2015 Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 The uproar from Premier League fans is quite comical. They have supported owners from USA, Russia and Middle East come into the League. These owners never had the best interest of the fans or the League in their heart, but they are happy to take the trophies and success. These fans don't understand Football, they look down upon the EFL and non league system. The Prem would be nothing without the English league pyramid. Non League attendances are on the rise, as are EFL attendances. It's about time fans stopped their sky sports subscriptions, got out of their homes and started supporting clubs who value their support and custom. To hell with the Premier League and the greed that comes with it. No wonder Real Madrid and Barcelona are seeking avenues to try and level the playing field with the obscene amount of money Premier League clubs spend. As for a World League? That can do one. They want Footballers to become robots. Passing accuracy of 99% eventually so there will be no faults. Absolutely terrible, much like globalisation is anyway. 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W-S-M Seagull Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 14 minutes ago, bcfc01 said: I'm all in favour of a Euro League. Getting shot of the "big 6" would make the EPL more competitive and enjoyable imo. If the EPL could as a result be brought back or merged into the Football League, even better. Also, barring the Euro clubs from the domestic cups would also make those competitions more competitive. New european cups could be easily be set up without those in the Euro League. EUEFA and FIFA should let them get on with it and just cut them off from the domestic leagues. Fat Chance.. The clubs never wanted to leave the PL. They wanted to leave UEFA competitions. Whilst the rules may have now changed to prevent them joining a rival competition, if they were prevented from joining then this court case shows that they could be successful challenging it in court. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IAmNick Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 6 minutes ago, 2015 said: The uproar from Premier League fans is quite comical. They have supported owners from USA, Russia and Middle East come into the League. These owners never had the best interest of the fans or the League in their heart, but they are happy to take the trophies and success. These fans don't understand Football, they look down upon the EFL and non league system. The Prem would be nothing without the English league pyramid. Non League attendances are on the rise, as are EFL attendances. It's about time fans stopped their sky sports subscriptions, got out of their homes and started supporting clubs who value their support and custom. To hell with the Premier League and the greed that comes with it. No wonder Real Madrid and Barcelona are seeking avenues to try and level the playing field with the obscene amount of money Premier League clubs spend. As for a World League? That can do one. They want Footballers to become robots. Passing accuracy of 99% eventually so there will be no faults. Absolutely terrible, much like globalisation is anyway. Clubs were primarily becoming business ventures rather than football clubs before the Premier League and before those owners you mention arrived as well. Who owned the original clubs and the massive increase in rights and income they got after all? The proverbial genie was out of the bottle within the first few years of the PLs formation and has accelerated ever since. I agree with the middle part of your post. I don't really understand the last line though! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledAjax Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 3 minutes ago, IAmNick said: Clubs were primarily becoming business ventures rather than football clubs before the Premier League and before those owners you mention arrived as well. Who owned the original clubs and the massive increase in rights and income they got after all? The proverbial genie was out of the bottle within the first few years of the PLs formation and has accelerated ever since. I agree with the middle part of your post. I don't really understand the last line though! I will go to my grave saying that a private limited company with a share capital is an inappropriate corporate vehicle for a community based enterprise with huge social value. 4 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pillred Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 1 hour ago, Rocking Red Cyril said: We will never be in it. So why is there a discussion thread on it here? I agree (sadly) but the last time I looked this was a football forum, so it will probably get discussed. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IAmNick Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 6 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said: I will go to my grave saying that a private limited company with a share capital is an inappropriate corporate vehicle for a community based enterprise with huge social value. I couldn't agree more. If you use a structure whose primary metric of success is monetary is it really then any surprise that they value that above (and to the detriment of) all else? Not to absolve the individuals of any responsibility, but it'll always be a struggle. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonBristolian Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 I've got mixed views on this. Back when it originally started I was massively opposed to a Super League - and I still am. At the same time, I'm increasingly of the view that FIFA and and UEFA are utterly unfit to govern global sport and - whilst maybe this is a case of being careful or what I wish for - I don't think it the worst thing in the world if their monopoly is broken up. There is part of me that thinks, whilst the Super League would also be undoubtedly run by the wrong people for the wrong reasons, an outright corporation running tournaments would at least be more honest and less corrupt than governing bodies that pretend to be about the good of the game and moral values whilst trying to hoover up the profits... