Tinnion on SotC

[The Coach]

Overall feeling has not changed following last nights interview. It’s not one that feels me with confidence or excitement for the future.

I will make a call now, which I will look at in 12 months time. 
 

If we carry on the same course we are currently on. We will finish in the bottom three come the end of the 24/25 season.

[Silvio Dante]

Just now, LondonBristolian said:

I think the other thing to say is that it just adds to the contradictions. For example, it's been widely reported that Pearson was criticised for playing King instead of an academy player and now we're being told the plan was never to play the academy players. 

Good point that - it was running through my mind earlier together with the totally fanciful notion as to whether they actually got narked because Nige played Joseph James and that disturbed the U18 grand plan.

That last part is clearly nonsense but it only becomes halfway credible because of the overall messaging.

[Silvio Dante]

2 minutes ago, Jacki said:

I think some have… but honestly, these kids give their teenage years and their lives to these academies and the higher up you go, the more of a blow it is when it all comes to an end. At least treat them with a bit of respect and dignity. 

To be fair, I’d be surprised if conversations haven’t already been had with Idehen, Wiles-Richards, possibly OTC etc that they weren’t being kept on and that is likely to be part of a reason you’re seeing their loans - it’s to set them up with clubs early before the mass release and is a vital part of the academy process. I’m not unduly concerned by that comment on the basis that I think those who needed to have been told are likely to already have been told.

[Cidre Monita]

2 hours ago, fisherrich said:

Just look at what players have left the club. The former players that left know the club is tinpot, that is why they left. Bristol City will be holding back their career.
Tommy Conway will be the next one. And on it goes.
Just listened to that Tinnion interview again and it’s even worse second time around. Shambolic.

Great post and I totally agree. If the likes of Conway don’t want to sign a new contract then what is the point of us. His mate Scott couldn’t wait to get away….to the mighty Bournemouth! Obviously those two still talk and I imagine have a good laugh at the going’s on at the Gate. It’s hypothetical now of course, but you would think that TC would probably sign a contract if NP was here especially if he’d been backed in the summer with the club showing some ambition. 

I really fear for us next season if we lose the 3 experienced midfielders in addition to TC and possibly Pring and Knight. It sounds like we will be looking to bring in a beanpole foreign striker which should make for really attractive winning football next year!! 

[Bat Fastard]

20 minutes ago, Sir Geoff said:

Notice he didn't mention how much Mehmeti cost though. Only the cheaper signings.

Mehmeti shows flashes of real class but I have always been concerned with his lack of pace.  Given the size of fees in the transfer market, if he doesn't work out he can probably be sold without much loss or even at a profit.  Taken "in the round" with young recruits like Stokes and Murphy, Tins is clearly trying to get value for the club.  The Lansdown family reigning back on their already huge financial input and financial fair play rules are probably the driving reasons for the approach chosen by the club and being executed by Brian.  He deserves recognition for the value that he has brought the club. i find this pile on sickening for someone who has served the club in different roles so diligently for three decades.

[ExiledAjax]

11 hours ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Tinnion then went on to say how great it was that the plan had clearly worked as the u-18s were in the semi finals. As if it's some sort of stroke of genius to screw your first team and development squads up at the expense of the u-18s.

The hubris is excruciating.

I can't stop thinking about it.

He's effectively admitted that the owner and his son, neither of whom have ever played in, managed, coached or been directly involved with a youth or men's football team have taken what is very clearly a football decision.

That being to take a good run at the FA Youth Cup.

The head coach, his staff, the players, all are affected by that decision and all are having to go along with it. The knock-on effect of this decision includes the fact that our mens first team hasn't named a full substitutes bench for several games. 

This is crazy right.

Aside from the fact that this is a footballing decision made by the owner and his son, it seems to be a reversal of our successful strategy of playing academy prospects "up" an age group. Instead, this season (or at least since the Youth Cup campaign began) we've reversed that and are now holding players back from a higher level in order to what end...to lose to Man City's wunderkinds?*

This is odd. I almost want to say it's a betrayal (although that word may be a little over the top) of the one thing that has been consistent and successful at our club over the past few years.

I honestly couldn't believe it when I heard it.

*I assume they've hoovered up every golden-boy from here to Seoul.

[milo1111]

20 minutes ago, Sheltons Army said:

And we are now almost certainly going to be losing playing experience within the actual squad.

 

I was only thinking about Richard Gould’s time here , this morning and the overall set up.

