Manchester Arena Explosion (Merged)

[The Joker]

6 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

And where are those parents now  - back in Libya , and have been for some time , leaving that piece of s**t behind

Noticeably they have enough money to all travel to and fro though

I do wonder if these scumbags that travel to and fro are bringing  back intel on bomb making because they are as sure as hell getting their info from somewhere,in a world of microdots and suchlike how hard would it be to get the info back to these shores,no bugger knows where they go or who they meet up with,its all a bit scary ,pure speculation on my behalf of course but these are ruthless bastards and will stop at nothing to damage western society. 

[The Gasbuster]

47 minutes ago, Tipps69 said:

Having heard the shocking results of this attack, even the people currently in hospital sound like they're going to live with a life sentence of this horror!!

It's time we stopped 'mamby pambying' about & worrying about 'human rights', what 'human rights' are they allowing our children, women & men? No longer is it safe to take yourself or your family out to enjoy some entertainment without being in fear & that's not what this great country is about!! We should be able to go about our daily business without fear & now we can't!!

Stop 'mamby pambying' about, if we have intelligence on more of these 'scum bags', round them up & send them to Syria / Libya / Iraq / Afghanistan & let them enjoy the free life they clearly crave, stop allowing these 'scum bags' back into the country once they have left!!

Find another Guantanamo Bay & let them fizzle out in their own little version of Butlins!!

It's time to stop worrying about their 'human rights', they rave on about how they hate the western world, well it's time they f**ked off out of the western world, let them enjoy the life they crave & blow each other up!!

This 'scum bag' may have been born here but his parents were allowed to enjoy our lifestyle because they couldn't handle life in their home land & this is how we've been repaid?!? Well **** off back where life was so unpleasant because I no longer want to live in a country / world where I have to live in fear while I aim to enjoy my life!!

For all these 'scum bags' that are out there, let's stop waiting for them to do something before we attempt to stop them, if they are known as any sort of risk, round them up & stop them before it's too late (again)!!

One life lost is one life too many, irrelevant of who or what that person does in our great country!!

If this religion are uncomfortable with this, tough shit!! Your people have incited hate & encouraged the maiming & killing of westerners for too long, go & find somewhere else that is willing to put up with your beliefs because I've had enough of it & don't want you in my country anymore!!

And before anyone starts, I'm not racist but human nature means that I will look at all muslims with an eye on them that fears that they are about to carry out another attack on my country & I will defend my country & myself, whatever it takes!!

Spot on, mate.

[Red Army 75]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DAjLKd-XsAEqQLH?format=jpg&name=large

Fair play to this man . Spot on

[pnefcok]

12 hours ago, Alan Dicks said:

Time for a blanket ban on islam in the uk

That is probably a step too far although I agree there has to be serious action and some sort of 'end game' soon.

There are scum out there blowing up little kids - placards, profile pictures, and hashtags do absolutely nothing I'm afraid.

[BobBobSuperBob]

6 minutes ago, Red Army 75 said:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DAjLKd-XsAEqQLH?format=jpg&name=large

Fair play to this man . Spot on

Agree ,

But the irony of this , is , if me or you , or any other poster on here had written that

We'd be arrested

 

Says it all really

[pnefcok]

5 minutes ago, Red Army 75 said:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DAjLKd-XsAEqQLH?format=jpg&name=large

Fair play to this man . Spot on

Yep, he's absolutely correct.

The muslim community also need to take a look at themselves. Yes they may be muslim doctors, muslims this and that profession cool, we all want to work for money, but what are they offering to the country they have come to in swathes?

We have whole towns now that have become muslim cliques, social tensions, child sex rings, suicide bombers.

I'm sure there's many of nice muslims out there who want to integrate, I know a few myself, but IMHO there are far too few and I think if you want to come to Britain you should conform to British culture and integrate, if you want to live in cliques and try to implement your own laws then don't come.

Why is it that when Brits/other western people go to places in the far east like Saudi etc. we have to do everything we can to conform by their laws and customs, yet many who come here think they can do what they want? 'Multiculturalism' in this country isn't working.

[BobBobSuperBob]

Just now, pnefcok said:

Yep, he's absolutely correct.

The muslim community also need to take a look at themselves. Yes they may be muslim doctors, muslims this and that profession cool, we all want to work for money, but what are they offering to the country they have come to in swathes?

