Scottish Independence

[...]

It depends on what she was wearing, where her hands were, etc, etc.

 

You have not really given us enough information to help you, EMB.

 

 

TFR

['Orns]

Saw some predictions at the weekend for the vote - biggest swing was 53% no to 47% yes

 

For such a big decision that doesn't sound like an overwhelming majority (whichever way the vote goes). Surely there needs to be a groundswill for making such a monumental move?

 

I just see this is a chance for Scotland to use it as a '**** you' to England, they've had chips on their shoulders for centuries about us, and, as someone above said, if they vote no they are going to look like pussies. All chops, no action. I get that Scottish people are proud to be Scottish, just as I'm proud to be English, but don't let the hatred of the English, and for actions that took place centuries ago cloud your judgement. The other interesting thing to come from the polls was the 18 to 24 year olds - they were something like 75% no, the no vote is coming from the downtrodden, out of work communities, which again, I get, but doesn't give the true feeling from a nation

 

I think that it will turn out to be no, just, but the 45% of people that vote yes will still be the loudest voices

[Guest]

The more Westminster panics and starts to offer this/visit Scotland the stronger the yes vote will get IMO. They've had 12-18 months to actually care about this vote and they've only started taking a real interest now that the yes vote has had a sudden surge.

 

For what its worth I think the don't knows will probably put the no vote across the line.  Working in Scotland next Thursday, going to be interesting day for sure.

[Red-Robbo]

Saw some predictions at the weekend for the vote - biggest swing was 53% no to 47% yes

For such a big decision that doesn't sound like an overwhelming majority (whichever way the vote goes). Surely there needs to be a groundswill for making such a monumental move?

I just see this is a chance for Scotland to use it as a '**** you' to England, they've had chips on their shoulders for centuries about us, and, as someone above said, if they vote no they are going to look like pussies. All chops, no action. I get that Scottish people are proud to be Scottish, just as I'm proud to be English, but don't let the hatred of the English, and for actions that took place centuries ago cloud your judgement. The other interesting thing to come from the polls was the 18 to 24 year olds - they were something like 75% no, the no vote is coming from the downtrodden, out of work communities, which again, I get, but doesn't give the true feeling from a nation

I think that it will turn out to be no, just, but the 45% of people that vote yes will still be the loudest voices

Quite a bit of the Yes appeal is based on the fact that Scotland is Disneyland - it disnae vote Tory.

Humorous to reflect then, that numerous Tory leaders, from David Cameron to Ian Duncan Smith and all the way back to Alec Douglas-Home and Harold MacMillan are either Scottish or of Scottish descent.

And of course, the Conservative Party's great philosophical touchstone is Edinburgh academic Adam Smith.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

Quite a bit of the Yes appeal is based on the fact that Scotland is Disneyland - it disnae vote Tory.

Humorous to reflect then, that numerous Tory leaders, from David Cameron to Ian Duncan Smith and all the way back to Alec Douglas-Home and Harold MacMillan are either Scottish or of Scottish descent.

And of course, the Conservative Party's great philosophical touchstone is Edinburgh academic Adam Smith.

 

The humorous part for for me is the labour party will be the party that is punished more by a yes vote, win/win?.

[Red-Robbo]

The humorous part for for me is the labour party will be the party that is punished more by a yes vote, win/win?.

Well you say that, but Scotland hasn't always been Disnae Land. In the 1950s it elected more Conservatives than Labour MPs.

No-one likes to live in a one-party state, and voting patterns change and shift, so anyone thinking we'll be getting decades of Tory rule is wide of the mark. Or indeed that an independent Scotland would be permanently left-leaning.

Even without Scottish seats, Labour would have won in the three elections 1997-2010.

[Guest]

The humorous part for for me is the labour party will be the party that is punished more by a yes vote, win/win?.

 

Bit of a fallacy - only 4 times in last 20 odd elections would it  have changed the outcome

[Esmond Million's Bung]

Bit of a fallacy - only 4 times in last 20 odd elections would it  have changed the outcome

 

Oh well i'll take 25% less labour governments, better than kick in the illegal wars.

[BigTone]

The best way for the Scots to guarantee a "Yes to Independence" is to allow us English to vote.

