Barnsley v City Match Day 15

[Davefevs]

So City travel to Oakwell tonight, sat in 6th position, knowing a win tonight v bottom club Barnsley would take them level on points with West Brom.  What could possibly go wrong?  If last week’s 6th v 19th tells you nothing, then you’ve probably not been looking too closely at the Championship and that any side can get a result against anyone.

Tonights opponents are bottom, but have recently seen manager Stendel leave, replaced by Adam Murray, and achieved two decent draws v Swansea and West Brom, before narrowly losing to the in-form Huddersfield.

How Do They Line-Up:

It looks massively attacking on the graphic above, but effectively it’s a back 3 with wing-backs, a defensive midfielder and then 2 CMs supporting the front-two.  A bit like us they have two wingers - who sit on the bench!

The Players:

Gonna confess there are quite a few names here I don’t know, nor have seen play.  The only time I’ve seen them for 90 was the recent demolition by Brentford on Sky, and the personnel are different under Murray.  Very, very young squad.

GK: Brad Collins (22) - signed on a free from Chelsea in the summer and conceding on average 2 goals per game.  Previous loans at Burton and FGR.

RWB: Dimitri Cavare (24) - signed from RC Lens (Taylor Moore’s old club), and imho a poor-man’s Mark Little.  Likes to drive forward, and powerful with it, but defensively, pretty poor

CB: Tony Sibbick (20) - signed from AFC Wimbledon.

CB: Mads Andersen (21) - Danish import signed from Horsens, having been a product of Brondby. Tall!

CB: Bambo Diaby (21) - French / Senegalese player signed from Belgian team Lokeren in the summer, having previously been in Italy.

LWB: Jacob Brown (21) - normally a winger but playing wingback in Murray’s system.  Previously at Chesterfield on loan, with a decent scoring record in Lg1 last season.

DM: Kenny Dougall (26) - Aussie midfielder previously with Rotterdam.  Not part of Stendel’s plans, but returned under Murray.

CM: Cameron McGeehan (24) - Northern Irish midfielder formerly of Scunthorpe and Luton.  Busy player with some nice touches, who has an eye for a goal lower down the EFL.

CM: Alex Mowatt (24) - ex-Leeds (and Oxford) left footed midfielder and captain.  Destined for bigger things when he broke through at Leeds but not fulfilled his potential.  Lovely left peg, and likes to get his shots off.  Would be my man to watch, but....

CF: Cauley Woodrow (24) - my man to watch - as if it could’ve been anyone else!! Ex-City loanee from Fulham who previously had loans at Burton and Southend.  It was at Burton where I first saw Cauley as a striker who’d fit in well at City, only for LJ to sign him on loan during 17/18 season with an option to buy.  It never worked out for him here, but he’s since gone on to score a goal every other game for the Tykes and us top scorer with 5 from 11 starts this season, several of which have been very good goals...not the man for a tap-in!

CF: Conor Chaplin (22) - ex-Portsmouth and Coventry advanced player who’ll play off of Cauley.  Useful player and we’ll need to be careful to not face up our defenders.

Other Players of Note:

Mallik Wilkes - winger signed from Leeds having been at Doncaster.

Luke Thomas - another winger signed from Derby having been at Cheltenham (and in our radar).

How Do We Win:

If they persist with the high line at the back, and midfielders who don’t press the passer, then the likes of Weimann could have a field day.  Definitely a game to try to control possession and chances will come.  Let it become end to end, get the crowd behind them, and it could be a tough night.  Difficult to know whether Murray will persist with the back 3, and difficult to know how we will line-up with Moore possibly out and and unsure how ready Kalas and Nagy are, or how Rodri’s sharpness / fitness is coming on.

Prediction:

2-0 away win.  City players realising last weekend was a chance missed, and rectifying it tonight.

[Lrrr]

Lee Johnson to get boo'd by Barnsley fans?

[BRISTOL86]

Cauley Woodrow masterclass incoming 

[Major Isewater]

3 minutes ago, BRISTOL86 said:

Cauley Woodrow masterclass incoming 

That’s the spirit.

[JamesBCFC]

12 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

 

How Do We Win:

Score more goals than them

Just an idea.

[Mr Popodopolous]

19 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

If they persist with the high line at the back, and midfielders who don’t press the passer,

Never got teams who do this- seems an accident waiting to happen!

