Liam Manning - CONFIRMED NEW HEAD COACH

[Riaz]

@W-S-M Seagull

Just watched his press conference and he's nothing like Lee Johnson. Not in any way.

Poor comparison

[Riaz]

14 hours ago, JammyOne said:

Poor appointment in my opinion, and we’ll do a lot worse now in the present and future. 

Based on?

[red panda]

40 minutes ago, Fordy62 said:

Thank you for a considered and insightful post. 

But please, let’s put to bed this ‘loyal club with managers’. We’ve been loyal once. Once ever. And that was to a family friend. Cotterill - no loyalty. Pearson - no loyalty. 

The Lansdowns seem to have been afforded this ‘patient owners’ tag, it’s peddled by Sky because they allowed Johnson to lose a million in a row, twice. And with respect, its bollocks. Take nepotism out of the equation and They’re no more patient than any other owners in reality (barring maybe Watford).

I hope you’re right about Manning. Good luck for the season.  

Sorry, I can't let this go.  The owners are patient and it's not just special treatment.  Watford are an extreme example, but there are lots of other trigger happy owners in the Championship.  In the last ten years, Birmingham have had 13 managers, Cardiff 12, Huddersfield 15, Leeds 14, Leicester 12, QPR 12, Sheffield Wednesday 14, Southampton 11, Stoke 10, Sunderland 16, Swansea 13 and West Brom 16.

These stats come from soccerbase.com and include caretakers (I've only shown those in double figures).  On exactly the same basis, we've had 7 or possibly 8 if you count both Curtis F and Liam M (and it's only that high because SO'D sneaks into the period by a few weeks).  If anyone wants to recalculate the stats without caretakers, be my guest.  But I think you'll find a similar picture.

Sorry to let facts get in the way of another anti-Lansdown moan.  And for those wondering, the figure for Watford is 21.

[Rossi the Robin]

11 hours ago, Not Banksy said:

Just thinking... can't be many situations where a new manager (head coach) comes in after a sacking with the team 4 points off the play offs.

And players still running through brick walls for the manager prior to sacking 

[Riaz]

4 hours ago, Andy082005 said:

I disagree on giving him the time of his contract. There may be money available in January and the question hs to be if you are the owner 

“do we want to give money to a man we are not sure is the right man past the summer of 2024?’

People say Pearson had the finances pulled - I don’t think he did. I just don’t think the bloke did enough to warrant a new contract past next summer, so it would be daft to have given him money in January and invest in his plan further when it was likely he would not be here 

Pearson then used the press to force the issue in recent weeks. Has he not done that - I’m sure he would still be here 

Time to move on 

Er what?? He improved the squad every season, while slashing the wage budget. He was only here 2 and a half years.

We were looking down and come the end, we were looking up. Absolutely deserved to get a chance at the next phase of getting into the play-offs.

[Red Army 75]

https://yellowsforum.co.uk/threads/clauses-for-bristol-city.10032/
 

Oh no the @GrumpyGit got it bad. Hope we sign a player from Oxford in January. 

Edited November 8, 2023 by Red Army 75

[AshtonGreat]

4 hours ago, SydneyCity said:

I’m unenthusiastic about him. I can’t even be bothered to finish the press conference or interview - just a bit boring really. Like an office middle manager. Hopefully his football is a lot more entertaining.

At least he's got a bit of zest about him

[Riaz]

1 hour ago, Fordy62 said:

Thank you for a considered and insightful post. 

But please, let’s put to bed this ‘loyal club with managers’. We’ve been loyal once. Once ever. And that was to a family friend. Cotterill - no loyalty. Pearson - no loyalty. 

The Lansdowns seem to have been afforded this ‘patient owners’ tag, it’s peddled by Sky because they allowed Johnson to lose a million in a row, twice. And with respect, its bollocks. Take nepotism out of the equation and They’re no more patient than any other owners in reality (barring maybe Watford).

I hope you’re right about Manning. Good luck for the season.  

We've always given managers plenty of time. Pearson is the first one, we've sacked early. First time, hardly any fans were calling for the sack.

[JP Hampton]

4 hours ago, Andy082005 said:

I disagree on giving him the time of his contract. There may be money available in January and the question hs to be if you are the owner 

“do we want to give money to a man we are not sure is the right man past the summer of 2024?’

People say Pearson had the finances pulled - I don’t think he did. I just don’t think the bloke did enough to warrant a new contract past next summer, so it would be daft to have given him money in January and invest in his plan further when it was likely he would not be here 

Pearson then used the press to force the issue in recent weeks. Has he not done that - I’m sure he would still be here 

Time to move on 

Here’s my take fwiw.
 As to your first comment, to balance that, the owners question should also be “or do we risk giving it to a new manager with no proven record in this league or above”.