It was clearly a testing time for RG downwards as we conducted , with a reduced budget , surgery on a dysfunctional squad , whilst keeping us away from threat of relegation 

But right then , with Pearson , Rennie , and Fleming , Euell , Tinnion seemingly one board’ and working well within the plan , undoubtedly happy as **** that youngsters were being promoted and utilised ......we actually felt we were set up not only for that surgery to move forward

Square pegs (With proven ability and experience in their roles) in square holes , tick , tick , tick

Even any question of JLs competence or SLs apparent wane in interest didn’t seem to matter , or likely to spoil what was , probably the best whole set up , (We’ve had some decent Managers but not the whole set up) we’ve had in my lifetime 

Now I look around across the whole structure , from the Lansdowns down to LM , and think  - who do I trust across the whole lot to ‘perform’ and make good decisions ?

for me - In all honesty , none of them at the present time

 

Away from results and performances in the meantime - as a structure what an almighty self sabotage

 

It means that if you had a magic wand and could get rid of one person , only one , in the structure right now , who would you choose ?

Because in reality I don’t think there’s one (Or I guess only one) you could choose to replace that would give any prospect of improvement and success.

Blimey just below the surface we look ‘fragile’ - We have all the ingredients for a crumbling 

Hang on tight

 

 

If I had to choose one person to go it would be SL as whoever came in next would undoubtedly replace the whole structure beneath him.

[alexukhc]

Remember when he use to wear a red and white hat and we’d sing about it?

what happened Brian?

scored against Liverpool? Shagged n married the club secretary at the time, managed the club and now he’s technical director, even got his son a job with the lads, where’s ya mate Carlos?

[awbb]

 

25 minutes ago, Cidre Monita said:

Great post and I totally agree. If the likes of Conway don’t want to sign a new contract then what is the point of us. His mate Scott couldn’t wait to get away….to the mighty Bournemouth! Obviously those two still talk and I imagine have a good laugh at the going’s on at the Gate. It’s hypothetical now of course, but you would think that TC would probably sign a contract if NP was here especially if he’d been backed in the summer with the club showing some ambition. 

I really fear for us next season if we lose the 3 experienced midfielders in addition to TC and possibly Pring and Knight. It sounds like we will be looking to bring in a beanpole foreign striker which should make for really attractive winning football next year!! 

I've not really seen it mentioned here, but, in my opinion, all of the stupid moves this season were down to the Scott sale. I'm not ITK by any means (and fully expect to be put right) but the departure of Alexander and the news that SL stepped in to do the negotiations, suggested to me, at least, that Alexander was put in an untenable position over it and felt he had to resign.

Partly, this may stem from SL's repeated statement that we don't stand in a players way when the PL comes sniffing (or any "bigger" club for that matter) so I can fully imagine a situation where PA played hard ball with Bournemouth (remember the initial bids were reported as being outright rejected with no apparent negotaition at all), using his many years of experience at Palace to determine what was the right deal for City and someone went over his head to SL (someone from Bournemouth, possibly, or Scott's agent, who knows). SL felt obliged to sell (because, you know, ego) and re-issued his decree (probably also referencing that we've been saying for months he's worth £25 million, we can't change now). PA stuck to his guns and that was that.

My point being is that if Alexander remained in the role. 1, we'd almost certainly have got more for Scott (or, because of the injury, kept him) and 2, No way Pearson would have got the boot, not for the nonsense spouted out at the time, anyway.

Ergo: Tins remains in a role he's eminently suited to. SL's ego is in check & JL has no real influence on football operations.

Edited March 12 by awbb
Typo

[spudski]

1 hour ago, Phileas Fogg said:

I feel a tiny bit sorry for Tinnion - he’s in a role which has a public relations requirement and he just doesn’t have the skills/experience for it.

I remember being a bit unimpressed by Richard Gould’s interviews at the time - but in hindsight what an enormous loss he was. We’ve significantly downgraded our boardroom - and done so wilfully.

I appreciate Gould left by his own volition, but losing Alexander too (and not replacing him?), plus Pearson’s experience.. then filling it with Jon’s mates - it’s crazy. No checks and balances, no accountability, just groupthink. It’s a crazy approach and clearly won’t be successful.

Under normal circumstances I would feel sorry for him. 

However...he knows what's required in the position he's taken, which includes speaking to the media and public about various matters he's not had much experience with...aside from the stuff he's good at. 