They have a young squad so would have thought it isn't a case of old players cannot press at all- quite the reverse- likewise if it is that, then the high line seems daft. Trying to be too clever or stubborn or? I don't know, but always felt a side shouldn't press up with one area but sit back in the other- but especially a high defensive line with a fairly passive midfield.

Old but still quite relevant, albeit an altogether higher level.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/1894949-tottenhams-high-line-coupled-with-lack-of-midfield-pressure-doomed-avb

I get the impression but hope I'm wrong that they've tightened up a bit tactically speaking at least under Murray- possibly a bit more reactive which makes it trickier for us if so- a nice high line in a struggling side tough, combined with little or no midfield pressure would be excellent for us to exploit.

Seems potentially disastrous for a side who does this though.

[Davefevs]

46 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Never got teams who do this- seems an accident waiting to happen!

They have a young squad so would have thought it isn't a case of old players cannot press at all- quite the reverse- likewise if it is that, then the high line seems daft. Trying to be too clever or stubborn or? I don't know, but always felt a side shouldn't press up with one area but sit back in the other- but especially a high defensive line with a fairly passive midfield.

Old but still quite relevant, albeit an altogether higher level.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/1894949-tottenhams-high-line-coupled-with-lack-of-midfield-pressure-doomed-avb

I get the impression but hope I'm wrong that they've tightened up a bit tactically speaking at least under Murray- possibly a bit more reactive which makes it trickier for us if so- a nice high line in a struggling side tough, combined with little or no midfield pressure would be excellent for us to exploit.

Seems potentially disastrous for a side who does this though.

Yes, I don’t think it’s by design.  To play a high line you have to press the passer.  Not sure Brentford game was “not trying to press”, more a case that Brentford played clever passes to create time for the passer to spring the likes of Canos.  Barnsley needed to drop off and get men behind the ball, but they didn’t seem to learn.  I doubt we’ll be that naive.  Can we exploit them like Brentford did?  We need Palmer at the tip...and we need to get him in the ball early in the passage of play.  Of course he might not play.  He’s not started more than 2 games on the trot this season, and only completed 90 twice.  Of his 10 starts he’s been subbed off 8 times...only once in those 8 has he got to the 70th minute.  The last 20 is where he can really hurt the opposition, but of course he needs the legs left to do it.  He and LJ need to work on making his defensive workload more efficient.  He needs to better position himself to avoid wasting his defensive runs.  He is only 22, and an undoubted talent.  I think LJ needs to trust him a bit more.

[ExiledAjax]

1 hour ago, Davefevs said:

So City travel to Oakwell tonight, sat in 6th position, knowing a win tonight v bottom club Barnsley would take them level on points with West Brom.  What could possibly go wrong?  If last week’s 6th v 19th tells you nothing, then you’ve probably not been looking too closely at the Championship and that any side can get a result against anyone.

Tonights opponents are bottom, but have recently seen manager Stendel leave, replaced by Adam Murray, and achieved two decent draws v Swansea and West Brom, before narrowly losing to the in-form Huddersfield.

How Do They Line-Up:

It looks massively attacking on the graphic above, but effectively it’s a back 3 with wing-backs, a defensive midfielder and then 2 CMs supporting the front-two.  A bit like us they have two wingers - who sit on the bench!

The Players:

Gonna confess there are quite a few names here I don’t know, nor have seen play.  The only time I’ve seen them for 90 was the recent demolition by Brentford on Sky, and the personnel are different under Murray.  Very, very young squad.

GK: Brad Collins (22) - signed on a free from Chelsea in the summer and conceding on average 2 goals per game.  Previous loans at Burton and FGR.

RWB: Dimitri Cavare (24) - signed from RC Lens (Taylor Moore’s old club), and imho a poor-man’s Mark Little.  Likes to drive forward, and powerful with it, but defensively, pretty poor

CB: Tony Sibbick (20) - signed from AFC Wimbledon.

CB: Mads Andersen (21) - Danish import signed from Horsens, having been a product of Brondby. Tall!

CB: Bambo Diaby (21) - French / Senegalese player signed from Belgian team Lokeren in the summer, having previously been in Italy.

LWB: Jacob Brown (21) - normally a winger but playing wingback in Murray’s system.  Previously at Chesterfield on loan, with a decent scoring record in Lg1 last season.

DM: Kenny Dougall (26) - Aussie midfielder previously with Rotterdam.  Not part of Stendel’s plans, but returned under Murray.

