Jon talks...

[Pickle Rick]

Been following this thread closely. Really good points made. But what I think is disgusting is that we haven’t even been informed what next season’s socks look like!!

JL out!

Edited April 30 by Pickle Rick

[W-S-M Seagull]

5 minutes ago, Malago said:

Personally, I couldn’t give a damn whether your expectations have been met or not.  You’re welcome to your opinion, but don’t think for one moment it matters.

The only opinion that matters is Jon's, and he's happy so let's all get down to collage Green and celebrate Jon being happy.

[Red-Robbo]

1 minute ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Jon said a lot about getting the message out there. 

The message was very clear. The expectation was not to stand still. It was to progress. Standing still isn't progress. It's not a positive. If you do not meet your expectations it's a failure. 

If people are changing their expectations based on how the sesson has gone. Then that takes away any credibility.  

I was very very clear in pre season that I expected us to get closer to the play offs by way of points. That expectation did not change throughout the season. 

So there is no bending out of shape here because weve not done that. 

I find it a hard concept to understand why another Bristol City has an issue with a fellow Bristol City fan being annoyed that their pre season expectations were not met. You are free to go back and check my pre season expectations and you'll see that the expectation for Pearson were the same as I have now. 

You can dress it up however you want. But in my opinion we have at the very most stood still. 

You may consider us to have made a tiny improvement, that's cool. I don't agree. I think you're trying to say that to validate the decisions the club have made. But the reality is all of us expected real progress this season following the reset and that has simply not happened. 

 

We'll have to differ because I do see progress - and it's measurable. I didn't (and still don't) support the sacking of Nigel Pearson, but I am not going to claim that we'd be definitely challenging for promotion if he was here.

It's been a steady improvement since the Holden season. No great leaps forward. IF Manning is learning as he goes along, maybe next season - depending on incomings and outgoings - maybe that'll be the first time for yonks we may genuinely have a chance of Top 6. 

This season I certainly didn't think we did, nor did most Otib members who were polled at the start of 23/24 and - I suspect - Jon Lansdown didn't think it either. But if you get asked "what's this season's target?" comfortable survival isn't the inspiring answer to give. 

 

[Mr Popodopolous]

18 minutes ago, Malago said:

Personally, I couldn’t give a damn whether your expectations have been met or not.  You’re welcome to your opinion, but don’t think for one moment it matters.

Jon, Brian or Steve come on down!!

Serious note, it has sort of levelled out now, got back to an okay place. A lot of fan discontent early to mid March, not long ago, hierarchy aren't trusted nor is there much faith in them among reasonable number of fans IMO.

A void exists in leadership, competence and trust and I doubt I'm alone in that view either.

Edited April 30 by Mr Popodopolous

[W-S-M Seagull]

3 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

We'll have to differ because I do see progress - and it's measurable. I didn't (and still don't) support the sacking of Nigel Pearson, but I am not going to claim that we'd be definitely challenging for promotion if he was here.

It's been a steady improvement since the Holden season. No great leaps forward. IF Manning is learning as he goes along, maybe next season - depending on incomings and outgoings - maybe that'll be the first time for yonks we may genuinely have a chance of Top 6. 

This season I certainly didn't think we did, nor did most Otib members who were polled at the start of 23/24 and - I suspect - Jon Lansdown didn't think it either. But if you get asked "what's this season's target?" comfortable survival isn't the inspiring answer to give. 

 

Nor me. 

But I'd be making the exact same posts if the outcome was similar under whatever manager, because that was my expectations for us, Bristol City and that's a concept that a lot of people seemingly have trouble understanding. 

I've not changed my expectations because of Manning. They remained the same. But the narrative that gets spread on here is that my expectations are high because I want Manning to fail when in fact my expectations were very clear in pre season and those expectations are there for people to go back and view. 

Edited April 30 by W-S-M Seagull

[lenred]

2 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Jon, Brian or Steve come on down!!

Serious note, it has sort of levelled out now, got back to an play place. A lot of fan discontent early to mid March, not long ago, hierarchy aren't trusted nor is there much faith in them among reasonable number of fans IMO.

A void exists in leadership, competence and trust and I doubt I'm alone in that view either.

I can confirm you are not!

