Fastest Builders In The West...

[giles_23_bcfc]

The number of grounds around the country that can fit 10,000 fans behind one goal can be counted on the fingers of one hand.

Increasing the capacity to something like 8,000 would mean spending much, much more money, and revisiting the planning process completely.

It isn't going to happen, and people need to be a little more realistic.

After the East End is done, the next step will be the Williams.

And rightly so. Then possibly that stupid little Block that's supposed to be with the Atyeo? Possibly make it bigger and extend it onto the Atyeo?

[Robbored]

Having read some of the responses to this news i think a few people are missing the point.

This isn`t a move to expand AG. It`s an improvement and any increase in capacity is a side issue. As a newly promoted club we have an opportunity to establish ourselves where, in all truth, we should be. That doesn`t equate to spending millions on an all singing and dancing 10,000 +, multi-tiered super stand.

Once again i will applaud SL/CS for, in my opinion, getting the decision making spot on. We`ll have no reduced capacity for the forthcoming season which IMO was crucial.

The new stand, whether it will be completed in time for the start of 2008/2009 remains to be seen, will provide an improved envoironment for watching football and will no doubt improve on the hospitality side of the business and that means more income to the club.

SL is a very shrewd businessman whose found success in the financial markets. Anyone who has any doubts about his plans for the long term future of this club should think again.

Softly softly is the approach.

PDG

Well said and spot on.

The current Wedlocks Stand is now very tired and decrepid and is in desperate need of replacement.The club have announced plans to do just that and at the same time cuase as little disruption as possible and yet still people complain.

Its truy amazing just how hard some people are to please.

[NickJ]

but only IF and when we need it. its pointles building a flash new 35,000-40,000 all seater new stadium if we are only going to half fill it in the mid table region of the championship. Look at Fulham. All they did was change their terracing to seating and add a couple of thousand to their capacity. There's is now about 22,000.

Building bigger stadiums leads to bigger crowds, irrespective of how the team is doing. Look at Derby, Southampton, Leicester. They all built bigger stadiums and their crowds increased despite doing no better (Derby) or worse (Southampton and Leicester).

It seems pointless replacing one stand with another of the same capacity. Why not wait until its viable and necessary to build one of significantly increased ccapacity.

[Nibor]

And rightly so. Then possibly that stupid little Block that's supposed to be with the Atyeo? Possibly make it bigger and extend it onto the Atyeo?

I hope it's the Dolman after that myself. I dread to think what would happen if there was a fire, the place is a death trap.

From what I recall, building "corners" of stands is the least cost efficient means of increasing capacity because the structures are more complicated. They tend to be the bits that get added on when the other options have been exhausted.

[jellyred]

i understand what youre saying,,but capacity for who? if we give the away fans the ateo which is probably whats going to happen,,then all we are actually doing is increasing the capacity for more away support,unless there going to use segregation in the new east end which would defeat the purpose of building the thing,,,being in the championship will surely increase our fanbase and if we manage to stay there until next season it will be increased again,don't get me wrong i would rather see a capacity crowd of 21000 rather than a half empty east end,,but bim sure that building this new 5.300 seater is going to leave some fans out in the cold for bigger games just like this season?

I would have thought the Atyeo will be split between the home and away fans.

[giles_23_bcfc]

Building bigger stadiums leads to bigger crowds, irrespective of how the team is doing. Look at Derby, Southampton, Leicester. They all built bigger stadiums and their crowds increased despite doing no better (Derby) or worse (Southampton and Leicester).

It seems pointless replacing one stand with another of the same capacity. Why not wait until its viable and necessary to build one of significantly increased ccapacity.

not necessarily. If i remember rightly, Sunderland's dropped to about 17,000 average the season after they last got relegated from the Premiership. And this new stand will be 5,300 with segregation (if away fans are in there aswell) i think. The club still havent said who will occupy the new stand. Thing is, we don't want to do the whole ground all at once, get 30,000 capacity, only to get relegated back to League 1 and then get half a grouund, sometimes less.

Look at Rovers (No disrespect) but, if they stay down, do you really think they will get more than a 7-8,000 average in their new ground? Granted for the first few home games they will have near capacity but that's because people will be interested to see what its like.

[Nibor]

It seems pointless replacing one stand with another of the same capacity. Why not wait until its viable and necessary to build one of significantly increased ccapacity.

