Where are all the doubters now??

[Engvall’s Splinter]

7 minutes ago, JoeAman08 said:

Who hasn’t been available? A few have missed some here and there but no one in the side today has missed long term with injury or anything

How many fixtures have that starting eleven been available for? During periods we’ve missed Atkinson, Tanner, Pring, Sykes & Williams for a variety of reasons. I didnt say injured. 

[Davefevs]

28 minutes ago, Engvall’s Splinter said:

Player availability?  

Yep, that is definitely part of it. Circumstances, e.g. Conway getting injured, therefore needing to break up Wells and Conway.  Loads of little things, as well as system change.

People forget we want 8 unbeaten earlier this season, then lost James and Naismith.

I wonder how important the Swansea (h) was in building Zak’s confidence…Rob the guest on BBCRB tonight mentioned this match, he came of age that day with Tanner and Pring as his outside CBs.  Enough to eventually trust him in a back 4?

I think it would be a good question to ask Nige - “what factors drove you to go to a back four”, and get a proper answer back from him.

23 minutes ago, E.G.Red said:

Now get the bus rather than drive due to  the CAZ and 50% increase in on street  parking so have missed Ian on Radio Bristol, or has he been quiet too?

I saw him in Kofi today, so he was definitely at the game.  He certainly hadn’t called in by 5:40 when I got home.

[JoeAman08]

22 minutes ago, Engvall’s Splinter said:

How many fixtures have that starting eleven been available for? During periods we’ve missed Atkinson, Tanner, Pring, Sykes & Williams for a variety of reasons. I didnt say injured. 

So does every side. All those players have been available the majority of not only this season but last. He has had the tools to do this for the last 18 months. It has taken him 17 months to figure it out.

I am not buying the he dropped them and now they are better either. Pring, Atkinson and Tanner were all good last season too when given chances. Sykes playing a more natural forward position is now coming into form. 
 

Imo he has complicated things all season. It takes him half the season to settle on who his best XI is. All I am saying is I am not shouting off the roof he is the best manager we ever had because we had a good month. I do however hope he keeps it going. Happy to be “wrong” about NP but who knows what any manager could have done with 24 months and unlimited patience from the owner. 

 

[Merrick's Marvels]

5 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I saw him in Kofi today, so he was definitely at the game.  He certainly hadn’t called in by 5:40 when I got home.

What???????

You mean he's an actual person?

With a brain. And those opinions?

Jesus wept.

[Merrick's Marvels]

4 minutes ago, JoeAman08 said:

So does every side. All those players have been available the majority of not only this season but last. He has had the tools to do this for the last 18 months. It has taken him 17 months to figure it out.

I am not buying the he dropped them and now they are better either. Pring, Atkinson and Tanner were all good last season too when given chances. Sykes playing a more natural forward position is now coming into form. 
 

Imo he has complicated things all season. It takes him half the season to settle on who his best XI is. All I am saying is I am not shouting off the roof he is the best manager we ever had because we had a good month. I do however hope he keeps it going. Happy to be “wrong” about NP but who knows what any manager could have done with 24 months and unlimited patience from the owner. 

 

Wrong. 

[Engvall’s Splinter]

2 minutes ago, JoeAman08 said:

So does every side. All those players have been available the majority of not only this season but last. He has had the tools to do this for the last 18 months. It has taken him 17 months to figure it out.

I am not buying the he dropped them and now they are better either. Pring, Atkinson and Tanner were all good last season too when given chances. Sykes playing a more natural forward position is now coming into form. 
 

Imo he has complicated things all season. It takes him half the season to settle on who his best XI is. All I am saying is I am not shouting off the roof he is the best manager we ever had because we had a good month. I do however hope he keeps it going. Happy to be “wrong” about NP but who knows what any manager could have done with 24 months and unlimited patience from the owner. 

 

You asked why and I’ve given you answer. We are speaking about City and not other sides. Well aware other teams have similar issues, perhaps not with a side with such youth and inexperience or a squad as wafer thin. 
 

I do chuckle at a few posters who do their utmost to avoid praising Pearson. Ducking and diving looking to find something to lob at him rather than revel in a the positivity we are feeling at the minute. Cringeworthy. 

[REDOXO]

27 minutes ago, JoeAman08 said:

So does every side. All those players have been available the majority of not only this season but last. He has had the tools to do this for the last 18 months. It has taken him 17 months to figure it out.

