From 4 points off the playoffs to 6 points from relegation

[Galley is our king]

Well done crayon boy and sid.

[kit]

I think today is the day we were sucked into the relegation picture.

[lenred]

Still think we already have enough points as we are but that’s not a defence of the ******* shitshow being served up. 

[Eco]

6 minutes ago, lenred said:

Still think we already have enough points as we are but that’s not a defence of the ******* shitshow being served up. 

I hope so but, sounds obvious, we need  goals and no sign in the past two home games.

[lenred]

1 minute ago, Eco said:

I hope so but, sounds obvious, we need  goals and no sign in the past two home games.

Oh I agree completely. Just can’t see it atm as I think we already have enough.  It’s a sad position to be on though. 

[Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan]

32 minutes ago, lenred said:

Oh I agree completely. Just can’t see it atm as I think we already have enough.  It’s a sad position to be on though. 

Don’t mean to be a big ol worrypants and bring everyone down but 3 games ago we were 15 points clear of the bottom 3.

 

[Dr Balls]

1 minute ago, Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan said:

Don’t mean to be a big ol worrypants and bring everyone down but 3 games ago we were 15 points clear of the bottom 3.

 

That’s what happens when you are mid table in the Championship and lose 3 on the bounce. What’s just as worrying is that we have some of the worst form in the division in 2024. Keep playing the same way we did today and there is no reason to think that’s going to change. Manning is way out of his depth and we can only hope for a couple of fluky results to get us to safety.

[joe jordans teeth]

It’s a worrying slide no doubt but if we get relegated from the starting point Pearson gave us then even I will be lost for words for the first time in my life 

[Shauntaylor85]

If we stay up it’s down to Nige, not this clueless management team. Get rid of them. 

[EstoniaTallinnRed]

10 minutes ago, joe jordans teeth said:

It’s a worrying slide no doubt but if we get relegated from the starting point Pearson gave us then even I will be lost for words for the first time in my life 

I won't be lost for words and they will be directed to SL, JL, BT and most of all Manning.

[Pippintogg]

Sadly looking down Nil points from next 2 games at least. FFS this was avoidable last November before junior and co decided that we needed a change. 

[Simon bristol]

1 hour ago, lenred said:

Still think we already have enough points as we are but that’s not a defence of the ******* shitshow being served up. 

Yeah im not sure now, that table has tightened right up,, sheffield weds were gone a few games ago, and they are close too, more importantly, we are in pathetic form, where as other are picking up points, in 3/4 weeks it could look very different unless we get a win or 2,,, that 6 point gap could be closed up in a couple of weeks.

[Son of Fred]

1 hour ago, Galley is our king said:

Well done crayon boy and sid.

These things take time ...

It's not easy- turning four points off playoffs into relegation..

Edited March 2 by Son of Fred

[Cidre Monita]

I reckon we are deep in the brown stuff. If we were losing games 2-3, or 3-4 I’d be a bit more relaxed, but we’ve stopped scoring as witnessed in the last few games. Difficult to see where the goals are going to come from under the current format. Add to this the fact the players may have lost confidence in him and are no longer putting in a shift. 

[lenred]

9 minutes ago, Simon bristol said:

Yeah im not sure now, that table has tightened right up,, sheffield weds were gone a few games ago, and they are close too, more importantly, we are in pathetic form, where as other are picking up points, in 3/4 weeks it could look very different unless we get a win or 2,,, that 6 point gap could be closed up in a couple of weeks.

I thought before the Southampton, Boro, Wednesday and QPR swing that we could be really in trouble as I didn’t see us getting anything at all from the first two.  We won the first two which were fantastic results but it’s just gone south since. Still think though we will end up 16th/17th.   A shitshow but not relegated.  

[BarneyCity]

Has anyone got the time to create a league table of the games since Manning arrived & one of NP games, and show them side by side?

[lotusman]

Earlier in the season before Pearson was sacked there was a survey which indicated we were the 3rd most over performing club based on the squads. Ipswich and Preston were the two teams above us, they have maintained that status. Forgetting the lunacy of both J.L. & B.T. perceptions of the squads top 6 potential L.M. is now simply illustrating Pearson and his coaching teams quality and success  in delivering that over achievement especially bearing in mind the thin squad available to them at that time.Normally new coaches or once upon a time managers came in and created an immeadiate "spike" with improved performances and results, sadly from treading water we seem to be being sucked further down!