Pearson wasn’t the “right man” from the early press release and his comments about “no way to run a club” etc. It wasn’t so much is he the right man for the job, but is he the right man for us and we know the answer to that one.  

 I think the fact that NP was not given any reinvestment after the sale of Scott, suggests the “finances were pulled “ .

You say it would be daft to give him money in January,why? Money was certainly a factor in the calibre of player NP was able to afford, drawing from several Division 1 teams for example. 
 

I think Pearson did plenty, while here, look at Mr Pops break down to see steady improvement. I don’t think results were exciting but I could see and appreciate the process.
 The fact is we will never know how well NP could have done from this point, with returning injuries and a promise of money in January, anymore than anyone can say LM will fail or succeed. 
 

Sorry but if your boss isn’t communicating with you, about where your job is headed or not, wouldn’t you use what means you could to find out and “force the issue”?. 
 

From what you say you believe if NP hadn’t created a noise and used the Press to raise the issue, he’d still be here. In my opinion that’s utter nonsense. The lack of communication was a very obvious sign of their having no intention of renewing, no matter what NP did. To suggest it was as simple as NP making a noise with the Press that brought his job to an end is to overlook all that had gone before. 
 

 And yes it is time to move on and I’m doing that nicely thanks, but with a clear idea of my reasons why NPs sacking will always be in my mind unjust, if not shortsighted. 

Edited November 8, 2023 by JP Hampton

[Rossi the Robin]

4 minutes ago, Red Army 75 said:

https://yellowsforum.co.uk/threads/clauses-for-bristol-city.10032/
 

Oh no the @GrumpyGit got it bad. Hope we sign a player from Oxford in January. 

Haha same here

That forum is also a good reminder that £5 a year for OTIB is definitely worth it 

[Red Army 75]

2 minutes ago, Rossi the Robin said:

Haha same here

That forum is also a good reminder that £5 a year for OTIB is definitely worth it 

Absolutely. Great value 

[italian dave]

13 minutes ago, Riaz said:

We've always given managers plenty of time. Pearson is the first one, we've sacked early. First time, hardly any fans were calling for the sack.

Agree Riaz. And even then, Pearson was the second longest serving manager in the division. At most other clubs, with most other owners, he’d have been gone a year ago. When, incidentally, a significant number of fans even on here would have supported that. 

[supercidered]

11 hours ago, Scrumpty said:

Having listened to Manning’s interviews, are you still devoid of optimism, feeling just a bit excited, maybe a little intrigued?

I thought he’s come across well, showed good insight across multiple dynamics, yet without LJ’s bull and smugness.

Of course, proof of pudding will be on the pitch. Still a massive gamble of course, but might work.

Not totally devoid of optimism but not excited and definitely not particularly intrigued.

I think he did well in that it's been a bit of a whirlwind time of it. I thought the intro to the players in the meeting room was really awkward. Totally agree on the LJ bit. I really couldn't stomach anymore of listening to that.

Of course the proof will be what happens on the grass. He intimated that he won't have time to make too many changes and implement his style in the short lead up to the QPR game. So, I'd imagine we will see a similar shape as we would have under NP.

If you listen to most coaches, they say the same sort of stuff and can't think of anything that he said that made me think he is different in any way. At least he didn't try and bullshit with too much technical jargon. He did say about pressing and going over the top of the press. It stuck in my mind a bit and if and when I get time, I will try and find it and quote what he said.

[TomThumb84]

Just saw the latest footage from his first day at the “HPC” and could not work out from body language if we was steely and taking it in stride, rabbit in headlights in demeanour, or trying to telepathically say “Hoggy. Wtf have we done mate?” 

[Davefevs]

4 hours ago, Andy082005 said:

I disagree on giving him the time of his contract. There may be money available in January and the question hs to be if you are the owner 

“do we want to give money to a man we are not sure is the right man past the summer of 2024?’

People say Pearson had the finances pulled - I don’t think he did. I just don’t think the bloke did enough to warrant a new contract past next summer, so it would be daft to have given him money in January and invest in his plan further when it was likely he would not be here 

Pearson then used the press to force the issue in recent weeks. Has he not done that - I’m sure he would still be here 

Time to move on 

Imho this is a flaw in your thinking.

The recruitment model is not - recruiting for a specific manager.  it is recruiting for a profile of player, borne out of a strategy of what is needed to get to the PL.

We have been following that recruitment strategy for over 18 months, the manager should’ve been recruited on the basis of the ongoing strategy, both JL and Tins have said the strategy hasn’t changed.

