Liam Pre Rotherham

[Kid in the Riot]

2 minutes ago, Unan said:

No need. Most of us could get through a Pearson presser without falling asleep.

Ah, of course. 

[RollsRoyce]

2 hours ago, eardun said:

I particularly liked the bit where he said that we can talk about being ambitious (which is why he joined us) but we have to show that in terms of our actions re the squad in the summer. Over to you SL. 

Well has nobody told him he has to create at least a £10M transfer profit each season, and still make a push for the play offs? Was it not mentioned at the interview? 

[Silvio Dante]

5 hours ago, Kid in the Riot said:

@Silvio Dante did you do these for all of Nige's pressers? I can't recall. 

Nope. Can’t recall the first one of Liams I did but as @1960maaan said, it seems to be appreciated so I’ll keep doing them if I have time.

Its been interesting both because you can see that a change in demeanour leads to better answers (I don’t think there was a Pearson change in demeanour against results that was as clear) and because Piercys bit is always good value (I tend to want the RB bit to be done so I can get to him). 
 

Title of thread is pretty clear so if it’s not something people are interested in they can always skip past

[Simon bristol]

7 hours ago, Davefevs said:

That is clear.

Do you see any correlation with twine signing and conway being more interested in extending his contract?

[Major Isewater]

9 hours ago, Superjack said:

"We need to take the emotion out of it"

Now apparently we didn't listen. 

Same as the players don't listen when we have lost. 

Bullshit, bullshit, bullshit. 

I really want to have some belief in this guy, because I don't have any modicum of belief in anyone above him. 

But all I see and hear is a blagger. 

 

 

He is desperate for approval like LJ was . It can be tiresome, I prefer the football to do their promotion. 

[redsquirrel]

9 hours ago, Silvio Dante said:

Ummm….its a public forum where you don’t need a membership to view? 
 

I know Liams denied being on social media before but I’ll be damned sure that the club (and we’ve seen posters here from the club) are tasked with trawling social media to gauge the fanbase - that’s not a bad thing, it’s sensible management. It follows that they’d then brief the manager/head coach.

This isn’t the masons.

great OP Silvo, thankyou. with regard to them knowing what's being suggested on here at times also gets across by people like myself who walk up to them and ask if there is any truth in rumours etc,  doesn't happen that often but used to have some great chats with Joe Bryan up the village. Nige was very accommodating too. Liam Manning  must bump into people at times, would be a bit odd if he didn't . wouldn't mind betting one or two people on here know him outside of ashton gate or the hpc.

[richwwtk]

1 hour ago, Silvio Dante said:

Nope. Can’t recall the first one of Liams I did but as @1960maaan said, it seems to be appreciated so I’ll keep doing them if I have time.

Its been interesting both because you can see that a change in demeanour leads to better answers (I don’t think there was a Pearson change in demeanour against results that was as clear) and because Piercys bit is always good value (I tend to want the RB bit to be done so I can get to him). 
 

Title of thread is pretty clear so if it’s not something people are interested in they can always skip past

I certainly appreciate them, don't always have time to sit and watch the videos so reading a summary is very useful.

[1960maaan]

2 hours ago, Silvio Dante said:

Its been interesting both because you can see that a change in demeanour leads to better answers (I don’t think there was a Pearson change in demeanour against results that was as clear) and because Piercys bit is always good value (I tend to want the RB bit to be done so I can get to him). 

I don't think there was a change in demeanour with results, but there seemed a definite change in attitude by Pearson. I found him a bit tetchy even adversarial at times to start, but he definitely relaxed as time went on , which is interesting in someone so experienced. I think he may even have mentioned relaxing himself. 

Manning is different , this is his biggest job and he's still relatively young and inexperienced . I don't enjoy them ATM , I find them quite dull and repetitive , TBH that could be the same for any Presser . That's why I appreciate your bullet point posts. 
With luck and time he will relax and they will become better, even enjoyable. But trying to come up with new things to say , new phrases etc is almost impossible , but it's the information that is key . 

[Silvio Dante]

1 hour ago, 1960maaan said:

I don't think there was a change in demeanour with results, but there seemed a definite change in attitude by Pearson. I found him a bit tetchy even adversarial at times to start, but he definitely relaxed as time went on , which is interesting in someone so experienced. I think he may even have mentioned relaxing himself. 

Manning is different , this is his biggest job and he's still relatively young and inexperienced . I don't enjoy them ATM , I find them quite dull and repetitive , TBH that could be the same for any Presser . That's why I appreciate your bullet point posts. 
With luck and time he will relax and they will become better, even enjoyable. But trying to come up with new things to say , new phrases etc is almost impossible , but it's the information that is key . 