I am not buying the he dropped them and now they are better either. Pring, Atkinson and Tanner were all good last season too when given chances. Sykes playing a more natural forward position is now coming into form. 
 

Imo he has complicated things all season. It takes him half the season to settle on who his best XI is. All I am saying is I am not shouting off the roof he is the best manager we ever had because we had a good month. I do however hope he keeps it going. Happy to be “wrong” about NP but who knows what any manager could have done with 24 months and unlimited patience from the owner. 

 

Exactly who knows what any manager would do. However what Pearson has done is change the culture of the club by

Getting rid of LJs dross over an extended period 

Bought well out of the lower leagues and spent time developing those players. 
 

Turned Semenyo into a goalscorer (who started that thread) and sold him for up to 12m with add ons

Developed Scott into the best player outside of the premier league

Turned Bell and ConwAy into the best young poachers in the division 

Turned Vyner into player of the season material

Given Wells a new lease of life and a contract and developed Weimann into team captain

Turned OLeary into a number one that’s as good as anything

Put us on a sound financial footing

I could go on and on and on. 
 

But you are right. Who knows what someone else would have done with Johnson/Ashton and Lansdowns FFP train wreck. 
 

What I always find interesting is people saying we had the players to play <enter formation adding up to ten here> obviously we had bodies in the main but you develop systems of play. Thus saying trite shit like I don’t know why we didn’t do XYZ earlier is because those players needed to be developed to play that way. 
 

Which of course will be the answer when anyone actually asks the bloke who’s getting paid 100s of thousands to do the job. 
 

Someone tell me what was the average age of out back four and goalkeeper today. And what was the average age of our team. 

Edited February 11, 2023 by REDOXO

[Kid in the Riot]

51 minutes ago, JoeAman08 said:

Still here. A good month and I am delighted with how we are playing. I just question why it took so long to change formation. Take out all other arguments I always said the squad was better than the results and performances.

Same here. Many of us were questioning why four at the back wouldn't work for months before Nige eventually changed formation. He was adament we didn't have the players to play that formation, but it is evident we do. 

Interesting that I have not seen him quizzed on this by any journalists. I am sure there is an explanation, be interested to know what it is... 

[spudski]

16 minutes ago, JoeAman08 said:

So does every side. All those players have been available the majority of not only this season but last. He has had the tools to do this for the last 18 months. It has taken him 17 months to figure it out.

I am not buying the he dropped them and now they are better either. Pring, Atkinson and Tanner were all good last season too when given chances. Sykes playing a more natural forward position is now coming into form. 
 

Imo he has complicated things all season. It takes him half the season to settle on who his best XI is. All I am saying is I am not shouting off the roof he is the best manager we ever had because we had a good month. I do however hope he keeps it going. Happy to be “wrong” about NP but who knows what any manager could have done with 24 months and unlimited patience from the owner. 

 

 

3 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Same here. Many of us were questioning why four at the back wouldn't work for months before Nige eventually changed formation. He was adament we didn't have the players to play that formation, but it is evident we do. 

Interesting that I have not seen him quizzed on this by any journalists. I am sure there is an explanation, be interested to know what it is... 

When they interviewed Tanner on the radio after the game, he mentioned the change in formation and that the players were more comfortable playing in this system. 

It's pretty much the same players that NP has had available. 

I've said for months, as have others, that we had the players to play with four at the back. 

I feel it maybe something he may have wished he'd tried more often earlier. 

However...we are never fully aware of what's going on behind closed doors etc. 

Hindsight maybe.

[cidercity1987]

When is Nige going to sign a contract extension?

At the moment he's leaving in 14 months

Not for me , I am a total disciple 

[Malago]

7 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Same here. Many of us were questioning why four at the back wouldn't work for months before Nige eventually changed formation. He was adament we didn't have the players to play that formation, but it is evident we do. 

Interesting that I have not seen him quizzed on this by any journalists. I am sure there is an explanation, be interested to know what it is... 

I would have thought the explanation was self evident.  Before he didn’t have faith in Pring, Atkinson etc, now he does.  
Credit all round.

 

[REDOXO]

4 minutes ago, Malago said:

I would have thought the explanation was self evident.  Before he didn’t have faith in Pring, Atkinson etc, now he does.  
Credit all round.

 

In a nutshell see above!