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 (edited) Mixed views on this like many. One angle, if the Big 6 are lost to a Super League, how will tbis impact on money to the PL verbatim which in turn impacts upon the flow down to the Football League, Non League etc. Otoh, if they go, might a more competitive League structure arise..or would it just be an Aston Villa, Newcastle type monopoly for the foreseeable. Everton if they get their act together too. None of them are exactly pure in ownership or structure either. Who is at that level? Brighton, Brentford and Luton perhaps. West Ham are also English owned. Burnley and Sheffield United are broadly speaking run along more rational economic lines too but are US Leveraged buyout owned and Saudi Prince albeit a not very well off one by their standards, respectively. Crystal Palace, mix of Parish and US investors isn't it. Edited December 21, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Open End Numb Legs Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 36 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said: I will go to my grave saying that a private limited company with a share capital is an inappropriate corporate vehicle for a community based enterprise with huge social value. I like a good analogy. If this new league ever took off it would be like a bigger version of that time in a hotel lobby when the Leeds players walked past some of their young fans, ignoring them on the way to the game, head phones on, looking at their phones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrs Court Red Posted December 21, 2023 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 Interesting, UEFA have said that they won’t oppose the proposal. I wonder if they have a rather high degree of confidence it’s dead, despite what Barca and Real are hoping. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swede Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 I've said it before, money is ruining football. The alleged financial irregularities of some of the biggest clubs in the Premier League and the possibility of sanctions [removal of titles/cups even relegation] will just push this on further. World cups played in country's with little or no footballing infrastructure & questionable human rights issues where money smooths the wheels of commerce just shows how low the game has fallen. There is so much wrong with the game I fear it will implode. It will become less of a spectacle & people will simply switch off as the game becomes more and more alienated and distanced from the fans. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maltshoveller Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 How i see it (prob wrong) It wont be the Premier League that suffers It will be the end of the Champions League What i cant what to see is the managers of the big clubs moaning that there is to much football If this comes off there will be another 14 games min to play Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledAjax Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 If clubs that join an ESL are kicked out of their domestic leagues then it will all come down to who can pay the wages that attract the players and the managers. If the ESL can generate enough revenue to pay top players more than the PL or other national leagues can then in the long run it will win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steviestevieneville Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 2 hours ago, Rocking Red Cyril said: We will never be in it. So why is there a discussion thread on it here? Because it has a massive knock on effect right through the football pyramid . Surely you can see that 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bristol Oil Services Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 15 minutes ago, steviestevieneville said: Because it has a massive knock on effect right through the football pyramid . Surely you can see that No, no. It's so that we can savage it with both barrells, safe in the knowledge we will never be invited Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 (edited) I doubt any English team will come forward after last time. This is being pushed mainly by Spain and Italy where there is nowhere near the money than in England. Edited December 21, 2023 by Super Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lrrr Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 So another downside of the proposed new league system, Girona having a great season in Spain now and if they finish in a qualifying spot they get Champions League football next season, under the new proposed system they would enter the blue league and it would be a further two seasons of exceptional football before they reached the star league to be able to play against the best. Despite being a City group club they would likely have their squad ripped apart in that time with the best players going to City or sold for big money and trying to replace them while staying competitive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2015 Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 2 hours ago, IAmNick said: Clubs were primarily becoming business ventures rather than football clubs before the Premier League and before those owners you mention arrived as well. Who owned the original clubs and the massive increase in rights and income they got after all? The proverbial genie was out of the bottle within the first few years of the PLs formation and has accelerated ever since. I agree with the middle part of your post. I don't really understand the last line though! They were, but largely owned by lifelong supporters, local businessmen. Last line? Because of the proposal to have a World Cup in 6 different countries, more teams qualifying, a 32 team Club World Cup. It's an attempt to globalise Football across the world, but at a detriment to the hardcore supporters and on the player's welfare. Too much Football imo. They expect the players to be like robots and the game has been turning very robotic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2015 Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 1 hour ago, Swede said: I've said it before, money is ruining football. The alleged financial irregularities of some of the biggest clubs in the Premier League and the possibility of sanctions [removal of titles/cups even relegation] will just push this on further. World cups played in country's with little or no footballing infrastructure & questionable human rights issues where money smooths the wheels of commerce just shows how low the game has fallen. There is so much wrong with the game I fear it will implode. It will become less of a spectacle & people will simply switch off as the game becomes more and more alienated and distanced from the fans. Hopefully fans revert to going to local non league teams eventually where the club's value their support. Sky Sports have got a whole generation or two brainwashed into thinking Football is just the Premier League and Champions League. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHILINFRANCE Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 Firstly, what exactly is meant by free? ‘For fans: We propose free viewing of all Super League matches’ Does this mean ‘free to air’, i.e. available on BBC or ITV, or on satellite/cable TV (which still requires a paid subscription), but not ‘pay per view’? Whatever, ‘free to air’ or ‘free’ satellite/cable, it will inevitably change once (they hope) people become interested. Secondly, in so far as it concerns English football, i.e. The Premier League, instead of becoming embroiled in a long, drawn out legal process, why can’t they just say to teams that they are free to join should they wish, but the fixture list, be it League matches, FA or League Cups, will not change to accommodate you. Accordingly, should you find yourself engaged in a Super League match that clashes with a Premier League match, that is your concern and your concern only. It is for you to decide whether or not to fulfil the PL fixture, with a reserve team if need be, or to forfeit the three points available, in addition to incurring the accompanying fines etc. Our League, our rules…. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 42 minutes ago, Lrrr said: So another downside of the proposed new league system, Girona having a great season in Spain now and if they finish in a qualifying spot they get Champions League football next season, under the new proposed system they would enter the blue league and it would be a further two seasons of exceptional football before they reached the star league to be able to play against the best. Despite being a City group club they would likely have their squad ripped apart in that time with the best players going to City or sold for big money and trying to replace them while staying competitive. Don't have too much sympathy for a CFG owned club personally although I get what you're saying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lrrr Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 31 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said: Don't have too much sympathy for a CFG owned club personally although I get what you're saying. Yeah they were just the best example of a non traditional club playing in Europe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 2 minutes ago, Lrrr said: Yeah they were just the best example of a non traditional club playing in Europe Thanks. Maybe I was a bit unfair as I dunno how high budget they are, higher with CFG but surely not table topping high. Have access to top facilities and coaching of course but their current season is quite remarkable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTone Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 6 hours ago, steviestevieneville said: It will as a lot of them are owned by yanks. They want a closed shop And good luck to them. The novelty will soon wear off for fans world wide. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lrrr Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 12 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said: Thanks. Maybe I was a bit unfair as I dunno how high budget they are, higher with CFG but surely not table topping high. Have access to top facilities and coaching of course but their current season is quite remarkable. Oh yeah they’ll be no where near the big 3 clubs and probably not even the next batch. Their whole thing will be signing high potential talent nurturing it and then selling it on and sprinkling some longer term signings around those for continuity. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sleepy1968 Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 4 hours ago, Markthehorn said: Surely the English clubs won’t want to risk upsetting their fans again but guess it depends how much they put money ahead of the supporters? All it depends on is who owns them. And what additional revenue they can generate. Its not a local game for local people anymore. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W-S-M Seagull Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 2 hours ago, ExiledAjax said: If clubs that join an ESL are kicked out of their domestic leagues then it will all come down to who can pay the wages that attract the players and the managers. If the ESL can generate enough revenue to pay top players more than the PL or other national leagues can then in the long run it will win. They won't be kicked out of their domestic leagues. The premier league clubs voted to put a block on clubs joining, they can easily vote to over turn that. The government may put things in place but then we get back into the competition law territory. I suspect what will happen is Premier league clubs wont join it initially. When they realise they want a slice of that pie, theyll join and fans will be on board too. European clubs are desperate for this because of the huge success of the Premier League. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W-S-M Seagull Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 (edited) All the hysteria around the ESL has always made me laugh. People didn't understand what they were getting hysterical about. No clubs were ever going to leave their domestic leagues. Why would a Premier league team leave the Premier league? Why should Uefa and Fifa have a monopoly on competitions? The European Cup was changed to the CL where lots of the clubs in it are not Champions. Fifa and Uefa are changing the format of their competitions soon. Why should they be allowed to do that but no one else? Why is everyone so keen to be governed by Uefa? Them and FIFA are rotten to the core. Competition is good. If Uefa feel threatened by this competition then thats a good thing as that will drive change and maybe they'll distribute funds better. That seems to be a core principle of the ESL. Makes me laugh all these Premier league fans crying about this. The premier league itself is a breakaway league. Edited December 21, 2023 by W-S-M Seagull Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTone Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 1 minute ago, W-S-M Seagull said: They won't be kicked out of their domestic leagues. The premier league clubs voted to put a block on clubs joining, they can easily vote to over turn that. The government may put things in place but then we get back into the competition law territory. I suspect what will happen is Premier league clubs wont join it initially. When they realise they want a slice of that pie, theyll join and fans will be on board too. European clubs are desperate for this because of the huge success of the Premier League. If they don't kick them out of their respective domestic leagues then it will just devalue the leagues themselves. Do we want Man Citys reserve side winning the PL ? Where does that leave of us ? It will be the death of UK football. Leave for a ESL then leave full stop with no coming back in anyway shape or form. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W-S-M Seagull Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 19 minutes ago, BigTone said: If they don't kick them out of their respective domestic leagues then it will just devalue the leagues themselves. Do we want Man Citys reserve side winning the PL ? Where does that leave of us ? It will be the death of UK football. Leave for a ESL then leave full stop with no coming back in anyway shape or form. Why would it mean that? Do they field their reserve sides in the premier league currently in favour of CL games? No. Is the CL the death of English football? This is just an alternative competition to the CL. The Premier League is a very wealthy and prestigious league. The only thing clubs want to leave iz Uefa competitions. Is this sort of hysteria that makes me giggle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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