[W-S-M Seagull]

1 minute ago, lenred said:

I can confirm you are not!

Apparently we are. 

[Gert Mare]

28 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

What's the right end of the table? We're finishing in the top half of the table - best 9th, worse 12th and have beaten a number of the Top 6 sides, not to mention a PL club.

He might talk shite for much of what he says, but he's correct in that it's ending "broadly positive", with very good form and more than one player stepping up and playing very well. 

As to whether anyone would finish higher than 9th with the same squad, that's total guesswork. Pearson had us at 8th at one point, but didn't hold that position. We just don't know where we'd be if he had stayed. 

I think "broadly positive" is an over-statement. Maybe "Things have settled down a bit" might have been more appropriate.

12 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

I think in one interview in the close season Lansdown Jr said Top 6 was the target. That's what pretty much all chairmen say and most managers too. It doesn't mean "we are guaranteed to be Top 6 and anything else is a failure".  Personally, I don't think we have the squad for it nor did we under the last manager.

However, it does seem to bend you out of shape that we ARE finishing higher up than before, potentially 4 places, and we had a short but lucrative cup run plus various underperforming players now look better under LM than they did before.

We await to see what the summer brings. Steve Evans thinks we're 2 or 3 players away from being contenders. I think he's right. 

Nothing is guaranteed in football, quite correct, but the way Nigel Pearson was sacked was atrocious.

If the players on the treatment table had returned under Nigel's tenure the signs at the time indicated that we would likely have achieved a similar placed finish to the one we are likely finish under Liam Manning, so as Jon stated in his original interview "What was the point of making a change?" I still cannot see that there was any point to it?

I have listened to Jon's interview and I agree that we are possibly 2 or 3 signings off improving, but we could have said that under Nigel, so why sack him?

Liam is in his first Championship level job and is still learning. Nigel had experience of getting promoted out of this division, so why sack him?

Interesting how everybody just chats behind the scenes without responsibilities that match their job titles and then ultimately Jon makes the actual final decision. Sounds like a really great business plan?

He mentioned Bristol City as being a football club, a rugby club and a basketball club that could be separated out....but how exactly? What are investors investing in? No wonder we can't get anyone to invest!

Season ticket sales are going better than last year? Wow. Well, best of luck with that. If people don't vote with their feet they get what they deserve.

He talked a lot about the academy, but there's not been much dipping into the academy from Liam to date, but there was plenty under Nigel. Be interesting to see what Liam does about this next season.

I'm not excited about next season. I'm not onboard with the board. They need to improve communications massively. Whilst I think it's a sensible decision to make the club sustainable I have zero trust in the board to implement any sort of coherent plan which would propel us towards the Premier League and I cannot see anyone wanting to invest in the footballing side alone because of the Bristol Sport carbuncle.

Would love to see 2 or 3 more additions to the squad, plus hopefully the introduction of Josh Stokes and Max Bird and maybe an unearthed gem or two from the academy and realistically finish top 10 next season (luck and injuries will obviously play a part and so strength in depth with always be a big concern).

The biggest thing I look forward to is the real story from Nigel once the gag has been removed and I don't think it will come as any surprise when it does come out.

 

 

 

[Homer Simpson]

26 minutes ago, Pickle Rick said:

Been following this thread closely. Really good points made. But what I think is disgusting is that we haven’t even been informed what next season’s socks look like!!

JL out!

Just released, we'll done Jon. I like them.

 

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

In one of the interviews at the time Jon said "ultimately we made the decision because we think the squad is good enough and I believe in it, if we didn't then why make the change, you'd just see things through as they are, but the ultimate reason is I think we have a really good squad here and we've got a good chance of competing at the right end of the table this season" 

In last night's interview, despite us not competing at the right end of the table and Manning not getting the best out of this really good squad, Jon described this season as "broadly positive" 

He's all over the place with his opinions. 

The bit for me is that if we have top-half budget (say 10th), have top facilities, e.g. HPC, a top young head-coach, excellent recruitment, we should be looking to beat our position based on budget.  But I think he overstates how good some of those things are.

1 hour ago, ProfitInMyPocket said:

If we give him millions to spend and we revert back to bore Manningball I am worried for next season. Will be another midtable borefest.