[GrahamC]

Obvious from this thread that at least one poster is always going to look at anything negative to say re NP..

My view on the back four thing is this;

He simply didn’t trust Vyner fully enough earlier this season to go with him as the main man in the middle & let’s be honest, look at today’s back four;

Tanner 20 starts, Pring 35 starts & Atkinson 51 starts at Championship level, that doesn’t exactly scream experience, does it?

Vyner has been exceptional but those saying I would have done this all along with 4 inexperienced defenders & a keeper too are certainly taking a huge leap of faith.

Edited February 11, 2023 by GrahamC

[Engvall’s Splinter]

10 minutes ago, GrahamC said:

Obvious from this thread that at least one poster is always going to look at anything negative to say re NP..

My view on the back four thing is this;

He simply didn’t trust Vyner fully enough earlier this season to go with him as the main man in the middle & let’s be honest, look at today’s back four;

Tanner 20 starts, Pring 35 starts & Atkinson 51 starts at Championship level, that doesn’t exactly scream experience, does it?

Vyner has been exceptional but those saying I would have done this all along with 4 inexperienced defenders & a keeper too are certainly taking a huge leap of faith.

Agreed. There is no way people would’ve suggested todays back four at the beginning / earlier part of the season. The extra centre half was what we all pretty much thought was required, an insurance policy perhaps.. I know I didn’t want Vyner in the back four, let alone playing in a CB pairing. 

Edited February 11, 2023 by Engvall’s Splinter

[Banjo Red]

Eating humble pie but enjoying it.

[eardun]

39 minutes ago, REDOXO said:

Exactly who knows what any manager would do. However what Pearson has done is change the culture of the club by

Getting rid of LJs dross over an extended period 

Bought well out of the lower leagues and spent time developing those players. 
 

Turned Semenyo into a goalscorer (who started that thread) and sold him for up to 12m with add ons

Developed Scott into the best player outside of the premier league

Turned Bell and ConwAy into the best young poachers in the division 

Turned Vyner into player of the season material

Given Wells a new lease of life and a contract and developed Weimann into team captain

Turned OLeary into a number one that’s as good as anything

Put us on a sound financial footing

I could go on and on and on. 
 

But you are right. Who knows what someone else would have done with Johnson/Ashton and Lansdowns FFP train wreck. 
 

What I always find interesting is people saying we had the players to play <enter formation adding up to ten here> obviously we had bodies in the main but you develop systems of play. Thus saying trite shit like I don’t know why we didn’t do XYZ earlier is because those players needed to be developed to play that way. 
 

Which of course will be the answer when anyone actually asks the bloke who’s getting paid 100s of thousands to do the job. 
 

Someone tell me what was the average age of out back four and goalkeeper today. And what was the average age of our team. 

But apart from all of that, what did the Romans (Pearson) ever do for us! 

[aa_bcfc]

Yep I’m/was a doubter. No question about  it though, since he’s realised that we didn’t have any wing backs and he went to a back 4 and started playing players in their natural position things have improved immensely. Well done Nige.

[bpexile]

58 minutes ago, JoeAman08 said:

So does every side. All those players have been available the majority of not only this season but last. He has had the tools to do this for the last 18 months. It has taken him 17 months to figure it out.

I am not buying the he dropped them and now they are better either. Pring, Atkinson and Tanner were all good last season too when given chances. Sykes playing a more natural forward position is now coming into form. 
 

Imo he has complicated things all season. It takes him half the season to settle on who his best XI is. All I am saying is I am not shouting off the roof he is the best manager we ever had because we had a good month. I do however hope he keeps it going. Happy to be “wrong” about NP but who knows what any manager could have done with 24 months and unlimited patience from the owner. 

 

I think it was more the case of getting "the tools" up to speed with how he wanted them to perform. 

After 18 months he has done that & we are reaping the rewards of his ideas & standards .

[REDOXO]

9 minutes ago, eardun said:

But apart from all of that, what did the Romans (Pearson) ever do for us! 

Yes I nearly wrote that myself.  

[Rossi the Robin]

His long term man management of Wells and Pring is nothing short of remarkable. 
It takes a lot of mental strength and character to be able to do that 

[Johnny Musicworks]

Had Nigel played this back four earlier then it could have been a disaster and 1 or 2 of them might have been ‘on the bus’ with the fans blessing.