My take on Nige is that although he had an idea he was walking into a shitshow, he didn’t quite understand how bad it was. When he got here and found that out there was a degree of “WTF have I gotten into?”. I agree he then broadly relaxed into it and I think that was because he saw the trajectory was improving and he was happier with what he had. In short it was someone who enjoyed the job more the greater chance he had to shape it.

Thats always been the contrast with Liam - again, done to death but he didn’t  walk into a shitshow playing squad wise and he probably put himself under a bit of unnecessary pressure due to the reasons you outline. Hopefully he’s over that now.

[Bainsey]

Got a 2 month old who has been bawling their eyes out for the last couple of hours. Decided to put this on, turned the volume up and hey presto - asleep in less than a minute. 

[Davefevs]

10 hours ago, Kid in the Riot said:

@Silvio Dante did you do these for all of Nige's pressers? I can't recall. 

Between us we’ve covered most, not always in loads of detail, depends what he’s said.

I have made notes on every LM interview, pre and post-match, club or media.  I started doing it with Nige to jog my memory of what he said and when he said it.  For LM I was trying to build an emerging view of him and his team over that initial 20 game period I’d given myself, so as not to jump to conclusions.

FWIW I’m not fussed by the tone of his voice, Nige wasn’t much different either in his delivery, more interested in what he says.  Generally I like the detail he gives.  I don’t think he’s a bluffer, I’ve always said that…I think he has good foundations. Most of my issues with him were translating those foundations onto the pitch at Championship level.

[spudski]

12 hours ago, eardun said:

And possibly also linked to Twine - he wants him. 

Noticed how he mentioned that Tommy had begun a good understanding with Twine on the pitch and was a better player for it.

Perhaps he wants to keep both. 

[Davefevs]

29 minutes ago, spudski said:

Noticed how he mentioned that Tommy had begun a good understanding with Twine on the pitch and was a better player for it.

Perhaps he wants to keep both. 

I’m sure he does.

[petehinton]

13 hours ago, eardun said:

I particularly liked the bit where he said that we can talk about being ambitious (which is why he joined us) but we have to show that in terms of our actions re the squad in the summer. Over to you SL. 

I think this & a few other pointed comments have all been quite clearly aimed at ‘the board’ - along with the “not going to change things overnight” “the squad is weaker than last year (paraphrased)” “difficult to change anything mid season” as a bit of ‘it’s not me guv, it’s them’ from Liam & Hoggy, and that the squad isn’t as good as was shouted from the rooftops about back in the autumn. I still standby the fact I’d be amazed if the squad is 2 players bigger in August than it currently is, and that there won’t be much movement in/out. 
 

They’re not stupid, and know the pressure that’s been put of them by the comments in October & November, but the recent run of results has probably given them a bit of license that currently, in their mind, they’ve bailed JL/Tinns/GM out a bit of what was an extremely toxic situation. 

[Davefevs]

26 minutes ago, petehinton said:

They’re not stupid, and know the pressure that’s been put of them by the comments in October & November, but the recent run of results has probably given them a bit of license

It’s called choosing your moment isn’t?  LM is smart to know when he can use these comments or not.  Nige used to also.

On a good run, it’s exactly the time to push home what you want.

Like you I think it’s the 9 and 10 in, and everything else is a reaction to outgoings.  But the size of squad won’t be massive.

[lenred]

7 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Like you I think it’s the 9 and 10 in,

Blimey - you think that many?  Interesting summer ahead if so!

[Davefevs]

2 minutes ago, lenred said:

Blimey - you think that many?  Interesting summer ahead if so!

Announce Twine, Twiney, Scottie, Twinesy and Twiniesta for half of them!

[mozo]

2 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Announce Twine, Twiney, Scottie, Twinesy and Twiniesta for half of them!

I like 'Twiniesta', might start using that...

[Davefevs]

Just now, mozo said:

I like 'Twiniesta', might start using that...

Please don’t.

remember:

#feelingsupersonicgivemesammieszmodics 

that went well didn’t it!

[Robbored]

12 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Like you I think it’s the 9 and 10 in, and everything else is a reaction to outgoings.  But the size of squad won’t be massive.

Phew……..that seems a lot and I thought that smarmy Ashton had moved on………….

Maybe the all knowing Ian Gay can tell us………..

[KegCity]

18 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

It’s called choosing your moment isn’t?  LM is smart to know when he can use these comments or not.  Nige used to also.

