:

 Should be decent battle for the final podium place - Be interesting to see what Carapaz can do now he’s released from the Ineos shackles and has a pretty decent EF team around him. Can Gaudu go one better than last year for the French? Will Mas ever step out of his comfort zone. Could Hindley be consistent enough to challenge the podium? Wide open for 3rd place for me. 

Oh dear. Spoke too soon. 
Mas now abandoned and Carapaz gonna be 10 mins back already and those knees not looking good after the crash! 

[Lanterne Rouge]

Great stuff from the Yates boys!

[RoystonFoote'snephew]

It is the Tour de France so you never know but I doubt that Carapaz will start tomorrow. Better he abandons and possibly start the Vuelta. 

Yates brothers amazing today. UAE looking strong. Tomorrow should be another amazing day amongst the GC contender teams.

As for Cav I hope Astana can get him to the flat stages because I do give him a chance for 35. I know he doesn't have a sprint train around him but if the strong riders can take him to the last 2km he can surf the wheels. There has never been a sprinter who needed a lead out less than him. 

[Antman]

4 hours ago, Harry said:

Agree re Ineos. I think stage wins is their target this year. 
Vingy & Pog to battle it out for 1 & 2. 
Should be decent battle for the final podium place - Be interesting to see what Carapaz can do now he’s released from the Ineos shackles and has a pretty decent EF team around him. Can Gaudu go one better than last year for the French? Will Mas ever step out of his comfort zone. Could Hindley be consistent enough to challenge the podium? Wide open for 3rd place for me. 
 

As for Cav, can’t see it myself. His team are not built around him and there’s stronger sprinters and sprint teams. In the early season stuff, aside from a couple of stages at the Giro he was never in the mix and often found himself well down the peloton coming into the crucial last K. 

Will also be interesting to see Wout and Van Der Poel potentially battling each other for stages. 
 

Looking forward to this one. 

re Cav - i don't think anyone saw that final Giro stage happening - he thrashed the opposition then. he will be well fired up, i think the 3 rd stage is one where he will have his eyes on it - just hope he doesn't crash out like in Yorkshire when he tried too hard

[Frenchay Red]

Adam talks so fast I almost need subtitles

[Harry]

4 hours ago, Antman said:

re Cav - i don't think anyone saw that final Giro stage happening - he thrashed the opposition then. he will be well fired up, i think the 3 rd stage is one where he will have his eyes on it - just hope he doesn't crash out like in Yorkshire when he tried too hard

Yep. At the Giro, the couple of times he managed to get himself ‘in the mix’ he still looked like he had the speed, but his problem all season has been actually getting himself ‘in the mix’. 
All to often he’s been buffetted down the peloton and not had the team mates around him good enough to protect him and move him back up again. 
For me he just hasn’t managed to get himself into the positions to be able to contest the final sprint. He’s too often found himself outside of the top 20-25 heading into the final corner and he’s too far off to launch. 
He doesn’t need the sprint train, but what he does need is enough strong and brave teammates to keep him in the top 20 heading into the final k. Cees Bol will help but he needs more than that, for me. 
Of course, I desperately hope he does it, but he’s just too far off contention too many times this season so far. 

[Rob k]

8 minutes ago, Harry said:

Yep. At the Giro, the couple of times he managed to get himself ‘in the mix’ he still looked like he had the speed, but his problem all season has been actually getting himself ‘in the mix’. 
All to often he’s been buffetted down the peloton and not had the team mates around him good enough to protect him and move him back up again. 
For me he just hasn’t managed to get himself into the positions to be able to contest the final sprint. He’s too often found himself outside of the top 20-25 heading into the final corner and he’s too far off to launch. 
He doesn’t need the sprint train, but what he does need is enough strong and brave teammates to keep him in the top 20 heading into the final k. Cees Bol will help but he needs more than that, for me. 
Of course, I desperately hope he does it, but he’s just too far off contention too many times this season so far. 

And don’t forget in the Giro who it was who helped him out which won’t happen again!! 

Edited July 1, 2023 by Rob k

[RoystonFoote'snephew]

As expected Richard Carapaz didn't start. Fractured left kneecap apparently. Not sure it's happened before that two teams, Movistar and EF Easypost, lose their leaders on day one. With what's ahead this could be a brutal tour. 

[Harry]

8 hours ago, RoystonFoote'snephew said:

As expected Richard Carapaz didn't start. Fractured left kneecap apparently. Not sure it's happened before that two teams, Movistar and EF Easypost, lose their leaders on day one. With what's ahead this could be a brutal tour. 

Yep. Big shame that. I was looking forward to seeing what Carapaz could do this year. I think he’d have genuinely challenged for 3rd. 
 

I loved that finish by Lafay today. Great for Cofidis. 
 

Let’s see how the first sprint stage pans out tomorrow. Lots of sprinters and lead outs have been taking it very steady this first 2 days. I think it’s gonna be a seriously fast and stressful finish. 

