City v Newport - City v Oxford

[TheReds]

1 hour ago, Alex_BCFC said:

Can’t get particularly optimistic playing these kinds of teams. Worrying for me that we aren’t playing anyone above league 1 level before the start of the season. Not that results against higher opposition mean that much but it’s more to get us to the level required. 

I do like Pearson and I’m hopeful of a top 10 but I do wonder how good our prep will turn out. Hope to be wrong. 

So let's say we play a Championship side, how many of our starting 11 will we play, and for how long? What systems, styles, change in plays will we practice? How physical will the game be up against an actual Championship game? How many of their starting 11 will the opposition start with, or will it be their under 21s etc, how serious will they take it? 

What other teams around us are consistently playing teams at our level or above? If it was the huge majority then I may change my stance, but as it generally isn't then I'll happily assume Pearson and the people in charge of all of these other teams know what they are doing, and what they want to achieve in pre-season friendlies.

I think it is a bit too simplistic to just want to player higher placed teams and expect it to end up being more to our level, and prepare us better for the start of the season. I think we have to trust the ones in charge on this.

[Rossi the Robin]

For a while didn’t we have all of our friendlies away from home and then the last one at AG against higher opposition? 
I can remember attending one against Blackpool (prem then) David Clarkson scoring 

[Jerseybean]

Oxford highlights: https://youtu.be/9mjf1JIE0N4

[Davefevs]

Late Saturday night ramble whilst watching the Who on BBC2.

 

Imho both Knight-Lebel and Araoye have an advantage over Towler…they’ve played CB for as long as I’ve heard their names mentioned, whereas Towler was a midfielder initially.  They have better instincts at this age to me.

I was really impressed the first time I saw Knight-Lebel in the u23s at just 16, old head on young shoulders type.

First time I saw Araoye was the pre-season game v Exeter City when he came on for Idehen (the beginning of the end for him) after 20 mins.  Looked so assured.

It is why I saw the logic of letting Towler move on, and now Low too.  I very much suspect we’d move Idehen on too if we could find him a club.

Both are still 18, babies for CBs, but they don’t play like they’re 18.

And we have Campbell-Slowey behind them, who’s just 17, a full year younger than the other two.

I wouldn’t loan any of them out unless we bring in a senior CB (assume Kalas really has gone).

 

First good look at Leeson in the construct of a first team today too.  Just bloody great habits, solid technique, good receiving angles.  Saw him briefly for Wales u18s a while back (Scott’s England u18 debut iirc), and a few times for u21s.  Getting a lot of sideline coaching, but that’s ok.

**** me, we are developing some great kids.  Never know how far they are gonna go, but there is a great opportunity for them to all have EFL careers.

Those are probably my biggest takes from pre-season, other than our fitness.

 

There is a lot of talk of high press “bollocks”, and last season we probably blocked lanes more than be high pressed, but we look a different beast in pre-season.  Both Swindon and Oxford, showed we learn quickly.  We seem to be playing a staggered midfield three.  James / King at the base.  1st game, Williams a bit ahead of King to the right, Scott further ahead of Williams to the left.  2nd game, Knight for Williams, Weimann for Scott.

It’s obviously much more fluid than this, but something I would like to watch a bit more closely over the next 2 or 3 games.

I think it also might highlight why we are perhaps a bit more of a threat down our left side, with the attacking tendency of Scott especially to drift into the left space.

Knight and Weimann’s energy was hugely noticeable this afternoon, they pressed the **** out of Oxford’s defenders and balls into midfield.  I thought Williams was good first game too.  I still think he’s a good player at this level, might still have to manage his games, but with the others available, that isn’t really an issue.

 

Finally, Scott on corners.  Decent delivery too.

 

Ramble over.

[Davefevs]

13 minutes ago, TheReds said:

So let's say we play a Championship side, how many of our starting 11 will we play, and for how long? What systems, styles, change in plays will we practice? How physical will the game be up against an actual Championship game? How many of their starting 11 will the opposition start with, or will it be their under 21s etc, how serious will they take it? 

What other teams around us are consistently playing teams at our level or above? If it was the huge majority then I may change my stance, but as it generally isn't then I'll happily assume Pearson and the people in charge of all of these other teams know what they are doing, and what they want to achieve in pre-season friendlies.

