Mason Greenwood

[BS4 on Tour...]

12 hours ago, The Batman said:

... what is wrong in asking why Everton's record signing and highest earner hasn't played all season? It's not like they're doing well without him. What rules would they be breaking? They're not reporting on a crime, they're asking a football related question......

 

11 hours ago, Red-Robbo said:

Delph played a couple of games in November and was an unused sub in another.

Is Delph Everton’s “record signing” ??! I’d be amazed if he was ...

[BS4 on Tour...]

11 hours ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

 ... people still reminisce fondly about the iconic part of Dirty Den on EastEnders, as portrayed by Leslie Grantham, a convicted murderer.  I don’t remember many references to the actor as ‘the murderer Leslie Grantham’ in discussion of this, and other roles, on popular tv.

His past misdemeanour was consistently brought up, and discussed zillions of times back then on many outlets, when he appeared in Eastenders ...

Edited February 3, 2022 by BS4 on Tour...

[The Dolman Pragmatist]

8 hours ago, BS4 on Tour... said:

His past misdemeanour was consistently brought up, and discussed zillions of times back then on many outlets, when he appeared in Eastenders ...

Didn’t stop him being a popular actor and very public celebrity though, did it?

[BS4 on Tour...]

23 minutes ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

Didn’t stop him being a popular actor and very public celebrity though, did it?

No, fair point 

[Red-Robbo]

1 hour ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

Didn’t stop him being a popular actor and very public celebrity though, did it?

 

It's whattabouttery however as maybe it should have. Just because it happened in another context in the past, doesn't excuse footballing abusers in the present.

 

[MarcusX]

On 31/01/2022 at 21:06, PHILINFRANCE said:

I don't know anything about Mason Greenwood's background, but I did read (following the current scandal) that he won a competition as a model as a very young boy, receiving a cheque and a year's guidance with an agency.

I have also read several articles about Marcus Rashford's childhood and how, just like Leeds' Kalvin Phillips, they grew up in virtual poverty and were heavily influnced by their mother.

The latter two appear to have developed into thoroughly decent young men.

A coincidence, perhaps, but Mum usually knows best, and it would do these young stars a lot of good if they would remember their roots, rather than let their privileged position go to their heads.

 

A lot is said about having a strong father figure, but I think  a good mother is just as important for boys and young men to know how to behave.

For me, I'm not so close to my Dad, but my mum's the most important person in my life. She's heavily shaped my behaviour and respect for women.

[MarcusX]

On 01/02/2022 at 20:51, BRIAN WILSON said:

An interesting Statement by Raith Rovers over the Goodwillie signing

They obviously understood and considered the gravity of what opinion such a signing would make BUT it does beg the question WHY ??? considering the ramifications (losing main sponsor/Directors etc...) 

 

As announced on our website last night, Raith Rovers FC can confirm that we have signed David Goodwillie from Clyde FC.

David is a proven goal scorer, and this will be his second stint with the club, having previously played for us on loan from Dundee United during season 2007-08.

As with all new signings, the club has carefully considered our position as a Community Club and we completely respect the differing views among fans and stakeholders, many of whom we have spoken to directly in the past 24 hours and are continuing to engage with.

As David has previously played for Raith Rovers earlier in his career, we consider him to be part of Raith Rovers Football Club. The management team is familiar with David’s career and background and – in particular – his footballing ability. That is our foremost consideration, and we believe that he will strengthen the Raith Rovers playing squad.

Please be assured that as a community football club we fully acknowledge this signing has divided opinion amongst our loyal fans and commercial stakeholders; We aim to rebuild that trust.

While acknowledging the gravity of what happened ten years ago, as a club we fully support and encourage rehabilitation, and many factors influenced our signing.

First and foremost, this was a football related decision.

Basically, we know he's done a bad thing, but hes good at football so that's more important to us.

[MarcusX]

On 01/02/2022 at 21:43, The Batman said:

You're funny. 

They wanted champions league football and to win the Europa league. As if they'd drop one of their top young talents in the process. 

The key is the Everton game that he missed in November 2020. An arrest was made on a Manchester based player around that time and he missed the Everton game due to "illness". Course once the Mendy stuff came out, everyone thought it was him..... Well.... 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.manutd.com/en/amp/news/detail/solskjaer-reveals-why-greenwood-missed-everton-1-man-utd-2-on-7-nov-2020

Could be nothing. Could just be a nasty coincidence. 

Didn't that turn out to be Giggs? He was arrested in November 2020

[The Batman]

5 minutes ago, MarcusX said:

Didn't that turn out to be Giggs? He was arrested in November 2020

Could be both.... Or neither.... See what comes out over time in the investigations. 

