red and breakfast Posted August 28, 2012 Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 So you think this justifies your disgusting comments about him, do you? You, sir, are a prize k-h-u-n-t. Support the guy as most level-headed City fans will do, or just **** off. Interesting comment. Almost the same abusive bile that was spouted on Woolfy's twitter page...disgusting comments MW...although bywaterred isn't a professional footballer so I guess abuse towards a forum member expressing a view doesn't count. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esmond Million's Bung Posted August 28, 2012 Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 Seems to me, like I have already said, players who start off poorly, are rarely given the time, let alone game time to rectify poor form. Hunt wasn't because he was moved on, and never given a chance to play under McInnes. Stewart, is a weird one, who when regularly playing had those who liked him, and those that didn't. Then he just disappeared in his 2nd season, another not given a real chance by Del. So unlike Woolford, they haven't been given the chance to become good for city. Be it their own fault or Del just hasn't taken to them. it then appears people jump on theDel bandwagon, and the "In Del we trust" mode, and slate the players not being picked. Their prerogative, just because Del doesn't pick them, doesn't mean they could not have become a good player for us... we will never know. I never understood the LJ hatred, most of out better runs came with him in the side, he served his purpose, but got a lot of stick for it. The Ashton Gate faithful have to have a figure of hatred, and all the better if he is in the first 11, so they can vent theri spleen rather than vent it at the opposition. first LJ, he went, straight on to JM, he stops playing Woolford, then there are the like of Skuse, Elliott and Carey who a few like to dislike on the forum, but are probably quieter at AG, because the majority like both these players. I expect is is the same at every club, I just don't understand the mentality of finding a player, to hate in your own ranks. it only needs a few loud angry haters and the sheep will follow Your first sentence says everything that you need to know and that is football is a results driven occupation and it's managers and not players who pay with their jobs and when a team is over 3 year period getting worse and worse and then teetering on the brink of relegation you cannot afford passengers and boy we had more than enough passengers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRL Posted August 28, 2012 Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 Your first sentence says everything that you need to know and that is football is a results driven occupation and it's managers and not players who pay with their jobs and when a team is over 3 year period getting worse and worse and then teetering on the brink of relegation you cannot afford passengers and boy we had more than enough passengers. Yet, Woolford was picked in the run in, and with that run, his form did start picking up... And this at the most important part of the season. So I am guessing the guy has character of strength, not only to deal with the bile been checked at him, but also the strength and determination to push his way back into Del's first team. He certainly wouldn't have been picked on his previous months performances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
citywest30 Posted August 28, 2012 Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 Seems to me, like I have already said, players who start off poorly, are rarely given the time, let alone game time to rectify poor form. Hunt wasn't because he was moved on, and never given a chance to play under McInnes. Stewart, is a weird one, who when regularly playing had those who liked him, and those that didn't. Then he just disappeared in his 2nd season, another not given a real chance by Del. So unlike Woolford, they haven't been given the chance to become good for city. Be it their own fault or Del just hasn't taken to them. it then appears people jump on theDel bandwagon, and the "In Del we trust" mode, and slate the players not being picked. Their prerogative, just because Del doesn't pick them, doesn't mean they could not have become a good player for us... we will never know. I never understood the LJ hatred, most of out better runs came with him in the side, he served his purpose, but got a lot of stick for it. The Ashton Gate faithful have to have a figure of hatred, and all the better if he is in the first 11, so they can vent theri spleen rather than vent it at the opposition. first LJ, he went, straight on to JM, he stops playing Woolford, then there are the like of Skuse, Elliott and Carey who a few like to dislike on the forum, but are probably quieter at AG, because the majority like both these players. I expect is is the same at every club, I just don't understand the mentality of finding a player, to hate in your own ranks. it only needs a few loud angry haters and the sheep will follow I agree that some people must have a scapegoat and so it doesn't matter how well the team do there'll always be one player to pick on, eg lj in the play-off season. However in the cases of Stewart and hunt there is more to it than simply a bad start. I would have thought there must have been stuff that we don't know about going on there so maybe the difference with wooly is that he has a good attitude, realised he started badly and wanted to put it right so worked harder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esmond Million's Bung Posted August 28, 2012 Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 Yet, Woolford was picked in the run in, and with that run, his form did start picking up... And this at the most important part of the season. So I am guessing the guy has character of strength, not only to deal with the bile been checked at him, but also the strength and determination to push his way back into Del's first team. He certainly wouldn't have been picked on his previous months performances. I suspect the manager liked what he saw on the training field and i'm sure that Woolford will have the greatest respect for the manager for his trust, bearing in mind it was he who was putting his career at risk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esmond Million's Bung Posted August 28, 2012 Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 I agree that some people must have a scapegoat and so it doesn't matter how well the team do there'll always be one player to pick on, eg lj in the play-off season. However in the cases of Stewart and hunt there is more to it than simply a bad start. I would have thought there must have been stuff that we don't know about going on there so maybe the difference with wooly is that he has a good attitude, realised he started badly and wanted to put it right so worked harder. and there is my problem, with Woolford "we all knew", with the other players "there must have been stuff we don't know about". