£22m loss 22/23 season

[Mr Popodopolous]

This bit surprised me.

Unless the Women's team added more than usual, or were there inbound transfers pre June 30th.

[GrahamC]

7 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Compared to the wages of footballers?! Wouldn't have thought so.

Many will be low-paid jobs and surely the majority are also part-time?

@ExiledAjax points out we had 14 fewer professionals on the books last year compared to the one before.

The 2023 departures of Kalas, Dasilva, Bentley, Martin, Klose, Baker plus the likes of Semenyo, Scott, Kane Wilson, Low, Taylor Moore & Owura Edwards & only 5 arrivals this summer suggests that we have to have significantly reduced our wage bill further since the period covered by these accounts.

[petehinton]

34 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

A loss of that scale, given it included the sale of Antoine too, certainly suggests we are still spending a lot on player wages/fees. 

Maybe it is a top 10 budget (or thereabouts) afterall. 

IIRC didn’t someone say it would technically look like a top 10er (or at least top half) due to kalas, HNM, Bentley, JD etc wages will still be included? Would imagine there’ll be a huge drop in the next set (for this season)

[Tim Monaghan]

38 minutes ago, Super said:

Ouch! Jon won't be getting a new crayon set for Xmas.

Do grown adults actually find this “crayon” jibe funny? That said, some people actually find Mrs Browns Boys funny, so I suppose that answers my own question. 

[italian dave]

14 minutes ago, GrahamC said:

@ExiledAjax points out we had 14 fewer professionals on the books last year compared to the one before.

The 2023 departures of Kalas, Dasilva, Bentley, Martin, Klose, Baker plus the likes of Semenyo, Scott, Kane Wilson, Low, Taylor Moore & Owura Edwards & only 5 arrivals this summer suggests that we have to have significantly reduced our wage bill further since the period covered by these accounts.

Is the women’s team part of all this? I think that’s what Mr P suggests - and if that’s the case wouldn’t their promotion have a significant impact - possibly more so than youngsters serving food at the stadium? 

[Kid in the Riot]

2 minutes ago, petehinton said:

IIRC didn’t someone say it would technically look like a top 10er (or at least top half) due to kalas, HNM, Bentley, JD etc wages will still be included? Would imagine there’ll be a huge drop in the next set (for this season)

Sure it will be top half, if not top 10. But we'll have to wait for all other clubs to publish to confirm that.

They'll be another drop in the next set of accounts, yes. But worth bearing in mind we aren't the only Championship club that has been reducing its wage bill, therefore our position in terms of budget probably won't change dramatically.

[Simon bristol]

10 minutes ago, petehinton said:

IIRC didn’t someone say it would technically look like a top 10er (or at least top half) due to kalas, HNM, Bentley, JD etc wages will still be included? Would imagine there’ll be a huge drop in the next set (for this season)

Yes the wages saved from that group must be huge, literally millions will be saved now this lot have gone, and you wouldnt say we are significantly weaker now they have all gone!

[Mr Popodopolous]

We have to account for the impact of the 13th month too.

Even before accounting for any net falls in wages, simplest answer is divide by 13 x 12 for the next set.

We have a particularly strong commercial non matchday revenue, moreso than a lot of Championship clubs which is why the club accounts in isolation are perhaps in some ways the best indicator- even if all costs before exclusions count towards FFP.

[Natchfever]

1 hour ago, George Rs said:

Thats down what £140,000 a week from last year? Without the Scott sale. I don’t know all too much about football finances but they seem to be doing a good job reducing losses year on year!  

"They" arent around anymore !

Hope the Lansdown/Tinnion brainstrust can keep up the good work.

[ExiledAjax]

35 minutes ago, George Rs said:

Does that suggest we got the 9.5m upfront? 
 

Would make a lot of sense as I thought he’d go a for a couple million more but if it was paid largely upfront that would’ve changed things.

Transfer fees paid to us will always be accounted for in one lump, regardless of how the cash payments are actually structured.

[Lew-T]

This the time when the “ we should be thankful ” posts come out.

[petehinton]

1 minute ago, Lew-T said:

This the time when the “ we should be thankful ” posts come out.

“We could have Vincent Tan”

(who has been owner of a team who got to a league cup final, and 2x separate promotions to the PL too)

[Bobbie]

4 minutes ago, Lew-T said:

This the time when the “ we should be thankful ” posts come out.

Well…we should 

[Mr Popodopolous]

One was Parachute assisted tbh.

Think Cardiff will find it quite a choppy landscape post Parachutes, they are in their 3rd year without and that insurance payout will have assisted them but not to be repeated.

[Natchfever]

1 minute ago, petehinton said:

“We could have Vincent Tan”

(who has been owner of a team who got to a league cup final, and 2x separate promotions to the PL too)

And I think listened to the fanbase over club colours.

[RedRoss]

33 minutes ago, RedM said:

Next year's accounts isn't going to look too great are they with all the hiring and firing we have done. Pearson alone got a huge payout. Obviously we have saved on wages and any bonuses, but he certainly walked away set up for life.

Did he? He literally had 6 months left on his contract and we would of paid that up that's all. I wouldn't say that would be 'huge' in the world of football but actually quite small. Plus with Mannings new wages that will be substantially lower than Nige's. I'd imagine we've saved over the longer term depending on how long Manning stays.

[RedRoss]

9 minutes ago, Lew-T said:

This the time when the “ we should be thankful ” posts come out.