[PHILINFRANCE]

15 minutes ago, MarcusX said:

A lot is said about having a strong father figure, but I think  a good mother is just as important for boys and young men to know how to behave.

For me, I'm not so close to my Dad, but my mum's the most important person in my life. She's heavily shaped my behaviour and respect for women.

In an ideal world, of course, children would be raised by two law abiding parents, preferably (and I am not trying to bring in another topic) both a mother and a father.

[ExiledAjax]

23 minutes ago, MarcusX said:

Basically, we know he's done a bad thing, but hes good at football so that's more important to us.

Raith have backtracked on the Goodwillie signing now though. Now seeking to terminate his contract after the backlash and comments from sponsors, fans, and members of their ladies team.

[BRIAN WILSON]

3 hours ago, ExiledAjax said:

Raith have backtracked on the Goodwillie signing now though. Now seeking to terminate his contract after the backlash and comments from sponsors, fans, and members of their ladies team.

Interesting HOWEVER I believe that the damage has been done, and just maybe no way back 

[1960maaan]

2 minutes ago, BRIAN WILSON said:

Interesting HOWEVER I believe that the damage has been done, and just maybe no way back 

I saw some Sponsors have said they have lost confidence in the Board and feel they have to go, they are still taking back their Sponsorship.

I did see earlier they we in talks about Goodwillie's contract. I wonder if it will be as simple as terminating the contract .

[ExiledAjax]

3 minutes ago, 1960maaan said:

I did see earlier they we in talks about Goodwillie's contract. I wonder if it will be as simple as terminating the contract .

Without seeing his contract, or knowing about any intricacies of Scottish employment or contract law, I would think it will be hard for them. He's not committed the offence whilst under his Raith contract, so gross misconduct isn't an option. The club also had full knowledge of his past when they signed him, so they can't argue he has hidden anything from them which now brings them into disrepute etc. It was public knowledge. Honestly, I suspect the starting position is that Raith need to pay him out - ie pay all wages he'd receive over the life of the contract. 

9 minutes ago, BRIAN WILSON said:

Interesting HOWEVER I believe that the damage has been done, and just maybe no way back 

I agree, was just pointing it out.

Depressing that we have to talk about this kind of stuff in football.

[1960maaan]

5 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

Without seeing his contract, or knowing about any intricacies of Scottish employment or contract law, I would think it will be hard for them. He's not committed the offence whilst under his Raith contract, so gross misconduct isn't an option. The club also had full knowledge of his past when they signed him, so they can't argue he has hidden anything from them which now brings them into disrepute etc. It was public knowledge. Honestly, I suspect the starting position is that Raith need to pay him out - ie pay all wages he'd receive over the life of the contract. 

 

Exactly my thoughts. He has never been convicted in a criminal Court. He was found guilty in Civil Court, and as you say that was well before they signed him. I imagine they will hope they can negotiate something, TBH in his position, I would hold out for the full term.

It always amazes me that Clubs can be so far out of touch with their Fan base.

[Numero Uno]

19 hours ago, BS4 on Tour... said:

 

Is Delph Everton’s “record signing” ??! I’d be amazed if he was ...

The point about Delph that many people miss is that when "the other bloke who cannot be identified yet we all know his identity" was arrested the Police only gave out the players age it was Delph who was initially suspected by the majority of people on social media.

[Numero Uno]

11 hours ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

Didn’t stop him being a popular actor and very public celebrity though, did it?

So what's the point, that we should legalise murder or that you feel Greenwood is being unfairly targeted because he is a footballer?

[Maesknoll Red]

Just stop, it’s not clever, and FFS stop quoting posts that you know contain things that possibly shouldn’t be aired.

[The Dolman Pragmatist]

1 hour ago, Numero Uno said:

So what's the point, that we should legalise murder or that you feel Greenwood is being unfairly targeted because he is a footballer?

Actually I was thinking more of Goodwillie in this context.  Greenwood is presently not a convicted criminal.  My point was to highlight the double standards of denying a living to a person found in a civil action to have committed rape, while continuing to celebrate the performances of an actor who happened to be a criminally convicted murderer.

[Numero Uno]

7 minutes ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

Actually I was thinking more of Goodwillie in this context.  Greenwood is presently not a convicted criminal.  My point was to highlight the double standards of denying a living to a person found in a civil action to have committed rape, while continuing to celebrate the performances of an actor who happened to be a criminally convicted murderer.