[kit]

7 minutes ago, BarneyCity said:

Has anyone got the time to create a league table of the games since Manning arrived & one of NP games, and show them side by side?

Google something like "championship table since" and there is something thqt can do a table for a date range.

We are p20 23 points 15th and 5 points clear of bottom 3 with that table I think.

[Bazooka Joe]

Yep, we’re clearly a top sucks club.

[BarneyCity]

2 hours ago, kit said:

Google something like "championship table since" and there is something thqt can do a table for a date range.

We are p20 23 points 15th and 5 points clear of bottom 3 with that table I think.

Thanks for that Kit, fairly lays bare the absolute horror show of form. I can’t get over how things were improving, players were coming back, and then we shot ourselves in the foot big style!

[The Masked Man]

I'm worried. Three of the next four are Ipswich, Leicester and West Brom. We can't create chances and there are increased instances of the players getting frustrated with each other on the pitch. We were really lucky to beat Boro. If we're not careful the next time we're challenging for the top six will be in League One. Really need Scott Twine back and hope he can be the creative spark we need. 

[italian dave]

3 hours ago, BarneyCity said:

Has anyone got the time to create a league table of the games since Manning arrived & one of NP games, and show them side by side?

 

3 hours ago, kit said:

Google something like "championship table since" and there is something thqt can do a table for a date range.

We are p20 23 points 15th and 5 points clear of bottom 3 with that table I think.

NP games: 18 points in 14 games (1.28 per game). 15th, 8 pts clear of bottom 3

LM games: 23 points in 20 games (1.15 per game). 15th, 5 points clear of bottom 3

Inconsistency, signs of promise followed by disappointment, seems to be the over-riding characteristic of both!

Curtis Fleming, on the other hand…….

[Sheltons Army]

4 minutes ago, italian dave said:

 

NP games: 18 points in 14 games (1.28 per game). 15th, 8 pts clear of bottom 3

LM games: 23 points in 20 games (1.15 per game). 15th, 5 points clear of bottom 3

Inconsistency, signs of promise followed by disappointment, seems to be the over-riding characteristic of both!

Curtis Fleming, on the other hand…….

Revealing

 

8 points clear of bottom 3 after 14 games

5 points clear of bottom 3 after 34 games

 

Sort of tells its own story there

Definitely not a great sign of any sort of progress or even stability wouldn’t you say 

 

[Davefevs]

I’m guessing we had the bounce then?

[italian dave]

7 minutes ago, Sheltons Army said:

Revealing

 

8 points clear of bottom 3 after 14 games

5 points clear of bottom 3 after 34 games

 

Sort of tells its own story there

Definitely not a great sign of any sort of progress or even stability wouldn’t you say 

 

As always, people will pick what they want from a set of stats to prove what they want to prove!

To be honest, the ‘points from bottom 3’ has a lot more to do with how adrift Rotherham, QPR and Wednesday all were after 14 games. At that time there was a gap of 4 points between 3rd and 4th from bottom. Right now, 3rd, 4th, 5th and 6th from bottom all have the same points

Not much sign of progress, certainly. But not desperately worse either. 

Edited March 2 by italian dave

[Sheltons Army]

Just now, italian dave said:

As always, people will pick what they want from a set of stats to prove what they want to prove!

To be honest, the ‘points from bottom 3’ has a lot more to do with how adrift Rotherham, QPR and Wednesday all were after 14 games. At that time there was a gap of 4 points between 3rd and 4th from bottom. Right now, 3rd, 4th, 5th and 6th from bottom all have the same points.

Not much sign of progress, certainly. But not much worse either. 

Dave

I have great respect for you as someone who clearly travels as many miles as probably anyone who supports the Club.

But you don’t like any whiff of criticism , (Although you weren’t so supportive of NP) and sorry , but if the Club served up a s**t sandwich for you , you would point out that it at least came with salad

[italian dave]

19 minutes ago, Sheltons Army said:

Dave

I have great respect for you as someone who clearly travels as many miles as probably anyone who supports the Club.