As you’ll know Nige wasn’t heavily involved in the day-to-day aspects of the process, but would’ve worked with Tins to define what players they wanted at the start of the process…then left it for Tins and SG to do their stuff to find the players to present to Nige.  That process won’t change, whether LM’s involvement will be different I’ve no idea…yet.

if you believe PA, Nige didn’t have the funds removed, he never had them in the first place due to a stupidly constrained budget!

Nige was happy (prepared to get in with it) with Tins squad construct of 2 players for each position backfilled by Academy.  That 22 man senior squad included Atkinson and Benarous with ACLs, and McCrorie’s injury supplemented by TGH’s loan…so remained at 20 - the same as the match day squad max.

We will see if LM is happy to work with similar numbers.

Pearson’s contract and lack of recruitment should not be linked imho.

[Bainsey]

23 minutes ago, TomThumb84 said:

Just saw the latest footage from his first day at the “HPC” and could not work out from body language if we was steely and taking it in stride, rabbit in headlights in demeanour, or trying to telepathically say “Hoggy. Wtf have we done mate?” 

Agreed. Also thought "Hoggy" was Niklas Bendtner for a minute.

[38MC]

5 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Imho this is a flaw in your thinking.

The recruitment model is not - recruiting for a specific manager.  it is recruiting for a profile of player, borne out of a strategy of what is needed to get to the PL.

We have been following that recruitment strategy for over 18 months, the manager should’ve been recruited on the basis of the ongoing strategy, both JL and Tins have said the strategy hasn’t changed.

As you’ll know Nige wasn’t heavily involved in the day-to-day aspects of the process, but would’ve worked with Tins to define what players they wanted at the start of the process…then left it for Tins and SG to do their stuff to find the players to present to Nige.  That process won’t change, whether LM’s involvement will be different I’ve no idea…yet.

if you believe PA, Nige didn’t have the funds removed, he never had them in the first place due to a stupidly constrained budget!

Nige was happy (prepared to get in with it) with Tins squad construct of 2 players for each position backfilled by Academy.  That 22 man senior squad included Atkinson and Benarous with ACLs, and McCrorie’s injury supplemented by TGH’s loan…so remained at 20 - the same as the match day squad max.

We will see if LM is happy to work with similar numbers.

Pearson’s contract and lack of recruitment should not be linked imho.

I would normally agree, but we have a Machiavellian board who wanted him out. I would suggest the two could be linked as I think they didn't want to be backed into a position whereby there could be no question of a contract extension. Not so much setting up to fail, but setting up to not succeed. 

[W-S-M Seagull]

1 hour ago, Riaz said:

@W-S-M Seagull

Just watched his press conference and he's nothing like Lee Johnson. Not in any way.

Poor comparison

Plenty of buzzwords just like LJ. 

Already heard the word processes about a million times. 

[W-S-M Seagull]

5 hours ago, steviestevieneville said:

Give it a rest ffs . You come across so angry that you’re reading/listening to what you want to. He said loads of times about the quality of the squad & it was a major reason for him joining . Take some time out . Doom & gloom

What a bizarre post. 

He didn't but thanks for making things up.

[W-S-M Seagull]

4 hours ago, RedRoss said:

Wow you are relentless with your anti Manning agenda. Over the last few hours you've said:

Promotion or bust because JL says so even though you don't respect JL.

Has to win straight away no excuses.

The players clearly hate him because he's not Nige.

He's not credited the current players enough even though he did and then compared it strangely to Clough telling Leeds players to rip up their medals.

He'll over complicate football but football needs to instructed simply so it doesn't confuse the players (again I'm guessing another reference to Clough liking to keep it simple, I'm sure you've just watched a documentary recently and think you've cracked the manager code)

You've automatically associated LJ with Manning because simply they are both young.

I've probably missed some other golden nuggets from you. You really need to get over Nigel leaving. I know it's been hard on you since he left. Everytime you get into bed with NP pjamas on, in NP bedsheets and then waking up to a NP mug of tea. He's gone mate. It's fine to be critical you've more than done that. Like a broken record infact!

 

 

 

It's nice to see that you believe in free speech and value others opinions. 

Keep it up.

[Riaz]

5 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Plenty of buzzwords just like LJ. 

Already heard the word processes about a million times. 

One buzz word. I watched it after you and was pleasantly surprised at the lack of buzz words and platitudes.

He definitely didnt use that word that much.

You have decided, that he's like LJ because you have made your mind up. I see little similarities.