On a good run, it’s exactly the time to push home what you want.

Like you I think it’s the 9 and 10 in, and everything else is a reaction to outgoings.  But the size of squad won’t be massive.

I think on paper that's all we need. Defence is fine, midfield is ok with Williams in the squad. Just need that extra quality going forward.

[lenred]

10 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Announce Twine, Twiney, Scottie, Twinesy and Twiniesta for half of them!

Ahhhh sorry - ignore me

[One Team]

1 hour ago, petehinton said:

I think this & a few other pointed comments have all been quite clearly aimed at ‘the board’ - along with the “not going to change things overnight” “the squad is weaker than last year (paraphrased)” “difficult to change anything mid season” as a bit of ‘it’s not me guv, it’s them’ from Liam & Hoggy, and that the squad isn’t as good as was shouted from the rooftops about back in the autumn. I still standby the fact I’d be amazed if the squad is 2 players bigger in August than it currently is, and that there won’t be much movement in/out. 
 

They’re not stupid, and know the pressure that’s been put of them by the comments in October & November, but the recent run of results has probably given them a bit of license that currently, in their mind, they’ve bailed JL/Tinns/GM out a bit of what was an extremely toxic situation. 

Great post Pete. 

It’s with comments like this I am actually starting to warm a little to Manning, and at the very least have some sympathy.

If he can continue to carefully craft a “it’s not me it’s them” narrative (carefully as Nige did this very well to his downfall) then he will get fans on side. We all saw October/November for what it was after all, FBCs latest podcast confirming it. 

To your other point I understand it’s two signings at the moment. 

Edited April 25 by One Team

[Northern Red]

50 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

It’s called choosing your moment isn’t?  LM is smart to know when he can use these comments or not.  Nige used to also.

On a good run, it’s exactly the time to push home what you want.

Like you I think it’s the 9 and 10 in, and everything else is a reaction to outgoings.  But the size of squad won’t be massive.

Yep. Conversely, if you say those things during a bad run it starts to look like excuses.

[Silvio Dante]

4 minutes ago, One Team said:

Great post Pete. 

It’s with comments like this I am actually starting to warm a little to Manning, and at the very least have some sympathy.

If he can continue to carefully craft a “it’s not me it’s them” narrative (carefully as Nige did this very well to his downfall) then he will get fans on side. We all saw October/November for what it was after all, FBCs latest podcast confirming it. 

To your other point I understand it’s two signings at the moment. 

The broader question is that if it’s two signings whether that gives us enough to make a dent in the top six. If we assume we retain Williams but not James/King, and also assume we lose Conway, then we’re pretty much at a zero sum game (Bird for James, new 10 for Twine or Twine, new 9 for Conway).

Yes, we then have SPH and Stokes as young players to augment the squad but there aren’t any others obviously coming through.

As Bird for James can be argued as like for like, Twine for Twine is obviously like for like and the new 9 for Conway is going to be like for like broadly, then the question really is - are the current squad (as it’s not going to be markedly improved) good enough to give us what we want, and sub question, how does that play to the “his players” narrative

(For avoidance of doubt if Liam gets success without “his players” but adjusting to the squad he has then it takes away a major concern).

[ExiledAjax]

4 minutes ago, Silvio Dante said:

The broader question is that if it’s two signings whether that gives us enough to make a dent in the top six. If we assume we retain Williams but not James/King, and also assume we lose Conway, then we’re pretty much at a zero sum game (Bird for James, new 10 for Twine or Twine, new 9 for Conway).

Yes, we then have SPH and Stokes as young players to augment the squad but there aren’t any others obviously coming through.

As Bird for James can be argued as like for like, Twine for Twine is obviously like for like and the new 9 for Conway is going to be like for like broadly, then the question really is - are the current squad (as it’s not going to be markedly improved) good enough to give us what we want, and sub question, how does that play to the “his players” narrative

(For avoidance of doubt if Liam gets success without “his players” but adjusting to the squad he has then it takes away a major concern).

I think two properly ambitious and quality signings would be enough. 

But, I don't think this is the summer to sign "ones for the future" (especially given we already have Stokes, Murphy, and Bird).

If there ever was a time to go a little harder and spend two lots of £3m and £15k a week on some absolute class, it's now.

[Silvio Dante]

1 minute ago, ExiledAjax said:

I think two properly ambitious and quality signings would be enough. 

But, I don't think this is the summer to sign "ones for the future" (especially given we already have Stokes, Murphy, and Bird).

If there ever was a time to go a little harder and spend two lots of £3m and £15k a week on some absolute class, it's now.

