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[A Horse With No Name]

No foreign options then?

[Red & Gold]

Like nearly everyone else, I did not want Nige to leave, and I would have preferred him over nearly everyone on this list. However, I am surprised that John Eustace seems to be the reluctant best fit according to many (and looks like our board too), given our current situation and his current reputation.

 

I understand that he did a commendable job at Birmingham under difficult circumstances. The club was on a downward trajectory, and there is no doubt that managed to add stability and start to turn them around. He did a decent job, and this year they appeared promising after having a bit more to spend. Clearly, he should not have been sacked considering the start they had and the declining performance since Ronney took over, has only seems to have further improved his reputation.

 

However, he is relatively inexperienced and hasn't achieved much in his managerial career to rank him above so many on this list, in my opinion (which is just one perspective). In his 63 matches at Birmingham, he averaged 1.24 points per game (Nige was at 1.20 at City for comparison), which, over a season, would average out to 57 points and a 16th place finish based on last year's league point scores. It's decent considering where Birmingham started, but it isn't particularly exciting.

 

I just feel that we  need to exercise caution when making appointments solely because someone is the 'flavour of the month.' It's not too dissimilar to when the footballing world felt SOD was unfairly sacked at Nottingham Forest, which made him a more reputable appointment for us at the time (although, to be fair, he had a track record with promotions at Doncaster and Bournemouth in League 1).

 

In comparison to Eustace, someone like Chris Wilder won four trophies at Alfreton Town, achieved promotions at Oxford, Northampton, and (two at) Sheffield United. Personally, Wilder would be my top choice from that list, not least because he is a 'coach' who plays exciting, attacking football and has a record of overachieving with teams. I think he would come here and has a point to prove after Boro (often when a manager is at their best). However, I mention him more to illustrate that we shouldn't dismiss someone because of one recent poor job has harmed their reputation, considering their entire career (just as we shouldn't overrate someone based on one good spell).

 

I've had the opportunity to meet with the Argyle chairman several times. He is a great example of running a club within its means while still pushing it forward. They operate within a highly statistical and data-driven model. He once mentioned to me that, generally speaking, final table rankings tend to correlate with money spent on wages (excluding a few outliers). Therefore, considering our current financial model under FFP in comparison to teams with parachute payments, we are likely to finish between 14th and 7th most years. So, appointing your typical Championship manager (Rowett, Jones, Ainsworth, etc.) is most likely to result in us finishing within this range (as we have with NP). It raises the question again of why change?

 

Our wage budget and spending won't change significantly in a league with so many financial powerhouses, therefore unless we adopt a different approach that sets us apart nothing will change much. So if we do want to push try and find a way to go up we need to try and find a way in which our method becomes an outliner.  Looking at past examples, this could mean appointing a foreign coach with a different tactical methodology (e.g., the German model that achieved promotions at Huddersfield and Norwich, which was quite novel a few years back, and Martinez when he was at Swansea). Alternatively, a different analytical approach to recruitment (e.g., Brentford, Brighton, and Plymouth in League 1) might be the way forward. Lastly, we could seek – and hope to be lucky enough to find the next cutting-edge young coach (e.g., Rodgers at Swansea). I may be oversimplifying, and for every one of these success stories, there are two that fail (I guess in our case Mciness), but I believe we need an appointment that excites and thinking outside the box may be what we need. Perhaps finding a talented assistant/coach who has worked under the likes of Guardiola, Arteta, Klopp, or an overseas manager whose analytics demonstrate a tactical approach that outperforms expectations, or, if we opt for a young British coach, we shouldn't go for the cheap option but go all out for a Schumacher type.

 

But, as I said at the start, I saw no reason to remove Nigel Pearson, and it feels unjust given the context and what he has done. I think it’s this annoyance, and seeing our past choices when recruiting managers (e.g. LJ, Holden and et al) that has compelled me to write this post as you just sense we won’t go into this with too much thought beyond, they interviewed well.