But you don’t like any whiff of criticism , (Although you weren’t so supportive of NP) and sorry , but if the Club served up a s**t sandwich for you , you would point out that it at least came with salad

Actually, I’ve been very critical of the catering this season

I’ve no problem with criticism. I’ve been critical of the way the departure of NP was handled. I’ve been critical of decisions that both NP and LM have made.

But I’m always supportive of whoever is in charge of the team because I believe they want what’s best for the club, I want them to succeed, and I always hope (sometimes against hope) that they’ll turn the corner and find that success.

And that was the case as much for NP as for anyone else. You won’t find any posts from me that were unduly critical of him, or that called for him to be sacked. I still believe that he did a fantastic job of rescuing us from a financial mess without us ever really looking relegation candidates.

I’m as disappointed as anyone with the last three games. It gives me the same doubts as others about our direction. But what I don’t agree with is the vitriolic pile on that happened in the hour or two after the game today.

And what I’ve always struggled with is the knee jerk ‘sack xxx’ without any positive suggestion for what we do to make things better. It’s always easy to shout ‘get rid of xxx’, change xx, but without a plan that will demonstrably improve things it’s just pure negativity. And help no-one, least of all the person currently charged with taking the club forward. 

Edited March 2 by italian dave

[fisherrich]

24 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I’m guessing we had the bounce then?

You produce a lot of good stats which I read with interest, but why do people at the club take no notice at what is going on ? Find it all really frustrating.
Can only assume a buy out is planned, hopefully soon.

This season is gonna get very toxic quick.

It just can’t continue.

[Baldyman]

Lose against Ipswich and by the time we play Swansea that gap could be 1 or 2 points or even non existent!!! 

[Davefevs]

2 minutes ago, fisherrich said:

You produce a lot of good stats which I read with interest, but why do people at the club take no notice at what is going on ? Find it all really frustrating.
Can only assume a buy out is planned, hopefully soon.

This season is gonna get very toxic quick.

It just can’t continue.

I think the worm turned today.

[Mr Popodopolous]

43 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I think the worm turned today.

Yeah the reaction at the end was one I haven't seen at AG for some time.

Felt it was the culmination of months of frustration- partially due to results and performances but also the narrative since November, the needlessness of it all and perhaps the fracturing of fan and club unity.

Edited March 2 by Mr Popodopolous

[Baldyman]

1 hour ago, The Masked Man said:

I'm worried. Three of the next four are Ipswich, Leicester and West Brom. We can't create chances and there are increased instances of the players getting frustrated with each other on the pitch. We were really lucky to beat Boro. If we're not careful the next time we're challenging for the top six will be in League One. Really need Scott Twine back and hope he can be the creative spark we need. 

We really are in the brown stuff . People will look at those fixtures and say  “ we’ll be far better against the better sides “! BUT whilst we’ve done well this season against  attacking sides , this time we’re going into it with our confidence shot and the realisation that a relegation spot could be ours if we don’t win more than one of those four games ! 

[Dr Balls]

6 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Yeah the reaction at the end was one I haven't seen at AG for some time.

Felt the culmination of months of frustration- partially due to results and performances but also the narrative since November, the needlessness of it all and perhaps the fracturing of fan and club unity.

At the end you could just feel how negative and angry it was in the stadium, and it wasn’t just about losing a derby against Cardiff. If JL and BT didn’t pick up on that they would have to be deaf, blind and dumb. But then given some of their decisions, that description of them could be completely correct!

[Out of his pie crust]

UTFC

[And Its Smith]

66/1 if anyone wants it 

[Oh Brasso]

I'm confused with the acronym. Who is SID?

[Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan]

10 minutes ago, red from the blue side said:

I'm confused with the acronym. Who is SID?

It’s not an acronym.

[Olé]

1 hour ago, red from the blue side said:

I'm confused with the acronym. Who is SID?

 

[redsquirrel]

7 hours ago, red from the blue side said:

I'm confused with the acronym. Who is SID?

hes the skunk that is stinking the place out at the moment. he was a snake but hes learning new talents as he goes along

[Dolman Block B]

6 points off the bottom 3

 

Ipswich A = 0

Swansea H = 1

West Brom A = 0

Leicester H = 0

 

We are very much in a relegation battle 

 

[MarcusX]

15 hours ago, kit said:

I think today is the day we were sucked into the relegation picture.