CM: Cameron McGeehan (24) - Northern Irish midfielder formerly of Scunthorpe and Luton.  Busy player with some nice touches, who has an eye for a goal lower down the EFL.

CM: Alex Mowatt (24) - ex-Leeds (and Oxford) left footed midfielder and captain.  Destined for bigger things when he broke through at Leeds but not fulfilled his potential.  Lovely left peg, and likes to get his shots off.  Would be my man to watch, but....

CF: Cauley Woodrow (24) - my man to watch - as if it could’ve been anyone else!! Ex-City loanee from Fulham who previously had loans at Burton and Southend.  It was at Burton where I first saw Cauley as a striker who’d fit in well at City, only for LJ to sign him on loan during 17/18 season with an option to buy.  It never worked out for him here, but he’s since gone on to score a goal every other game for the Tykes and us top scorer with 5 from 11 starts this season, several of which have been very good goals...not the man for a tap-in!

CF: Conor Chaplin (22) - ex-Portsmouth and Coventry advanced player who’ll play off of Cauley.  Useful player and we’ll need to be careful to not face up our defenders.

Other Players of Note:

Mallik Wilkes - winger signed from Leeds having been at Doncaster.

Luke Thomas - another winger signed from Derby having been at Cheltenham (and in our radar).

How Do We Win:

If they persist with the high line at the back, and midfielders who don’t press the passer, then the likes of Weimann could have a field day.  Definitely a game to try to control possession and chances will come.  Let it become end to end, get the crowd behind them, and it could be a tough night.  Difficult to know whether Murray will persist with the back 3, and difficult to know how we will line-up with Moore possibly out and and unsure how ready Kalas and Nagy are, or how Rodri’s sharpness / fitness is coming on.

Prediction:

2-0 away win.  City players realising last weekend was a chance missed, and rectifying it tonight.

First thing that jumps out is just how young that Barnsley squad/team are! Oldest player in the XI is 26!

Every time I see that a team plays with a high line I wish a little bit harder that we could have Palmer playing through balls to Afobe. 

[Guest]

That formation is a weird one, and a bit like how we played last week isn't it?

It is very much like the England 3322 formation at the world cup. Spurs used it a fair bit in champions league games, but always in games against attacking sides like Real Madrid. And it did work for them on those occasions. But I am not really a fan of it. Much prefer 3412 or 343.

I know that's Barnsley and not us, but I wouldn't be surprised if LJ picks a similar team to last week, which will be all wrong if he wants to control it and create chances imo.

[havanatopia]

Very nice write up there Dave. New thread poster nominee i reckon.

[wendyredredrobin]

We need a rethink up top if we are going to win this one.  Andi & Kasey maybe playing in front of a diamond.  It can't be any worse than our last 2 games.

[Septic Peg]

10 minutes ago, havanatopia said:

Very nice write up there Dave. New thread poster nominee i reckon.

Seconded. 

 

Also, can a mod aka @RedM, @Dollymarie, @phantom, @WesM please add Match Day 15 to the subject thread, if @Davefevs doesn't mind?

[Davefevs]

28 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

That formation is a weird one, and a bit like how we played last week isn't it?

It is very much like the England 3322 formation at the world cup. Spurs used it a fair bit in champions league games, but always in games against attacking sides like Real Madrid. And it did work for them on those occasions. But I am not really a fan of it. Much prefer 3412 or 343.

I know that's Barnsley and not us, but I wouldn't be surprised if LJ picks a similar team to last week, which will be all wrong if he wants to control it and create chances imo.

I still wouldn’t mind seeing something like these at some point:

The left one is what I call my lopsided diamond.  The three more defensive midfielders can be as fluid as they like, as long as one always provides cover for the CBs.

The right one, although one only one of-top has COD and KP with licence to get close to Weimann (or whoever up top), but also helps share the pressing duties, which maybe means KP can be more dynamic when he has the ball.

[Davefevs]

8 minutes ago, Septic Peg said:

Seconded. 

 

Also, can a mod aka @RedM, @Dollymarie, @phantom, @WesM please add Match Day 15 to the subject thread, if @Davefevs doesn't mind?

I don’t want to steal your match day thread guys....that has its own reason for being on the forum.  This is part tactical, and part “don’t underestimate the opposition”.  If you feel it adds to the match day thread, feel free to merge it....but don’t let this stop you doing your wonderful match day thread openings.  They are a thing of beauty / comedy.