[Keep the Faith]

Don’t get the anti Rowett stuff. He looks a decent option to me. Complaints about playing style seem slightly odd as Pearson didn’t exactly deliver earth shatteringly good football or results at home and I say that as someone who has no issue with him.

[Red-Robbo]

5 minutes ago, Keep the Faith said:

Don’t get the anti Rowett stuff. He looks a decent option to me. Complaints about playing style seem slightly odd as Pearson didn’t exactly deliver earth shatteringly good football or results at home and I say that as someone who has no issue with him.

You can see Rowett being on Lansdown's radar as he has worked with a tight budget and moulds a team who are tough to bear from limited resources. 

Thing is, so did Peatson, and he offered more.

(And that's before we get to the unfairness of the sacking and the appalling waste of money of paying 7 months of a contract off)

Edited October 30, 2023 by Red-Robbo

[Kingswood Robin]

9 minutes ago, Keep the Faith said:

Don’t get the anti Rowett stuff. He looks a decent option to me. Complaints about playing style seem slightly odd as Pearson didn’t exactly deliver earth shatteringly good football or results at home and I say that as someone who has no issue with him.

I don't want him anywhere near here as I remember how awful games against Birmingham were while he was in charge. Players apparently injured off the pitch, running to the halfway line then collapsing in a heap again, keepers taking five minutes to work out which side of the box to take a goal kick.

I'll quite easily find something else better to do than be subjected to that.

[Nuno Gomes]

1 hour ago, bcfc01 said:

It has to be politically correct.

He is the token nutter.

I don’t think you can say nutter!

[Scrumpty]

17 minutes ago, Winterstoke toad said:

That’s like any manager though mate . Until we get to the prem(Big ask) we will always have the possibility of managers being poached .

Agreed, but the risk increases if we opt for someone above our station, which Potter is. I can see him managing Bournemouth before the season’s over.

[bcfc01]

Just now, Nuno Gomes said:

I don’t think you can say nutter!

Nutter, nutter, nutter.

 

[RoystonFoote'snephew]

We need to stay up. Warnock it is then. 

[steveybadger]

1 hour ago, Gillies Downs Leeds said:

Same old names on that list!!

Aren’t they just. There is a huge lack of imagination in football really. 
 

NP shouldn’t have gone but as he has I’d prefer someone a bit more left field (from abroad?) to see if it can give us an edge, especially given the squad is already quite stable. Trouble is you wouldn’t trust the ownership to have the knowledge to select correctly.

Wonder if Benny fancies another stab

[MelksRed]

12 minutes ago, RoystonFoote'snephew said:

We need to stay up. Warnock it is then. 

Warnock would turn AG into a fortress, ruin any sense of free flowing play and pi55 me off weekly.

Knowing our luck, the bloke we've hated for so long would be the bloke that got us to the playoffs. 

[JoeAman08]

40 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

No foreign options then?

Yea my first thought is none of those really. Obviously would have Potter but not realistic. Like to see us expand our search outside of the country

[Ian M]

We don't have any strategic advantages over other clubs at this level (eg larger budgets or exceptional recruitment strategy) to allow a run-of-the-mill Championship manager to succeed here so all the managers linked with us so far fill me with apathy. The appointment of Pearson's replacement needs to bring that X-Factor if we are going to stand a chance of achieving the Lansdowns' stated goal of promotion, so that means scouring the globe for a manager with as yet un-heralded tactics or coaching methods and backing ourselves to make that call. Someone like a Will Still before he took Reims to 5th in Ligue 1 or a DeZerbi clone. Without that (or increased budget or overhauled recruitment department), we have a ceiling of mediocrity.

[maxjak]

2 hours ago, FNQ said:

Wouldn’t be Tinnions first choice.. 

Swansea 7 Bristol City 1  ?    Trundle scored 2...............Bit mean, i know   

Beale for me at 18/1

Edited October 30, 2023 by maxjak

[Red-Robbo]

52 minutes ago, Nuno Gomes said:

I don’t think you can say nutter!

