Crossing The Rubicon - Cotts Out?

[Smokey]

really? So you were frustrated last season at not being able to raise the question of sacking SC? Is that right

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I read it as sarcasm

[downendcity]

really? So you were frustrated last season at not being able to raise the question of sacking SC? Is that right

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Not me, Last season was one of the rare oasis of success in the desert of continual disappointment that has been being a City supporter for half a century.

However, I sometimes get the feeling that some fans are only really happy when they have something to moan about and last season gave them no opportunity.

[ten minutes of rough]

To be honest I am concerned that he hasn't" been able to strengthen the squad in the recent window. Something was not right in how all that played out, we are very small squad , and short of another striker, midfielder, and the two loan defenders we did bring in smacked of desperation, and has done nothing to stem the goals against.

The post match interview after Preston was OTT, and bigged up the players and the performance, in a game we should have won, he summed up the players as ruthless? In  1.1 draw, it was hardly ruthless. It was though he was  trying to kid us, and the Board perhaps?

No room for sentiment my fellow reds, we need to not get relegated, whatever it takes.

In the past this club have not acted  soon enough, I hope SL  will do what is best for the club, that's all.

 

[Up The City!]

No one is saying Cotts out right now. I can only speak for myself but I really hope he turns it around as I like the guy. My position is that due to the lack of transfer activity in the summer and the poir results and the feel good factor of promotion has vanished then for me Cotts positiin must be under review. It's better to make a change in Sept rather than in Dec when were almost down and out.

[Roger Red Hat]

Quite frankly , if there is someone out there who can take us forward I don't give a flying ffffk if Cotts gets the boot. Whether the 'club management' are up to it is a different question.

[JamesBCFC]

For arguments sake, say we're 9 points adrift in January - you absolutely wouldn't consider a change of management?

9 points adrift in january and 1 point behind with 38 games to go (an entire premier league season!)are 2 totally incomparable situations

[TNBT]

Well the average time for a championship manager is 10 months so only another 8 or somonths and we'll probably have a new one if he doesn't stop being so stubborn, personally was only expecting survival this season and hope we can do that with SC but fully expect him gone most likely in Dec if we're not where expected.

Still think we'll be ok but the size of our squad is worrying.

[Olé]

Can I just say that Sean O'Dreary will be available in a couple of weeks when Rogers gets sacked and he'll be new *improved* Premiership O'Dreary. 

Who wouldn't want that! Stupid question...

[Miah Dennehy]

Well I've mentioned on here before that, whilst some players are released when clubs get promoted because they aren't deemed good enough for the level above, I can't understand why managers are always given the chance at the higher level.

When will a club be brave enough to say 'thanks for guiding us to promotion Mr Manager but we don't think you can do it in the division above so we are letting you go' ???

Not saying Cotts should necessarily have been treated like this but we had the chance to build on some serious momentum after last season and with the stadium rebuild and it looked woeful today. 

I'm not in serious panic mode yet but interested to know any thoughts on whether we should have perhaps looked at managers with serious track records of getting out of this tough tough division back in June/July as well as new players?

 

Or when will a club be brave enough to stick with a manager (and for that matter players) who  brought success to a club, even if it means a couple of years of struggling. Short termism, may or may not bring a modicum of (short term ) success. It is a far better achievement to build something lasting based on stability, rather than some quick fix method just to keep the forums quiet ,I honestly believe social media causes far too much panic in football club boardrooms.

Anyway, long may yer shit start to the season continue, and I confidently predict that at some time this month we will see on our forums a 'We could be playing City next season' type thread

 

[Chappers]

It's a debate and a reasonable question to ask. Obviously SC will get time, but we can't dwell forever on last season and ignore what's going on. The simple fact is that the defence is leaking like a sieve, and we look vulnerable whenever sides counter-attack at pace. It was not just yesterday, the gaps have been there all season, very noticeable at Birmingham with Flint often isolated. Donaldson alone 6 yards out... Twice!!!!