Vyner and Pring have massively developed throughout this season and both Tanner and Atkinson really only in recent weeks. They have come together at the right time as each has increased their confidence. Who among us ‘football experts’ would have picked this back 4 pre-season with a straight face.  

Luck, timing and circumstance may have been a big part of the change of fortune but it couldn't have happened if Nigel had not over time helped them all slowly and carefully build confidence. ‘Patience’ the missing ingredient at Ashton Gate for so many years has finally paid off. We didn’t need a miracle worker we needed a proven manager who would be given the time to see through the plan. 

[nickolas]

2 hours ago, REDOXO said:

Don’t be an idiot. We’ll need him in the Premier League

Well, that may be the only way to keep him!

[Kid in the Riot]

38 minutes ago, GrahamC said:

Obvious from this thread that at least one poster is always going to look at anything negative to say re NP..

My view on the back four thing is this;

He simply didn’t trust Vyner fully enough earlier this season to go with him as the main man in the middle & let’s be honest, look at today’s back four;

Tanner 20 starts, Pring 35 starts & Atkinson 51 starts at Championship level, that doesn’t exactly scream experience, does it?

Vyner has been exceptional but those saying I would have done this all along with 4 inexperienced defenders & a keeper too are certainly taking a huge leap of faith.

No, I think it's fair comment. I think there's a bit of revisionism going on regards Pring. Plenty of us thought he was more than good enough to start. He'd always performed very solidly when called upon imo. I don't think he's suddenly become brilliant, or experienced, overnight.  In any case JD has demonstrated he's reliable enough on the left? 

Quite a coincidence that Pearson decided to switch to four at the back when we were on a horrible run and he was desperate for a result, don't you think? It's mainly because of that I'd question that the switch was more out of necessity than by design. If experience was his requirement then why wait until we were on a bad run before changing formation and throwing in...inexperienced players.

I don't think Pearson is the most tactically astute manager, his strength is clearly on the psychological side of things. 

[TonyTonyTony]

1 hour ago, JoeAman08 said:

So does every side. All those players have been available the majority of not only this season but last. He has had the tools to do this for the last 18 months. It has taken him 17 months to figure it out.

I am not buying the he dropped them and now they are better either. Pring, Atkinson and Tanner were all good last season too when given chances. Sykes playing a more natural forward position is now coming into form. 
 

Imo he has complicated things all season. It takes him half the season to settle on who his best XI is. All I am saying is I am not shouting off the roof he is the best manager we ever had because we had a good month. I do however hope he keeps it going. Happy to be “wrong” about NP but who knows what any manager could have done with 24 months and unlimited patience from the owner. 

 

What utter drivel

[eardun]

34 minutes ago, Rossi the Robin said:

His long term man management of Wells and Pring is nothing short of remarkable. 
It takes a lot of mental strength and character to be able to do that 

I think Pearson’s patient man management has been great generally. He obviously sees the players day in and day out and decides who to play based on that. I trust his judgment. 

It wasn’t that long ago he was being criticised for not picking Atkinson and giving Atkinson a public kick up the A. Well to my mind, that has worked. 

Vyner looked on his way out and now look at him. Tanner and Pring and have been developed and improved. 

And so on. 

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, JoeAman08 said:

So does every side. All those players have been available the majority of not only this season but last. He has had the tools to do this for the last 18 months. It has taken him 17 months to figure it out.

I am not buying the he dropped them and now they are better either. Pring, Atkinson and Tanner were all good last season too when given chances. Sykes playing a more natural forward position is now coming into form. 
 

Imo he has complicated things all season. It takes him half the season to settle on who his best XI is. All I am saying is I am not shouting off the roof he is the best manager we ever had because we had a good month. I do however hope he keeps it going. Happy to be “wrong” about NP but who knows what any manager could have done with 24 months and unlimited patience from the owner. 

 

I think it’s naive to think that just because players were here that you can just slot them into positions and it works.  It seems clear (to me at least) that Nige has worked heavily on culture and the mental side, and that is a good part of why players like Vyner can now play as a RCB in a back four.  Come on, you only have to see the inconsistent performances and errors in him…even this season (early on).  He’s just one example.  Tanner, are you ignoring his two bad hamstring injuries last season?

I really think you are trying hard tonight to make it so black and white to avoid praising the role Nige has played in the improvement.  It’s like you think change can happen overnight.