Barton is "differently moralled" 

[Cityboy1954]

2 hours ago, fisherrich said:

When you compare that list with Nigel Pearson - WTF is this football club doing?

Going backwards mate who are these names gonna attract ffs

[And Its Smith]

2 hours ago, Gillies Downs Leeds said:

What odds can you get on Luke Williams ?

I asked sky bet for a price and have so far been ignored. I asked last night 

[maxjak]

1 hour ago, Red & Gold said:

Like nearly everyone else, I did not want Nige to leave, and I would have preferred him over nearly everyone on this list. However, I am surprised that John Eustace seems to be the reluctant best fit according to many (and looks like our board too), given our current situation and his current reputation.

 

I understand that he did a commendable job at Birmingham under difficult circumstances. The club was on a downward trajectory, and there is no doubt that managed to add stability and start to turn them around. He did a decent job, and this year they appeared promising after having a bit more to spend. Clearly, he should not have been sacked considering the start they had and the declining performance since Ronney took over, has only seems to have further improved his reputation.

 

However, he is relatively inexperienced and hasn't achieved much in his managerial career to rank him above so many on this list, in my opinion (which is just one perspective). In his 63 matches at Birmingham, he averaged 1.24 points per game (Nige was at 1.20 at City for comparison), which, over a season, would average out to 57 points and a 16th place finish based on last year's league point scores. It's decent considering where Birmingham started, but it isn't particularly exciting.

 

I just feel that we  need to exercise caution when making appointments solely because someone is the 'flavour of the month.' It's not too dissimilar to when the footballing world felt SOD was unfairly sacked at Nottingham Forest, which made him a more reputable appointment for us at the time (although, to be fair, he had a track record with promotions at Doncaster and Bournemouth in League 1).

 

In comparison to Eustace, someone like Chris Wilder won four trophies at Alfreton Town, achieved promotions at Oxford, Northampton, and (two at) Sheffield United. Personally, Wilder would be my top choice from that list, not least because he is a 'coach' who plays exciting, attacking football and has a record of overachieving with teams. I think he would come here and has a point to prove after Boro (often when a manager is at their best). However, I mention him more to illustrate that we shouldn't dismiss someone because of one recent poor job has harmed their reputation, considering their entire career (just as we shouldn't overrate someone based on one good spell).

 

I've had the opportunity to meet with the Argyle chairman several times. He is a great example of running a club within its means while still pushing it forward. They operate within a highly statistical and data-driven model. He once mentioned to me that, generally speaking, final table rankings tend to correlate with money spent on wages (excluding a few outliers). Therefore, considering our current financial model under FFP in comparison to teams with parachute payments, we are likely to finish between 14th and 7th most years. So, appointing your typical Championship manager (Rowett, Jones, Ainsworth, etc.) is most likely to result in us finishing within this range (as we have with NP). It raises the question again of why change?

 

Our wage budget and spending won't change significantly in a league with so many financial powerhouses, therefore unless we adopt a different approach that sets us apart nothing will change much. So if we do want to push try and find a way to go up we need to try and find a way in which our method becomes an outliner.  Looking at past examples, this could mean appointing a foreign coach with a different tactical methodology (e.g., the German model that achieved promotions at Huddersfield and Norwich, which was quite novel a few years back, and Martinez when he was at Swansea). Alternatively, a different analytical approach to recruitment (e.g., Brentford, Brighton, and Plymouth in League 1) might be the way forward. Lastly, we could seek – and hope to be lucky enough to find the next cutting-edge young coach (e.g., Rodgers at Swansea). I may be oversimplifying, and for every one of these success stories, there are two that fail (I guess in our case Mciness), but I believe we need an appointment that excites and thinking outside the box may be what we need. Perhaps finding a talented assistant/coach who has worked under the likes of Guardiola, Arteta, Klopp, or an overseas manager whose analytics demonstrate a tactical approach that outperforms expectations, or, if we opt for a young British coach, we shouldn't go for the cheap option but go all out for a Schumacher type.