Both Club and fans have to stop basking in glory and look at our current plight, and how to move forward. We might also have to accept that some of our players are struggling at the higher level. One thing is for sure, we can't carry on as we are.

[cidered abroad]

I remember how surprised, upset, angry, many people were that Southampton sacked Adkins after he had got them promotion twice.

Yet were they right or wrong?

Being very realistic and hard hearted, there are at least four or five of our team, who at the moment appear to be too good for League One but not even adequate for a Championship bench.

And a manager who thinks he can succeed in the Championship with the gung-ho attacking without any thought of the other side hitting us on the break. It worked against League One sides like Walsall and the rest, but this is a totally different world.

If Mr Lansdown is really serious about the Prem in five years, should he be doing what to many, will be the unthinkable? Or does he want to be the big fish with a lovely new stadium in the very small League One pond?

[LondonBristolian]

I certainly think we're a long way from "Cotts out" but I don't think it should be a taboo subject, nor that there is any space for sentiment or sitting on past achievements in football.  Just as JET was released and Elliott told he'd not be offered a playing contract as they weren't deemed to be what the club needed, I think clubs need to be prepared to change managers as soon as it becomes clear the current manager isn't the person to turn the club around.  I also think that any club should have two or three ideas at any time of who they'd go for if the manager did leave and I hope that applies to us.

 

That said, I think Cotterill is the man to turn things around BUT it has to be acknowledged things are not working at the moment and, two or three more performances like Saturday and we HAVE to change the formation and make the loan signings necessary to strengthen our options.  There's only so long you can blame bad luck. What's more, I also don't think we can blame transfer fees and wages.  Yes, there are clubs out-spending us but we're not the only club in the division that has to make do with tight resources and it's the manager's job to make the best of those.  Plenty of clubs have succeeded (or at least stayed out the bottom three) on limited resources.  I certainly don't think Cotterill should be sacked but I do think we need to do better and he needs to do better.  ,Given his winning mentality, I'm sure he feels that as much as anyone does. 

[ashton_fan]

There are many other teams struggling eg PNE, MK, Rotherham etc, we have to focus on picking up points from these and finishing above the bottom 3, just need to hold our nerve at present

[AshtonGreat]

Ok, I'll say it although I hope I am wrong. Cotts is out of his depth, way too stubborn and things are not going to improve anytime soon.

I don't think managers are like players in that they get 'out of their depth' as the quality of the league improves. A good manager is a good manager. I think the problem is that after last season's success we have all got used to winning and being the best team, so when we start coming up against better teams and the results go against us (even though we've more than held our own in most matches), we start accusing the manager and the players of being useless. What we forget is that most of the other clubs in this league have far bigger budgets than us, so of course SC is going to 'struggle' to some extent. He's still a good manager.

[Calculus]

Cotts and his mangement team needs help. Call Lars Lagerbäck and ask him to watch one of our games and he will sort the defensive mess  

Would he be the new Benny to SC's Ward?

[CityCiderEd]

First time this season I've left the ground feeling we were outplayed. The 3-5-2 is clearly not working and the opposition have sussed the way to counter it. We made Reading look very good yesterday but they hardly had to break sweat as we gave them all the space they needed. Most of the people I sit with want Cotts to succeed but all agree  the formation needs changing. Reading tore us apart and I think if we carry on with this style of play we will be in big trouble

[oldstandrobin]

I agree that he's got to make changes, but where and with what? The first two subs this afternoon were players who were on loan to league 2 clubs last season. Whilst they have come back better players, it's asking a bit much to expect them to turn things around. With the exception of Kodjia, the squad is no better than last season, but we're playing in a far better division.    

