Credit where it is due

[The Dolman Pragmatist]

8 minutes ago, Cole Not Gas said:

Some of us actually like rational, sometimes, as opposed to absurd abuse most give the club we support!

Much improved, all City fans happy for 89 mins - not every away game we can say that. Onwards now for Sunday. Keep the faith, keep the support of the club, ease off on the blame and dont get personally vindictive just because we are behind a keyboard. My opinion and I love it

Well said mate.

[Davefevs]

6 hours ago, BCFC31 said:

This is completely against my point that I am saying the players are technically atrocious though isn't it

They aren’t though, that is just your excuse because a young, progressive, modern, on-the grass coach has a flawed ideaology about his best to play this game at this level at this club.

The sane flawed ideaology from the owner that he can get out of this division with a young coach.  He is hell-bent on proving that.  What he should be doing is trying to find the best coach, age is irrelevant.

And to add young coach does NOT (Necessarily) EQUAL High press, forward thinking attacking football.

In Liam Manning’s case it is almost the opposite.

25 minutes ago, 1960maaan said:

Disagree , there are some technically good players in the squad . The next bit is worrying as he seems to be taking the hard running bit away while not adding anything.  When we have struggled in games we have worked hard and been fitter towards the end. Last night I saw players looking like they were carrying knocks and looking leggy during the least busy period for some time. 
Not saying that Pearson was perfect , but the togetherness and fitness looked well above what they do now.

There is another , totally Bristol City , or at least Lansdown route. They back him with money, but don't trust him with it so it will be spent on BT's and the Clubs choices. They then won't be exactly what he wants anyway, probably won't fit the brief and we carry on going the way we are with higher wage bill and another bloated squad . 

Lansdown's version of Groundhog day .

Yes, I agree Mike, taking the good elements away.

No, Pearson wasn’t perfect, but he was building a squad with a realistic chance of competing.

I don’t expect people to agree, but I think they need to wake up and smell the coffee.  A summer window isn’t the answer, it probably compounds things.

[RedJim]

36 minutes ago, Cole Not Gas said:

Bye then

Very droll.   I'm not going anywhere.

[Sir Geoff]

35 minutes ago, Cole Not Gas said:

Some of us actually like rational, sometimes, as opposed to absurd abuse most give the club we support!

Much improved, all City fans happy for 89 mins - not every away game we can say that. Onwards now for Sunday. Keep the faith, keep the support of the club, ease off on the blame and dont get personally vindictive just because we are behind a keyboard. My opinion and I love it

Welcome back. We've missed you the last couple of weeks.

[TV Tom]

27 minutes ago, AshtonGreat said:

We gave them a really good game in the second half. I imagine most Ipswich fans would say that was one of the tougher games they've had all season

Absolutely, we played Luton away around about this time last season when they were also second, now that was a dogs dinner of a performance

[Swede]

6 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

They aren’t though, that is just your excuse because a young, progressive, modern, on-the grass coach has a flawed ideaology about his best to play this game at this level at this club.

The sane flawed ideaology from the owner that he can get out of this division with a young coach.  He is hell-bent on proving that.  What he should be doing is trying to find the best coach, age is irrelevant.

And to add young coach does NOT (Necessarily) EQUAL High press, forward thinking attacking football.

In Liam Manning’s case it is almost the opposite.

Yes, I agree Mike, taking the good elements away.

No, Pearson wasn’t perfect, but he was building a squad with a realistic chance of competing.

I don’t expect people to agree, but I think they need to wake up and smell the coffee.  A summer window isn’t the answer, it probably compounds things.

Exactly the point Dave & others far more knowledgeable than me like Silvio Dante & Spudski have come to the same conclusion. He's just not the right fit. The performance last night was probably more down to the players will to succeed rather than his coaching credentials and when he had the opportunity to apply them, he didn't or couldn't.  A summer transfer window won't make any difference, it will just make it worse.

[Numero Uno]

35 minutes ago, AshtonGreat said:

We gave them a really good game in the second half. I imagine most Ipswich fans would say that was one of the tougher games they've had all season

I’m not sure why a number of people are talking up last night’s DEFEAT in isolation as if it’s a turning point when, for the last ten and a half weeks, our record is shockingly bad. It’s marooned at the bottom of the table by miles form. 35-36 points per season form.