Hopefully not, but it does perhaps provide some context why we haven't been loosening the purse strings as much as hoped by the majority of our fans including me.

[noize]

Apparently clubs get paid a lot of money if they reach the premier league, and then substantial parachute payments if they are relegated. Someone should mention it to Landsdown.

Edited December 23, 2023 by noize

[italian dave]

47 minutes ago, RedM said:

Next year's accounts isn't going to look too great are they with all the hiring and firing we have done. Pearson alone got a huge payout. Obviously we have saved on wages and any bonuses, but he certainly walked away set up for life.

That will be interesting. I think the general assumption is that he had 6 months left on his contract so that’s what he gets. But I’m not sure it’s that straightforward.

I don’t know whether that’s the norm in football, or whether NP might have wanted something different. I believe that - even with a fixed term contract - many of the usual employment protections apply, so in theory a negotiated arrangement over and above simply the remainder of the contract might be relevant. 

Edited December 23, 2023 by italian dave

[Mr Popodopolous]

Looking at key departures and incomings:

McCrorie, Dickie, Roberts, Knight, TGH 12 months of wages.

Plus an added 5 or 6 months for Cornick and Mehmeti given they joined halfway through.

Off the wage bill:

Kalas, DaSilva, Scott give or take 12 months worth.

Baker, we honoured his wages, despite the sad need to retire.

Bentley, Klose, Massengo, Martin..They were here give or take 6 or 7 months, in some ways double the cost saving.

In the case of Klose and Martin maybe they were paid 12 months or close to, so anything from 6-12 months depending on the terms of their departure.

Ah of course, 6 extra months of Semenyo off it and Haikin again a saving now.

Edited December 23, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[Mr Popodopolous]

Apologies if I've missed anyone in or out, I haven't checked fully.

[italian dave]

3 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Looking at key departures and incomings:

McCrorie, Dickie, Roberts, Knight, TGH 12 months of wages.

Plus an added 5 or 6 months for Cornick and Mehmeti given they joined halfway through.

Off the wage bill:

Kalas, DaSilva, Scott give or take 12 months worth.

Baker, we honoured his wages, despite the sad need to retire.

Bentley, Klose, Massengo, Martin..They were here give or take 6 or 7 months, in skme ways double the cost saving.

In the case of Klose and Martin maybe they were paid 12 months or close to, so anything from 6-12 months depending on the terms of their departure.

Just as long as we haven’t been paying Martin to score goals for the R*****s.

[ExiledAjax]

1 hour ago, italian dave said:

Is the women’s team part of all this? I think that’s what Mr P suggests - and if that’s the case wouldn’t their promotion have a significant impact - possibly more so than youngsters serving food at the stadium? 

Women's team is a subsidiary of the mens team which is a subsidiary of Holdings. So yes they are included.

[Bristol Rob]

Only skimmed the story, but am I right in thinking that without the Semenyo sale, we would have lost even more than the previous year.

[Mr Popodopolous]

6 minutes ago, Bristol Rob said:

Only skimmed the story, but am I right in thinking that without the Semenyo sale, we would have lost even more than the previous year.

Yes but the impact of 13 months v 12 can't be understated. The underlying loss maybe reduced in any event on a like for like basis 

[petehinton]

No wonder they were so miserable last night then

[RedM]

1 hour ago, RedRoss said:

Did he? He literally had 6 months left on his contract and we would of paid that up that's all. I wouldn't say that would be 'huge' in the world of football but actually quite small. Plus with Mannings new wages that will be substantially lower than Nige's. I'd imagine we've saved over the longer term depending on how long Manning stays.

You will have to trust me on this, or not I don't mind. I was surprised by the figure and if it was only for 6mths as you say it was a lot of money we were paying for his services. I didn't think it was right how he was sacked and didn't like how it was done but what he was paid tainted my view somewhat. I certainly won't worry about him financially, but as he is struggling with poor health I bet he would give most of it up if he could improve that in an instant.

[Tim Monaghan]

19 minutes ago, petehinton said:

No wonder they were so miserable last night then

To be fair, SL is worth 2.2 billion. 22 million is literally 1% of his net worth, so I don’t think he’ll be losing too much sleep over it. 

[cidered abroad]

3 hours ago, George Rs said:

Question, in the summary it says there was a large rise (£6m) in staff costs partly due to more non footballing events happening at the stadium meaning more staff both permanent and temporary had to be brought on. Doesn’t Lansdown own the stadium? Why are non football related costs of it being accounted for in BCFC accounts? 
 

Someone please explain for me. 

Because the profits are included somewhere in the total income which reduces the total loss.

[Harry]

2 hours ago, View from the Dolman said:

The accounts for Bristol City Football Club Ltd will give an idea of this when they're filed at Companies House. 

These group accounts make it somewhat difficult - an increase in wage bill but also an additional 200 employees. 

It’s £6m more. 
If they’ve added 200 employees that’s an average salary of £30k. 
I highly doubt the staff they’ve brought in for extra events are on £30k per year. 
They’d mostly be zero hours or part time minimum wage. 
I’d be being very generous if I suggested the extra 200 employees make up at most £2m of that extra £6m. 
 

I’m certainly very very keen to understand exactly how much the player wages have reduced. My feel based on these figures is “not very much” and certainly not anywhere as much as we were led to believe. 

Edited December 23, 2023 by Harry