The squad is basically the same that took us up on the crest of a wave last season. I think the management down AG possibly thought that as we demolished the league last season, then if it aint broke, dont try and fix it. This showed with the lack of activity during the summer and I should imagine after yesterdays dismal display, they are accepting they were wrong. Sacking Cotts is not the answer for Gods sake, he may be an arrogant manager who hates losing but 2 seasons ago he rescued us from another drop where we could have been playing the Gas this season. He is pig-headed, we know that as all of us on here would play 4-4-2 and he is the last to recognise that but thankfully, this bad form can still be changed around. After watching City for nearly 60 years now, nothing at all surprises me down the Gate and before Forums we had to take our frustration out below the old Directors Lounge or just kick the cat when we got home ! Last season saw one of the best seasons I have ever seen down AG and I am grateful to Cotts for that, nothing will ever take that away. Patient ?  City Fans ??? Havent met many in those 60 years but get a grip, we support a club with passion but in return we are dished up regular dishes of frustration and I dont believe anything will ever change that but I still go down there with hope. Cotts Out ? Not even thinking of it. Time is of the essence here, we are in a better league than last year and if we didnt have the backing of SL, I would be worried. Give it time.

[Welcome To The Jungle]

What flak?  Most people have taken this thread for what it was intended; only a couple of reactionary hot heads who seem to have negligible reading comprehension skills like yourself have seemed to have taken the use of the phrase "Cotts Out?", ingnored the question mark and fired off - look at my post history, and you'll find me firmly a fan of SC, and a stanch defender of him, but don't let that get in the way of your weird obsession of jumping on anything you even perceive as being negative towards the club.

I saw another fan say along the lines of SC needing to change something fast, or he needs to be gone, and thought it would be interesting to get that discussion out in the open; sorry you disagree, but until you run this place, you'll probably see the odd thing you disagree with being discussed being discussed - deal with it.

Some people don't understand civil debate and devils advocate. 

[glynriley]

I am

Who would you go for  then? All very well saying get rid, but who's a viable alternative?

 

 

[Phileas Fogg]

9 points adrift in january and 1 point behind with 38 games to go (an entire premier league season!)are 2 totally incomparable situations

what are you talking about?

[Guest]

The squad is basically the same that took us up on the crest of a wave last season. I think the management down AG possibly thought that as we demolished the league last season, then if it aint broke, dont try and fix it. This showed with the lack of activity during the summer and I should imagine after yesterdays dismal display, they are accepting they were wrong. Sacking Cotts is not the answer for Gods sake, he may be an arrogant manager who hates losing but 2 seasons ago he rescued us from another drop where we could have been playing the Gas this season. He is pig-headed, we know that as all of us on here would play 4-4-2 and he is the last to recognise that but thankfully, this bad form can still be changed around. After watching City for nearly 60 years now, nothing at all surprises me down the Gate and before Forums we had to take our frustration out below the old Directors Lounge or just kick the cat when we got home ! Last season saw one of the best seasons I have ever seen down AG and I am grateful to Cotts for that, nothing will ever take that away. Patient ?  City Fans ??? Havent met many in those 60 years but get a grip, we support a club with passion but in return we are dished up regular dishes of frustration and I dont believe anything will ever change that but I still go down there with hope. Cotts Out ? Not even thinking of it. Time is of the essence here, we are in a better league than last year and if we didnt have the backing of SL, I would be worried. Give it time.

great post saved me writing it

[RobintheRed Red]

It's not his fault the board won't pay the going rate for wages. We have a good L1 team that needs some quality additions to make us competitive in this league. You get what you pay for simple as that 

spot on mate been seriously let down  regarding wage structure to compete at this level

[BS4 on Tour...]

Or when will a club be brave enough to stick with a manager (and for that matter players) who  brought success to a club, even if it means a couple of years of struggling. Short termism, may or may not bring a modicum of (short term ) success. It is a far better achievement to build something lasting based on stability, rather than some quick fix method just to keep the forums quiet ,I honestly believe social media causes far too much panic in football club boardrooms.