If that new stand of the same capacity would enable us to make a million extra every year from non matchday revenue would you still say it was pointless?

I'm sure they've worked out the numbers.

The prices you can charge businesses for use of those sort of facilities are absolutely obscene.

[NickJ]

Well said and spot on.

The current Wedlocks Stand is now very tired and decrepid and is in desperate need of replacement.The club have announced plans to do just that and at the same time cuase as little disruption as possible and yet still people complain.

Its truy amazing just how hard some people are to please.

It's called debate and expressing one's opinion.

And there was me thinking that's what this forum is all about.

[giles_23_bcfc]

I hope it's the Dolman after that myself. I dread to think what would happen if there was a fire, the place is a death trap.

From what I recall, building "corners" of stands is the least cost efficient means of increasing capacity because the structures are more complicated. They tend to be the bits that get added on when the other options have been exhausted.

well they are changing the wooden seats for plastic ones as we speak so that's no longer a fire risk. I'd rather have it joined than left as it is, it looks completely stupid there.

[NickJ]

If that new stand of the same capacity would enable us to make a million extra every year from non matchday revenue would you still say it was pointless?

I'm sure they've worked out the numbers.

The prices you can charge businesses for use of those sort of facilities are absolutely obscene.

I would be amazed if the new stand would make significant additional non-matchday revenue. How could it? At the end of the day, it will only be able to offer conferencing and room-hire facilities, which already exist elsewhere at Ashton Gate and which I doubt very much are any where near fully utilised during the week.

I'm sure they worked out the numbers for the Premier Club, and that hasn't exactly been a roaring success. The main reason it will do much better this season is because we will be sold out for many if not most games, depending on how well the team perform, forcing people into the Premier seats, as they were for other sold out games this season. Which takes us back to the capacity issue....

[bh_red]

the point that people seem to be missing that part in the "the stand will be as tall as current planning permission allows which will be bigger than the dolman", if they now decide they want to make the stand even bigger they are going to have to go back to the drawing board, redesign the stand, reapply for planning permission all over again, which they may...........or may not get and will take alot of time and money.

perhaps what they are saying is that we can't actually build any higher than what we have permission for? so are building a big a stand as they can already, although the orginal idea was for a 2 tier stand, I'd imagine the it would no doubt seriously impact on the houses behind, not just in height but in depth.

People also need to remember that once this inital stand is done, they will be in the position to connect the stand to the Dolman and Williams stand at later date if needed, which again will add further capacity when needed.

[giles_23_bcfc]

the point that people seem to be missing that part in the "the stand will be as tall as current planning permission allows which will be bigger than the dolman", if they now decide they want to make the stand even bigger they are going to have to go back to the drawing board, redesign the stand, reapply for planning permission all over again, which they may...........or may not get and will take alot of time and money.

perhaps what they are saying is that we can't actually build any higher than what we have permission for? so are building a big a stand as they can already, although the orginal idea was for a 2 tier stand, I'd imagine the it would no doubt seriously impact on the houses behind, not just in height but in depth.

People also need to remember that once this inital stand is done, they will be in the position to connect the stand to the Dolman and Williams stand at later date if needed, which again will add further capacity when needed.

exactly. itll be deeper and taller from what i read.

also, the capacity will rise to 21,000 AFTER segregation, wherever that will be. with the new stand holding 5,300. sounds like a roundabout way of saying that away fans will be moved.

[Robbored]

I would be amazed if the new stand would make significant additional non-matchday revenue. How could it? At the end of the day, it will only be able to offer conferencing and room-hire facilities, which already exist elsewhere at Ashton Gate and which I doubt very much are any where near fully utilised during the week.

I'm sure they worked out the numbers for the Premier Club, and that hasn't exactly been a roaring success. The main reason it will do much better this season is because we will be sold out for many if not most games, depending on how well the team perform, forcing people into the Premier seats, as they were for other sold out games this season. Which takes us back to the capacity issue....

Basically Nick, the club are improving the falicities at AG on a gradual basis.Last summer the DEH was refurbished and the Williams was knocked about to accomodate Premier Seating (not a great success last season but worth every penny in the Championship)

Over this summer the seating in the Dolman is being upgraded and the pitch renewed with a better quality one.A new PA system will also be introduced.

At the end of next season the Wedlocks get flattened and replaced with a brand new stand with far better facilites which will improve the overall 'look' and standard of AG.

