European Super League

[2015]

3 minutes ago, AppyDAZE said:

A lot of it is all the hype surrounding it. People like Martin Tyler claiming things like THIS IS THE LEAGUE OF LATE GOALS!

and bollocks like that.. All leagues get late goals, you ****!

 

It's the disneyland of Football. Super star players earning super star wages with little care about the club's they play for or the core of the club (The fans). Ask 30 of Nottingham Forest new signings who their legendary manager was in the 70s and 80s and I guarantee you over half of them would not know. The Prem lost its soul around 10 years ago, just after Man City started splashing their cash about, bringing in players who have little care for the local area or little to no knowledge on the club they represent. We're the legacy fans remember? Just a pawn in the product. We're nothing to them.

The owners, sky sports, BT Sport, millionaire ex footballers know nothing on what the football actually means to people in this Country. Sometimes it's not all about being the best side or being in the highest level.

Sometimes it is as if the EFL never exists and simply being relegated to the Championship is some kind of 'disaster', which it's not. Those who run the game in England really do not understand the fans.

[AppyDAZE]

@2015 Spot on. Sorry if it seems like I'm liking all your posts like a fan boy

But you're talking a lot of sense.

I totally agree with your comment about modern comedy too.

Edited February 9, 2023 by AppyDAZE

[View from the Dolman]

 

"ECA notes the latest dispatch from A22's alternative reality. However, in the real world, this rehashed idea has already been proposed, discussed and comprehensively rejected by all stakeholders in 2019."

https://www.ecaeurope.com/news-media-releases/eca-statement-on-latest-breakaway-european-super-league-reporting/

[RoystonFoote'snephew]

3 hours ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

It was something like 9 permanent clubs and 3 entries based on sporting merit. 

It was never the closed shop that people believed it was. 

I'm not saying I'm happy with the previous proposed format. But let's be honest, the likes of Barca, Real, Bayern etc are already pretty much permanent members of the Champions league so it's really no different to that. It was just a condensed version of the CL. 

Let's be honest in the early rounds of the CL the games are pants. I'd much rather watch Real Vs PSG.

Time to get on my soapbox again. The reason these teams are permanent members of the farce that us the 'Champions' league is due to its corrupt format. That there is more than one club from a nation is a farce as many clubs in the competition are champions of **** all. Unlike you I don't want to see Real playing PSG for the umpteenth time and especially don't want to see them given privileged entry into the TV lucrative league stages over teams that are actually Champions of their nation. UEFA should be seeking to improve the standards of teams and leagues across Europe which could come around sooner if these clubs were allowed access to lucrative TV monies and games against the big sides instead of pandering to the privileged few. Its especially ridiculous that English clubs should still enjoy the privilege of 4 teams in the Champions league when it's based on successes over 30 years ago pre Premier League. Between 1967 and 1992 English clubs won 22 European trophies (at a time when it was much harder to qualify) as opposed to the paltry 11 trophies won in the 30 years since the Premier League's formation. Real Madrid alone has won more European Cup/Champions League trophies than the entirety if English clubs since PL formation. 

[Rocking Red Cyril]

4 hours ago, LondonBristolian said:

I don't know if I'm missing something but I don't see how they could in that I just don't see any connection between the two things or how one could influence the other. How do you think it might?

In terms of the actual proposal, they've taken out all the bits that felt horrifying the first time round but it's now become something I don't really see the point of.

I think a lot of the problem is that football is basically maxed out in terms of how far organisers can push commercial concepts and maximise interests but it has left even the big clubs losing money trying to keep pace. Hence this constant chase for something that will generate eve more money but I'm not sure something that will generate even more money exists and the major risk is football organisers ******* up what they have already (which I certainly think is the case with the latest plans for the Champions League).

Yes good points

My feelings are. That if the super league is again being proposed. And then if in punishment for the alleged offences is relegation. Man city will say if you relegate  us we  go and join the super League. Then maybe that would sway other premium League clubs to follow.All a game of bluff

 

[ExiledAjax]

49 minutes ago, View from the Dolman said:

 

"ECA notes the latest dispatch from A22's alternative reality. However, in the real world, this rehashed idea has already been proposed, discussed and comprehensively rejected by all stakeholders in 2019."

https://www.ecaeurope.com/news-media-releases/eca-statement-on-latest-breakaway-european-super-league-reporting/

That's worth putting in full on here:

ECA notes the latest dispatch from A22's alternative reality. However, in the real world, this rehashed idea has already been proposed, discussed and comprehensively rejected by all stakeholders in 2019.