[Mr Popodopolous]

7 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I still wouldn’t mind seeing something like these at some point:

The left one is what I call my lopsided diamond.  The three more defensive midfielders can be as fluid as they like, as long as one always provides cover for the CBs.

The right one, although one only one of-top has COD and KP with licence to get close to Weimann (or whoever up top), but also helps share the pressing duties, which maybe means KP can be more dynamic when he has the ball.

I like that side a lot- think would need a few more fit but I like the idea of that a lot.

Could also give Palmer on occasion, or possibly even O'Dowda the possibility to burst into space as a false 9 as none of those are what you would call the most orthodox strikers- Weimann is a striker but certainly doesn't have to stay positioned high or central.

[Davefevs]

Just now, Mr Popodopolous said:

I like that side a lot- think would need a few more fit but I like the idea of that a lot.

Could also give Palmer on occasion, or possibly even O'Dowda the possibility to burst into space as a false 9 as none of those are what you would call the most orthodox strikers- Weimann is a striker but certainly doesn't have to stay positioned high or central.

Exactly why I think COD would be a good option in that position.

[Maesknoll Red]

48 minutes ago, Septic Peg said:

Seconded. 

 

Also, can a mod aka @RedM, @Dollymarie, @phantom, @WesM please add Match Day 15 to the subject thread, if @Davefevs doesn't mind?

Done, even though I feel ignored and unloved......

[JamesBCFC]

Sat in Woodall services now so coach driver can have a break.

Didn't sleep at all last night and only managed 30 minutes or so on the coach, so I'll probably fall asleep on my feet at the game.

[RedEyez]

6 minutes ago, JamesBCFC said:

Sat in Woodall services now so coach driver can have a break.

Didn't sleep at all last night and only managed 30 minutes or so on the coach, so I'll probably fall asleep on my feet at the game.

Drugs are bad, mmmkay?

[Guest]

32 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I still wouldn’t mind seeing something like these at some point:

The left one is what I call my lopsided diamond.  The three more defensive midfielders can be as fluid as they like, as long as one always provides cover for the CBs.

The right one, although one only one of-top has COD and KP with licence to get close to Weimann (or whoever up top), but also helps share the pressing duties, which maybe means KP can be more dynamic when he has the ball.

I would have gone with a diamond against Wigan. I would have carried on from the end of that Charlton game. Keep that confidence and momentum.

But instead he went with an extra centre back because of keiffer Moore and big men on set pieces, and Baker got done both times for goals anyway. And we had no attacking intent as a result, and it gave them loads of corners. 

The one problem I have with it though is where is the width coming from. Rowe is a very defensive full back. Periera hasn't been getting forward quite like i thought he would either.

It's not so much when we have the ball down the other end and both naturally join in on the flanks. It is more when we have the ball deeper and we need wide options.

[Maesknoll Red]

Nice write up Dave, it’ll be interesting to see the line and tactics of LJ.  I have been sceptical of him, I’ll admit,  but there is no denying his record is one of steady improvement, I sometimes  wonder if he has neared his limit with us, but again, I admit that has been pushed further back to the recesses of my pessimistic mind, with the potential to be right up there, the home performances often disappoint, that does need addressing. 

 I still see times in games where we revert back to the early days of his tenure, where the players look like strangers, like there is no plan and the on field leadership is missing.  That said, it’s much less than those early days, I can only assume he is learning and adapting.

Fingers crosses it all slots into place tonight for a seamless win.

[Davefevs]

Just now, JonDolman said:

I would have gone with a diamond against Wigan. I would have carried on from the end of that Charlton game. Keep that confidence and momentum.

me too as it happens 

But instead he went with an extra centre back because of keiffer Moore and big men on set pieces, and Baker got done both times for goals anyway. And we had no attacking intent as a result, and it gave them loads of corners.

yes, but bloody good delivery too.  

The one problem I have with it though is where is the width coming from. Rowe is a very defensive full back. Periera hasn't been getting forward quite like i thought he would either.

I’ve deleted this sentence in my head
It's not so much when we have the ball down the other end and both naturally join in on the flanks. It is more when we have the ball deeper and we need wide options.

on Sunday in fairness we went back to Baker too often when over the halfway line, and he can’t use the ball as well as Moore, Williams or Kalas.  But our midfield have got to work harder to give Baker better, simpler passing options too.