All these improvements take time and money.

Now I don't see what some people hope to achieve by complaining about what is (as I see it) a long overdue redevelopment of AG.You might call it 'opinions' but to me its about whether the glass is half empty or half full.Yours it seems is always half empty.

[Desso]

It's all very well people saying - we want this, we want that, but as there are houses behind the Atyeo and half of the Wedlock, we are restricted as to what we can build (right of light etc.)

We should remember that Ashton gate is in a built up area not in the country.

[Barrs Court Red]

If that new stand of the same capacity would enable us to make a million extra every year from non matchday revenue would you still say it was pointless?

I'm sure they've worked out the numbers.

I agree, but then they've cocked up the numbers for this new stand twice already.

[Nibor]

I would be amazed if the new stand would make significant additional non-matchday revenue. How could it? At the end of the day, it will only be able to offer conferencing and room-hire facilities, which already exist elsewhere at Ashton Gate and which I doubt very much are any where near fully utilised during the week.

Well, it's about size. We were told when the plans came out originally that the conferencing facilities would be the largest available in Bristol by quite a margin. That could mean a lot of business that is currently going outside the city when there's a need to get that many people into one facility. The fees charged to big business for something like that can easily run into five figures a day.

I'd agree it won't be fully utilised to start with, but I would think it's something that will build up year on year and could well pay for itself over say, 5-8 years.

I'm sure they worked out the numbers for the Premier Club, and that hasn't exactly been a roaring success. The main reason it will do much better this season is because we will be sold out for many if not most games, depending on how well the team perform, forcing people into the Premier seats, as they were for other sold out games this season. Which takes us back to the capacity issue....

I think that's wrong on two counts.

First, I don't think we'll be sold out for most games. We didn't last time we were up, and I can't see capacity issues forcing people into 3 year Prem Club tickets.

Second, I think the Premier Club, badly handled as it was, was still a good move financially. Even if it takes until 08/09 to be full, I would have thought it would be well into the black by then because again it makes more money year on year.

I'm not saying that more capacity wouldn't be a good thing, just that it's not the be all and end all for redeveloping one stand. When we eventually do the Williams I would expect there to be very significant capacity increases and a multi tier stand makes much more sense along the pitch than at the end of it.

[Guest ashtonyate]

A start of another Lansdown c**k up is in the making, building a stand that small is pointless if this club is going to become a real player in the championship you need to have a ground to hold 30/35,000.

The club have only two sides to redevelop East End or Williams if you don't have a stand that can hold 10,000 forget it its pointless small minded and typical of the way the club thinks

[Robbored]

A start of another Lansdown c**k up is in the making, building a stand that small is pointless if this club is going to become a real player in the championship you need to have a ground to hold 30/35,000.

The club have only two sides to redevelop East End or Williams if you don't have a stand that can hold 10,000 forget it its pointless small minded and typical of the way the club thinks

And this post is typical of the way you think AY.

Try taking a balanced view for once.

[pdgifford64]

A start of another Lansdown c**k up is in the making, building a stand that small is pointless if this club is going to become a real player in the championship you need to have a ground to hold 30/35,000.

The club have only two sides to redevelop East End or Williams if you don't have a stand that can hold 10,000 forget it its pointless small minded and typical of the way the club thinks

Talking of small minded. :noexpression:

PDG

[bh_red]

A start of another Lansdown c**k up is in the making, building a stand that small is pointless if this club is going to become a real player in the championship you need to have a ground to hold 30/35,000.

The club have only two sides to redevelop East End or Williams if you don't have a stand that can hold 10,000 forget it its pointless small minded and typical of the way the club thinks

How is it a c**k up? they are building the LARGEST STAND PLANNING PERMISSION WILL ALLOW!

they can only build so far up and so far back with the land that is available, unless you are suggesting that they start building the stand into people's back gardens without their permission?

once the East End has been done, and the Williams development is completed, Ashton Gate will be a 30,000 seater ground.

this is pointless small minded and typical of the way the YOU think

[jellyred]

A start of another Lansdown c**k up is in the making, building a stand that small is pointless if this club is going to become a real player in the championship you need to have a ground to hold 30/35,000.

The club have only two sides to redevelop East End or Williams if you don't have a stand that can hold 10,000 forget it its pointless small minded and typical of the way the club thinks

You are sooooooooo negative it is untrue.