 

But, as I said at the start, I saw no reason to remove Nigel Pearson, and it feels unjust given the context and what he has done. I think it’s this annoyance, and seeing our past choices when recruiting managers (e.g. LJ, Holden and et al) that has compelled me to write this post as you just sense we won’t go into this with too much thought beyond, they interviewed well.

Am i correct in thinking that recruiting a Number 2 from relatively successful teams has   proven   to be a successful route for some clubs,?  Such as Farke, Mckenna and Rohl, who has just been recruited at Sheff W. and of course an extreme example in Arteta, It just seems a smart way to go, namely appointing a Number 2 who has learnt his trade under a quality manager, and is looking to fullfil his own ambitions?  Just a thought, but probably too far out and left field for Lansdown!? ................who would prefer someone cheap and subservient..........Ha!

[Kid in the Riot]

1 minute ago, maxjak said:

Am i correct in thinking that recruiting a Number 2 from relatively successful teams has   proven   to be a successful route for some clubs,?  Such as Farke, Mckenna and Rohl, who has just been recruited at Sheff W. and of course an extreme example in Arteta, It just seems a smart way to go, namely appointing a Number 2 who has learnt his trade under a quality manager, and is looking to fullfil his own ambitions?  Just a thought, but probably too far out and left field for Lansdown!? ................who would prefer someone cheap and subservient..........Ha!

Maresca at Leeds too.

[marmite]

3 hours ago, Elmore James said:

How is Barton on that list? 

He's on the list because that's how low the club is sinking to under the Lansdowns reign. 

[bartolona]

2 hours ago, A Horse With No Name said:

No foreign options then?

Nathan Jones

[Red Army 75]

When the fan base want a manager gone, the excitement for the new manager begins and the list looks attractive. Sack the manager who the majority wanted to stay, the list looks very uninspiring. Wish the new man all the best but it’s all a bit meh. 

[bcfc01]

3 hours ago, Gillies Downs Leeds said:

What odds can you get on Luke Williams ?

I'm guessing he fits with the type they may be looking for, but they'd have to pay compo to Notts County. On the flip side, he wouldn't have the same level of salary as some of the names in the pot.

[shelts]

3 hours ago, FNQ said:

Probably worth a tenner on Curtis Fleming.. . He’s a nice guy, will do as he’s told and gets on well with the players… oh, and he won’t cost much.

Still can’t understand why he wasn’t sacked

[Harry R]

1 minute ago, shelts said:

Still can’t understand why he wasn’t sacked

Leave him in place to take training, then sack him when the new man is appointed.

If he resigns, no payout, so he stays waiting to be sacked.

Is my guess.

[shelts]

4 minutes ago, Harry R said:

Leave him in place to take training, then sack him when the new man is appointed.

If he resigns, no payout, so he stays waiting to be sacked.

Is my guess.

Makes sense . He was part of the problem!

[CliftonCliff]

2 minutes ago, Harry R said:

Leave him in place to take training, then sack him when the new man is appointed.

If he resigns, no payout, so he stays waiting to be sacked.

Is my guess.

I should probably know this, as it presumably must have been spelled out somewhere, but I’m still unclear as to whether all the personnel who have gone were dismissed, or if some chose to leave in the wake of Pearson’s sacking. Can anyone enlighten me?

[The Coach]

5 minutes ago, shelts said:

Makes sense . He was part of the problem!

And what problem is that?

[Merrick's Marvels]

16 minutes ago, shelts said:

Still can’t understand why he wasn’t sacked

We need someone to take training, mate! And field those tricky questions from the Evening Post before Saturday's game. 

He'll be gone as soon the owner finds his new patsy.

Edit - answered already above!

Edited October 30, 2023 by Merrick's Marvels

[Antman]

3 hours ago, red kev said:

Andy king? Cheap easy option!

sadly i don't see King staying, too closely associated with Nige.

 

i have a really bad feeling re Nathan Jones - please god no. - but the luton link scares me, as SL has them as his current bedroom poster wannabee wet dream team.