I don't want to become another Man City clone, the football just isn't entertaining for me personally.

I’d suggest it would be bottom half borefest

[Ashtongreight]

1 hour ago, Davefevs said:

The bit for me is that if we have top-half budget (say 10th), have top facilities, e.g. HPC, a top young head-coach, excellent recruitment, we should be looking to beat our position based on budget.  But I think he overstates how good some of those things are.

I’d suggest it would be bottom half borefest

I see the last half a dozen games or so as a blend between how we played before LM arrived,  tweaked with a few LM additions, if he continues this next season (provided the summer business is good), I’m hopeful of doing well. If he just reverts to Manningball I fear we are doomed. 

[Bazooka Joe]

19 hours ago, Kingswood Robin said:

At the very end he talks about - getting ourselves in the best position so we can push when the times right.

Does anybody know what that means?

I think he's reciting what he learnt at some Antenatal class.

Poor Jon, it's so confusing trying to remember what to say when and where.

 

But truthfully, it's the usual vague, unspecific statement that allows him, in the future, to interpret it as he chooses, and claim that we, the thick "customers" misunderstood.

[Bazooka Joe]

17 hours ago, Lew-T said:

You only have to listen to him. He has no personality, no leadership qualities and no bottle.

He is a quivering moron.

That's akin to bigging him up.

[redkev]

19 hours ago, Redrascal2 said:

Let's turn it around and ask what has Jon Lansdown  done that he deserves to be congratulated for. I can think of nothing.

I’ve not congratulated him on any thing I just thought he spoke slightly better and gave some decent answers than before , however all coming from a pretty low bar mind

[WessexPest]

The usual claptrap from Junior, would be my précis. 
 

Obfuscation, answers with so many caveats they become meaningless and contradictions. How many times did he say “Getting your messaging out there”?

The man inspires zero confidence or trust.

Edited April 30 by WessexPest

[Davefevs]

4 minutes ago, WessexPest said:

would be my précis. 

I had no idea how to spell this word so avoided using it.  Now I know.

[Galley is our king]

1 hour ago, Ashtongreight said:

 tweaked with a few LM additions

Yes, funny how there were ZERO additions following the sale of Scott!

A completely unnecessary and self harming decision by JL and led to Phil Alexander leaving the club.

Ask yourself.... 

Why did we not get Twine in the summer?

Where would we now be in the league if we had?

Having instead gone to Hull, how much MORE did it cost to get Burnley to recall him and then loan him to us?

It just stinks!

A hobby chairman who thinks he knows best but actually knows bugger all...

[Simon bristol]

1 hour ago, Galley is our king said:

Yes, funny how there were ZERO additions following the sale of Scott!

A completely unnecessary and self harming decision by JL and led to Phil Alexander leaving the club.

Ask yourself.... 

Why did we not get Twine in the summer?

Where would we now be in the league if we had?

Having instead gone to Hull, how much MORE did it cost to get Burnley to recall him and then loan him to us?

It just stinks!

A hobby chairman who thinks he knows best but actually knows bugger all...

I agree, but TGH signed 12 days after scott left.

[W-S-M Seagull]

1 hour ago, Galley is our king said:

Yes, funny how there were ZERO additions following the sale of Scott!

A completely unnecessary and self harming decision by JL and led to Phil Alexander leaving the club.

Ask yourself.... 

Why did we not get Twine in the summer?

Where would we now be in the league if we had?

Having instead gone to Hull, how much MORE did it cost to get Burnley to recall him and then loan him to us?

It just stinks!

A hobby chairman who thinks he knows best but actually knows bugger all...

What people forget when they often state that there has been an improvement recently which has seen us equal last season is that improvement has come with Twine in the team. 

We had to make a financial outlay, which wouldn't have been cheap to equal last season. Marvellous. 

It does beg the question, why wasn't this outlay possible in the summer? Why are we looking to do it this summer? Why did we sacrifice our season by refusing to spend it in the summer? 

Or are we not allowed to ask these questions cos we should be happy with how things have panned out? 

Edited April 30 by W-S-M Seagull

[spudski]

7 hours ago, Harry said:

I’m certainly not against collaborative thinking and empowerment of the playing staff. 
I certainly wouldn’t advocate a “my way or the highway” type of leadership. 
So I don’t see a problem per sé in what occurred, nor do I see a problem per sé that Manning accepted the feedback from the players and took action. 
 