1) You don't need a 30-35000 seater stadium to be a 'real player' in the championship

2)Once the williams is redeveloped as well then we will be closing onto 30000 seats anyway

3)We've already spent out on the legal side of things (planning permission etc) and spent the time for the new stand so why would they go ahead trying to get planning permission for a stand that would never be approved. It says that they are going to build up to the planning limits.

I'm sure there is more but I can't be arsed.

[giles_23_bcfc]

A start of another Lansdown c**k up is in the making, building a stand that small is pointless if this club is going to become a real player in the championship you need to have a ground to hold 30/35,000.

The club have only two sides to redevelop East End or Williams if you don't have a stand that can hold 10,000 forget it its pointless small minded and typical of the way the club thinks

What's the point of building a 35000 stadium when were in the championship and going to be fighting to stay up?! If we went down we wouldnt even half ill it most games s there would be no atmosphere. i would much rather have a full capacity of 22,000 in the championship than a half empty stadium in league 1!

[Guest ashtonyate]

And this post is typical of the way you think AY.

Try taking a balanced view for once.

If we can't afford to build a stand that improve the capacity then why bother its pointless you are condemning the club to a roll of 2/3 division football. That is a balanced view

[red panda]

A start of another Lansdown c**k up is in the making, building a stand that small is pointless if this club is going to become a real player in the championship you need to have a ground to hold 30/35,000.

The club have only two sides to redevelop East End or Williams if you don't have a stand that can hold 10,000 forget it its pointless small minded and typical of the way the club thinks

Don't worry about it. We're sure to be relegated next year, and all because of our useless academy

[Nibor]

If we can't afford to build a stand that improve the capacity then why bother its pointless you are condemning the club to a roll of 2/3 division football. That is a balanced view

No it's not, it's an ignorant one.

There's more to redeveloping a stand than just capacity.

Anyway, I thought it was the academy that was condemning the club to permanent 3rd division football? Oh, wait a minute we got promoted!

[pdgifford64]

A start of another Lansdown c**k up is in the making, building a stand that small is pointless if this club is going to become a real player in the championship you need to have a ground to hold 30/35,000.

The club have only two sides to redevelop East End or Williams if you don't have a stand that can hold 10,000 forget it its pointless small minded and typical of the way the club thinks

I have to ask. Have you some personal vendetta against SL. It seems that no matter what the topic is you always manage to twist it around so that you can continue your personal campaign against him. I don`t understand it, i really don`t.

PDG

[giles_23_bcfc]

If we can't afford to build a stand that improve the capacity then why bother

can you not read or are you simply being more annoying than normal?!

quote from the website:

"The huge new 5,300-seater stand will increase the stadium's football capacity - after segregation - to 21,000. In comparison to the final home game of the season saw a sell-out crowd of 19,500-plus visit Ashton Gate."

now, to me, and correct me if my maths is right, that's an increase of nearly 1,500.

[Dubai Red]

A start of another Lansdown c**k up is in the making, building a stand that small is pointless if this club is going to become a real player in the championship you need to have a ground to hold 30/35,000.

The club have only two sides to redevelop East End or Williams if you don't have a stand that can hold 10,000 forget it its pointless small minded and typical of the way the club thinks

You do realise that Old Trafford's West and East stand (the ones at the end) are 11,500 & 12,000 and they are double and triple tier so 5,300 on a single tier sounds like a very big / nice stand to me. Also they have built in corner sections which add capacity but are 3 -5 time the cost per seat to that of a standard side section.

[Robbored]

can you not read or are you simply being more annoying than normal?!

quote from the website:

"The huge new 5,300-seater stand will increase the stadium's football capacity - after segregation - to 21,000. In comparison to the final home game of the season saw a sell-out crowd of 19,500-plus visit Ashton Gate."

now, to me, and correct me if my maths is right, that's an increase of nearly 1,500.

Reasoned arguement is wasted on AshtonYate.

He has two views - fixed and negative on all things City.

[StapleHillPhil]

I agree, but then they've cocked up the numbers for this new stand twice already.

I think previously they couldn't guarantee the non matchday revenue due to the investments being put into the Bristol Arena and the competition it would offer. With that now almost certainly dead in the water, it should hopefully allow a redeveloped Ashton Gate to clean up in the corporate market.