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SC&T Meeting with BCFC 13/09/23

phantom

By phantom
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thatcham red

thatcham red

Posted
Posted
23 hours ago, ExiledAjax said:

Stu, does the SC&T ever speak to other Trusts and Supporter Clubs about similar situations?

Many other clubs have a set up very similar to us. Just one well known one is Spurs.

Big shiny new stadium that isn't owned by the club but by a sister company. Stadium is used for a huge number of other commercial events, including other sports. Ultimately it's all owned by an offshore company and some public individuals. How do they sort things out? How do they make sure the football fans feel prioritised on the right things?

Honest question that I don't think I've asked you before. 

Yes, the FSA have networks set up for men's and women's teams, however, it is done by leagues. So, these days I don't speak to many premier league teams like Tottenham. The FSA are just collecting data on away ticket prices for example and do sometimes ask Supporters Trusts to feed in on certain topics and surveys. I must admit i have not come across any teams that talk about the complexities that we face.

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The Humble Realist

The Humble Realist

Posted
Posted

Hi all,

Reading the recent meeting between the supporters trust and bristol.city I was shocked at how many answers were 'this is to do with Bristol sport'

It seems like a cop out to me but it got me thinking about a hypothetical but I assume unlikely scenario. 

What would happen/be the consequences of Lansdown selling Bristol city but keeping Bristol sport ?

Is it the actual stadium bristol sport own or do they just provide the services in it for example. If bristol city own the stadium and my scenario came true would the new owner be effectively able to kick out the rugby team etc etc 

Someone like @Davefevs I'm sure can detail a few implications althoguh I also assume.the scenario is highly unlikely ....or is it? Are there any actual possible scenarios where lansdown only sells one/part of the bristol sport empire ?

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Rocking Red Cyril

Rocking Red Cyril

Posted
Posted

It's what has always worried me with this Lansdown set up. Bristol city do no own Ashton gate. I am a Bristol city fan, red till I dead for 49 years now. And to be honest am not greatly interested in Bristol sports . All my concern is is for the team, fans and stadium. I am greatly concerned by the thought of foreign ownership because I will have to re access my support or not. Foreign owners is not what English football should be about . I know it seems to the modern way to funding for success but the thought of it with us leaves a bad taste in my mouth. Success at any cost is not acceptable in my mind 

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ExiledAjax

ExiledAjax

Posted
Posted (edited)

There are basically 4 companies that make up "Bristol City". 

These are:

1. Bristol City Football Club Limited - this is the company that you think of as "the Club". It's the company that employs the players, and it hold the share in the EFL that entitles us to compete in that competition, it also owns the training ground at Failand.

2. Bristol City Women Football Club Limited - does the same as the above but for the Women's team. This company is owned by Bristol City Football Club Limited.

3. Ashton Gate Limited - owns Ashton Gate. Bristol City Football Club Limited and the Rugby Club have contracts with this company to use the stadium.

4. Bristol City Holdings Limited - this company owns both Bristol City Football Club Limited and Ashton Gate Limited. It is the the "Top Company". It does not trade, and does not have contracts with other companies, it merely exists to report consolidated accounts to the EFL for FFP purposes. It is itself owned by Pula Sport Ltd, a Guernsey company owned by Steve and Maggie Lansdown.

This is not unusual, and is a common set up in football. There's a picture at the bottom of my post that shows this.

As you can see, "Bristol Sport" does not own either the football club or the stadium.

"Bristol Sport" is a separate company that is also owned by Pula Sport Ltd. It provides services, by way of commercial contract, to the other companies, including the club and the stadium companies. That it's Bristol Sport that organised the catering, the ticket services, and operates Ashton Gate is no surprise really, and it leaves the Club company free to just contract and pay players and staff. 

25 minutes ago, The Humble Realist said:

What would happen/be the consequences of Lansdown selling Bristol city but keeping Bristol sport ?

The contractual relationships would have to either be terminated, in which case the Club would need to find new suppliers, or would continue, in which case there'd be some possible commercial issues.

Screenshot_20230917-090330.png

Edited by ExiledAjax
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Numero Uno

Numero Uno

Posted
Posted
44 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

There are basically 4 companies that make up "Bristol City". 

These are:

1. Bristol City Football Club Limited - this is the company that you think of as "the Club". It's the company that employs the players, and it hold the share in the EFL that entitles us to compete in that competition, it also owns the training ground at Failand.

2. Bristol City Women Football Club Limited - does the same as the above but for the Women's team. This company is owned by Bristol City Football Club Limited.

3. Ashton Gate Limited - owns Ashton Gate. Bristol City Football Club Limited and the Rugby Club have contracts with this company to use the stadium.

4. Bristol City Holdings Limited - this company owns both Bristol City Football Club Limited and Ashton Gate Limited. It is the the "Top Company". It does not trade, and does not have contracts with other companies, it merely exists to report consolidated accounts to the EFL for FFP purposes. It is itself owned by Pula Sport Ltd, a Guernsey company owned by Steve and Maggie Lansdown.

