Southampton away match thread

[Edgy Red]

2 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

I don't want to keep dragging the past up cos we are where we are now. 

The expectation was that we were not embarking on another 3 year project and instead made the change to immediately improve. 

At the moment the early signs are that we have gone backwards. Whilst we could go forwards in the future, based on his 1st 3 games surely you can understand that that there are concerns? 

I think it's clear that we disagree. I have said a number of times before that i liked Nige, but i never saw a progression in the way we played over his 3 years. I fully appreciate that he worked under restrictions but the modern game is all about posession and i was never convinced that we were going to move forward under him.

Time will tell if Manning will do any better, but lets all get behind him and support the team.

[Mr Popodopolous]

3 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

We are the epitome of mid table and our data absolutely hammers it home…….but we have the worlds top badge designer and a bloke who can’t even spell his own job correctly who beg to differ.

I tend to agree midtable, think maybe push at top 10 with less injuries ie 10th but..again where would Ipswich be if they traded places with us injury wise. Or a range of sides.

3 minutes ago, Edgy Red said:

I think it's clear that we disagree. I have said a number of times before that i liked Nige, but i never saw a progression in the way we played over his 3 years. I fully appreciate that he worked under restrictions but the modern game is all about posession and i was never convinced that we were going to move forward under him.

Time will tell if Manning will do any better, but lets all get behind him and support the team.

Can't agree. The side had multiple tactical phases under NP.

I won't list them but if you can't see the evolution then.

Edited November 29, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[The Original OTIB]

Just now, Mr Popodopolous said:

I tend to agree midtable, think maybe push at top 10 with less injuries ie 10th but..again where would Ipswich be if they traded places with us injury wise. Or a range of sides.

Or where when their manager leaves. Palace of even Burnley could lure. Other suitors too, I'd wager.

[The Journalist]

10 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Injuries? Could push us a bit further with less.

Had Conway taken that chance..

Yeah, I get that - I didn’t really mean it to sound as negative as it did.

I really like the squad, I like how hard they work, I like the way they try to play. I liked us under Pearson and I suspect I’ll like us under Manning.

But we really lack that extra bit of quality, particularly in the middle. We get punchy at times when we get some momentum behind us, but we struggle to really control a game. Southampton are clearly much better than us, which is fine, but my word do we give the ball away a lot.

Anyway, all fine. I’m not the one expecting us to be better than mid-table.

[bbew]

I'm still trying to work out what James was doing for the goal.  You could have driven the team bus through in the space he let him have to get the shot in.  Fantastic finish though.

Edited November 29, 2023 by bbew

[Chivs]

9 minutes ago, lenred said:

Yes.  Top 6 no?  Completely agree with your second para but that is what we were told.  That’s the reason they got rid of Nige.   Personally I’m pretty sure I said I’d be happy and expect 10th as a minimum this season before it started when lots were getting dizzy about top 6.   That still stands. But that’s not good enough for our esteemed leadership it seems. 

With Pearson in charge, I forecast around 14. I'll stick with that but we may make top 10 with Manning. Fingers crossed.

[Galley is our king]

19 minutes ago, Edgy Red said:

Manning has had THREE games. Give him a chance and lets see how things pan out. If in 3 years time we are still an average Champ team then he will have done no better or worse than the previous manager

Sorry that's rubbish.

Manning doesn't have to get rid of players, slash the wage bill, etc.

And let's not forget, it was Pearson who selected, trained, coached and motivated the academy lads to the point that our club was top of the top 2 divisions for playing home grown players.

Manning has a much easier start actually inheriting a top 6 squad....

.....that's right isn't it?

[Kid in the Riot]

19 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Maybe it would seem a little better if you used some of the excuses you used to use under Nige:

We've got loads of injuries

Can't even name a full bench

Haven't spent any of the Scott money on new players

Squad too small

Opposition have parachute payments

Opposition have former England players

We're playing a bunch of kids 

No CEO

Board is incompetent 

Etc

Manning is still working under all of the above constraints.

Hope this helps. 

Hello @W-S-M Seagull don't run 

[Edgy Red]

3 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

I tend to agree midtable, think maybe push at top 10 with less injuries ie 10th but..again where would Ipswich be if they traded places with us injury wise. Or a range of sides.

Can't agree. The side had multiple tactical phases under NP.

I won't list them but if you can't see the evolution then.

Thats fine, i completely understand that we all have different opinions.

I just think Manning deserves a fair chance to prove himself and a few transfer windows to recruit some players.

It may work, or it may not, but lets all support our team regardless

[Street red]

1 hour ago, Super said:

Naismith injured again.

Rennie's fault...