 

[Guest]

14 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

 

I would rather we didn't play Baker to be honest. If LJ had to go with a 3 then I actually think Wright on the right and Moore left would have been better against Wigan with Williams central.

Wright is a bit better on the ball in that position imo. His experience at right back has helped. I really am not saying he's good on the ball!

But he knows how to dribble (awkwardly) and use his body to stop anyone taking the ball off him. Seen it quite often when he was at right back when linking with Brownhill. It was kind of effective!

But a more attacking option would be Pereira right of the 3, Moore left and Williams central. Though a gamble, I do like a gamble, Norwich didn't win the league by being really careful every game!

I do however understand that the Pereira idea might be a bad one as I've seen little of him there. But he did play there near the end against Reading.

I just think it offers so much having ball players on each side of the central centre back.

Obviously Moore is now injured. And Kalas back soon. So then it all changes.

But when everyone is fit I predict he will at times go Kalas and Williams in a 2. But when going 3 he will go Kalas - Williams - Moore.

But even that is not perfect as Kalas never looked comfortable wide right of a three for us last season. Though that may be because pack was dropping deep and our 2 side centre backs were pushed out too far wide.

I still think it's a position we need to really strengthen. Long term I'm only really happy with Kalas and Moore. Williams obviously done really well, but I would like us to bring in a couple by next summer.

[jrt55555]

3 hours ago, hodge said:

Lee Johnson to get boo'd by Barnsley fans?

He’s going to be up in the stands given the touchdown ban, so I’m guessing they won’t get the opportunity?

[JamesBCFC]

2 minutes ago, jrt55555 said:

He’s going to be up in the stands given the touchdown ban, so I’m guessing they won’t get the opportunity?

Surely that makes it easier for them?

[Davefevs]

8 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

I would rather we didn't play Baker to be honest. If LJ had to go with a 3 then I actually think Wright on the right and Moore left would have been better against Wigan with Williams central.

Wright is a bit better on the ball in that position imo. His experience at right back has helped. I really am not saying he's good on the ball!

But he knows how to dribble (awkwardly) and use his body to stop anyone taking the ball off him. Seen it quite often when he was at right back when linking with Brownhill. It was kind of effective!

But a more attacking option would be Pereira right of the 3, Moore left and Williams central. Though a gamble, I do like a gamble, Norwich didn't win the league by being really careful every game!

I think Pereira is more than capable at RCB in a 3...the issue at the mo’, is who plays RWB, with Hunt injured!

I do however understand that the Pereira idea might be a bad one as I've seen little of him there. But he did play there near the end against Reading.

he did in another game

I just think it offers so much having ball players on each side of the central centre back.

Obviously Moore is now injured.

We don’t know for sure.  Hope he starts tonight.

And Kalas back soon. So then it all changes.

But when everyone is fit I predict he will at times go Kalas and Williams in a 2. But when going 3 he will go Kalas - Williams - Moore.

But even that is not perfect as Kalas never looked comfortable wide right of a three for us last season. Though that may be because pack was dropping deep and our 2 side centre backs were pushed out too far wide.

Kalas played between Moore and Baker earlier this season.  Could this happen again but Moore and Williams either side of him?  Either could play left or right (imho), and both can play if you wanted their footballing ability over Baker as LCB?

I still think it's a position we need to really strengthen. Long term I'm only really happy with Kalas and Moore. Williams obviously done really well, but I would like us to bring in a couple by next summer.

I really haven’t seen anything of McKenna to form a judgement, but listening to the commentators in Scotland’s recent internationals, he got mentioned several times and is spoken very highly of.  Think there are a small number of other CBs we would be attractive to also.  Shame Hector is going to Fulham.

 

[cidered abroad]

Barnsley four, Bristol seven, was hurriedly blurted out by the ITN newsreader on the Ten O'Clock news on a Tuesday evening in August 1958.

It followed a 6-1 thrashing of Rotherham in the opening match of the season at Ashton Gate.

So I set off to Sheffield United on the following Saturday full of hope.

Lost 0-4. Typical City! Build you up and then drop you in the brown stuff.

I'll settle for a dull 1-0 win tonight. COYREDS.

[Super]

Watkins in?

[Alessandro]

Kalas!

[Garland-sweden]

5 minutes ago, Super said:

Watkins in?

Why not.