I think it is a bit too simplistic to just want to player higher placed teams and expect it to end up being more to our level, and prepare us better for the start of the season. I think we have to trust the ones in charge on this.

There seems to be a couple of things we do a bit different to (the majority of) other clubs.

We go on tour…and don’t play games.  Purely fitness and bonding.  No fans either.

We seem to get players playing 90s early(ish) in pre-season.

The double-header facilitates this nicely.  No need for 45:45 or 60:30 min splits, and not knowing how your body will handle the latter stages of the first league game.

[Mr Popodopolous]

I always think one friendly at home vs a good opponent maybe not CL or PL but decent to round off pre-season can be decent. Both from a fans perspective and a peaking before the season perspective.

Otherwise working up and being closed doors seems okay. Some away ones in the upcoming week, assuming these will have fans present.

[liamhealeybcfc96]

1 hour ago, Davefevs said:

Late Saturday night ramble whilst watching the Who on BBC2.

 

Imho both Knight-Lebel and Araoye have an advantage over Towler…they’ve played CB for as long as I’ve heard their names mentioned, whereas Towler was a midfielder initially.  They have better instincts at this age to me.

I was really impressed the first time I saw Knight-Lebel in the u23s at just 16, old head on young shoulders type.

First time I saw Araoye was the pre-season game v Exeter City when he came on for Idehen (the beginning of the end for him) after 20 mins.  Looked so assured.

It is why I saw the logic of letting Towler move on, and now Low too.  I very much suspect we’d move Idehen on too if we could find him a club.

Both are still 18, babies for CBs, but they don’t play like they’re 18.

And we have Campbell-Slowey behind them, who’s just 17, a full year younger than the other two.

I wouldn’t loan any of them out unless we bring in a senior CB (assume Kalas really has gone).

 

First good look at Leeson in the construct of a first team today too.  Just bloody great habits, solid technique, good receiving angles.  Saw him briefly for Wales u18s a while back (Scott’s England u18 debut iirc), and a few times for u21s.  Getting a lot of sideline coaching, but that’s ok.

**** me, we are developing some great kids.  Never know how far they are gonna go, but there is a great opportunity for them to all have EFL careers.

Those are probably my biggest takes from pre-season, other than our fitness.

 

There is a lot of talk of high press “bollocks”, and last season we probably blocked lanes more than be high pressed, but we look a different beast in pre-season.  Both Swindon and Oxford, showed we learn quickly.  We seem to be playing a staggered midfield three.  James / King at the base.  1st game, Williams a bit ahead of King to the right, Scott further ahead of Williams to the left.  2nd game, Knight for Williams, Weimann for Scott.

It’s obviously much more fluid than this, but something I would like to watch a bit more closely over the next 2 or 3 games.

I think it also might highlight why we are perhaps a bit more of a threat down our left side, with the attacking tendency of Scott especially to drift into the left space.

Knight and Weimann’s energy was hugely noticeable this afternoon, they pressed the **** out of Oxford’s defenders and balls into midfield.  I thought Williams was good first game too.  I still think he’s a good player at this level, might still have to manage his games, but with the others available, that isn’t really an issue.

 

Finally, Scott on corners.  Decent delivery too.

 

Ramble over.

Do you think we will bring another centre half or go with younger once until Atkinson is back ? @Davefevs

[Davefevs]

Just now, liamhealeybcfc96 said:

Do you think we will bring another centre half or go with younger once until Atkinson is back ? @Davefevs

Think it will depend on Naismith (maybe McCrorie - not sure why he didn’t play today).  Hopefully Naismith back on Tuesday.

[Johnny Musicworks]

Not having seen any of the games yet it’s good to hear people’s opinions on the likes of Knight-Lebel and Araoye in particular compared with players such as Low and Towler who have been moved on. Is it fair to say that aside from natural skill and physicality it’s maybe more about the ability to play 90 minutes with a consistent intensity. We hear a lot of talk about the high press but it sounds like it’s more about pressing in all areas all the time and some players however skilful just can’t do that. That would fit in more with Tinnions comments a few months back about the qualities our potential targets need to possess. 

[liamhealeybcfc96]

10 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Think it will depend on Naismith (maybe McCrorie - not sure why he didn’t play today).  Hopefully Naismith back on Tuesday.