We have whole towns now that have become muslim cliques, social tensions, child sex rings, suicide bombers.

I'm sure there's many of nice muslims out there who want to integrate, I know a few myself, but IMHO there are far too few and I think if you want to come to Britain you should conform to British culture and integrate, if you want to live in cliques and try to implement your own laws then don't come.

Why is it that when Brits/other western people go to places in the far east like Saudi etc. we have to do everything we can to conform by their laws and customs, yet many who come here think they can do what they want? 'Multiculturalism' in this country isn't working.

Totally agree

Taken a while but the Caribbean Community have done just this

 

[Kid in the Riot]

2 hours ago, IAmNick said:

Interesting picture of the guy is coming out: https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/may/23/manchester-arena-attacker-named-salman-abedi-suicide-attack-ariana-grande

Some describe him as quiet etc. but others aren't so sure. A couple of bits stood out to me - and I have to wonder why he wasn't confronted or people weren't made aware if some of the things in that article are true?

It mentions a senior figure at his mosque gave a sermon strongly criticising ISIS etc. and that while the majority agreed a few (this guy included) didn't like what he he said - so why was this not reported previously?

Yes, the imam said that Abedi looked at him hatefully when he was criticising ISIS in his weekly sermons and unbelievably went on to say he wasn't surprised that Abedi had carried out this attack - maybe time for you to wake the **** up then mate and start reporting anyone who does not denounce ISIS and particularly ones who actually appear angry when you are criticising ISIS! As well as reporting them, maybe also talk to them and try and explain to them the error of their ways.

[BobBobSuperBob]

2 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Yes, the imam said that Abedi looked at him hatefully when he was criticising ISIS in his weekly sermons and unbelievably went on to say he wasn't surprised that Abedi had carried out this attack - maybe time for you to wake the **** up then mate and start reporting anyone who does not denounce ISIS and particularly ones who actually appear angry when you are criticising ISIS! As well as reporting them, maybe also talk to them and try and explain to them the error of their ways.

Concerned enough to get some people sat next to him (The piece of scum) in the Mosque to try and ensure his own safety but not enough to report it

 

Mind you - I smell a security failing here - El Scum had only returned from Libya and entered U.K. Only Three days before the attack

[Mr Popodopolous]

3 hours ago, Big Brother said:

Quote

 

I have nationalist beliefs so I'm answering from that perspective.

 

Fair enough.

Quote

 

The Iraq invasion was a Globalist project and I was totally against it.  I would like British troops withdrawn from all wars.

But nothing excuses murdering kids.  If these terrorists scum feel so bad about Iraq they should get their arses to Mosul and die there and save us here a lot of suffering.

As for the impact of the Irag invasion - it's not as simple as that.  The issue is Islam.  The Caliphate.  The Umma. That is the driving force.

Actually the biggest weapon in terms of conquering the West is not terror, it's demographics. That is the really scary problem.

 

Remember this - if the Islamic world had the weaponry of say the USA, Europe would either be:

- an Islamic theocracy, or

- a smouldering wreck

 

Dunno if I quite agree about Globalist but terrible mistake, disastrous decision and had serious impact on the region IMO. Agree I too was against it and troops deployed overseas in war- doesn't seem a good plan.

Agree, murdering kids is beyond even the terrorism which is beyond the pale anyway.

I think is a mix of both. I think Iraq destablised the region and allowed space for these bastards to get a foothold, but also I have some sympathy with the view of that- think there's a clash of cultures for sure. On demographics...jury is out for me, plenty of Westernised Muslims, Muslims who aren't so hardline so whose to say every one of them by any stretch would want an Islamic State if they ever became a majority?

Dunno if I agree- don't know enough about it tbh.

Quote

 

Imo every people group has a right to exist and a right to self-determination in their own homeland, so I agree to 2 states, but having said that, it's up to the actors to sort this out, not 'The West'.

 

Agreed- though I think this one needs outside help. Old Trump likes a deal??

Quote

 

I was totally against the illegal destruction of Libya.

There's a lot online about Ghadaffi - it's interesting to say the least.

 

Yeah, seems another blunder, hubris- the toppling of Gadaffi. May read up on some of that.

Quote

 

We are where we are.  Islam is the threat now.  This is because of the size of the muslim community.