This is just another deliberately distorted and misleading attempt to de-stabilise the constructive work currently taking place between football's real stakeholders to move things forward in the overall best interests of the European club game.

As the sole organisation recognised by FIFA and UEFA representing clubs at European and international level, and the only body through which clubs have genuine representation in their decision-making, ECA reiterates its long-standing opposition to the European Super League and any breakaway project.

A great amount of progress and positive change has been achieved by ECA in recent years in collaborative partnership with all football stakeholders – UEFA, FIFA and the confederations, national associations, leagues, fans, players and clubs of all sizes – working for the benefit of the entire European football ecosystem.

From 2024 more clubs from more countries will participate in European men’s club competitions every season, growing the passion of European football and greatly increasing the amount of revenue being shared.  Significant progress can be seen across other aspects of the game from women’s football, youth and academy development, finance and regulation to sustainability and social impact.  

This is what real change looks like. We have moved on, when will A22?

For those that don't know, the ECA is an independent body directly representing football clubs at European level. So it's not part of UEFA, the PL, the FA, FIFA, or anyone else. It is effectively a kind of trade union for European football teams. It's English members are Arsenal, Villa, Chelsea, Everton, Leicester, Liverpool, Man City, Man Utd, Spurs and Newcastle. It also has PSG, Inter Milan, AC Milan, Valencia, Bayern Munich, Dortmund and most other big European teams as members.

Notably it does not count Barcelona, Real Madrid or Juventus amongst its membership.

[Sir Geoff]

31 minutes ago, Rocking Red Cyril said:

Yes good points

My feelings are. That if the super league is again being proposed. And then if in punishment for the alleged offences is relegation. Man city will say if you relegate  us we  go and join the super League. Then maybe that would sway other premium League clubs to follow.All a game of bluff

 

Good, let them go and any others that care to join the ' circus' with the proviso that they never be allowed to return.

[Sir Geoff]

Spooky timing for this to re emerge a day after the white paper was postponed for two weeks.

[Bristol Rob]

 

 

[W-S-M Seagull]

Think we should be talking about things like this more tbh

[Lrrr]

Does the whole concept not lose its appeal (if it had any to begin with) if it expands to 40-60 teams? The whole point was it was supposed to be the best of the best playing each other? So what happens when teams who were say in the 50-60th choice bracket make their way to the top league? What if a Barca, Madrid, Chelsea get relegated to the second tier? 

[Harry]

Am I the only one who likes the idea of something like this. Not ‘exactly’ this, but something like this. 
In fact I think it should go a step further and there should be a World League. 
Would be fantastic having a World League Division 1 with Arsenal, Man C, Barca, Real, Ajax, PSG, Bayern, Juve etc all in the same division as the best teams from the other federations (River Plate, Boca Juniors, Corinthians, Flamengo etc). 
 

As long as it’s not closed, and the qualification to the world League each year is still based on your domestic league performance. 
 

I haven’t necessarily thought it through but why can’t there be something where the top 5 ranked teams from each federation go into Division 1 (with a restriction of only 1 team per country). 
The next 5 ranked teams into Division 2 etc. 

I’d much rather see the best from all teams in the world playing regularly against each other. 

[ExiledAjax]

13 minutes ago, Harry said:

Am I the only one who likes the idea of something like this. Not ‘exactly’ this, but something like this. 
In fact I think it should go a step further and there should be a World League. 
Would be fantastic having a World League Division 1 with Arsenal, Man C, Barca, Real, Ajax, PSG, Bayern, Juve etc all in the same division as the best teams from the other federations (River Plate, Boca Juniors, Corinthians, Flamengo etc). 
 

As long as it’s not closed, and the qualification to the world League each year is still based on your domestic league performance. 
 

I haven’t necessarily thought it through but why can’t there be something where the top 5 ranked teams from each federation go into Division 1 (with a restriction of only 1 team per country). 
The next 5 ranked teams into Division 2 etc. 

I’d much rather see the best from all teams in the world playing regularly against each other. 

An expanded Club World Cup is already coming in 2025 with expansion to 32 clubs (and presumably commensurately more games).

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.skysports.com/amp/football/news/11095/12769221/gianni-infantino-fifa-to-launch-new-32-team-mens-club-world-cup-and-will-rediscuss-2026-world-cup-group-stage-format

Honestly, I won't watch it, and my main concerns around it are regarding player welfare, carbon emissions, and a disregard for fans that actually go to games in domestic countries.

Anyway, if you think UEFA hate the ESL, just imagine how FIFA would react to a rival Club World Cup/League. 