This is not unusual, and is a common set up in football. There's a picture at the bottom of my post that shows this.

As you can see, "Bristol Sport" does not own either the football club or the stadium.

"Bristol Sport" is a separate company that is also owned by Pula Sport Ltd. It provides services, by way of commercial contract, to the other companies, including the club and the stadium companies. That it's Bristol Sport that organised the catering, the ticket services, and operates Ashton Gate is no surprise really, and it leaves the Club company free to just contract and pay players and staff. 

The contractual relationships would have to either be terminated, in which case the Club would need to find new suppliers, or would continue, in which case there'd be some possible commercial issues.

Screenshot_20230917-090330.png

Bearing in mind your flowchart is only a portion of the set-up that has been created........anyone know why Steve is having trouble selling up?

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ExiledAjax

ExiledAjax

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Numero Uno said:

Bearing in mind your flowchart is only a portion of the set-up that has been created........anyone know why Steve is having trouble selling up?

In my experience of helping people buy and sell businesses the number one reason that buyer's can't be found is the same reason you or I might struggle to sell our house: too high an asking price.

A secondary reason could be the commercial complexity but in my experience if the price is right then those other hurdles can be worked around.

Oh and the third is that the buyer doesn't have the money they said they did.

Edited by ExiledAjax
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Numero Uno

Numero Uno

Posted
Posted (edited)
48 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

The whole lot I believe, ie the bit on the right missing from the pic above.

 

Yes, it was a firmly tongue in cheek comment. I understand @ExiledAjax's comments that hurdles can be overcome but my question would be "What is it about Bristol City FC or any other part of Bristol Sport for that matter that would attract a billionaire to overcome those hurdles in the first place? What compelling reasons are there for someone to part with North of £100 million and take that lot on? What is our USP that convinces them Bristol Sport is the one?". Take our Bristol biased specs off and where is the value (or at least the sensible limit on outlay) for a prospective buyer?

If I was a Saudi, American or UK businessman I wouldn't touch our set up with a barge pole from a purely business perspective. As a business model all it appears to do is piss money up against the wall in multiple directions.........that's Steve's money, Steve's model, Steve's clubs and Steve's legacy we are talking about right there.

And this is my longstanding point, Steve is 100% responsible for the structure and as a result we are in total limbo until that one buyer comes along who is willing to purchase Spaghetti Junction........................if they ever come along that is.

Edited by Numero Uno
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Davefevs

Davefevs

Posted
Posted
7 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

Yes, it was a firmly tongue in cheek comment. I understand @ExiledAjax's comments that hurdles can be overcome but my question would be "What is it about Bristol City FC or any other part of Bristol Sport for that matter that would attract a billionaire to overcome those hurdles in the first place? What compelling reasons are there for someone to part with North of £100 million and take that lot on? What is our USP that convinces them Bristol Sport is the one?". Take our Bristol biased specs off and where is the value (or at least the sensible limit on outlay) for a prospective buyer?

If I was a Saudi, American or UK businessman I wouldn't touch our set up with a barge pole from a purely business perspective. As a business model all it appears to do is piss money up against the wall in multiple directions.........that's Steve's money, Steve's model, Steve's clubs and Steve's legacy we are talking about right there.

And this is my longstanding point, Steve is 100% responsible for the structure and as a result we are in total limbo until that one buyer comes along who is willing to purchase Spaghetti Junction........................if they ever come along that is.

I guess the simple answer is, the riches of the Premier League???

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Numero Uno

Numero Uno

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Davefevs said:

I guess the simple answer is, the riches of the Premier League???

I reckon there are other clubs in the pecking order before us when investors look at owning clubs who could potentially get to the Premier League. In fact you could argue Plymouth Argyle would be a better buy than us....................and a big part of the reason why is the structure that we operate under.

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Davefevs

Davefevs

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, Bristol Rob said:

The CEO has already resigned.

??

4 minutes ago, BUTOR said:

I heard dismissal, but yep. Gone.

??

Ta, haven’t heard anything, but then again, I wouldn’t expect to either.

Interesting if true, he was only on BBCRB week before last, and at golf day too.

Nor, would I be surprised either.

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Bristol Rob

Bristol Rob

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

??

??

Ta, haven’t heard anything, but then again, I wouldn’t expect to either.

Interesting if true, he was only on BBCRB week before last, and at golf day too.

Nor, would I be surprised either.

To be fair to the other poster, all I heard was 'he's already gone', no indication of if it was because they had resigned or were given the Spanish.

I assumed resignation.

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bcfc01

bcfc01

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Leaving because it’s a mess and things you can’t influence.

I realise its a shitshow behind the scenes, but I thought that would be his job - to sort it out.

I suppose if he found it impossible to do so, then he just becomes a part of it.

Huge indictment on SL if true.

 

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