Yh hopefully Naismith will play some part on Tuesday and maybe start against Portsmouth . If Naismith is fit and available for Preston game I could see him start centre back with Dickie/ Vyner for balance reason  ?

[Davefevs]

12 minutes ago, liamhealeybcfc96 said:

Yh hopefully Naismith will play some part on Tuesday and maybe start against Portsmouth . If Naismith is fit and available for Preston game I could see him start centre back with Dickie/ Vyner for balance reason  ?

Think as it stands, Vyner and Dickie will start purely on the basis they’ve been fit and available so far.

[liamhealeybcfc96]

Didn’t I read dickie looks a bit lost left centre back 

[Davefevs]

10 minutes ago, liamhealeybcfc96 said:

Didn’t I read dickie looks a bit lost left centre back 

You might’ve read it…he looked absolutely fine in both games to me.  Today he made a weak tackle on their goalscorer.  That’s about the only thing I’d pick him up on.

There was some general commentary stuff re right footed players playing left side, but just commentator / co-comms stuff imho.

Edited July 22, 2023 by Davefevs

[liamhealeybcfc96]

6 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

You might’ve read it…he looked absolutely fine in both games to me.  Today he made a weak tackle on their goalscorer.  That’s about the only thing I’d pick him up on.

There was some general commentary stuff re right footed players playing left side, but just commentator / co-comms stuff imho.

Which one of them would u take out when Atkinson comes back ?

[Davefevs]

7 minutes ago, liamhealeybcfc96 said:

Which one of them would u take out when Atkinson comes back ?

Whoever he deserves to, if at all.

#squadgame

[Jerseybean]

Positive stuff +++ here: https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/sport/football/bristol-city-rob-dickie-knight-8622424?utm_source=bristol_live_newsletter&utm_campaign=bcfc_newsletter2&utm_medium=email

[1960maaan]

8 hours ago, Davefevs said:

Think as it stands, Vyner and Dickie will start purely on the basis they’ve been fit and available so far.

2 fully fit CB's , Atkinson out for a few months yet, Naismith carrying a niggle and Kalas situation very quiet. I don't blame Kalas for hanging on and getting his full contract paid up, what I would have done is pushed for a decision on his intensions . We have 4 Fb's who have , or could fill in at CB but I'm not sure that's how we want to start the season. We must be looking for that extra body or we wouldn't be waiting on Kalas. I don't think we are desperate, but with our injury record you would be a little concerned starting the season with just the two fit CB's.
On the other side of the coin, Dickie and Vyner have good appearance records and Naismith is just a niggle. I guess it comes down to Glass half full or half empty.

10 minutes ago, Jerseybean said:

Positive stuff +++ here: https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/sport/football/bristol-city-rob-dickie-knight-8622424?utm_source=bristol_live_newsletter&utm_campaign=bcfc_newsletter2&utm_medium=email

Great article by Piercy , love the quote
"one member of the Oxford staff said as they left the HPC, “you lot were miles ahead of Swansea. In everything”. They had been left impressed."

Yes it's all about fitness, but these "easier" games give you a chance to work on patterns of play, form relationships and partnerships and get Pearsons ideas ingrained into the team, which will be important as the intensity picks up over the next few games. 

[bcfc01]

35 minutes ago, 1960maaan said:

2 fully fit CB's , Atkinson out for a few months yet, Naismith carrying a niggle and Kalas situation very quiet. I don't blame Kalas for hanging on and getting his full contract paid up, what I would have done is pushed for a decision on his intensions . We have 4 Fb's who have , or could fill in at CB but I'm not sure that's how we want to start the season. We must be looking for that extra body or we wouldn't be waiting on Kalas. I don't think we are desperate, but with our injury record you would be a little concerned starting the season with just the two fit CB's.
On the other side of the coin, Dickie and Vyner have good appearance records and Naismith is just a niggle. I guess it comes down to Glass half full or half empty.

Having seen Araoye, I'd have no problem in starting him if necessary.

 

[INCRED]

24 minutes ago, bcfc01 said:

Having seen Araoye, I'd have no problem in starting him if necessary.

 

Been keeping tabs on him for the past 12 months and I know the coaching team rate him very highly and think he could step into the first team if required as he has the physique to cope 

Just experience lacking but he does all the right things well and looked comfortable yesterday but wasn’t really tested 

[mozo]

11 hours ago, TheReds said:

So let's say we play a Championship side, how many of our starting 11 will we play, and for how long? What systems, styles, change in plays will we practice? How physical will the game be up against an actual Championship game? How many of their starting 11 will the opposition start with, or will it be their under 21s etc, how serious will they take it? 