The problem for me, and the reason that this incident gave me the full 180 (remember, I was backing him before this), was that it demonstrated to me that Liam didn’t have the nous nor the leadership to have recognised this problem for himself. 
It was pretty clear to every single fan that the players were not able to play the style that Liam wanted. It should have been obvious to Liam and his staff too. 
If should have been something that came from Liam to the group to say “ok lads, I see things aren’t working the way we want. Let’s revert to our collective strengths, get some form and results and we can continue to work on my new philosophy in training and seek to progress”. 
 

The fact he didn’t recognise this himself and the change only occurred after the players intimated this, is why I lost all confidence in him. 
 

As I said, I was very vocally behind him on this forum up until that point. And I’m still actually generally happy with how his term has progressed so far. But this incident showed me he doesn’t have the kahunaberries to lead this team to the top end. 
I hope he does, and I’m not calling for his head - would be pointless anyway as he’s going nowhere. But I do now lack confidence in him 

I think he probably did recognise it...he just didn't want change. He has said in interviews that one of his weaknesses is being stubborn. 

Eventually gave in and saw sense. 

[Mr Popodopolous]

42 minutes ago, Simon bristol said:

I agree, but TGH signed 12 days after scott left.

That was only and probably in part due to the sudden combination of Scott being sold and McCrorie being injured for an indeterminate period. Cover for 2ish positions in 1 was one element.

[lenred]

Just actually listened.  

Key thoughts / takeaways for me (without going over Manning again)  

- Says he should've communicated better before Pearson was sacked (‘before the event happened’)  What does he think he should’ve said exactly in the run up to that ‘event’? 

- Mentioned it’s the fans club.  At least he’s learnt there from his dad’s huge mistake.   Whether he means it or not who knows.  

- Board and roles just sounds a complete and utter muddled mess.  But he doesn’t seem bothered.  

- Who are the ‘experts’ he refers that he confides and gets info from that feeds his decisions about running our club? His mates as referenced on here before?  Again just sounds extremely haphazard.   

- Clearly doesn't want to spend much money…. Was pushed about it but seemed reticent.  Same old ‘HPC is the attraction, the coach is the attraction’…. ‘We need to be seeing value others don’t see’.   Another summer of penny pinching then and hoping for the best.   

- Clearly doesn’t want to spend on Twine either.  Fair enough with me but that position will need money whether it’s Twine or someone else.  

- Realistic about the reasons for improvement in attendances.   Fair play.  

- ‘Promotion is still the focus’. Attitude doesn’t say that to me though.    Sounds meaningless as per.  

- Wants ‘fans to feel part of it’…..no explanation as to how though.  I’m not seeing anything changing here.   

- Referenced fans ‘playing football manager’ in summing up. Why did he have to say that?  Fans in the main completely understand we don’t sign the ‘best players on the most money’ - it’s just a ***** move by him and a shame to end the interview that way.  

Mostly just pointless waffle then and I can’t say I’m any more enthused or confident after listening to him but I guess I didn’t think I would be so it’s as you were! 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 30 by lenred

[W-S-M Seagull]

10 minutes ago, lenred said:

Just actually listened.  

Key thoughts / takeaways for me (without going over Manning again)  

- Says he should've communicated better before Pearson was sacked (‘before the event happened’)  What does he think he should’ve said exactly in the run up to that ‘event’? 

- Mentioned it’s the fans club.  At least he’s learnt there from his dad’s huge mistake.   Whether he means it or not who knows.  

- Board and roles just sounds a complete and utter muddled mess.  But he doesn’t seem bothered.  

- Who are the ‘experts’ he refers that he confides and gets info from that feeds his decisions about running our club? His mates as referenced on here before?  Again just sounds extremely haphazard.   

- Clearly doesn't want to spend much money…. Was pushed about it but seemed reticent.  Same old ‘HPC is the attraction, the coach is the attraction’…. ‘We need to be seeing value others don’t see’.   Another summer of penny pinching then and hoping for the best.   