[sh1t_ref_again]

Think losing Pring had a big impact and having to reshuffle so much with players out of position. Will be interesting if we go back to a back 4 on Saturday 

[Mr Popodopolous]

20 minutes ago, Edgy Red said:

Thats fine, i completely understand that we all have different opinions.

I just think Manning deserves a fair chance to prove himself and a few transfer windows to recruit some players.

It may work, or it may not, but lets all support our team regardless

Agreed, we all have different views.

This wasn't the remit, this isn't the remit. A solid middling base shouldn't need ripping up and starting again, some changes to make us stronger sure but a few windows??

Edited November 29, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[Sleepy1968]

38 minutes ago, GlastonburyRed said:

Something about my aunt and testicles...

I hate to be the one to break it to you ...

[johnbytheriver]

Playing well in one half ain't good enough,same old story!

[SomeRandomBristolian]

On my way back from Southampton, I thought we had a fairy decent first half, and the second half the quality of Southampton came through. They have a lot of Premier league experience and are a decent side and I expect will be up in the playoffs at the end of the season.

Teams have gone to St Mary's and performed worse than we did. 

Its early days only 3 games since Liam Manning took over. 

Onwards and upwards. COYR!! 

[Chivs]

13 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

When every metric you can imagine plus your own eyes tell you that we are a mid table side…..guess what?

I thought someone on here said that we are second best for goals conceded?? I might have imagined that though.

It's just a shame we have either a sulking 12 year old, or an old baby giraffe, playing up front. Neither of whom look like scoring at the moment.

[Kibs]

18 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

At the moment the early signs are that we have gone backwards. Whilst we could go forwards in the future, based on his 1st 3 games surely you can understand that that there are concerns? 

How the hell have you arrived at that conclusion?

Even if you were stupid enough to form a judgement over 3 games, 1 of which LM had just arrived, 1 of which was against one of the form teams in the division and the other was away at a team 4th in the table, and expected to go straight back up……We gained 4 points over 3 games which is 61 points over a season…..more than we’ve ever achieved under NP I believe, and more than he was on target to get this season!!!!

But of course you don’t have an agenda

I feel bit sad for you tbh, if you were genuinely expecting us to mount a top 6 challenge because you believe the crap we were fed from BT/JL, I can’t help but feel you’re going to be very disappointed!!! 

Edited November 29, 2023 by Kibs

[stortfordred]

14 minutes ago, Edgy Red said:

I think it's clear that we disagree. I have said a number of times before that i liked Nige, but i never saw a progression in the way we played over his 3 years. I fully appreciate that he worked under restrictions but the modern game is all about posession and i was never convinced that we were going to move forward under him.

Time will tell if Manning will do any better, but lets all get behind him and support the team.

Trouble is we haven’t got the players to really nail a possession game. Not enough technical players who can play on the half turn. Play a game that’s not suited to your players and you’ll get found out by the top teams. Coaching can go some way to improving things but you need raw talent. NP was experienced enough to cut his coat according to his cloth. Problem is his signings are either not good enough or are injured. Manning has an odd mixture of veterans, youngsters and journeymen. No real real quality cos it’s all gone to the south coast. 

Edited November 29, 2023 by stortfordred

[lenred]

3 minutes ago, Chivs said:

With Pearson in charge, I forecast around 14. I'll stick with that but we may make top 10 with Manning. Fingers crossed.

Even as a ‘Pearson Lover’ I expected and demanded there be improvement this year - for me it really was the year to turn those hard couple of years of graft into fruition so 10th or above was my realistic goal I’m sure (maybe you can check for me @Marina's Rolls Royce next time your looking through my posts for me ) On that basis I’ll be pretty cheesed off with anything less but anything above 14th would be progress I guess. 

[Mr Popodopolous]

2 minutes ago, stortfordred said:

Trouble is we haven’t got the players to really nail a possession game. Not enough technical players who can play on the half turn. Play a game that’s not suited to your players and you’ll get found out by the top teams. Coaching can go some way to improving things but you need raw talent. NP was experienced enough to cut his cost according to his cloth. Problem is his signings are either not good enough or are injured. Manning has an odd mixture of veterans, youngsters and journeymen. No real real quality cos it’s all gone to the south coast. 

Nor sure who drops out but was thinking that a hypothetical midfield 3 including Naismith and Scott would have looked very different in this respect.

I was thinking it, and then I woke up! Naismith as part of a CM 3 though I do think would add a bit of craft, his range of passing is strong.

Edited November 29, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[Top Robin]

19 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

I don't want to keep dragging the past up cos we are where we are now. 

The expectation was that we were not embarking on another 3 year project and instead made the change to immediately improve. 

At the moment the early signs are that we have gone backwards. Whilst we could go forwards in the future, based on his 1st 3 games surely you can understand that that there are concerns? 

I thought the first half performance was excellent away at an ex Prem team.