What other teams around us are consistently playing teams at our level or above? If it was the huge majority then I may change my stance, but as it generally isn't then I'll happily assume Pearson and the people in charge of all of these other teams know what they are doing, and what they want to achieve in pre-season friendlies.

I think it is a bit too simplistic to just want to player higher placed teams and expect it to end up being more to our level, and prepare us better for the start of the season. I think we have to trust the ones in charge on this.

Rob Atkinson disagrees with you. He was dismissive of the lack of a challenge in these games and referring to the Swindon game where we played against some of our U23s said something like "Yeah it's not great is it."

He said something along the lines of you learn more from a defeat, and suggested we won't gain much from these games.

[Carey 6]

9 hours ago, Davefevs said:

You might’ve read it…he looked absolutely fine in both games to me.  Today he made a weak tackle on their goalscorer.  That’s about the only thing I’d pick him up on.

There was some general commentary stuff re right footed players playing left side, but just commentator / co-comms stuff imho.

Asked an Oxford player if anyone stood out after the game, seems he was very impressed by RD. 

‘Mehmeti was decent but Dickie probs the best. His passing is class literally starts most attacks’

‘Yeah tbf all the boys at Oxford said him and that Atkinson are best centre halves they’ve seen or played with. But Dickies passing today was a joke.’

Some of the comments I’ve seen on here/Twitter don’t seem to be agreeing with his view though. 

Hopefully Dickie will be as influential as Webster was for us in terms of distribution & bringing the ball out from the back. 

[Col The Ox]

As my name implies I'm an Oxford fan, and have posted here separately regarding our new stadium bid, where a number of you have been very supportive and filled out our County Council's survey. Thanks very much for that, it's much appreciated. If anyone else wants to do it today is the last day before it closes. It's under the thread title Oxford United Help Needed, which is currently on page 3.

 

Anyway, as I'm here I thought I'd give you an OUFC perspective on yesterday's game. It didn't tell us much, as that was very much a reserves, kids, and trialists line up from us, as we played Swansea on Friday night. We fielded pretty much a first team against Swansea, who did the same, and beat them 1-0, although it was more comfortable than the scoreline suggests. They used the game very much as an audition for their first team, in a match situation, to impress their new manager. On the basis of what I saw he clearly wouldn't have been very impressed at all. They only made two or three changes, no bringing the kids on in the second half, and it got a bit niggly, so they must have had a blocking at half time.

 

On the evidence of the two games, you looked far better than Swansea, although our line up has to be taken into consideration. There was probably only one, possibly two, players out there who will be pushing for a first team start, and I'm not even sure about that. We finished the game with seven teenagers on the field I think, and used nine teenagers overall. We normally play a high pressing, passing game, with the keeper as a sweeper keeper, passing out from the back with the keeper needing to be good on the ball. Unfortunately yesterday we had the hapless Simon Eastwood in goal, who will be nowhere near our first team this season, and it showed. He's hopeless with ball at his feet and your lads soon sussed that out and closed him down, leading to him putting defenders under pressure with poor passes to them. I think the Carabao Cup game in a few weeks time will be a better test, but even then it might be that both teams field a bit of a mix and match side?

 

Lastly, it was good to see Sykes and Dickie out there, both good players for us. Sykes in particular, was badly treated by our previous idiot of a manager and he let his contract run down as he was pissed off with how we treated him, so you got the advantage of that. Most OUFC fans criticised our manager's treatment of him. Dickie was great for us, and most of us were surprised that he never pushed on from QPR, as there were rumours of a number of Premier League teams being interested. I think the fact they appointed Gareth Ainsworth as manager worked against Dickie, as he's more of a ball playing CH than an Ainsworth lump it merchant. Shame Atkinson didn't play, as I think he might have the highest ceiling out of them all, and it would have been interesting to see how he has progressed.

 

I think I've rambled on enough, good luck, I think you'll have a good season, and see you for the Carabao Cup game.

[petehinton]

43 minutes ago, mozo said:

Rob Atkinson disagrees with you. He was dismissive of the lack of a challenge in these games and referring to the Swindon game where we played against some of our U23s said something like "Yeah it's not great is it."