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRL Posted August 28, 2012 Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 I suspect the manager liked what he saw on the training field and i'm sure that Woolford will have the greatest respect for the manager for his trust, bearing in mind it was he who was putting his career at risk. Without doubt. That is why so many players get starts, but often look poor in games, they clearly look a lot different in training. Sometimes it works, sometimes it costs them their jobs by being to loyal to a good trainer who doesn't quite perform in league matches. Either way, the judgement the manager has of you, must surely help with confidence of players Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esmond Million's Bung Posted August 28, 2012 Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 Just one last question on this topic (because I am a BCFC fan and want every player to live up to his potential for us) but where were all of you "we knew he would come good for us" on all of the Woolford threads of the past 18 months?. Really don't recall seeing as many on the threads then as there are now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
citywest30 Posted August 28, 2012 Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 and there is my problem, with Woolford "we all knew", with the other players "there must have been stuff we don't know about". I'm not sure I always knew he'd come good but glad at the min that del gave him the chance. I think that it goes to show that as much as US fans like ti have a go at managing, we really don't know half of what goes on day to day and isn't it nice that we have a manager who it seems we can trust to be doing things the right way. Wouldn't it be interesting to find out exactly what the deal was with hunt and Stewart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRL Posted August 28, 2012 Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 Just one last question on this topic (because I am a BCFC fan and want every player to live up to his potential for us) but where were all of you "we knew he would come good for us" on all of the Woolford threads of the past 18 months?. Really don't recall seeing as many on the threads then as there are now. I think I kept going with him, saying he had form at Scunny, surely he will begin to show it. i remember berating him after one game where he was bottling nearly every challenge. but on the the whole, apart from 1 or 2 games where he really bottled every challenge, i have backed him to come good. I have not been so forgiving of Killa though, so that does make me a bit of a hypocrite, just didn't like his attitude as soon as he joined us, and his interviews in the press (maybe I read too much into it, but he did not come across well one little bit). I will say, his last two appearences of the season when, he improved a lot for me, nothing flashy, but two good midfield performances. Still rather he wasn't at AG though, not that i would go on twitter and rant at him, or rant at him from the stands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strictly Obi Posted August 28, 2012 Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 I think the point for me is.....we all have our favourite players, and ones we think are crap. But even if you think a player is complete tosh, why would any normal person cross the street to give him abuse or post abusive twitter rants? Pathetic! There are some very obsessive so called fans who seem to get very irate about certain players and even managers. And it's just not normal. Look at Robboreds obsessive and constant barracking of GJ, there was something quite unatural and even scary about that. Bit like stalking in an odd sort of way. Lee Johnsons constant abuse etc. There's lots of people i dislike, but i don't feel the need to shout expletives at them or post crap or stick a horses head in there bed. Martyn Woolford, i though was absolute rubbish last season, Yet if i had bumped into him on a night out i am sure i would have been both courteous and civil with him. Doesn't cost nowt...does it? Just need to chill out a bit some of you's.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted August 28, 2012 Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 Look at Robboreds obsessive and constant barracking of GJ, there was something quite unatural and even scary about that. Bit like stalking in an odd sort of way. Give it a rest. You and a number of others still can't admit that I was right all along about Johnson despite his two successful seasons. Just compare his style of management and play with that of McInnes and ask yourself which one would be more likely to poached by a PL club? They are poles apart Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strictly Obi Posted August 28, 2012 Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 Give it a rest. You and a number of others still can't admit that I was right all along about Johnson despite his two successful seasons. Just compare his style of management and play with that of McInnes and ask yourself which one would be more likely to poached by a PL club? They are poles apart I think as you suggest McInnes may very well get us to the play-offs or similar or even better the record of GJ. I agree he will prove to be a better manager. What i and others find strange is how you backed Keef to the hilt, and he has no record at all to shout about.....and will largely be seen by many to have failed in his time with us. Yet vilified a manager who the record will show brought us success. This is the weird behavioural and obsessive side of some fans i refer to in my earlier post.....never to admit how wrong they were about a manager or player. You say you were right all along....yet you know and i know and everybody else knows you are just plain silly! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strictly Obi Posted August 28, 2012 Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 Stealing a living? Seems like you were one of the so called 'fans' that probably demoralised the poor bloke in the first place, you and others are just like sheep, and that's what bullies do, safety in numbers, and so on. Personally I find it sickening that anyone should get abuse via forums twitter or whatever medium those that are so cowardly they wouldn't say it to his face. Now he is playing well and you lot are squirming, and even though he is a City player I bet you would love it when his form drops and you will all again revert to type. You and yours are the very worst btypes, go and support ManU or similar. Totally Agree! How can they call themselves fans, when they would rather see a manager or player fail....just to prove a point. There are those who will hate to see Woolford 's form continue, and prove them wrong. They will hibernate and appear by magic when things go wrong. They will then tell us they were right all along about a certain manager or player! They will still expect us to take them seriously! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sidebet Posted August 28, 2012 Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 Wow!! What a read! Truely shocking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
citywest30 Posted August 29, 2012 Report Share Posted August 29, 2012 I think the point for me is.....we all have our favourite players, and ones we think are crap. But even if you think a player is complete tosh, why would any normal person cross the street to give him abuse or post abusive twitter rants? Pathetic! There are some very obsessive so called fans who seem to get very irate about certain players and even managers. And it's just not normal. Lee Johnsons constant abuse etc. There's lots of people i dislike, but i don't feel the need to shout expletives at them or post crap or stick a horses head in there bed. Martyn Woolford, i though was absolute rubbish last season, Yet if i had bumped into him on a night out i am sure i would have been both courteous and civil with him. Doesn't cost nowt...does it? Just need to chill out a bit some of you's.... This. I'm sure in the passion of a game we have all criticised players and have those in particular who drive us crazy and at some point said they're rubbish or useless etc sproule is one that springs to mind for me and I know that at times he could be superb. But like you say that is one thing to then go and abuse someone in the street or on internet forums and the like is as you say pathetic. BCFC_1988 I don't know what you have said in the past and not really commenting on that but if it is as you say just about him playing poorly then I'm sure his comments were aimed at these people not people like you who just criticise his performances; I'm sure he is the first to admit he wasn't good enough for 18 months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Watts Posted August 29, 2012 Report Share Posted August 29, 2012 Give it a rest. You and a number of others still can't admit that I was right all along about Johnson despite his two successful seasons. Just compare his style of management and play with that of McInnes and ask yourself which one would be more likely to poached by a PL club? They are poles apart I hardly think you could ever be considered to be "right" about GJ. Now towards the end of his tenure I was one of the most vocal about the need for change, but if you look at his record of league management, he took Yeovil into the league and then into league one. He then took us into the Championship and then to the play-off final in what was admittedly a poor division that year and that was his level. Since he left us he was doing well at Peterborough until Golden Bollocks Ferguson became available again and then it was just a case of his face not fitting. Sure, it didn't work out at a poor Northampton Town, but he's since taken back over at Yeovil, saved them from the drop and taken them to the top of league one. "Conference Manager" Right about GJ? You were about as right about GJ as you were about your mate Keef! So lay off the holier than thou bullshot RR. As for Wooly, I'm delighted he's started to show some of the form that prompted us to shell out almost a million on him and long may it continue, but let's not pretend that if he'd been sold in the summer there would've been an outcry because there wouldn't. Let's just hope he continues as he's started this season as we will have a very good player on our hands. If he does drop off form I hope to see lots of supportive Woolford threads, as we sure haven't seen many over the last 18 months. Despite all of the "I knew he'd come good" crap being spouted here. Hindsight is a wonderful thing, isn't it?!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
citywest30 Posted August 29, 2012 Report Share Posted August 29, 2012 As for Wooly, I'm delighted he's started to show some of the form that prompted us to shell out almost a million on him and long may it continue, but let's not pretend that if he'd been sold in the summer there would've been an outcry because there wouldn't. Let's just hope he continues as he's started this season as we will have a very good player on our hands. If he does drop off form I hope to see lots of supportive Woolford threads, as we sure haven't seen many over the last 18 months. Despite all of the "I knew he'd come good" crap being spouted here. Hindsight is a wonderful thing, isn't it?!? Agree not sure anyone would have been surprised or cared if he had been sold. And also think those saying they always knew he'd come good are annoying but not in the same bracket as the abusers. But not sure there's too many doing that, I think some are just coming on saying that they never really got on his back which, if true fair enough, but with his poor form for 18 months any body who went to witness it I find it hard to believe at one time or another they didn't shout in exasperation "rubbish" or "useless" or maybe something a bit stronger ( but I don't really so swearing). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YouReds Posted August 29, 2012 Report Share Posted August 29, 2012 he needs to get over it tbh and be more professional, all he goes on about on twitter is how hes proving people wrong etc god hes a grown man a pro on a lot of money if idiots wana give him grief then why worry he really lets it get to him ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRL Posted August 29, 2012 Report Share Posted August 29, 2012 he needs to get over it tbh and be more professional, all he goes on about on twitter is how hes proving people wrong etc god hes a grown man a pro on a lot of money if idiots wana give him grief then why worry he really lets it get to him ! Maybe you need to get over his one line answer, seems to have got to you, even though it wasn't directed to you per se As for being professional, I think he has been that. Never said anything bad about city fans, never thrown a strop on or off the pitch , never shown any dissent. As for his twitter account, I also think he has handled himself pretty well considering a few of the keyboard warriors ad mongs on there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
citywest30 Posted August 29, 2012 Report Share Posted August 29, 2012 Maybe you need to get over his one line answer, seems to have got to you, even though it wasn't directed to you per se As for being professional, I think he has been that. Never said anything bad about city fans, never thrown a strop on or off the pitch , never shown any dissent. As for his twitter account, I also think he has handled himself pretty well considering a few of the keyboard warriors ad mongs on there. And obviously worked hard to prove to del he should be persevered with. Sure a bad attitude could have led to him being another hunt or Stewart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esmond Million's Bung Posted August 29, 2012 Report Share Posted August 29, 2012 Give it a rest. You and a number of others still can't admit that I was right all along about Johnson despite his two successful seasons. Just compare his style of management and play with that of McInnes and ask yourself which one would be more likely to poached by a PL club? They are poles apart You really have no shame do you?, the point is regardless of how his tenure as manager ended, he is historically our 3rd most successful manager of all time and that is what you cannot stomach and for you to claim that you knew it would end in the way that it did is just a lie and you don't even have the guts to admit what many on here know to be the truth about why you really hated GJ and as for your sudden love in with DMC you should give it rest because your support has only become apparent in the past 2 games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esmond Million's Bung Posted August 29, 2012 Report Share Posted August 29, 2012 I hardly think you could ever be considered to be "right" about GJ. Now towards the end of his tenure I was one of the most vocal about the need for change, but if you look at his record of league management, he took Yeovil into the league and then into league one. He then took us into the Championship and then to the play-off final in what was admittedly a poor division that year and that was his level. Since he left us he was doing well at Peterborough until Golden Bollocks Ferguson became available again and then it was just a case of his face not fitting. Sure, it didn't work out at a poor Northampton Town, but he's since taken back over at Yeovil, saved them from the drop and taken them to the top of league one. "Conference Manager" Right about GJ? You were about as right about GJ as you were about your mate Keef! So lay off the holier than thou bullshot RR. As for Wooly, I'm delighted he's started to show some of the form that prompted us to shell out almost a million on him and long may it continue, but let's not pretend that if he'd been sold in the summer there would've been an outcry because there wouldn't. Let's just hope he continues as he's started this season as we will have a very good player on our hands. If he does drop off form I hope to see lots of supportive Woolford threads, as we sure haven't seen many over the last 18 months. Despite all of the "I knew he'd come good" crap being spouted here. Hindsight is a wonderful thing, isn't it?!? Agree with every word of this post, every word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CliftonCliff Posted August 29, 2012 Report Share Posted August 29, 2012 Agree not sure anyone would have been surprised or cared if he had been sold. And also think those saying they always knew he'd come good are annoying but not in the same bracket as the abusers. But not sure there's too many doing that, I think some are just coming on saying that they never really got on his back which, if true fair enough, but with his poor form for 18 months any body who went to witness it I find it hard to believe at one time or another they didn't shout in exasperation "rubbish" or "useless" or maybe something a bit stronger ( but I don't really so swearing). I do agree wiith the general spirit of your comments, but for the record, has anyone actually claimed to "know he would come good"? I certainly haven't, though I have been among the many who have spoken up on his behalf. What a lot of people have said is that they could see he had ability (which is confirmed by his record at his previous club) and quite a few of us weren't being wise after the event, because we said it even when he was playing badly. No one could have been greatly surprised if he'd been let go this summer - I wouldn't have. And I was as exasperated and disappointed as the next person by his poor form. But what I would have felt is that it was a pity that we never saw the best of a talented footballer. It would also not have surprised me to see him go on and do well elsewhere, which is why I'm glad he's still here. Both this thread and the other one ostensibly about Woolford have not just been about him specifically, but have in fact had a more general