No chance, there’s only 2 places up for grabs and 1 of those were 9 points clear of (10 with GD). There’s worse teams than us, we aren’t at risk IMO.

[And Its Smith]

40 minutes ago, Dolman Block B said:

6 points off the bottom 3

 

Ipswich A = 0

Swansea H = 1

West Brom A = 0

Leicester H = 0

 

We are very much in a relegation battle 

 

Is there any point in predicting results?  It’s the championship. 

[Sir Geoff]

2 minutes ago, MarcusX said:

No chance, there’s only 2 places up for grabs and 1 of those were 9 points clear of (10 with GD). There’s worse teams than us, we aren’t at risk IMO.

Apart from Rotherham, what teams are worse than us ? You have seen the form table for the last 10 games I assume.

[And Its Smith]

1 minute ago, Sir Geoff said:

Apart from Rotherham, what teams are worse than us ? You have seen the form table for the last 10 games I assume.

If you look across the last 5 games we are 13th.  

[Sir Geoff]

1 minute ago, And Its Smith said:

If you look across the last 5 games we are 13th.  

Thanks, that will help me sleep better tonight.

[And Its Smith]

1 minute ago, Sir Geoff said:

Thanks, that will help me sleep better tonight.

If you are losing sleep over a 66/1 relegation shot then I’d learn some coping techniques 

[Dastardly and Muttley]

7 minutes ago, And Its Smith said:

If you look across the last 5 games we are 13th.  

If you look across the last 3, we’re 22nd.

[And Its Smith]

2 minutes ago, Dastardly and Muttley said:

If you look across the last 3, we’re 22nd.

If you look across the last 35 we are 13th. We could do this all day!  
 

 

[Super]

19 minutes ago, And Its Smith said:

Is there any point in predicting results?  It’s the championship. 

Exactly. Qpr won at Leicester I wouldn't completely write us off on Tuesday obviously we'll have to play a lot better.

[ExiledAjax]

10 minutes ago, Dastardly and Muttley said:

If you look across the last 3, we’re 22nd.

Is it Leicester who are 23rd? We're better than Leicester then. All good.

[Dastardly and Muttley]

Just now, And Its Smith said:

If you look across the last 35 we are 13th. We could do this all day!  
 

 

Exactly. It’s pointless. Just like our team over the last 3.

Truth is, though, when you look at our games against teams currently placed 17th or lower, we’ve only beaten Millwall on opening day, Rotherham in October and Sheff Weds in Fleming’s game.

We’ve lost to Blackburn, QPR, Millwall, Birmingham, Stoke and Sheff Weds, whilst drawing with the rest.

We’re in trouble.

1 minute ago, ExiledAjax said:

Is it Leicester who are 23rd? We're better than Leicester then. All good.

Yeah, but I reckon they’ve got enough points to be safe.

[steviestevieneville]

16 hours ago, lenred said:

Still think we already have enough points as we are but that’s not a defence of the ******* shitshow being served up. 

Don’t think we’ve got enough points at all . Most of the teams below us are gaining some momentum . Our next for games are Ipswich , Swansea, West Brom & Leicester . Can’t see much of a return from that lot 

[Robbored]

16 hours ago, lenred said:

Still think we already have enough points as we are but that’s not a defence of the ******* shitshow being served up. 

We don’t have enough points yet - need at least two more wins from 11 games and I can’t see where they’re coming from.

Another loss at Portman Rd on Tuesday it’ll be squeezey bum time.

[steviestevieneville]

1 minute ago, Robbored said:

We don’t have enough points yet - need at least two more wins from 11 games and I can’t see where they’re coming from.

Another loss at Portman Rd on Tuesday it’ll be squeezey bum time.

Squeaky ?

[Bodiesaffer]

This is also a problem for next season.  Who will want to come and who will want out?  We can’t afford to take relegation form into next season. 

[ExiledAjax]

12 minutes ago, Dastardly and Muttley said:

Yeah, but I reckon they’ve got enough points to be safe.

So will we by the end of May.

Edited March 3 by ExiledAjax

[Alessandro]

Spoken about relegation in another thread - I personally don’t think we’ll actually go down, but I can see us getting sucked down the league to an uncomfortable position - I wouldn’t be surprised to see us within 3/4 points of it at some point, at this rate - which is frankly shocking.