He said something along the lines of you learn more from a defeat, and suggested we won't gain much from these games.

I find that pretty impossible to believe, sorry Rob. 
 

I think you can be far superior than the opposition, be a very good side and them be a bad one all together. The first game of last season on Sky, people were saying “Wow Burnley are good, but Huddersfield look awful” so naturally the conclusion, broadly, was that Burnley looked really good because of how bad Huddersfield were/are. Both things can be true. 
 

Pre-season is about getting as fit and together as possible, create competition and minimise the amount of injuries/knocks we go into the season with. Our midfield, full backs, and all forwards have looked so good in all games, that none of us can confidently predict what our starting front 3, midfield 3, or LB/RB will be. I’d say that’s a massive win. 
 

Piercy’s article in BP today articulates perfectly the intricacies of tactics and fluidity between midfield and defence we have clearly worked on in Austria/outside of games. 
 

I’d say we’re definitely gaining from it. What’s the flip side, we play 3 top PL/EU sides in a row, get beaten and everyone’s moaning that we’re going into the season low on confidence? 
 

Maybe we are just beating these teams comfortably with a mix of first team and 23s because we have great depth and have become a really good side?! There’s a fair few champ sides struggling against lesser opposition this summer. 

Edited July 23, 2023 by petehinton

[Mr Popodopolous]

13 hours ago, Rossi the Robin said:

For a while didn’t we have all of our friendlies away from home and then the last one at AG against higher opposition? 
I can remember attending one against Blackpool (prem then) David Clarkson scoring 

We also played Wolves if memory serves in 2009. Maynard scored an impressive goal, a sign of things to come as he scored a host of them in 2009-10.

Ajax as well that pre-season, didn't go so well thst. 4-0 but a bit of a showcase game for sure. Wasn't Suarez playing that evening too?

Edited July 23, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[Mr Popodopolous]

As for pre-season little conflicted. One actual home game would be god, however the level will step up a bit over the next week with away games v Cheltenham and Portsmouth.

Edited July 23, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[Bryans Left Peg]

34 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

We also played Wolves if memory serves in 2009. Maynard scored an impressive goal, a sign of things to come as he scored a host of them in 2009-10.

Ajax as well that pre-season, didn't go so well thst. 4-0 but a bit of a showcase game for sure. Wasn't Suarez playing that evening too?

Suarez scored the 1st IIRC

[bcfc01]

1 hour ago, INCRED said:

Been keeping tabs on him for the past 12 months and I know the coaching team rate him very highly and think he could step into the first team if required as he has the physique to cope 

Just experience lacking but he does all the right things well and looked comfortable yesterday but wasn’t really tested 

I think he's just about there, as you say he's lacking experience - but how do you obtain experience ? 

Reminds me of the first game Caulker played for us at 18 after a season at Yeovil aged 17. You could tell the lad was a natural and I think the same of Araoye. Hopefull he'll get a chance this season.

If only I could pronounce his name..

[BS3City]

1 minute ago, bcfc01 said:

 

If only I could pronounce his name..

Agreed mate. I'm saying -

Arra - Oi - Yay (if that makes sense).

Hopefully not being disrespectful. Looks a great prospect.

[Davefevs]

2 hours ago, 1960maaan said:

We must be looking for that extra body or we wouldn't be waiting on Kalas

I don’t think we are waiting on Kalas.  No insight, just think the ship has sailed.

@Col The Ox we only played half our first team too!!

1 hour ago, petehinton said:

Maybe we are just beating these teams comfortably with a mix of first team and 23s because we have great depth and have become a really good side?! There’s a fair few champ sides struggling against lesser opposition this summer. 

There is most definitely an element of you want a) fitness / minutes and b) to work in shape.  Pre-season is a process to get you ready for the season (not even just PNE).

Was the PSF v Celtic two summers ago where we got hammered 0-0 ().  They had over 70% of the ball, were well ahead of us in PS because of Europe?  We got absolutely zero practice of our patterns that evening.

And as you say not all championship teams are pissing over their lower league opponents.

I don’t worry too much about it, we are building.  Cheltenham and Portsmouth will be the next stage of that build.  Not sure what to make of Exeter this pre-season. 

[Davefevs]

Made me chuckle!