[Red-Robbo]

Oh well i'll take 25% less labour governments, better than kick in the illegal wars.

Actually maybe no fewer Labour governments. The two elections in recent times that it would have affected were when Harold Wilson won a majority of 3 in 1974. Without Scotland, the Tories under Heath would've been the largest party, but only just. In practice a Lib-lab pact - as Wilson had already negotiated - would be the most likely result.

The other was when Alec Douglas-Home led a Tory minority government in 1963. Without Scotland, he'd have been leading a government with a very slender majority. The chances are the Profumo affair, with its resignations and defections would have swept that away in the same way as it swept him away in 1964.

[screech]

Surely the best way to get a Yes vote for Scottish independence is to send 3 of the UK's most despised politicians. Job done.

[wayne allisons tongues]

Am I right in thinking that all driving licenses the scots have may need to change for say uk on them?

Would they have to create there own dvla? Passport office?

Anything that says uk on it would need to change? That's not going to be cheap.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

Good to see the Rambling Syd Rumpo of the labour party (John Prescott) and his offering today, what is he on ffs?

[Red-Robbo]

[wayne allisons tongues]

[Red-Robbo]

That's quite a lot to find, do they also need to create a border control between England and Scotland?

In theory if they do not get immediate accession to the EU, yes. In practice, I'm less sure. We didn't require passports from Republic of Ireland citizens before either country was in the EEC. And that's with a terrorist threat there. Salmond is assuming similar "special privileges" will be in place.

Pretty fond of his assumptions, is old Eck.

[RedM]

Surely the best way to get a Yes vote for Scottish independence is to send 3 of the UK's most despised politicians. Job done.

That's what I thought too. Oh well we will soon see how Scot's hearts and minds work, will they protest vote against the 3 stooges or have the intelligence to think long term.

[Guest]

Latest poll puts things back to as was. Possible that the you gov one was a bit of an outliner

[Cambridge Batch Red]

An interesting take on the independence issue

 

http://www.monbiot.com/2014/09/09/england-the-brave/

[wayne allisons tongues]

In theory if they do not get immediate accession to the EU, yes. In practice, I'm less sure. We didn't require passports from Republic of Ireland citizens before either country was in the EEC. And that's with a terrorist threat there. Salmond is assuming similar "special privileges" will be in place.

Pretty fond of his assumptions, is old Eck.

Thanks, thought as much. So basically its a yes no vote but no one really knows what the outcomes will be, depending on how you vote. So just a gut instinct.

[Red-Robbo]

Thanks, thought as much. So basically its a yes no vote but no one really knows what the outcomes will be, depending on how you vote. So just a gut instinct.

Salmond's a chancer. A lot of his appeal is "Och, it'll be alright on the night!"

If I was.a Scottish voter I'd want a bit more assurance than that!

[RedM]

Salmond's a chancer. A lot of his appeal is "Och, it'll be alright on the night!"

If I was.a Scottish voter I'd want a bit more assurance than that!

If/when he messes up he can simply bail out and move away from Scotland to anywhere in the world, even England. The rest of the Scots will be left in a country that is out on a limb and bankrupting itself, they wont have the luxury of being able to escape. No doubt he could spend his time making after dinner speeches etc massaging his ego as he goes. It's one big power trip for him.

[marshy]

[Red-Robbo]

[chipdawg]

An interesting take on the independence issue

http://www.monbiot.com/2014/09/09/england-the-brave/

Monbiot is a ****wit of the highest order (though I concede he made some interesting points in his unedifying rant. He's the Melanie Philips of the left (of course Melanie Philips used to be the Melanie Philips of the left until The Daily Mail paid her more cash to become the Melanie Philips of the right) and makes wild claims about a variety of things that he can't back up and knows will be inflammatory so he gets lots of Internet hits. The Daily Mail model of journalism basically

[chipdawg]

[Red-Robbo]

[RedRock]

Makes me question democracy .... It seems, from listening to people interviewed, that which way they vote depends entirely on whether in the short term they are going to be made financially richer or poorer. Sod the value of the Union, longer term prospects, the impact on others.

Sure the same would happen south of the border.

[chipdawg]

[JammyOne]