We should have been 2-0 up at ht if we had a decent striker. 

Yes second half was disappointing but Max didn't really have much to do apart from pick the ball out of the net from a quality strike.

Definitely some positive signs.

[W-S-M Seagull]

3 minutes ago, Kibs said:

How the hell have you arrived at that conclusion?

Even if you were stupid enough to form a judgement over 3 games, 1 of which LM had just arrived, 1 of which was against one of the form teams in the division and the other was away at a team 4th in the table, and expected to go straight back up……We gained 4 points over 3 games which is 61 points over a season…..more than we’ve ever achieved under NP I believe, and more than he was on target to get this season!!!!

But of course you don’t have an agenda

Why do you keep mentioning Nige? Talking of agendas....

We are where we are. 

Shall we close this forum down until Liam has been here for let's say 20 games? And then maybe you'll find it acceptable for people to comment on performances? 

[Edgy Red]

1 minute ago, stortfordred said:

Trouble is we haven’t got the players to really nail a possession game. Not enough technical players who can play on the half turn. Play a game that’s not suited to your players and you’ll get found out by the top teams. Coaching can go some way to improving things but you need raw talent. NP was experienced enough to cut his cost according to his cloth. Problem is his signings are either not good enough or are injured. Manning has an odd mixture of veterans, youngsters and journeymen. No real real quality cos it’s all gone to the south coast. 

I completely agree, but he needs time to adjust the team to his style of play. He will need to add a few new faces to the group.

Look at what Kompany did at Burnley last summer. He turned a team that had been drilled in to playing direct for 6 years, in to a passing, offensive side. 

Lets give Manning a chance. It may work, it may not, but lets support him

[Mr Popodopolous]

4 minutes ago, Edgy Red said:

I completely agree, but he needs time to adjust the team to his style of play. He will need to add a few new faces to the group.

Look at what Kompany did at Burnley last summer. He turned a team that had been drilled in to playing direct for 6 years, in to a passing, offensive side. 

Lets give Manning a chance. It may work, it may not, but lets support him

Kompany also kept a number of PL players, could reinvest a good portion oh and Parachute Payments. Apples and Oranges.

Oh we need to give Manning a chance absolutely but it isn't a brilliant comparison.

Edited November 29, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[Kibs]

4 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Why do you keep mentioning Nige? Talking of agendas....

We are where we are. 

Shall we close this forum down until Liam has been here for let's say 20 games? And then maybe you'll find it acceptable for people to comment on performances? 

Because you stated “The early signs are we have gone backwards”….is that not referring to the arrival of LM and/or departure of NP? 

Or is there some other major event that I missed? Apologies if there is. 

Edited November 29, 2023 by Kibs

[W-S-M Seagull]

1 minute ago, Edgy Red said:

I completely agree, but he needs time to adjust the team to his style of play. He will need to add a few new faces to the group.

Look at what Kompany did at Burnley last summer. He turned a team that had been drilled in to playing direct for 6 years, in to a passing, offensive side. 

Lets give Manning a chance. It may work, it may not, but lets support him

Can you not understand that when the board said things like "We've made this decision because we think we have a top 6 squad so have made this decision to give the new head coach the best possible chance of promotion this season" that raises expectations and raises the bar.

There was nothing about, its going to take time, we need to bring in new players. It was briefed that the new head coach would be expected to work with what he's got and to get them out performing their ability. 

Everyone on here supports him and hopes he is a success here. 

[Sleepy1968]

17 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Hello @W-S-M Seagull don't run 

Give him a chance, he's been distracted by someone eating chips on the seafront.

[W-S-M Seagull]

Just now, Kibs said:

You said we’d gone backwards….is that not referring to the arrival of LM and/or departure of NP? 

Or is there some other major event that I missed? Apologies if there is. 

No, it's a general observation that at this moment in time, we have gone backwards with our performances. 

If Nige was still here and we put in these same performances, I'd be saying the same. 

[Sleepy1968]

15 minutes ago, johnbytheriver said:

Playing well in one half ain't good enough,same old story!

I think if the two halves were swapped around, we'd all be saying we were robbed/unlucky. Despite reverting to type in the second half, we still had two or three decent opening and should have at least drawn a save from the keeper.

My main takeaway is that the players aren't confident enough in their own ability (and maybe just not good enough - in this game anyway) to carry out the coaches instruction for the entire game.

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, IAmNick said:

In other news does anyone else think Nahki is really great on the co commentary? Really insightful and confident to chat away. Would happily have him on more often (although even better if he's on the pitch ofc).

Very astute, said so on the Forwards thread.

I like the commentator (Rob Duffell?) too, knows when to talk, when to keep quiet, doesn’t gush over City.  And I think it’s good having two co-commentators (Nahki and Chris Honor).