I think your post is a poor take on the work he has done.  But that’s your prerogative, as it is to dislike my reply to your post.

1 hour ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Same here. Many of us were questioning why four at the back wouldn't work for months before Nige eventually changed formation. He was adament we didn't have the players to play that formation, but it is evident we do. 

Interesting that I have not seen him quizzed on this by any journalists. I am sure there is an explanation, be interested to know what it is... 

He had players to play a back four is debatable…as above who saw Vyner being able to be a leader on a back two?  The first time I thought he’d shown the responsibility to play / lead there was Swansea (h).  Nobody seems to think about how he might’ve played the other six…especially when Wells and Conway were performing so well.  That necessitated a front two.  There are so many little things that may have caused the reason not to change, and then eventually change.

1 hour ago, GrahamC said:

Obvious from this thread that at least one poster is always going to look at anything negative to say re NP..

My view on the back four thing is this;

He simply didn’t trust Vyner fully enough earlier this season to go with him as the main man in the middle & let’s be honest, look at today’s back four;

Tanner 20 starts, Pring 35 starts & Atkinson 51 starts at Championship level, that doesn’t exactly scream experience, does it?

Vyner has been exceptional but those saying I would have done this all along with 4 inexperienced defenders & a keeper too are certainly taking a huge leap of faith.

Certainly not alongside the introvert Atkinson (his words).  He said he couldn’t even play Rob in the middle of a three.  Don’t get me wrong he’s sometimes gonna say things with a bit of bullshit license too.

[mozo]

7 minutes ago, Percy Pig said:

On the Atkinson point, Kal alluded to Rob finding his voice in commentary on RTV. 

Clearly a noticeable and recent development.

But let's not let that easily accessible information stop people claiming to know more about football than Nigel Pearson. 

:laugh:. 

Atkinson has a trait that the coaching team are working on. To get him performing at this level is evidence of good work.

[JoeAman08]

50 minutes ago, bpexile said:

I think it was more the case of getting "the tools" up to speed with how he wanted them to perform. 

After 18 months he has done that & we are reaping the rewards of his ideas & standards .

Maybe. I don’t really see it that way. Is Pring really that much better in January than he was in October? Atkinson had a great start to the season got dropped and come back at same level. Vyner has shown when he gets a good run in one position he can perform. Finally playing Wells has helped us massively too. 
 

I am not sitting here trying to be overly negative. Just that one month of results hasn’t swayed me that he is all of a sudden a genius. 

3 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I think it’s naive to think that just because players were here that you can just slot them into positions and it works.  It seems clear (to me at least) that Nige has worked heavily on culture and the mental side, and that is a good part of why players like Vyner can now play as a RCB in a back four.  Come on, you only have to see the inconsistent performances and errors in him…even this season (early on).  He’s just one example.  Tanner, are you ignoring his two bad hamstring injuries last season?

I really think you are trying hard tonight to make it so black and white to avoid praising the role Nige has played in the improvement.  It’s like you think change can happen overnight.

I think your post is a poor take on the work he has done.  But that’s your prerogative, as it is to dislike my reply to your post.

He had players to play a back four is debatable…as above who saw Vyner being able to be a leader on a back two?  The first time I thought he’d shown the responsibility to play / lead there was Swansea (h).  Nobody seems to think about how he might’ve played the other six…especially when Wells and Conway were performing so well.  That necessitated a front two.  There are so many little things that may have caused the reason not to change, and then eventually change.

Certainly not alongside the introvert Atkinson (his words).  He said he couldn’t even play Rob in the middle of a three.  Don’t get me wrong he’s sometimes gonna say things with a bit of bullshit license too.

Slot players into positions they have played growing up and during their careers? I have always acknowledged the culture shift under NP. It has always been on a match day that I don’t rate him. I just don’t think there is a way to measure it and I don’t measure as high. Imo the tools have been here to be more consistent in performances. The culture change had been in place for months so why all of a sudden have performances changed? It is putting the right people in the right positions and them gaining confidence. Something that could have been done 15 games ago

[Simple Red]

I was convinced as soon as he kept last season’s team in the Championship. We were a basket case of a club, with promising but naive youngsters and some old hands. We were odds on for relegation, but he kept us up and now we are reaping the rewards. Brilliant manager!

[Guest]

Another one just here who wanted NP gone, I now bow my head and say I WAS WRONG