Understand where you are coming from. The Goodwillie case is interesting in that he was found "guilty" in a civil case on the "balance of probabilities" a far, far lower threshold than required in Crown Court. It's an awkward truth that if you really were innocent but with a lot of "circumstantial" evidence going against you there is a very high chance you would get convicted in a civil case brought against you. That would apply to many an innocent person who was found not guilty at crown court, if not the majority.

[Numero Uno]

2 hours ago, Tafkarmlf said:

Just to clarify , not guilty, doesn't actually mean innocent. 

It means that there was not enough evidence to successfully convict. 

It's something to remember and gets lost in all of this as people will have had enough evidence to get arrested and charged and CPS will have proceeded on evidence on a potential conviction. 

When something is quoshed because of lack of evidence, that would me more suggesting of innocence, but even then it may not mean that someone is. 

Agree totally with that point in the same way that being charged does not mean someone is ipso facto guilty although it certainly indicates they have a case to answer. In terms of Greenwood if that is his voice on the audio people will make their own minds up irrespective of whether or not he passes the charging threshold.

Sometimes people are found not guilty in court because their defence barrister has proven beyond all reasonable doubt that they ARE INNOCENT of the charges being tried regardless of the evidence and case the Police/CPS thought they had.

[The Batman]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/metro.co.uk/2022/02/13/premier-league-star-arrested-after-attacking-girlfriend-16096579/amp/

Dean Henderson has had to come out and make a statement saying that it wasn't him. That's why the dangers of naming people on social media / forums can be a dangerous thing. 

Who knows how many pay offs and gagging orders women have been put under over the years. 

[Northern Red]

 

[BTRFTG]

On 05/02/2022 at 13:56, Numero Uno said:

....that being charged does not mean someone is ipso facto guilty although it certainly indicates they have a case to answer. 

Actually, it only means The Police believe the person they have charged has a case to answer, not the person DOES have a case to answer.

Plenty of convicted Post Office staffs presently fighting this very point, not they were wrongfully convicted rather they should never have been charged in the first place.

[Numero Uno]

3 hours ago, BTRFTG said:

Actually, it only means The Police believe the person they have charged has a case to answer, not the person DOES have a case to answer.

Plenty of convicted Post Office staffs presently fighting this very point, not they were wrongfully convicted rather they should never have been charged in the first place.

Somebody really needs to do a significant amount of time for that whole fiasco and serious compensation should be paid out. Won't happen though.

[BTRFTG]

48 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

Somebody really needs to do a significant amount of time for that whole fiasco and serious compensation should be paid out. Won't happen though.

Sadly, quite a few are already dead. 

[Sleepy1968]

1 hour ago, Numero Uno said:

Somebody really needs to do a significant amount of time for that whole fiasco and serious compensation should be paid out. Won't happen though.

I agree with your sentiment, and conclusion.

PS Many who were forced into "paying back" money they didn't steal to avoid prosecution (and who also lost their jobs to boot) should not be forgotton in this either.

 

Edited March 3, 2022 by Sleepy1968

[The Batman]

He's back on the man utd website. 

Cavani was injured for Uruguay the other day. Martial still out on loan. 

https://www.manutd.com/en/players-and-staff/first-team

. 

. 

. 

He was taken off the site when all this came about. Something has happened behind the scenes. We shall see. 

[Lorenzos Only Goal]

On 04/02/2022 at 21:05, Numero Uno said:

Understand where you are coming from. The Goodwillie case is interesting in that he was found "guilty" in a civil case on the "balance of probabilities" a far, far lower threshold than required in Crown Court. It's an awkward truth that if you really were innocent but with a lot of "circumstantial" evidence going against you there is a very high chance you would get convicted in a civil case brought against you. That would apply to many an innocent person who was found not guilty at crown court, if not the majority.

 

On 04/02/2022 at 20:53, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

Actually I was thinking more of Goodwillie in this context.  Greenwood is presently not a convicted criminal.  My point was to highlight the double standards of denying a living to a person found in a civil action to have committed rape, while continuing to celebrate the performances of an actor who happened to be a criminally convicted murderer.

 

I get what you're saying here, I did remember looking at the Goodwillie case a while back and thinking he was guilty it just didn't go through the criminal process, it does bother me though that there is this sense of trying to erase people though, I personally think its better to have these people still in the public eye, as there is scrutiny that comes with that.  Out of the public eye they are free to drop off the radar and to a certain extent reoffend easier, our reactions to these events are far to emotionally driven they should be more driven by thoughtful consideration.  In Greenwoods case he will get a disproportionate sentence for what he's clearly done, there will be a drive to make sure justice is seen to be done, however it wont happen for all the other cases where there is not such a public figure involved, this disjointedness does not sit well with me at all. 

[joe jordans teeth]

Shouldn’t laugh but