We now have 3000 soldiers on the streets of the UK ffs - this is because ... Islam.

 

Again I am on the fence about how big a threat the bulk of Muslims are but doubtless there are a sizeable minority.

5,000 I thought? Worrying times indeed- not happened on the Mainland since WW2 I think?

 

[Mr Popodopolous]

@BobBobSuperBob @glynriley @Red Army 75 @The Gasbuster

Kicking them out. or even more significantly sounds an easy solution. But I think Bob touched upon it, International law an issue with that?

Another consequence of this...it would signficantly erode our moral authority i.e. us teaching (some may call lecturing) others about human rights would be seen as less credible and less inclined to listen. UK's moral authority, credibility in this area would absolutely be eroded in the world...is it a price worth paying? Hard question.

We already have a small element of this law it seems anyway.

http://www.cafebabel.co.uk/politics/article/revoking-nationality-whats-the-deal-across-europe.html

[TRL]

2 hours ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Problem being Glyn , asa UK Citizen we cannot refuse him entry back to the UK

Your second sentence is an option and one I've suggested on here (Once there is sufficient evidence / indicators that he is a 'threat' in violence terms)

Then we treat it as treason and bring back the death penalty for it.

 

As much as I dislike the death penalty, and the potential underhanded tactics that could be used by government to get rid of tricky customers, it must be something we have to look at when concerning home grown jihadists.

[Red Army 75]

5 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

@BobBobSuperBob @glynriley @Red Army 75 @The Gasbuster

Kicking them out. or even more significantly sounds an easy solution. But I think Bob touched upon it, International law an issue with that?

Another consequence of this...it would signficantly erode our moral authority i.e. us teaching (some may call lecturing) others about human rights would be seen as less credible and less inclined to listen. UK's moral authority, credibility in this area would absolutely be eroded in the world...is it a price worth paying? Hard question.

We already have a small element of this law it seems anyway.

http://www.cafebabel.co.uk/politics/article/revoking-nationality-whats-the-deal-across-europe.html

Well something has got to change. This can't continue. 

[Northern Red]

Not sure the death penalty is much of a deterrent for a would-be suicide bomber tbh.

[Kid in the Riot]

Plot thickens...

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/live/2017/may/24/manchester-arena-bombing-terror-attack-victims-threat-critical-ariana-grande-concert-live-news

The father of Salman Abedi, the Manchester Arena suicide bomber, fought against the Gaddafi regime with a group that was designated a terrorist organisation by the US, according to a man who says he fought alongside him.

Salman Abedi, 22, who was known to the British security services, is thought to have returned from Libya as recently as this week. His parents, who escaped the Gaddafi regime in the early 1990s and fled to the UK, now live in the Libyan city of Tripoli. Their youngest son, Hashmi, is also believed to be with them in Libya.

Abedi was born in Manchester and grew up in a tight-knit Libyan community that was known for its strong opposition to Colonel Muammar Gaddafi’s regime.

His father, Ramadan Abedi, fought against the Gaddafi regime during the Libyan revolution in 2001 with the Libyan Islamic Fighting Group. The US state department says that elements of LIFG were aligned with Osama bin Laden and al-Qaida, and designated the group a foreign terrorist organisation in 2004.

Ramadan, a security officer, and his wife Samia Tabbal, 50, were both born in Tripoli but appear to have emigrated to London before moving to Whalley Range in south Manchester, where they had lived for at least a decade.

Akram Ramadan, 49, who fought with Ramadan Abedi in the Libyan revolution, said he was passionate about overthrowing a regime that had “displaced thousands of his brethren”.

“It was something we all felt we had to do. Some were more radical than others but we all shared a common cause,” he added.

Salman, who was born in 1994, was the second youngest of four children. The imam at Didsbury mosque last night said that Salman, who wore Islamic dress, had shown him “the face of hate” when he gave a talk warning of the dangers of Islamic State.

Abedi’s older brother, Ismail, 23, had been a tutor at the mosque’s madrassa teaching children the Qur’an. Ismail’s flat, which he shared with his wife, Salha, in Whalley Range was raided hours after the suicide bomb. It is understood Ismail has been arrested.

Abedi went to school locally and in 2014 on to Salford University, where he studied business management before dropping out. His trips to Libya, where his parents returned in 2011 following Gaddafi’s overthrow, are now subject to scrutiny over possible links to jihadis.