[Numero Uno]

11 minutes ago, TV Tom said:

Absolutely, we played Luton away around about this time last season when they were also second, now that was a dogs dinner of a performance

Rather than a dogs dinner of a quarter of a season……

[TV Tom]

2 hours ago, Major Isewater said:

Why couldn’t Manning get the players up for the three precedent games ?

Maybe for the same reason NP couldn’t get the players up for many games ?

[RedJim]

7 hours ago, Supersonic Robin said:

I was planning to write something similar, but don't think I could've put it better myself.

Today was undoubtedly an improved performance, but ultimately it's a 4th consecutive defeat for us.

There have been a fair few posts on the forum tonight along the lines of - "Ipswich are quality, we gave it a go. What more could we want?"

Granted, Ipswich are flying at the moment, but we were 2-1 up with 15 minutes to play against a team in the same division as us. How can we come away with 0 points from that position and simply be happy that we gave them a decent game?

Do we really have that little self respect? That little self belief? That little ambition?

If we come away from a night like tonight feeling positive, what does that say about where we are as a club? And what does that say about who we are as a club?

[TV Tom]

1 minute ago, Numero Uno said:

Rather than a dogs dinner of a quarter of a season……

Pearsons quarter season wasn’t that bad 

[TV Tom]

7 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

Rather than a dogs dinner of a quarter of a season……

Pearsons quarter season wasn’t that bad 

[WeAreThePigs]

Thought we were excellent for 70 minutes, ran out of steam and Ipswich have the squad depth to bring on 4 players who would get into our first team - LM should have brought Robert’s on for Mehmeti and blocked the left hand side.

[oldstandrobin]

10 hours ago, ChippenhamRed said:

This is what we’re reduced to now. We’ve lost our fourth game in a row to a club who’ve just spent four years in League One, but it’s OK because “we gave it a go”. So what if it felt different. It felt different against Southampton and we’ve lost every game since then. I have zero faith in Manning now, and even less faith in the people that put him there.

Meanwhile Ipswich join the long list of clubs that emerge from the depths of lower league football and pass us on the way up.

Sick of this club.

Cant help but agree CR, after supporting them for so long, sick to death of being overtaken by likes of Bournemouth and many more, we now face yet another period of possibly entering a relegation battle, will NEVER see Prem football in my lifetime at AG I'm afraid.Lansdown Snr and Jnr have betrayed genuine City supporters.

[TV Tom]

Come on people, irrespective of people’s opinion on Manning/NP no one can deny that was a very good performance last night, as a rule when playing away against a top two club we barely raise a glove

[Alessandro]

The way I describe last night was like a boxing match.

We were a weight division below, but came out positive and swinging - landing some good blows. Ahead on points.

But instead of being ready for the inevitable comeback from our superior opponent and looking to box clever - we kept looking for the knock out blow, left ourselves wide open, and got knocked out.

So you can say, oh well done, we’ve had a go and showed some spirit and looked good at times, but we still got knocked out. It was naive. Against lesser opponents it might work, but ultimately again we seem unable to play the right game for the right opponent.

Interestingly though - I’ve got a question - if I and plenty others can see that, did Manning:

A) Not see that and froze in the headlights again, failing to adapt to the game situation again. 

or

B) See it and think, no we stay the course, regardless of result?

I suppose what I’m asking is, did anyone else have the feeling Manning is now playing ‘his way’ almost like he’s been told he has a free pass - “just go out and play your game” from above or is he being stubborn to show, “this is how I play, take it or leave it and back me in the summer if you want us to close that gap”?

Because surely he can see what us layman can, right?

 

[red panda]

Some of the posts on here are embarrassing.  No Ipswich are not Man City or Real Madrid, but they are second, have comfortably more than 2ppg, and were in good form (having won their last five) with lots of confidence.  From where we started - three really depressing and disjointed performances - a competitive performance away to Ipswich is progress.

[pillred]

10 hours ago, PFree said:

Okay, beaten in the end by a side who were better than us, but fair play, we gave it a real go. Along with most others, I’ve been really disappointed after the last three games but tonight felt different.

Finally, well done to our fans who made the journey, horrible place to get to and it takes flipping ages.