He's either delusional and thinks he's fully capable, or just plain thick. 

Or perhaps he's thought, **** it...I'll take it, regardless of consequence, as it pays well and looks good on his CV.

If SL watches and listens to JL and BT he must surely cringe. If not...he's delusional as well. 

It's the Kings play thing...we can all go and eat cake it seems...

[Silvio Dante]

31 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

I can't stop thinking about it.

He's effectively admitted that the owner and his son, neither of whom have ever played in, managed, coached or been directly involved with a youth or men's football team have taken what is very clearly a football decision.

That being to take a good run at the FA Youth Cup.

The head coach, his staff, the players, all are affected by that decision and all are having to go along with it. The knock-on effect of this decision includes the fact that our mens first team hasn't named a full substitutes bench for several games. 

This is crazy right.

Aside from the fact that this is a footballing decision made by the owner and his son, it seems to be a reversal of our successful strategy of playing academy prospects "up" an age group. Instead, this season (or at least since the Youth Cup campaign began) we've reversed that and are now holding players back from a higher level in order to what end...to lose to Man City's wunderkinds?*

This is odd. I almost want to say it's a betrayal (although that word may be a little over the top) of the one thing that has been consistent and successful at our club over the past few years.

I honestly couldn't believe it when I heard it.

*I assume they've hoovered up every golden-boy from here to Seoul.

Still, look on the bright side, gives S82 something to get their teeth into:

”You’ll never sing that

You’ll never sing that

FA Youth Cup semi finalists

You’ll never sing that”

[Merrick's Marvels]

37 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

I can't stop thinking about it.

He's effectively admitted that the owner and his son, neither of whom have ever played in, managed, coached or been directly involved with a youth or men's football team have taken what is very clearly a football decision.

That has Steve Lansdown's fingerprints all over it.

Wouldn't be the first, or last, time he's stuck his oar in. The man just can't help himself, whatever the sport.

Here's Pat Lam just a few weeks ago:

"Steve Lansdown had a quiet word with me about playing the Bears way, he wanted to be excited about the way we play and I said I'd see what we can do". 

So because the owner was a bit bored at the rugger, he told the Coach to play a different way.

Says it all really. 

Edited March 12 by Merrick's Marvels

[spudski]

5 minutes ago, Silvio Dante said:

Still, look on the bright side, gives S82 something to get their teeth into:

”You’ll never sing that

You’ll never sing that

FA Youth Cup semi finalists

You’ll never sing that”

God help us if we win it... 30 year commemorative shirt and pitch walk to look forward to 

Edited March 12 by spudski

[Silvio Dante]

Just now, spudski said:

God help us if we win it... 30 year commemorative shirt and pitch walk to look forward too

With an 85 year old Brian Tinnion fully kitted up and barging Campbell-Slowey and Duncan out of the team photo

[Kid in the Riot]

4 minutes ago, Merrick's Marvels said:

That has Steve Lansdown's fingerprints all over it. Wouldn't be the first, or last, time he's to stuck his oar in.

The man just can't help himself, whatever the sport. Here's Pat Lam just a few weeks ago:

"Steve Lansdown had a quiet word with me about playing the Bears way, he wanted to be excited about the way we play and I said I'd see what we can so". 

So because the owner was a bit bored at the rugger, he told the Coach to play a different way.

Says it all really. 

I have it on good authority that was in the dressing room in front of the Bears players too.

[ExiledAjax]

1 minute ago, Silvio Dante said:

Still, look on the bright side, gives S82 something to get their teeth into:

”You’ll never sing that

You’ll never sing that

FA Youth Cup semi finalists

You’ll never sing that”

I can't joke about it yet Silvio. I'm sorry.

I'd love the Club to win the FA Youth Cup. It would be a good achievement at that level and the people involved would rightly be proud of it.

But the way it sounded last night was that it was one of the main priorities for the season. In fact such is it's priority that players are being "given" to the U18s over the first team. 

Now, I accept that for months now it's looked like the mens first team are the most mid-table of all mid-table teams, and in many respects their league campaign has been a write-off for a very long time. But I still don't think the FA Youth Cup should be this club's priority competition.

3 minutes ago, Merrick's Marvels said:

That has Steve Lansdown's fingerprints all over it.

The governance at this club is appalling. Fortunately we're getting a regulator so even if Steve doesn't sell, or doesn't bring in an investor who demands that decisions are made properly, we're going to get a Football Code of Governance (eventually) that (hopefully) tells him that.