- Clearly doesn’t want to spend on Twine either.  Fair enough with me but that position will need money whether it’s Twine or someone else.  

- Realistic about the reasons for improvement in attendances.   Fair play.  

- ‘Promotion is still the focus’. Attitude doesn’t say that to me though.    Sounds meaningless as per.  

- Wants ‘fans to feel part of it’…..no explanation as to how though.  I’m not seeing anything changing here.   

- Referenced fans ‘playing football manager’ in summing up. Why did he have to say that?  Fans in the main completely understand we don’t sign the ‘best players on the most money’ - it’s just a ***** move by him and a shame to end the interview that way.  

Mostly just pointless waffle then and I can’t say I’m any more enthused or confident after listening to him but I guess I didn’t think I would be so it’s as you were! 

 

 

 

 

 

I kinda wondered if this was maybe a dig at Nigel saying we have a knowledgeable fanbase. 

I wish Jon would be interviewed by someone willing to raise all the points you raised. 

[The Wild Bunch]

13 minutes ago, lenred said:

Just actually listened.  

Key thoughts / takeaways for me (without going over Manning again)  

- Says he should've communicated better before Pearson was sacked (‘before the event happened’)  What does he think he should’ve said exactly in the run up to that ‘event’? 

- Mentioned it’s the fans club.  At least he’s learnt there from his dad’s huge mistake.   Whether he means it or not who knows.  

- Board and roles just sounds a complete and utter muddled mess.  But he doesn’t seem bothered.  

- Who are the ‘experts’ he refers that he confides and gets info from that feeds his decisions about running our club? His mates as referenced on here before?  Again just sounds extremely haphazard.   

- Clearly doesn't want to spend much money…. Was pushed about it but seemed reticent.  Same old ‘HPC is the attraction, the coach is the attraction’…. ‘We need to be seeing value others don’t see’.   Another summer of penny pinching then and hoping for the best.   

- Clearly doesn’t want to spend on Twine either.  Fair enough with me but that position will need money whether it’s Twine or someone else.  

- Realistic about the reasons for improvement in attendances.   Fair play.  

- ‘Promotion is still the focus’. Attitude doesn’t say that to me though.    Sounds meaningless as per.  

- Wants ‘fans to feel part of it’…..no explanation as to how though.  I’m not seeing anything changing here.   

- Referenced fans ‘playing football manager’ in summing up. Why did he have to say that?  Fans in the main completely understand we don’t sign the ‘best players on the most money’ - it’s just a ***** move by him and a shame to end the interview that way.  

Mostly just pointless waffle then and I can’t say I’m any more enthused or confident after listening to him but I guess I didn’t think I would be so it’s as you were! 

 

 

 

 

 

Agree with lots of this and didn’t take anything from this interview plus the recent Gavin Marshall interview of FBC.

 

 

[Harry]

5 minutes ago, lenred said:

Just actually listened.  

Key thoughts / takeaways for me (without going over Manning again)  

- Says he should've communicated better before Pearson was sacked (‘before the event happened’)  What does he think he should’ve said exactly in the run up to that ‘event’? 

- Mentioned it’s the fans club.  At least he’s learnt there from his dad’s huge mistake.   Whether he means it or not who knows.  

- Board and roles just sounds a complete and utter muddled mess.  But he doesn’t seem bothered.  

- Who are the ‘experts’ he refers that he confides and gets info from that feeds his decisions about running our club? His mates as referenced on here before?  Again just sounds extremely haphazard.   

- Clearly doesn't want to spend much money…. Was pushed about it but seemed reticent.  Same old ‘HPC is the attraction, the coach is the attraction’…. ‘We need to be seeing value others don’t see’.   Another summer of penny pinching then and hoping for the best.   

- Clearly doesn’t want to spend on Twine either.  Fair enough with me but that position will need money whether it’s Twine or someone else.  

- Realistic about the reasons for improvement in attendances.   Fair play.  

- ‘Promotion is still the focus’. Attitude doesn’t say that to me though.    Sounds meaningless as per.  

- Wants ‘fans to feel part of it’…..no explanation as to how though.  I’m not seeing anything changing here.   

- Referenced fans ‘playing football manager’ in summing up. Why did he have to say that?  Fans in the main completely understand we don’t sign the ‘best players on the most money’ - it’s just a ***** move by him and a shame to end the interview that way.  