But the simple fact we’re even discussing it, we shouldn’t even be having this conversation - and those who defend Manning are now saying “we’ll be safe” is a sad reflection on how much of shit show we’re seeing - from nicely placed when he came in and lots of play off chat - to now:

12 points from play offs.

6 points from relegation zone. 

And going backwards.

Edited March 3 by Alessandro

[Swede]

One of the problems is the belief. I'm looking at the players and I am starting to see one or two not believing in his coaching techniques. So he's starting to lose the dressing room. Yesterday he said we did all the work but its up to the players who have to express themselves in the final third. He points to the stats in such a way that backs him up. Next he'll be saying they're not his players, the ones that are not performing. He puts a lot of emphasis on Twine because he's coached him before and can "trust" him, yet he's been injured most of the time here. So, rather than looking at the team collective, he'll slot him in no matter what. A bit like the unfit Pring last week at the expense of a fit Roberts.

I think he's already panicking and making knee jerk reactions. A clear and worrying sign of someone in the deep end, way out of his league 1 depth  who's lost confidence, not in his methods as he steadfastly believes them to be correct, but it's in his inability to adapt and harness what he has at his disposal.

He says it will be back to basics for Tuesday which I read as the players are not good enough to implement his methods. The rot has set in, especially judging by the reaction of the fans at the end of the match yesterday. City fans, I believe, are usually very forgiving &  supportive and back the coach/manager. This reaction can't have been lost on the hierarchy who are already thinking about season ticket sales. 

On the whole, we have been generally  poor at home this season and that includes Pearson's reign. But the overriding difference is that there was a belief in the former's methods that it will come good, that has evaporated with the latter. I have no doubt that Manning is a good coach but this has been a chastening experience for him in that you need the right club at Championship level for your methods to click. I just think with the type of playing staff we have its not the right fit.

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, Swede said:

One of the problems is the belief. I'm looking at the players and I am starting to see one or two not believing in his coaching techniques. So he's starting to lose the dressing room. Yesterday he said we did all the work but its up to the players who have to express themselves in the final third. He points to the stats in such a way that backs him up. Next he'll be saying they're not his players, the ones that are not performing. He puts a lot of emphasis on Twine because he's coached him before and can "trust" him, yet he's been injured most of the time here. So, rather than looking at the team collective, he'll slot him in no matter what. A bit like the unfit Pring last week at the expense of a fit Roberts.

I think he's already panicking and making knee jerk reactions. A clear and worrying sign of someone in the deep end, way out of his league 1 depth  who's lost confidence, not in his methods as he steadfastly believes them to be correct, but it's in his inability to adapt and harness what he has at his disposal.

He says it will be back to basics for Tuesday which I read as the players are not good enough to implement his methods. The rot has set in, especially judging by the reaction of the fans at the end of the match yesterday. City fans, I believe, are usually very forgiving &  supportive and back the coach/manager. This reaction can't have been lost on the hierarchy who are already thinking about season ticket sales. 

On the whole, we have been generally  poor at home this season and that includes Pearson's reign. But the overriding difference is that there was a belief in the former's methods that it will come good, that has evaporated with the latter. I have no doubt that Manning is a good coach but this has been a chastening experience for him in that you need the right club at Championship level for your methods to click. I just think with the type of playing staff we have its not the right fit.

He’s abdicating his responsibility.

Thats probably the worst thing he can say, in effect “I’ve done my bit, over to you”….he's not in there with them.

The stats but was a joke.

Yep, he’s thrown his principles out.  And that along with the interviews tipped me over the edge, because I don’t think he can come back from this.

So, I’ve gone quickly to sack him.  I don’t like it, I want him to succeed, and I quite like some of his ways.  But he’s betrayed what was coming out of his mouth, which was that his methods were solid, he believed in them, and he’d make them work, to almost a position of “it’s their fault”.

Out I’m afraid.

[Oldland2]

The only way Manning is going to get 3 points is if he is caught speeding by a speed camera 

[Davefevs]

28 minutes ago, Oldland2 said:

The only way Manning is going to get 3 points is if he is caught speeding by a speed camera 

I’d suggest that’s unlikely, the kind of bloke that has the speed delimiter permanently on at 5 mph less than the limit.

(I’m joking btw)