[Sheltons Army]

32 minutes ago, milo1111 said:

If I had to choose one person to go it would be SL as whoever came in next would undoubtedly replace the whole structure beneath him.

The only conclusion I could come to

Replacing just one of any of the others does little or nothing 

[exAtyeoMax]

1 minute ago, Kid in the Riot said:

I have it on good authority that was in the dressing room in front of the Bears players too.

[Son of Fred]

16 hours ago, WeAreThePigs said:

Cornick 500k, that is terrible business. 

Why is this good business @Robbored??

[lenred]

6 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

I have it on good authority that was in the dressing room in front of the Bears players too.

Not surprising at all.  Both sports rapidly going down the Swannie at the moment and there’s one clear common denominator!!!!

[Silvio Dante]

2 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

I can't joke about it yet Silvio. I'm sorry.

I'd love the Club to win the FA Youth Cup. It would be a good achievement at that level and the people involved would rightly be proud of it.

But the way it sounded last night was that it was one of the main priorities for the season. In fact such is it's priority that players are being "given" to the U18s over the first team. 

Now, I accept that for months now it's looked like the mens first team are the most mid-table of all mid-table teams, and in many respects their league campaign has been a write-off for a very long time. But I still don't think the FA Youth Cup should be this club's priority competition.

The governance at this club is appalling. Fortunately we're getting a regulator so even if Steve doesn't sell, or doesn't bring in an investor who demands that decisions are made properly, we're going to get a Football Code of Governance (eventually) that (hopefully) tells him that.

I think I’m in the if you didn’t laugh you’d cry phase mate.

I think there is 99% agreement on this forum that we need rid of the Lansdowns and Tinnion. I’m realistic enough to know that the former aren’t going anywhere soon and also to know that the latter would stab anyone in the back to protect his own position. It’s a bit of despair as to how long any meaningful change will actually take.

As I said somewhat flippantly earlier the one thing that the interview did, certainly for me, is create a modicum more sympathy for Liams position - I still think he is the wrong man for avoidance of doubt - but whereas before I was maybe on 80-90% of the first team stuff being within his control I’d say with the hamstringing of youth it’s nearer 60- 70%. It’s not enough to move the dial, but he has my sympathies for having to work in this shitshow. I bet he’s wishing he’d done that due diligence.

[Riaz]

16 hours ago, Dastardly and Muttley said:

Not going back to the Gate until Manning and Tinnion are gone.

Really? It aint that bad. Been much worse. Many a time.

[petehinton]

1 hour ago, Jacki said:

I listened back again this morning and it was a worrying interview. He was  indiscreet and seemed angry throughout, and said things (the McKenna stuff and some academy information) that are simply not true. I thought the way he spoke about some of the 21s missing their chance was a hugely disrespectful way to speak publicly about people who don’t know what the future holds for them after 10 plus years in the academy system as well.

The transfer fee stuff also blew my mind. He couldn’t wait to divulge the information and it sounded like he was a doing it because his beans were going and he was out of control - he wanted to sound like his finger is on the pulse. It was bizarre.

He kept talking about how hard people are working and I don’t doubt it for a minute, but there is a difference between blind hard work and long hours and being effective, efficient and doing what’s needed. We’re clearly on the wrong side of that at present. 

Unlike many on here, I quite like Tinnion and have no axe to grind with him. He is clearly passionate and wants to do well. But as I’ve said before, his job is far too big for one person and he is just not suited to the ‘first team department’ part of his job. He just doesn’t have the communication skills, intelligence and gravitas required for it. It’s a real shame but we really have created an unholy mess for ourselves and shot ourselves in both feet. God know how it ends. 

This is exactly how I feel. Nothing personal one bit. I almost feel a bit sorry for him. However he was a big contributor to the absolute shambles of last October, so he is reaping what was sown atm.
 

however, The fact that SL thinks we can run a club of this size with ONE person responsible for the day to day running of the football club is absolutely insane. Theres probably 4x as many people in the media & matchday content teams as there are in the senior football operation department atm. 
 

Said yesterday, but let Tinns be head of academy or something similar, and employ 2 or 3 senior, experienced football operators for footballing department. 
 

Oh, and actually hire a CEO. 
 