Anyway, long may yer shit start to the season continue, and I confidently predict that at some time this month we will see on our forums a 'We could be playing City next season' type thread

 

Well look at West Ham as an example. They had a reasonable season in the premier league last season, it tailed off a bit and they finished 12th.

They decided that isn't good enough and they sacked big Sam. Now this season they've already beaten Arsenal, Liverpool and Man City all away from home. So they seem to be going in the right direction to get towards the 'next level.'

They could easily have stuck with Sam and they would have probably finished between 8th and 14th every season, which would have kept some fans happy.

But they've obviously thought, every manager has their level, just like players, and to move on they needed someone else. Brave move but it may just work out for them as they move into the Olympic Stadium..

[samo II]

Well look at West Ham as an example.

Equally, and perhaps more directly comparable is Watford; went up, but shifted out the man in charge, and look very capable now.

Again; not saying I think Cotts should go - I don't; if the board give him support in the loan market, and time to nurse this team back to confidence, I think we'll comfortably survive, and allow him to build better next summer - but there are examples of teams moving up and moving on.

[Guest]

For arguments sake, say we're 9 points adrift in January - you absolutely wouldn't consider a change of management?

For me, it will depend upon the manner of us being in that position.

As a board member you would have to assume some, even if small, blame or responsibility for the squad following the transfer window. So he would get an allowance to that extent. If then the performances were of the standard seen in all but yesterday's game, no I actually wouldn't consider a change and he'd get the other half of the season to see if it can finally click. It can only take one run at the right time after all and but for yesterday I do not think we have been far away from picking up points. 

If performances like yesterday became the norm I might not wait until even January because that was simply unacceptable. But I think for now we have to take it for what it was - a first of that kind. 

[Beni71]

If cotts doesn't get the financial support he thinks the club need I suppose there is a chance he could walk. As already said chopping and changing doesn't help with stability on and off the pitch. Not sure who we would attract.

we need to support him and the team. COYR

[samo II]

If cotts doesn't get the financial support he thinks the club need I suppose there is a chance he could walk. As already said chopping and changing doesn't help with stability on and off the pitch. Not sure who we would attract.

we need to support him and the team. COYR

This is a concern of mine.

He's brought in what looks like an excellent striker in Kodjia, and two well-thought of defenders from the Premier League (and Fredericks, but less said on that front the better), while clearly also wanting a striker, and despite him being combative with the media over it all, I don't for one moment think the driver here is his unwillingness to reach out and bring in some extra players, though I think he's sincere when he expresses his dismay at the cost of competing at this level.

My worry is if he comes to the conclusion prior to January that we need serious help, yet the club ether cannot or will not provide that support in the shape of loans or new players in that window, then he may come to the conclusion that it would be better to walk away with an impressive two years on his jacket, than be involved in a relegation, which I understand he never has been before.

I don't believe he is anywhere close to doing this, but the end of the transfer window scared me somewhat in this regard.

[Port Said Red]

Next four games will be decisive

Why, does the season finish in mid October this year?

[Marcus Griff]

Cotts has earned the right to be given a chance to turn thing's around, the question is how long do you give him??? I am not sure the current crop of players are good enough whoever the manager is!!

 

 

[glynriley]

I look at whats in front of me.  I see a manager who has never achieved anything of note in the Championship, and in fact has "lower league westcountry no-mark" written all over him.

What i'm not, is someone with all the skills to successfully scout out and interview managers from other clubs.  I will leave that to the professionals.

I could list some names of the latest flavour of the month managers, but what would be the point?

My point is simple - SC is not the man to take this club forward.

For the record, I know this will have many on OTIB casting insults at me and calling me knee-jerk.  let me save people's breath by saying:

a) I dont give a hoot what people think

b) I'm sorry for killing that woman and can I come home now?

Fair enough, but you do have an opinion. Yours is that our 'lower league westcountry no-mark' is not up to the job.Surely you have an opinion on who would be?

Or is this another knee jerk reaction to a bad start?