Guest ashtonyate Posted October 16, 2005 Report Share Posted October 16, 2005 Praise be that we've got something one hundred times better than the BCFC academy - a proper manager at last !!!!! And well done to the Charlton academy and Charlton FC for their two academy players that played in our central defence yesterday !!!!This is why I started this post how come a team has to bring in young player from another club to cover when it should have players from its own academy at that standard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nibor Posted October 16, 2005 Report Share Posted October 16, 2005 This is why I started this post how come a team has to bring in young player from another club to cover when it should have players from its own academy at that standard.It's quite simple.We don't have any centre backs in the academy that are ready for first team action at the moment. Were you under the illusion that all the academy players should be able to step up immediately at the drop of a hat?Nibor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ashtonyate Posted October 16, 2005 Report Share Posted October 16, 2005 It's quite simple.We don't have any centre backs in the academy that are ready for first team action at the moment. Were you under the illusion that all the academy players should be able to step up immediately at the drop of a hat?By the way, where's the point by point response you were going to make? You didn't really respond to anything you just said you didn't think the players were very good.NiborI cant spend hours on emails if you send me one point at a time i will answer it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nibor Posted October 16, 2005 Report Share Posted October 16, 2005 I cant spend hours on emails if you send me one point at a time i will answer itNever mind, I'd edited that bit out because I'd decided it was futile, I didn't realise you were reading it at the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dolman_man Posted October 16, 2005 Report Share Posted October 16, 2005 "You have chosen to ignore all posts from: ashtonyate. · View this post · Un-ignore ashtonyate"Ahh, good ol' Ignore button. What a superb idea. I've done the same thing. The silence is wonderful. Long live the academy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bh_red Posted October 16, 2005 Report Share Posted October 16, 2005 I cant spend hours on emails if you send me one point at a time i will answer itRUBBISH.......................YOU DON'T ANSWER EVERY VALID POINT!!! YOU JUST SKIM AROUND THE VALID POINTS AND PICK UP ON PICKY ISSUES!how can you judge any academy player when don't watch them!!!! BLOODY ARMCHAIR FANS! plus if it was down to me I'd invest MORE money into the academy the results so far have been GREAT since it was started! We really should cast the net further, there are not many clubs in Devon or Cornwall and surely there must be some talented players down there ready to be groomed for the 1st team!http://www.otib.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=46207What do we think of Ashtonyate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex_BCFC Posted October 16, 2005 Report Share Posted October 16, 2005 I cant spend hours on emails if you send me one point at a time i will answer itWhy can't you just spend hours on here answering all the points you've missed?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ashtonyate Posted October 16, 2005 Report Share Posted October 16, 2005 RUBBISH.......................YOU DON'T ANSWER EVERY VALID POINT!!! YOU JUST SKIM AROUND THE VALID POINTS AND PICK UP ON PICKY ISSUES!how can you judge any academy player when don't watch them!!!! BLOODY ARMCHAIR FANS! plus if it was down to me I'd invest MORE money into the academy the results so far have been GREAT since it was started! We really should cast the net further, there are not many clubs in Devon or Cornwall and surely there must be some talented players down there ready to be groomed for the 1st team!http://www.otib.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=46207What do we think of Ashtonyate?Its Money that makes me an armchair supporter I was watching City before the best bit of you ran down your mother leg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bh_red Posted October 16, 2005 Report Share Posted October 16, 2005 Sell your PC and spend the money on a season ticket! You will be doing us and the club a favour!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ashtonyate Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 Sell your PC and spend the money on a season ticket! You will be doing us and the club a favour!!!Then next year sell the tv yea great no i do think so, I shall go down at christmas to see a game Also I need my computer to point out what a waste of money the academy is. just anwser this if we had got into the 1st division how many of the players the academy have produced would be good enough to play in it and if we were near the top how many would be good enough to play in the prem 2 Lita & Roseinor In 7 years of Academy we have produced 2 high quaily players its Crap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Frank Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 just anwser this if we had got into the 1st division how many of the players the academy have produced would be good enough to play in it Liam RoseniorLeroy LitaAaron BrownTommy DohertyDanny ColesJoe AnyinsahThey all currently play at that level or above so are presumably seen as good enough by people with a bit more knowledge of the game than you.Add to that Skuse being trailed by at least one Premiership club, Cotterill who was offered contracts by 2 or 3 Premiership clubs and Clayton Fortune who Preston offered 400k for and that's 9 players.Also take a look at the under 18 results this season and you will see they are beating their counterparts from higher divisions regularly. There seems to be an even better crop coming through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ashtonyate Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 Liam RoseniorLeroy LitaAaron BrownTommy DohertyDanny ColesJoe AnyinsahThey all currently play at that level or above so are presumably seen as good enough by people with a bit more knowledge of the game than you.Add to that Skuse being trailed by at least one Premiership club, Cotterill who was offered contracts by 2 or 3 Premiership clubs and Clayton Fortune who Preston offered 400k for and that's 9 players.Also take a look at the under 18 results this season and you will see they are beating their counterparts from higher divisions regularly. There seems to be an even better crop coming through.Yes I agree with the list now would you pay 4 1/2 million for those player Cotterill