I am absolutely convinced that Steve ordered this as some sort of ‘reassurance for the fans’ piece, after rocking up on Sunday to see the place basically empty, the football nothing like he said it would be, and the atmosphere horrific. 

Edited March 12 by petehinton

[Davefevs]

2 hours ago, Tim Monaghan said:

The funny thing is, is that nobody would have been any the wiser if Brian hadn’t have gone on the radio this evening about the Youth Cup! Now everyone’s an expert on the under 18s and it’s tarnished the whole thing with the supporters by the sounds of it. 

I know we are enjoying hitting the club at the moment, but who would honestly make that difference in the first team from the under 18s? Literally nobody was up in arms like this before last night that we weren’t playing 17 and 18 year olds or having them sit on the bench for the “experience”. 

Just playing devils advocate here more than anything, but as the under 18s have progressed through the tournament, don’t you think it makes sense to give them that experience as a group / teams mates moving forward keeping them all together and build that bond. Surely that only helps us? So you can’t just take negatives from it when you look at a bigger picture and the future.

I don’t think this would even be an issue if the results had been slightly different. Some of the 18s are and have been involved in the first team training. So are we just upset because some aren’t on the bench?

If so, which ones from the 18s would you have had, because I haven’t heard any calls for them (maybe Yeboah) until now. 

Again, just playing devils advocate here before abuse starts. 

I wouldn’t say it’s tarnished anything for the 18s.  All it’s done is raise questions re the approach this season.  Probably not helped by Tins making it sound as if the notion came from “upstairs” because they wanted some silverware!  I hope he just poorly explained it…but poor form from the Ls if so.

Gimme, gimme, medal, medal!

I think your rationale is fine, but there is the flipside, that as you progress up the ages, the chances of keeping a group together diminishes anyway, natural fall off of some players, speedier progress of other.  So, play them at their ability level not their age level, in fact until this season, it’s been expose them higher up asap.  So a change in strategy, because of the owner’s wishes!

I have no real issues with it, but wouldn’t want to hold a player back either.  Some happy medium?  I would hope that first team takes priority where a conflict occurs.  As it happens I don’t LM is gonna play any of the 18s, so I’m not bothered.

Re 18s training.  Seems to have been a bit of inconsistency, some weeks none are up with the first team, other weeks they are.

[chinapig]

6 minutes ago, Silvio Dante said:

I bet he’s wishing he’d done that due diligence.

The question he should have asked after meeting JL and BT:

 

 

 

[Kid in the Riot]

6 minutes ago, petehinton said:

Said yesterday, but let Tinns be head of academy or something similar, and employ 2 or 3 senior, experienced football operators for footballing department. 

Whoever mentioned Mark Warburton yesterday, fair play, as he'd be a great shout to head up the footballing operation.

He was responsible for Brentford's entire internal restructure 10 years ago, which appears to have done alright. 

61 years old, out of work - what a shame it's pie in the sky to think the owners would employ anyone like him into that role. 

Edited March 12 by Kid in the Riot

[petehinton]

1 hour ago, LondonBristolian said:

I think the other thing to say is that it just adds to the contradictions. For example, it's been widely reported that Pearson was criticised for playing King instead of an academy player and now we're being told the plan was never to play the academy players. 

And also, why take Yeboah, one of the 18s best players, out of the u18s and say he is ‘part of the first team now’ at the start of the season???

[Mr Hankey]

Wouldn't surprise me with the absolute shambles that is Bristol City that in 12 months time we will be right in the shit in relegation places, Manning gets the boot and Tinnion makes himself "interim" manager for the final 6 games of the season. He can then claim he has managed a Championship side.

[Clutton Caveman]

12 hours ago, WolfOfWestStreet said:

It saddens me to hear talk of giving Manning money in the summer, but what is even more depressing is that it'll be for "one or two" signings ...

There's absolutely no way in living hell Manning has the talent to turn this squad into a top6 outfit with only 2 signings.

That's not going to get bums on seats is it Brian ... IS IT BRIAN. 

We could sign Harry Kane and LM would turn off the goals but make him a better defender like Conway

[lenred]

3 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Whoever mentioned Mark Warburton yesterday, fair play, as he'd be a great shout to head up the footballing operation.

He was responsible for Brentford's entire internal restructure 10 years ago, which appears to have done alright. 

61 years old, out of work - what a shame it's pie in the sky to think the owners would employ anyone like him into that role. 

Agree. We desperately (and I can’t stress that word enough) need footballing nouse at this club.