 

Better than us? we were beaten in the end yes, but watching the game it was only right at the end where we lost it had Wells's shot gone in to make it 2-0 or Mehmet's wonder strike went in who knows how the game would have turned out, any neutral watching last night for 80 minutes would not have known who were the better side, am I delusional? maybe, to my mind we just seemed to run out of inspiration, had we held on for a few more minutes I think maybe your opinion might have been different.   

Edited March 6 by pillred

[W-S-M Seagull]

8 hours ago, Supersonic Robin said:

I was planning to write something similar, but don't think I could've put it better myself.

Today was undoubtedly an improved performance, but ultimately it's a 4th consecutive defeat for us.

There have been a fair few posts on the forum tonight along the lines of - "Ipswich are quality, we gave it a go. What more could we want?"

Granted, Ipswich are flying at the moment, but we were 2-1 up with 15 minutes to play against a team in the same division as us. How can we come away with 0 points from that position and simply be happy that we gave them a decent game?

Do we really have that little self respect? That little self belief? That little ambition?

If we come away from a night like tonight feeling positive, what does that say about where we are as a club? And what does that say about who we are as a club?

Let's be honest here. The only people who are being positive about us LOSING is Liam Mannings biggest fans. 

Yea we fought hard etc and had a few chances but it was nothing to write home about. People are talking like it was the performance of the century. Ipswich concede a lot of goals whilst scoring a lot. Rotherham scored 3 there for example recently. So us scoring twice wasn't really as special as people are making it out to be. 

The first half we barely offered anything going forward. 

[1960maaan]

I'm seeing a lot of "much improved" , is it though ?

Good Performance.
M'Boro (for 45) and Southampton sides that give us room to play. Good performance, importantly we score at good times and got blocks in when it counted.

Poor performance
QPR ,Sheff W and Cardiff , restrict space and get us to play even slower . Limit chances and don't give us room to break.

Decent performance 
Ipswich gave us room to play and we could hit them on the break , or pinch the ball high. We missed the chance at a great time and didn't get the blocks in when we needed to. 

This isn't a much improved performance , it is continuing a pattern . We will probably do ok against Swansea if they open up and give room and time. 
We have a run of games against teams that may well come at us, this could be a time we pick up enough points and may even look good at times. The time to judge progress is when we play a team that sits and restricts space , lets see how we go then. 

[TonyTonyTony]

2 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Let's be honest here. The only people who are being positive about us LOSING is Liam Mannings biggest fans. 

Yea we fought hard etc and had a few chances but it was nothing to write home about. People are talking like it was the performance of the century. Ipswich concede a lot of goals whilst scoring a lot. Rotherham scored 3 there for example recently. So us scoring twice wasn't really as special as people are making it out to be. 

The first half we barely offered anything going forward. 

Where is the issue, with looking at the positives of the performance? You are so glass half empty it's ridiculous.

For me, it was a decent away performance against a team at the top of the league. Far better than the last few games, where we have been terrible.

I suppose you have little choice but to be negative, saying as your mind is made up already.

[milo1111]

There is no credit due because we’ve just lost our fourth game in a row and we are in dreadful form over the last few months.

lets see how we go Sunday. If it’s anything like the last two home performances we are going to be in a heap of trouble as they were absolutely shocking.

[bearded_red]

We were always going to be better against a team like Ipswich than we’ve been in the last three games. Surely everyone knew that? Surely everyone who watches us play knew that? 
 

It’s a nonsense to suggest ‘oh if only we’d played like that in the last three games’. We can’t play like that because the opposition let us have the ball. And when the opposition let us have the ball we play crap football at walking pace 70 yards away from the opposition’s goal.

This utterly small time reaction that we should be somehow over the moon with last night is stunning. This wasn’t a plucky non league team getting beat at Man City or Liverpool in the third round. 

We were fine for 70 minutes, we could have got something out the game. We didn’t, we lost, and let’s be honest it could just as easily have been a couple more in the last few minutes. It’s four defeats on the bounce, it’s 9 points in 13.

Celebrating because we weren’t atrocious and didn’t get thrashed at Ipswich. Was this the aim when we sacked Nigel Pearson?