Edited February 9, 2023 by ExiledAjax

[spudski]

2 minutes ago, Harry said:

Am I the only one who likes the idea of something like this. Not ‘exactly’ this, but something like this. 
In fact I think it should go a step further and there should be a World League. 
Would be fantastic having a World League Division 1 with Arsenal, Man C, Barca, Real, Ajax, PSG, Bayern, Juve etc all in the same division as the best teams from the other federations (River Plate, Boca Juniors, Corinthians, Flamengo etc). 
 

As long as it’s not closed, and the qualification to the world League each year is still based on your domestic league performance. 
 

I haven’t necessarily thought it through but why can’t there be something where the top 5 ranked teams from each federation go into Division 1 (with a restriction of only 1 team per country). 
The next 5 ranked teams into Division 2 etc. 

I’d much rather see the best from all teams in the world playing regularly against each other. 

Harry...much as I respect you...the sentence that resonates most in your post is...' I haven't necessarily thought it through'...

How on earth can anyone think this is possible and acceptable in this day and age, when you can't drive across Bristol without worrying about being charged or some lunatic is glueing themselves to the road in the name of climate change.

Having a world league with teams and fans travelling vast distanced on a regular basis... really?

It contradicts everything the world leaders and world powers are trying to eradicate.

However...if we are in the Bill Gates theory of if you have money and contribute to trying to help the world...you can do whatever you freaking want...then let's all fill our boots.

Take away that analogy...then you have the domestic supporters to consider...and the policing of cultural differences. Good luck policing Boca Juniors v Napoli etc etc 

I've not even touched on the myriads of other reasons...in a perfect world, maybe...but in this day and age, it's a mental idea, full of hypocrisy.

 

[Harry]

4 minutes ago, spudski said:

Harry...much as I respect you...the sentence that resonates most in your post is...' I haven't necessarily thought it through'...

How on earth can anyone think this is possible and acceptable in this day and age, when you can't drive across Bristol without worrying about being charged or some lunatic is glueing themselves to the road in the name of climate change.

Having a world league with teams and fans travelling vast distanced on a regular basis... really?

It contradicts everything the world leaders and world powers are trying to eradicate.

However...if we are in the Bill Gates theory of if you have money and contribute to trying to help the world...you can do whatever you freaking want...then let's all fill our boots.

Take away that analogy...then you have the domestic supporters to consider...and the policing of cultural differences. Good luck policing Boca Juniors v Napoli etc etc 

I've not even touched on the myriads of other reasons...in a perfect world, maybe...but in this day and age, it's a mental idea, full of hypocrisy.

 

I’d love to see Napoli away to Boca Juniors. Would be brilliant. And then perfectly set up for a tasty return tie! 
I just think if there’s gonna be a super league then why not go whole hog and make it a world league. 
As for the climate argument. Well, there’s probably about 509 flights leaving Europe for South America every day, what difference will a couple more make once every couple of Wednesdays. 
Instead of flying to Eastern Europe in the euro league they’ll just be doing a few hundred miles more. 
 

Anyway, maybe for every flight a footy team has to make we could ensure is offset by our politicians and ‘leaders’ not flying to one of their pointless conferences that solve bugger all except lining their own pockets. 

[exAtyeoMax]

2 hours ago, Bristol Rob said:

 

 

#existentialcrisis

[spudski]

6 minutes ago, Harry said:

I’d love to see Napoli away to Boca Juniors. Would be brilliant. And then perfectly set up for a tasty return tie! 
I just think if there’s gonna be a super league then why not go whole hog and make it a world league. 
As for the climate argument. Well, there’s probably about 509 flights leaving Europe for South America every day, what difference will a couple more make once every couple of Wednesdays. 
Instead of flying to Eastern Europe in the euro league they’ll just be doing a few hundred miles more. 
 

Anyway, maybe for every flight a footy team has to make we could ensure is offset by our politicians and ‘leaders’ not flying to one of their pointless conferences that solve bugger all except lining their own pockets. 

Like I said...in a perfect world...great, but imo it's simply not feasible. 

And yes...the biggest stumbling block is the climate argument. 

You are probably right with your flight example, but in the bigger picture how can we argue that against domestic restrictions? 

It simply goes against everything the agenda is trying to apply. 

All it reinforces is if you have the money, you can carry on regardless, but those with less...obey.

[Rocking Red Cyril]

2 hours ago, Sir Geoff said:

Spooky timing for this to re emerge a day after the white paper was postponed for two weeks.