The irony there is that I’d envisage we’d have to pay a minimum of £3m for Twine and at least £15k a week, and whoever is buying Conway would expect to pay a minimum of £3m and £15k a week.

So, on those sums, it’s back to the squad being as it is broadly.

(Don’t disagree with the general thrust of argument but two quality signings that markedly improve us will be a bit more than that IMO)

[ExiledAjax]

Just now, Silvio Dante said:

The irony there is that I’d envisage we’d have to pay a minimum of £3m for Twine and at least £15k a week, and whoever is buying Conway would expect to pay a minimum of £3m and £15k a week.

So, on those sums, it’s back to the squad being as it is broadly.

(Don’t disagree with the general thrust of argument but two quality signings that markedly improve us will be a bit more than that IMO)

Agree on both those figures for those two.

I'll just say that £15k is about the max we have been paying over the last couple of seasons. It's probably about what our top earners are on. We might stretch a bit towards £17k for someone really special, but more than that and I think we're at our limit.

So, if our limit is therefore players of the quality of Vyner, Knight, Twine - then it's about getting more of that standard in. Improve the depth of the squad and the breadth of the quality. 

Go from a strong first 15 to a strong first 17. It could be enough to just get us the 10 extra points we need (just 3 wins and 1 draw) to be in that playoff mix in 12 month's time.

[Silvio Dante]

4 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

Agree on both those figures for those two.

I'll just say that £15k is about the max we have been paying over the last couple of seasons. It's probably about what our top earners are on. We might stretch a bit towards £17k for someone really special, but more than that and I think we're at our limit.

So, if our limit is therefore players of the quality of Vyner, Knight, Twine - then it's about getting more of that standard in. Improve the depth of the squad and the breadth of the quality. 

Go from a strong first 15 to a strong first 17. It could be enough to just get us the 10 extra points we need (just 3 wins and 1 draw) to be in that playoff mix in 12 month's time.

Don’t disagree overall but I think what’s generally being pitched is a bit of a “like for like” - two major “ins” just equalises the two major “outs”. I’d also agree that we shouldn’t go outside the structure - one of the things Nige was always big on was that players should earn broadly similar. Ways and means around that (Signing on fee structure, bonus) mind.

So to go via your route I think it’s four players to account for the likely losses, and agree they can’t be ones for the future. The wildcard is Stokes who from reports might - just might - be akin to one of those major “ins”

[Davefevs]

7 minutes ago, Silvio Dante said:

The broader question is that if it’s two signings whether that gives us enough to make a dent in the top six. If we assume we retain Williams but not James/King, and also assume we lose Conway, then we’re pretty much at a zero sum game (Bird for James, new 10 for Twine or Twine, new 9 for Conway).

Yes, we then have SPH and Stokes as young players to augment the squad but there aren’t any others obviously coming through.

As Bird for James can be argued as like for like, Twine for Twine is obviously like for like and the new 9 for Conway is going to be like for like broadly, then the question really is - are the current squad (as it’s not going to be markedly improved) good enough to give us what we want, and sub question, how does that play to the “his players” narrative

(For avoidance of doubt if Liam gets success without “his players” but adjusting to the squad he has then it takes away a major concern).

Silv - I think the 9 and 10 come in regardless of whether Tommy leaves.  If Tommy leaves we may bring in another forward, but might be one more for the future (see my Max Dean thread).

So Twine goes back - we are one down.  The new no10 (might be Twine) comes in, numbers back up.

New no9 - an extra squad member

I think King goes - one down, but replaced by Bird, numbers back up

And I think we keep one of James or Williams, so one down, but with Knight moving deeper that accommodates the duo of Stokes and Murphy as squad options.

Of course if both go, then I think we will add a player, but I think that will take budget from elsewhere if it requires a fee, hence why I think we will try to retain one, likely Williams.

So, in LM’s eyes:

- the 9 improves us

- the 10 improves us (Twine or whoever)

- Bird improves us

Everything else is a reaction to who leaves if anyone.  I know it’s not as black and white as I paint it, but if those 3 players improve this squad / 2 players if you count Twine as already here, then I do think that can be enough of a difference-maker.  The margins ARE fine.

I don’t think LM thinks he’s getting 5-6 players on top of the scenario I set out above, nor is he getting oodles spent, but he he does exoect his squad for next season to have 2 to 3 (see above) players that improve the base he has now.

Hope that makes sense.

Where this changes is with the possibility that certain players leave, e.g. Conway, Naismith, Pring, etc, who might all have suitors for different reasons.