significance. A lot of it has been about the habit of some OTIB members of slagging off individual players - and the harm it can do. The importance to the forum of Woolford's rennaisance (quite apart from its value to the team) is that it seems to have finally got through to some people the inappropriateness, unfairness and futility of abusive (as opposed to balanced or constructive) criticism, which at least as far as I'm concerned has been heartening to see. I haven't actually seen anyone go as far as claiming outright "I told you so", so I'd respectfully suggest your irritation is misplaced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murraysrightplum Posted August 29, 2012 Report Share Posted August 29, 2012 I have seen more than enough to know that Woolford was pretty damned poor for 18 months, I also know and have said on earlier threads about Woolford that there was almost certainly a good player in there somewhere but was showing very little sign of coming out and how long do you persist especially given how close to relegation we came last season, I also know enough about the pro game to also know it is indeed a confidence game and you cannot carry players, especially at championship level. But my problem really is the selective memory and the holier than attitude of some on here they have castigated people who have not had the same faith that they CLAIM to have had over Woolford and of course for at least the 3rd time on this thread the yes the twitter abuse was vile, wrong and embarrassing, but nobody has answered as to why Stewart and Hunt were not afforded the same sort of treatment. I recall under Millen after he took over from Coppell that we went our best run of the season and LJ played in all of the games during that run, but hey ho he still got abused, I think it's called balance and I wonder why all of these prophets are not football league managers. Errr they aren't on Twitter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted August 29, 2012 Report Share Posted August 29, 2012 I haven't actually seen anyone go as far as claiming outright "I told you so", so I'd respectfully suggest your irritation is misplaced. Some posters (me included) saw a steady improvement in Woolford's performances towards the end of last season and said so on here. Add to that that he was a regular scorer in a struggling Championship Scunny side suggested that there was far more to his ability than he was showing for much of last season.It was fairly obvious that his confidence was low and a major factor in his struggling form. Despite that McInnes continued to show faith in him and he featured in virtually every game as a starter or on the bench. He was obviously showing well in training which we don't get to see. Maybe the cruel stick he was getting firstly effected him negatively but he been able to reframe that criticism around. Maybe other players helped with that.Stead in particular seemed to understand what Woolford was going through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strictly Obi Posted August 29, 2012 Report Share Posted August 29, 2012 I hardly think you could ever be considered to be "right" about GJ. Now towards the end of his tenure I was one of the most vocal about the need for change, but if you look at his record of league management, he took Yeovil into the league and then into league one. He then took us into the Championship and then to the play-off final in what was admittedly a poor division that year and that was his level. Since he left us he was doing well at Peterborough until Golden Bollocks Ferguson became available again and then it was just a case of his face not fitting. Sure, it didn't work out at a poor Northampton Town, but he's since taken back over at Yeovil, saved them from the drop and taken them to the top of league one. "Conference Manager" Right about GJ? You were about as right about GJ as you were about your mate Keef! So lay off the holier than thou bullshot RR. As for Wooly, I'm delighted he's started to show some of the form that prompted us to shell out almost a million on him and long may it continue, but let's not pretend that if he'd been sold in the summer there would've been an outcry because there wouldn't. Let's just hope he continues as he's started this season as we will have a very good player on our hands. If he does drop off form I hope to see lots of supportive Woolford threads, as we sure haven't seen many over the last 18 months. Despite all of the "I knew he'd come good" crap being spouted here. Hindsight is a wonderful thing, isn't it?!? This! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esmond Million's Bung Posted August 29, 2012 Report Share Posted August 29, 2012 Some posters (me included) saw a steady improvement in Woolford's performances towards the end of last season and said so on here. Add to that that he was a regular scorer in a struggling Championship Scunny side suggested that there was far more to his ability than he was showing for much of last season.It was fairly obvious that his confidence was low and a major factor in his struggling form. Despite that McInnes continued to show faith in him and he featured in virtually every game as a starter or on the bench. He was obviously showing well in training which we don't get to see. Maybe the cruel stick he was getting firstly effected him negatively but he been able to reframe that criticism around. Maybe other players helped with that.Stead in particular seemed to understand what Woolford was going through. Yep I remember your campaign of undying support for Woolford and for DMC it started at about 5pm on saturday 25th August 2012. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Peacock Posted August 29, 2012 Report Share Posted August 29, 2012 Maybe the cruel stick he was getting firstly effected him negatively but he been able to reframe that criticism around. What? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted August 29, 2012 Report Share Posted August 29, 2012 What? What don't you get? Turning a negative into a positive? Using cruel criticism as a motivator rather that a demoraliser? Adopting 'I'll prove to you what I'm capable of on the pitch' attitude Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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