Yes interesting timing 

[Lrrr]

You’d see the big clubs playing reserve players regularly in the premier league if they had a big game midweek (different to the odd champions league game if they have a minimum of 14 games) and what’s now the benefit of finishing top 4/6 in the prem if you’re not a super league team? 
 

either that or big clubs would just hoover up so many players that they can basically field two different squads 

[Barrs Court Red]

Looks like the EU court has given an early Christmas present to those clubs still trying for a European Superleague. 

[BigTone]

2 minutes ago, Barrs Court Red said:

Looks like the EU court has given an early Christmas present to those clubs still trying for a European Superleague. 

Good news, the sooner they all bugger off then the better as long as it means they are barred from playing in UK football under any circumstances.

[Mr Hankey]

Not sure if this will change much, particularly for the English clubs - it was soon pretty apparent that the driving forces were Barcelona, Juventus & Real Madrid, all of which were massively fooked financially & that is where their drive came from. Madrid seem to have sorted themselves out a bit now but Barca & Juve are still very much in massive trouble.......& lets be honest, Juventus aren't exactly an elite club these days.

[steviestevieneville]

3 minutes ago, Barrs Court Red said:

Looks like the EU court has given an early Christmas present to those clubs still trying for a European Superleague. 

If this rears its head again . You can see the Saudis getting involved to fund it . I’m totally against it . However fifa & uefa are corrupt beyond belief. Infantino is worse than blatter because he’s pretty brazen about it. I really wish the top nations would have the balls to walk away from fifa , but they won’t. The game’s got out of hand . What with this world club cup expansion. There’s no consultation , they just do it. 

[steviestevieneville]

Just now, Mr Hankey said:

Not sure if this will change much, particularly for the English clubs - it was soon pretty apparent that the driving forces were Barcelona, Juventus & Real Madrid, all of which were massively fooked financially & that is where their drive came from. Madrid seem to have sorted themselves out a bit now but Barca & Juve are still very much in massive trouble.......& lets be honest, Juventus aren't exactly an elite club these days.

It will as a lot of them are owned by yanks. They want a closed shop 

[Mr Hankey]

1 minute ago, steviestevieneville said:

It will as a lot of them are owned by yanks. They want a closed shop 

Meh if they go, they go, but i just think due to the massive reaction & protests of the fans last time that they may think twice about it. I often find the most boring matches are when the top teams play each other anyway, these days with the amount of analysis & tactic work they put in to it, they end up cancelling each other out so it's a drab affair.....people would soon get bored of watching that type of football every week.

[Red Skin]

On 09/02/2023 at 11:42, W-S-M Seagull said:

But Real, Barca, PSG, Man City, Bayern etc all get in the Champions league every season anyways. So whats the difference?

And so did Man Utd, but it looks like they won't be this season and maybe for a few more if they don't get their act together.  

It's an unfair meritocracy at present given the finances these clubs enjoy, but at least there is a chance others can break into it. 

[Lrrr]

Need the PL to come out and say any club who wants to compete in the super league will not be welcome to be a member of the PL 

[The Batman]

1 minute ago, Lrrr said:

Need the PL to come out and say any club who wants to compete in the super league will not be welcome to be a member of the PL 

Absolutely but money talks. 

Villa loving it right now if that's the case. 

As for the same clubs being in the CL year after year, Liverpool ain't in it this year, Newcastle were. Earned the right to be there. Not always a given it will be the same clubs year after year. Gone are the mid 2000's where it was Man Utd, Arsenal, Chelsea and Liverpool every season. 

[George Rs]

12 minutes ago, Lrrr said:

Need the PL to come out and say any club who wants to compete in the super league will not be welcome to be a member of the PL 

That’s technically been in the rules since the first attempt to create the ESL, all premier league teams (and new ones who joined since) have signed off. 
 

Unless plans changed, all premier league club owners had to sign a “Owners Charter” and one of the main rules was at no point could they join in an attempt to create a breakaway league. Whether it’ll be enforced once people start flashing money around will be a different story. 

[ExiledAjax]

It's an explosive decision.

It paves the way for the ESL to be formed - but doesn't guarantee that it actually will be formed or that clubs will actually join it.

It's so curious that FIFA and UEFA lost not because the decision to block the ESL was in itself wrong, but because the processes by which they made that decision were not "transparent, objective, non-discriminatory and proportionate". Basically they've got shite governance and that's really done them in.

There probably is some scope for them to change their policies and rules and then make the decision again...but that will take time.

As others have said, there's still scope for the national leagues to say "if you join ESL you're out of the domestic league", but that's a risk. Gambling on the failure of the ESL is going to be punchy... especially with middle eastern money lurking in the corner.

Edited December 21, 2023 by ExiledAjax