[Keepers Ball]

10 hours ago, Lordofthebling said:

Fair play, can't fault that, either team could've won that. Seeing where we currently are, .can't grumble.

On to the next one.

Sorry fella but its that very attitude as to why this is City is absolutely backward when it comes to success. Size of the bloody place yet we have this apathetic mindset of it will do. 

[milo1111]

4 minutes ago, Keepers Ball said:

Sorry fella but it’s that very attitude as to why this is City is absolutely backward when it comes to success. Size of the bloody place yet we have this apathetic mindset of it will do. 

All day long. I’m so sick of it. NP was slowly solving the soft underbelly that we’ve had for years (bar cotts double season) and now it’s back in full swing. Absolutely soul destroying.

[38MC]

58 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

 A summer window isn’t the answer, it probably compounds things.

Spot on. Not only that, it's potentially a dangerous path to follow.

LM even if backed is only going to have the funds for 3 or so quality additions to the first team squad to play 'his way', because technical players ain't cheap - look at figures quoted for the number 10 we were after. And then they'd probably just get injured anyway, or be dragged down to playing at a mediocre level. 

We will lose Conway and we will lose James, we will lose King from the dressing room and I dare say we might lose one or two more. We will then be left with a mixed match of players, some able to play in a counter-attacking system, some in a recycle the ball and go again system. But there will be a large incompatibility and a total imbalance in the squad.

Manning has already shown he cannot get the players to perform in his system, and without giving him the licence to go and get 7-8 first teamers (and back the horse the whole way FFP wise - and why the fk would we do that?!), it just cannot work in my mind. We can't even look to the academy for these technically strong players to step up as the pipeline doesn't seem there for Manning-ball. 

The only way I see we can continue with Manning is to trust that he can (eventually) coach what is here. That seems absolutely foolish to me based on what we've seen so far. But if he goes into the summer he simply cannot get the chance to make wholesale changes or significant signings. He hasn't shown enough to be trusted to spend money that we will carry for 3 years from an FFP position.

So to me, the only way we keep him is to trust the coaching process and not let him hamstring us further down the line because he hasn't yet shown enough to trust him with money. And to me that's destined to fail. 

[Red-Robbo]

I think you can take last night as "much improved" while still despairing of where we are. That isn’t celebrating a defeat, it's acknowledging that we put in a reasonable performance in an away match against an in-form promotion contender. We weren't thumped 7-0 as one Otiber suggested we might be.

It's at this stage if the season that the bottom clubs that might escape the drop (Rotherham have already given up the ghost) are at their most dangerous. Players are desperate to retain their Championship status (and wages) and minds are focused like never before. Every season we lose to at least one club you look at before the match and think "that should be 3 points in the bag". 

So, losing to hitherto poor clubs is not just a Liam Manning phenomenon.  What was concerning about the past three losses was the manner of defeat. We looked like we could hardly be arsed. Out of ideas, not as fit, poorly set-up and coached. 

If the performance at Portman Road can instill some self-belief in the side and get it back on track to record the not many more points we need for safety, that'd be good.

It's a big IF however. 

 

[Roe]

It was a "much improved" performance from absolutely shite baseline.

And even then we still lost and got battered last 20 minutes once Ipswich turned up

[pillred]

6 minutes ago, Roe said:

It was a "much improved" performance from absolutely shite baseline.

And even then we still lost and got battered last 20 minutes once Ipswich turned up

The last 20 is pushing it, 10 I will give you.

[W-S-M Seagull]

1 hour ago, TonyTonyTony said:

Where is the issue, with looking at the positives of the performance? You are so glass half empty it's ridiculous.

For me, it was a decent away performance against a team at the top of the league. Far better than the last few games, where we have been terrible.

I suppose you have little choice but to be negative, saying as your mind is made up already.

What is there to be positive about Tonyx3? We are on a run of 23 points from 21 games and have lost 4 in a row.

If you care to look back at my posts from last season you'll see I was positive about performances in games that we lost. 

I'm calling a duck a duck. 

For me, I expected us to put in a better performance against Ipswich because its the same sort of game as Southampton, West Ham, Forest etc. Games that suit us. So we were only better by default really and in the end we were totally outclassed by Ipswich so in some respects you can say we've gone backwards. 

What can we take from last night that will be relevant to the Swansea game?