 

[BobBobSuperBob]

42 minutes ago, Big Brother said:

 

bomber's father claims son is innocent

-- see screenshot

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/05/24/manchester-arena-terror-attack-salman-abedi-ariana-grande-victims/

 

Can you see what we as a country (as a society really) are dealing with here?  This bloke says his son is innocent.  What fu-cking lying ****.

 

Scoop the scums remains up and deliver them to Father in a bin bag

let him work it out from there 

[Northern Red]

34 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Plot thickens...

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/live/2017/may/24/manchester-arena-bombing-terror-attack-victims-threat-critical-ariana-grande-concert-live-news

The father of Salman Abedi, the Manchester Arena suicide bomber, fought against the Gaddafi regime with a group that was designated a terrorist organisation by the US, according to a man who says he fought alongside him.

Salman Abedi, 22, who was known to the British security services, is thought to have returned from Libya as recently as this week. His parents, who escaped the Gaddafi regime in the early 1990s and fled to the UK, now live in the Libyan city of Tripoli. Their youngest son, Hashmi, is also believed to be with them in Libya.

Abedi was born in Manchester and grew up in a tight-knit Libyan community that was known for its strong opposition to Colonel Muammar Gaddafi’s regime.

His father, Ramadan Abedi, fought against the Gaddafi regime during the Libyan revolution in 2001 with the Libyan Islamic Fighting Group. The US state department says that elements of LIFG were aligned with Osama bin Laden and al-Qaida, and designated the group a foreign terrorist organisation in 2004.

Ramadan, a security officer, and his wife Samia Tabbal, 50, were both born in Tripoli but appear to have emigrated to London before moving to Whalley Range in south Manchester, where they had lived for at least a decade.

Akram Ramadan, 49, who fought with Ramadan Abedi in the Libyan revolution, said he was passionate about overthrowing a regime that had “displaced thousands of his brethren”.

“It was something we all felt we had to do. Some were more radical than others but we all shared a common cause,” he added.

Salman, who was born in 1994, was the second youngest of four children. The imam at Didsbury mosque last night said that Salman, who wore Islamic dress, had shown him “the face of hate” when he gave a talk warning of the dangers of Islamic State.

Abedi’s older brother, Ismail, 23, had been a tutor at the mosque’s madrassa teaching children the Qur’an. Ismail’s flat, which he shared with his wife, Salha, in Whalley Range was raided hours after the suicide bomb. It is understood Ismail has been arrested.

Abedi went to school locally and in 2014 on to Salford University, where he studied business management before dropping out. His trips to Libya, where his parents returned in 2011 following Gaddafi’s overthrow, are now subject to scrutiny over possible links to jihadis.

 

Similar to that Bethnal Green Academy story a while back where those girls escaped to Syria. Parents blamed the police, school etc, then it turned out at least one of the families was knee deep in extremism.

[AppyDAZE]

Just reading about some of those poor people who died in the bomb blast. Not just numbers anymore, real people and real lives and families etc etc. Almost unbearably sad to read about it. Just felt I owed it to them and their families to hear about their stories. Love to everyone involved in this terrible AVOIDABLE tragedy.

[AppyDAZE]

1 hour ago, Northern Red said:

Not sure the death penalty is much of a deterrent for a would-be suicide bomber tbh.

The life penalty, no release ever, no comforts EVER. That's my punishment for anyone caught even thinking about commiting terrorism.

[IAmNick]

3 hours ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Yes, the imam said that Abedi looked at him hatefully when he was criticising ISIS in his weekly sermons and unbelievably went on to say he wasn't surprised that Abedi had carried out this attack - maybe time for you to wake the **** up then mate and start reporting anyone who does not denounce ISIS and particularly ones who actually appear angry when you are criticising ISIS! As well as reporting them, maybe also talk to them and try and explain to them the error of their ways.

Interesting report on the BBC now about this in fact:

Quote

EXCLUSIVE: Terror hotline alert

Steve Swann

BBC Home Affairs Unit

Posted at16:35

A Muslim community worker has told BBC News that members of the public called the police anti-terrorism hotline warning about the Manchester suicide bomber’s extreme and violent views several years ago.

The BBC also understands that Abedi was in Manchester earlier this year when he told people of the value of dying for a cause and made hardline statements about suicide operations and the conflict in Libya.