[W-S-M Seagull]

2 minutes ago, Riaz said:

One buzz word. I watched it after you and was pleasantly surprised at the lack of buzz words and platitudes.

He definitely didnt use that word that much.

You have decided, that he's like LJ because you have made your mind up. I see little similarities.

Where as I felt he did. 

But it's OK for us to have differing thoughts on the matter. 

I've gone back and watched lots of Oxford interviews too and a lot of stuff gets repeated over and over again. 

[lenred]

10 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Plenty of buzzwords just like LJ. 

Already heard the word processes about a million times. 

Tbf he isn’t anywhere near LJisms who just waffled on about complete bollocks most of the time with his batshite analogies and baffling terminology.  LM - admittedly on first impressions - seems to use ‘footballisms’ which are now common place amongst most managers who have come through the academy systems.   There is a difference. Give me Nige’s approach any day but Manning isn’t LJ……yet!

[Davefevs]

17 minutes ago, 38MC said:

I would normally agree, but we have a Machiavellian board who wanted him out. I would suggest the two could be linked as I think they didn't want to be backed into a position whereby there could be no question of a contract extension. Not so much setting up to fail, but setting up to not succeed. 

Yeah, quite possibly an element of that, but nobody should’ve been thinking “oh shit he might bring in the wrong players”.

[steviestevieneville]

43 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

It's nice to see that you believe in free speech and value others opinions. 

Keep it up.

I do , but not when you keep banging on & making up scenarios that may never happen. Do you wake up every morning thinking . Oh no , a plane might crash into my house today that’s how you’re coming across . Worrying about nothing 

[W-S-M Seagull]

Just now, steviestevieneville said:

I do , but not when you keep banging on & making up scenarios that may never happen. Do you wake up every morning thinking . Oh no , a plane might crash into my house today that’s how you’re coming across . Worrying about nothing 

Genuine question, are you Tony Wilkins?

[Mattredrobin]

I've been listening to LM interview today on the official site and press conference he speaks very well, comes across like a genuine nice guy and fits everything we want in the head coach. I also Listened to the Podcast with his Assistant head coach Chris Hogg, He seems like a character and was talking about how they are more of a team (He didn't suggest this the interviewer did) along the lines of Howe and Tindall at Newcastle.....not for one minute suggesting that they will hit those heights. But I am exctited about this appointment. Obviously proof will be in the pudding.

[Scrumpty]

2 hours ago, supercidered said:

Not totally devoid of optimism but not excited and definitely not particularly intrigued.

I think he did well in that it's been a bit of a whirlwind time of it. I thought the intro to the players in the meeting room was really awkward. Totally agree on the LJ bit. I really couldn't stomach anymore of listening to that.

Of course the proof will be what happens on the grass. He intimated that he won't have time to make too many changes and implement his style in the short lead up to the QPR game. So, I'd imagine we will see a similar shape as we would have under NP.

If you listen to most coaches, they say the same sort of stuff and can't think of anything that he said that made me think he is different in any way. At least he didn't try and bullshit with too much technical jargon. He did say about pressing and going over the top of the press. It stuck in my mind a bit and if and when I get time, I will try and find it and quote what he said.

Agree, most coaches say the same things these days, so it was the subtlety I listened to, identifying anything that I didn’t agree with and/or concerned me. I didn’t picked up anything I didn’t agree with, but then it’s the players he needs to inspire, not the likes of me.

To that point, the most impressive part of his interview for me was his explanation of the people that have inspired him and why. I thought this bit was unrehearsed, but showed great insight into dynamics that form successful teams.

[TheJudge07]

Excited by the prospect of Manning and there is clear potential there given his background and coaching experience. However, what a terrible few weeks it has been. The Club's communication has been deplorable and the reasons for Nigel's departure could have been delivered in a different and more professional way. I have watched most of the games this season and there is no way any sensible person could conclude we are a top 6 side. Whilst Pearson's record may have been questioned, this did not really properly consider the conditions he was under.  What concerns me about all this is that we were progressing and the change did not need to happen now. Manning is untested at this level, there not his players and personally I think he is short at least 4/5 players. He also wants to play a different way. Looks like he plays a 343 type formation as well which I dont think works with our current squad. He may well have the midas touch and I will be there at QPR giving full support. However, our board's history and track record of recruiting managers at this level has been deplorable, often ending in relegation.  The next 6 months will therefore be extremely interesting and I have to say, I am nervous about it and where we might end up. Good luck to Liam and I hope he is successful. 

[italian dave]

1 hour ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Plenty of buzzwords just like LJ. 

Already heard the word processes about a million times. 

Not impressed then? Why am I not surprised?

Edited November 8, 2023 by italian dave