[tin]

I dont think Carapaz would’ve been near the podium, personally, not based on his performances in the Dauphiné.

Half chance for Cav in Bayonne tomorrow, definitely the first sprint stage unless the break gets away.

[Harry]

52 minutes ago, tin said:

I dont think Carapaz would’ve been near the podium, personally, not based on his performances in the Dauphiné.

Half chance for Cav in Bayonne tomorrow, definitely the first sprint stage unless the break gets away.

Not saying he’d have got on the podium but he’d have been one of a few riders who’d be challenging for 3rd, and I think it would’ve made for a quite exciting side dish - Carapaz, Mas, Hindley, Gaudu, Bardet, Simon Yates, Landa - there’d not have been much between them all, and to have 2 of them gone on day 1 is a huge disappointment 

[tin]

9 hours ago, Harry said:

Not saying he’d have got on the podium but he’d have been one of a few riders who’d be challenging for 3rd, and I think it would’ve made for a quite exciting side dish - Carapaz, Mas, Hindley, Gaudu, Bardet, Simon Yates, Landa - there’d not have been much between them all, and to have 2 of them gone on day 1 is a huge disappointment 

Early days but Simon Yates looks best of the rest so far IMO, assuming Lafay doesn’t stay the pace. Surely he’ll pay for his efforts at some point soon. 

Can’t wait to see them go up the Tourmalet on Thursday, that’ll be when the GC riders come to the fore. I climbed it last summer and hope they’ve sorted the surface on the downhill to Luz-Saint-Saveur. 

[red84]

Enjoyed the finish yesterday, decent opportunity for Cavendish to be up in the mix today

[Lanterne Rouge]

The scenery today is absolutely stunning. The Atlantic coast of France is beautiful.

[Rob k]

Quality finish today - i can’t imagine riding a bike that fast, i doubt i go as quick as they do even when going downhill

[Harry]

10 hours ago, tin said:

Early days but Simon Yates looks best of the rest so far IMO, assuming Lafay doesn’t stay the pace. Surely he’ll pay for his efforts at some point soon. 

Can’t wait to see them go up the Tourmalet on Thursday, that’ll be when the GC riders come to the fore. I climbed it last summer and hope they’ve sorted the surface on the downhill to Luz-Saint-Saveur. 

Superb. 
I did the Tourmalet in 2012 (was the final climb of the tour and Wiggins just needed to get over it and be safe for the win). 
We stayed in Luz-Saint-Saveur too. 
However, after a few beers in the bar near the top I don’t remember the road back as we detoured across the fields most of the way back down!!! Got a bit hairy when the light started to fade mind! 

[Harry]

3 hours ago, Lanterne Rouge said:

The scenery today is absolutely stunning. The Atlantic coast of France is beautiful.

It was actually the scenery that got me into the Tour back in the early 80’s when they first started showing it. 
I loved the cycling, but I was always transfixed by the stunning landscapes too. 

[tin]

1 hour ago, Harry said:

Superb. 
I did the Tourmalet in 2012 (was the final climb of the tour and Wiggins just needed to get over it and be safe for the win). 
We stayed in Luz-Saint-Saveur too. 
However, after a few beers in the bar near the top I don’t remember the road back as we detoured across the fields most of the way back down!!! Got a bit hairy when the light started to fade mind! 

Haha, I know the cafe you mean. We had a beer in there, and got stuck in to more in a lovely little bar in Luz-Saint-Saveur. It was a good decision as the descent was pure gravel and sketchy as!

The Tourmalet wasn’t as hard as some of the Tour climbs I’ve done, although I remember it ramped up coming out of La Mongie. The scenery was spectacular. 

I wouldn’t be at all surprised if Pinot fancies it on Thursday, having won there last time and with this being his final Tour…

Edited July 3, 2023 by tin

[Harry]

18 minutes ago, tin said:

Haha, I know the cafe you mean. We had a beer in there, and got stuck in to more in a lovely little bar in Luz-Saint-Saveur. It was a good decision as the descent was pure gravel and sketchy as!

The Tourmalet wasn’t as hard as some of the Tour climbs I’ve done, although I remember it ramped up coming out of La Mongie. The scenery was spectacular. 

I wouldn’t be at all surprised if Pinot fancies it on Thursday, having won there last time and with this being his final Tour…

Yeah. This is the bar/cafe, in the background on this first pic. 
Our walk back down afterwards, I think it was when we got to the bit in the 2nd pic that we decided it’d be best to just go straight through the fields instead. But then we got a little lost

Yeah; I can understand what you mean about the difficulty level of the Tourmalet. Whilst it’s not necessarily the steepest in parts, it’s just brutally long. 
 

[miser]

27 minutes ago, TomF said:

Very flat one today, maybe this ones got Cav's name on it? 

Today's gonna be a long wait for a short race at the end. One for the purists.

[Lanterne Rouge]

Jesus! That was ******* terrifying!