Golbourne Skuse all look good prospects at the moment but you don't know how good they will be in a few years time.The reason I say that is would Preston give 400k for Fortune now and look at Coles at 19 he looked so good but has never improved Andrew Jordan look good at 19 where is he now.You can get loads of good looking youngster in the early years but when they get a bit older they just fade a way. I am sorry to say the academy is not producing the quailty players it should be and puting the club in to debt at the same now I know a lot of fan on this don't like what i say but i feel someone must point out the facts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Frank Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 Yes I agree with the list now would you pay 4 1/2 million for those player Cotterill Golbourne Skuse all look good prospects at the moment but you don't know how good they will be in a few years time.The reason I say that is would Preston give 400k for Fortune now and look at Coles at 19 he looked so good but has never improved Andrew Jordan look good at 19 where is he now.You can get loads of good looking youngster in the early years but when they get a bit older they just fade a way. I am sorry to say the academy is not producing the quailty players it should be and puting the club in to debt at the same now I know a lot of fan on this don't like what i say but i feel someone must point out the facts.You asked a question and I gave you the answer. You've now replied with a load of inarticulate crap and labelled it as facts.What is a fact is all the players I listed are playing at a higher level than where they started their career or they are being courted by clubs at a higher level. Yet you claim that none of them have improved and they have faded away. Not only that, you then label the rubbish you spout as fact.It could be argued that moaning fans who never go to games or put money into the club and always have an excuse for not buying a ticket are putting the club in debt. Know anyone like that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ashtonyate Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 You asked a question and I gave you the answer. You've now replied with a load of inarticulate crap and labelled it as facts.What is a fact is all the players I listed are playing at a higher level than where they started their career or they are being courted by clubs at a higher level. Yet you claim that none of them have improved and they have faded away. Not only that, you then label the rubbish you spout as fact.It could be argued that moaning fans who never go to games or put money into the club and always have an excuse for not buying a ticket are putting the club in debt. Know anyone like that?Now read my post again I agred with your list and asked if you would pay 4 1/2million for those player, i when on to say that the new bunch of player look good now but as in the past players look good at 18 but never get much better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Frank Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 Now read my post again I agred with your list and asked if you would pay 4 1/2million for those player, i when on to say that the new bunch of player look good now but as in the past players look good at 18 but never get much betterI would but I can't be arsed with you anymore. Many people before me have tried to explain, but you are either too ignorant/rude or dim to listen and accept a single point they make or take the time to answer in a coherent way.Little point discussing anything with someone like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ashtonyate Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 I would but I can't be arsed with you anymore. Many people before me have tried to explain, but you are either too ignorant/rude or dim to listen and accept a single point they make or take the time to answer in a coherent way.Little point discussing anything with someone like that.Fair enough but you put some points and i countered them that what you call debating Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Frank Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 Fair enough but you put some points and i countered them that what you call debatingI refer you to my previous reply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bh_red Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 Give up frank the bloke is a fool, if he got off his butt and got himself a job he might actually be able to go to matches and see for himself!Some people claim to be fans, but this bloke is just a moran he never goes to game so is in no position to judge anything.You can justify till your blue in the face and the bloke just overlooks everything of any valid point........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex_BCFC Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 Liam RoseniorLeroy LitaAaron BrownTommy DohertyDanny ColesJoe AnyinsahThey all currently play at that level or above so are presumably seen as good enough by people with a bit more knowledge of the game than you.A.Brown doesn't really play at the level above. He is at QPR, yes. Is he good enough- nowhere near. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bh_red Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 He is good enough, just hasn't really fully recovered from injury yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex_BCFC Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 He is good enough, just hasn't really fully recovered from injury yet.He wasn't that great for us so what makes you think he will make it?! One good game in five will not be anywhere near good enough in the championship. You only have to look at Carey to see how average players do there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rednotblue Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 I give you Crewe a team who have a fantatsic youth policy and are in a league higher then us.Do you think every player they have produced and sold on have come through their under 5 teams?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purple_monkey_dishwasher Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 I give you Crewe a team who have a fantatsic youth policy and are in a league higher then us.Do you think every player they have produced and sold on have come through their under 5 teams??I think this was the first point I ever made to Ashtonyate - it seems like years ago now. He told me it was a stupid thing to say then, and I doubt he's changed his mind since. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bh_red Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 SPOT ON!!!!!It's the perfect point of view of how an academy system works!!! they are constantly getting in players from other clubs on short term basis to cover for any academy short comings!though saying that.........how many real quality players have they produced???hmmmm......lets face it David Platt was never good enough for the Premiership, which is why he went off to play in Italy for their poxy league!!!oh wait, now I'm sounding like Ashtonyate! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ashtonyate Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 SPOT ON!!!!!It's the perfect point of view of how an academy system works!!! they are constantly getting in players from other clubs on short term basis to cover for any academy short comings!though saying that.........how many real quality players have they produced???hmmmm......lets face it David Platt was never good enough for the Premiership, which is why he went off to play in Italy for their poxy league!!!oh wait, now I'm sounding like Ashtonyate!City has never had anyone near Platts class in fact if you take out Lita & rosenior the rest have been very average and no better than you could pick up from premership club cast offs now thats the truth, all of you must be daft if you think the rest are worth 3 1/2 million pounds thats what it has cost the club to produce them and thats an under estimation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bh_red Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 No. They are not, are you just plain stupid or are you that stupid that you can't accept that you are actually in the wrong, everyone has proved that but you are unwilling to listen to any reason! You are also ignoring the fact that Crewe have a more than proven academy system which has taken the about 20years to get fully running to the way it is now.Take away Lita and Rosenior from the equation.Coles £1m bid rejectedA Brown £750k rejectedFortune £400k rejected.Hill went for £100, but more likely worth £400k.Anaiysh went for £200kin addition to Rosenior and LitaALL THESE PLAYERS ARE PLAYING HIGHER LEVEL FOOTBALL! and are better players than we currently have picked up from Exit Trials! plus we still have the likes of Cotterill and Skuse left!If we had received the true value for these players we would have got at £2.25m, in addition to the true worth of Rosenior then these players would have more than made the academy profitable.We have had NOT ONE! Premiership cast off, that has truely proved them self at this level, Orr, Brown and Gillespie are the only players we have picked up and none of them have truely established themselves in our team for a long period of time (i.e a full season!) they have shown small bits of potential but nothing has been full realised just yet!where as Hill, Coles, Brown and Fortune have made many appearance for the club and proved themselves at this level and have now made the step upI'm awaiting you ignoring this post!Though as you have never seen any of the exit trial players play how can you judge? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex_BCFC Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 No. They are not, are you just plain stupid or are you that stupid that you can't accept that you are actually in the wrong, everyone has proved that but you are unwilling to listen to any reason! You are also ignoring the fact that Crewe have a more than proven academy system which has taken the about 20years to get fully running to the way it is now.Take away Lita and Rosenior from the equation.Coles £1m bid rejectedA Brown £750k rejectedFortune £400k rejected.Hill went for £100, but more likely worth £400k.Anaiysh went for £200kin addition to Rosenior and LitaALL THESE PLAYERS ARE PLAYING HIGHER LEVEL FOOTBALL! and are better players than we currently have picked up from Exit Trials! plus we still have the likes of Cotterill and Skuse left!If we had received the true value for these players we would have got at £2.25m, in addition to the true worth of Rosenior then these players would have more than made the academy profitable.We have had NOT ONE! Premiership cast off, that has truely proved them self at this level, Orr, Brown and Gillespie are the only players we have picked up and none of them have truely established themselves in our team for a long period of time (i.e a full season!) they have shown small bits of potential but nothing has been full realised just yet!where as Hill, Coles, Brown and Fortune have made many appearance for the club and proved themselves at this level and have now made the step upI'm awaiting you ignoring this post!Though as you have never seen any of the exit trial players play how can you judge?Fair enough points bh_red except for the A.Brown one. I don't remember anyone being mad enough to offer to buy A.Brown, especially not for 750k. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wed wobin Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 Fair enough points bh_red except for the A.Brown one. I don't remember anyone being mad enough to offer to buy A.Brown, especially not for 750k.West Brom made an offer but I thought it was 600k ish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex_BCFC Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 West Brom made an offer but I thought it was 600k ishYeah it was 600k. How mad were we to turn that down. Rather like the offer for Fortune from Preston! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nibor Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 Some corrections. Coles bid was £500k from Cardiff and rejected. I thought the Aaron Brown one was £750k from WBA and rejected. Fortune was £400k from Preston and accepted but the player rejected the move.Ashtonyate you're again ignoring things:- you are thinking only in terms of transfer fees not other costs- ignoring cash from selling players? (£2m not £3.5m)- these "very average" players are playing at a higher level than usA player we sign for 200-300k is going to get a big signing on fee and immediately be on "senior" wages regardless of age because the size of the fee justifies it and because we're often competing against other clubs.An academy player going pro with us will get a relatively tiny signing on fee and in general lower wages since they're younger, and also we're less likely to be competing.An academy player who makes it has a large value due to their youth ie Lita (provided we don't mess up the contracts) whereas a signing is generally over the age of 24 and free to leave for nothing at the end of their contract.You keep making unsupported statements about the quality of the players but the fact that a number of them have been holding down starting places in teams at our level and above proves you wrong.Nibor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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