Mostly just pointless waffle then and I can’t say I’m any more enthused or confident after listening to him but I guess I didn’t think I would be so it’s as you were! 

 

 

 

 

 

Yep. Vagueness followed by more vagueness and a bit more vagueness to boot. 
And ended with an unnecessary “I know better than you lot” football manager dig. 
As I said earlier in the thread, if you actually write his words down and read them back to yourself, he makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. 
 

Oh, and I’ll add this :

On managerial recruitment :

”we have our way of playing through the academy. We recruit based on what a manager has shown. Either they work with that or they adapt”. 
 

On reaching the Prem :

”It’s about gradual steps but we need to make a big leap” what?? “We’ve got the academy and the HPC”. 
 

These 2 comments genuinely tell me that he thinks the way we achieve prem football is via the success of the academy and having a nice training ground - he thinks that we can end up with 11 Bristol kiddies in the team, managed by a young head coach who prefers one style but has to adapt to the way we play from 8 years upwards. 
 

Jon - it ain’t gonna happen that way. Trust me. 
It’s delusional 

[lenred]

6 minutes ago, Harry said:

delusional

Yep.  It’s exactly how it continues to feel unfortunately.  

[mozo]

1 hour ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

What people forget when they often state that there has been an improvement recently which has seen us equal last season is that improvement has come with Twine in the team. 

We had to make a financial outlay, which wouldn't have been cheap to equal last season. Marvellous. 

It does beg the question, why wasn't this outlay possible in the summer? Why are we looking to do it this summer? Why did we sacrifice our season by refusing to spend it in the summer? 

Or are we not allowed to ask these questions cos we should be happy with how things have panned out? 

After selling Scott, and in the absence of Semenyo too, we definitely need talent to come in, and I agree that Nige should have been able to invest. 

[lenred]

18 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

I kinda wondered if this was maybe a dig at Nigel saying we have a knowledgeable fanbase. 

 

Just think it’s a completely unnecessary sly little dig which has no substance and just comes across as rude and patronising. Feeds the feeling of dislike and distrust towards him amongst those of us who have concerns. Ultimately does him no favours whatsoever.   

[RollsRoyce]

49 minutes ago, Harry said:

Yep. Vagueness followed by more vagueness and a bit more vagueness to boot. 
And ended with an unnecessary “I know better than you lot” football manager dig. 
As I said earlier in the thread, if you actually write his words down and read them back to yourself, he makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. 
 

Oh, and I’ll add this :

On managerial recruitment :

”we have our way of playing through the academy. We recruit based on what a manager has shown. Either they work with that or they adapt”. 
 

On reaching the Prem :

”It’s about gradual steps but we need to make a big leap” what?? “We’ve got the academy and the HPC”. 
 

These 2 comments genuinely tell me that he thinks the way we achieve prem football is via the success of the academy and having a nice training ground - he thinks that we can end up with 11 Bristol kiddies in the team, managed by a young head coach who prefers one style but has to adapt to the way we play from 8 years upwards. 
 

Jon - it ain’t gonna happen that way. Trust me. 
It’s delusional 

If there is anyone playing Football Manager it is most certainly Jon and Steve Lansdown. And after 20 years , they still cannot work out how to win. 

Crayloa boy is useless, he is only in the role because of his dad, surrounds himself with cronies and is as far detached from the fan base as you can get. Nepotism at its worse. 

[Alessandro]

Hats off this thread is OTIB at its best.

The whole Manning episode has absolutely split this place into camps hasn’t it - some forum big hitters very much with “markers in the sand”. Great to read.

Anyway the interview - my two take aways:

1) OTIB has pretty much called all of this ahead of time. Again hats off. 

2) I do now genuinely believe that JL does not believe we will actually achieve promotion. Nothing in what he says makes me believe they are in anything other than a holding pattern, where they look to maintain the value of their asset by keeping us in this division, before they sell up. Anything better would be lottery win stuff. This is backed up by the disappearance of the owner. 

There is zero plan, beyond the obvious and basic - there is zero drive, innovation or passion. It’s all fluff and lip service. 

Sad times. For them and us, in reality.