The community worker – who did not want to be identified – said two people who knew Salman Abedi at college made separate calls to the police.

They had been worried that “he was supporting terrorism” and had expressed the view that “being a suicide bomber was OK.” The friends had argued with him, telling him he was wrong but had become so concerned they contacted the police.

The community worker told the BBC “all of the publicity is about Muslims not coming forward and this shows that they are coming forward and expressing their concerns.”

The calls are thought to have been made around five years ago after Abedi left school, where he was known to have smoked marijuana and mixed with gangs in south Manchester.

Greater Manchester Police said they would not comment on the claims.

Very odd...

[BobBobSuperBob]

1 hour ago, Northern Red said:

Not sure the death penalty is much of a deterrent for a would-be suicide bomber tbh.

It works if you deliver it before their vile act

[glynriley]

3 hours ago, Red Army 75 said:

Well something has got to change. This can't continue. 

Lots of people in this country now thinking the same, going by conversations I've been having for the last couple of days.

There will be reprisal attacks over the weekend I reckon. Not saying it's right, but this latest attack has made a lot of people very angry. I'm ******* angry myself, and I'm normally a fairly mild mannered, live and let live sort of a bloke. If I can feel this angry, imagine what some of the more extreme BNP/EDL types are going to be like. A bank holiday weekend, sun and booze a plenty...could be a powder keg.

[TRL]

1 hour ago, Northern Red said:

Not sure the death penalty is much of a deterrent for a would-be suicide bomber tbh.

Kill plotters before they carry out the act is the premise. Even planni g is an act of treason

[BobBobSuperBob]

Just now, TRL said:

Kill plotters before they carry out the act is the premise. Even planni g is an act of treason

%100

If the plotter was in Afghanistan or Syria and we could get him it's exactly what we'd do

As we did in Gibraltar with the IRA team

What difference if they're on U.K. soil - even more reason I'd suggest

 

[TRL]

Just now, BobBobSuperBob said:

%100

If the plotter was in Afghanistan or Syria and we could get him it's exactly what we'd do

As we did in Gibraltar with the IRA team

What difference if they're on U.K. soil - even more reason I'd suggest

 

Indeed. No more worrying about upsetting people. No more worries about throw away racist taglines. Execute these plotters.  Those suspected immediately jail.. do not watch. Keep them in detention until their is evidence to kill or release.

 

 

[Mr Popodopolous]

4 hours ago, Red Army 75 said:

Well something has got to change. This can't continue. 

Oh it can't go on but the solutions being proposed in this thread certainly have downsides too.

On a general point. A key difference is we are governed by rule of law...extrajudicial killings in such nations don't fit. i.e. Why America had Guantanamo outside of America.

[Red Army 75]

10 minutes ago, glynriley said:

Lots of people in this country now thinking the same, going by conversations I've been having for the last couple of days.

There will be reprisal attacks over the weekend I reckon. Not saying it's right, but this latest attack has made a lot of people very angry. I'm ******* angry myself, and I'm normally a fairly mild mannered, live and let live sort of a bloke. If I can feel this angry, imagine what some of the more extreme BNP/EDL types are going to be like. A bank holiday weekend, sun and booze a plenty...could be a powder keg.

Same. Like most people now . Not anyone but certainly not children. So sad it brings a tear to your eye . Last post from me on this topic. 

[Guest]

55 minutes ago, AppyDAZE said:

Just reading about some of those poor people who died in the bomb blast. Not just numbers anymore, real people and real lives and families etc etc. Almost unbearably sad to read about it. Just felt I owed it to them and their families to hear about their stories. Love to everyone involved in this terrible AVOIDABLE tragedy.

I read the story about Martin Hett and how he helped his mum sell knitted dolls online to help with her depression.  I lost it at that point and the tears came out.

Having just driven up the M6 seeing the serious incident signs central manchester around the M62 junction really hit it hard.

[BobBobSuperBob]

Brothers of El Scum being rounded up including younger brother in Libya - Bet he didn't 'play up' to the Libyan Security Forces

[BobBobSuperBob]

Father of Scum arrested in Libya too now

Good

Libyan Security Forces saying younger brother was fully aware of The scums plans

Bet they obtain more information than we would 

No Police & Criminal Evidence Act in Libya or likelihood of 'No comment ...innit'