Derby County

[Davefevs]

32 minutes ago, billywedlock said:

How did Derby get to a £25m HMRC debt ?

By a blatant disregard for paying bills due.  That doesn’t happen because of cashflow issues, that happens because the owner made a conscious decision that he wanted something to pick up the tab.  What a tosser.

[downendcity]

42 minutes ago, billywedlock said:

But why did HMRC not issue a winding up petition? They did at Bolton for 1.5 m . They let it get out of control which is unlike them 

Morris must have told them that settlement of the tax bill was imminent!

[Mr Popodopolous]

The winding up petition bit...is this another piece of the jigsaw?

Seemingly they did albeit the debt would have been undoubtedly lower at this juncture issue one on Jan 10th 2020...and it was withdrawn on Jan 16th 2020.

The other odd aspect is that if you google winding up petitions football clubs- they're not uncommon and usually get moved on, settled, kicked down the road, they don't actually tend to result in a club getting wound up at least not one of the 92 but they are newsworthy- I'd suggest the bigger the club the bigger the story.

Yet this was found out or reported on only once administration had occurred, some 20 months on.

Apologies cannot link it right now but there is something on Twitter confirming the fact yet total radio silence for 19-20 months by any and every media outlet.

Perhaps they only get reported on when it goes to court or causes administration, I don't know enough to say- perhaps the mere act of winding up but withdrawing keeps it out of the public domain?

Good thread below anyway- it's included within there somewhere.

 

Edited March 29, 2022 by Mr Popodopolous

[PHILINFRANCE]

I see that Mel's £80M stadium is now being offered at a cut down price of £22M.

Bargain, or does anybody think it might perhaps have been slightly overvalued ?

[downendcity]

10 minutes ago, PHILINFRANCE said:

I see that Mel's £80M stadium is now being offered at a cut down price of £22M.

Bargain, or does anybody think it might perhaps have been slightly overvalued ?

I think you are using 'slightly' in the same way that 'imminent' is used in connection with DCFC!

 

 

[Mr Popodopolous]

There is an awkward question to answer- and the EFL need to be right on the case here.

Such a deal can be engineered whereby the MSD loan is paid in return for the stadium returning but here is the problem...

1. Valuer whose word was stated for Derby and indeed a key reason they won that aspect, stated a Fair Rent of £4.16m per year. This would count against FFP. Might add, that Aston Villa, Birmingham, Reading and Sheffield Wednesday are all in the 4-5% of yield per annum so that rent is consistent.
2. Derby have claimed rent of £1.1m per year based on some formula of days usage but that might have been because the subsidiaries also pay rent- Club DCFC, Stadia DCFC, perhaps even but perhaps not DCFC Academy- this should appear in the consolidated not the club if indeed it appears (they've neglected to release any accounts for 3 years for any of these).  Unclear if it's club or consolidator.
3. You cannot just because of a change of ownership reconsolidate it just like that. As such the stadium company and the club FFP group- @Hxj covered this some months ago need to be firewalled. New stadium company or Gellaw Newco 202 to the new owner maybe? If you reconsolidate it that is cake and eat it massively...there needs to be some kind of rent even if it's only on paper or covered by loans to justify the original transaction. If reconsolidated that rent could cancel itself out so something has to be done moving forward- perhaps the EFL push back on any plans to reconsolidate the stadium and club companies?

Edited March 30, 2022 by Mr Popodopolous

[REDOXO]

Loving their forum, apparently it is not EFL, Couhig, Gibson, Quantuma, Mel Morris and Uncle Tom Cobblies fault anymore......its OTIB. 

[downendcity]

20 minutes ago, REDOXO said:

Loving their forum, apparently it is not EFL, Couhig, Gibson, Quantuma, Mel Morris and Uncle Tom Cobblies fault anymore......its OTIB. 

No - it’s all Mr Popodopolous’s fault!

[chinapig]

33 minutes ago, REDOXO said:

Loving their forum, apparently it is not EFL, Couhig, Gibson, Quantuma, Mel Morris and Uncle Tom Cobblies fault anymore......its OTIB. 

You mean they have sussed that we are the secret masterminds behind the global conspiracy against plucky Derby County and that Morris was just our front man?

Don't mention that Quantuma are actually working to our orders. I mentioned it once but I think I got away with it.

Edited March 30, 2022 by chinapig

[Hxj]

2 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

perhaps the EFL push back on any plans to reconsolidate the stadium and club companies?

The agreed decision with Derby contains the following order:

"vii)  Make no changes to reporting entities for P&S purposes or accounting treatments without full prior disclosure and written agreement from the EFL."

I think that that helps significantly,

[SBB]

 

[Bristol Rob]

I haven't followed this as closely as some, but have the Supporters tried to buy the stadium from Mel?

They have had loads of time to get organised, devised a share package, spoken to lenders and all that sort of thing.

[downendcity]

9 minutes ago, Hxj said:

The agreed decision with Derby contains the following order:

"vii)  Make no changes to reporting entities for P&S purposes or accounting treatments without full prior disclosure and written agreement from the EFL."

I think that that helps significantly,

Perhaps prior disclosure and written consent is imminent. 

[chinapig]

11 minutes ago, SBB said:

 

As usual they discount this story and claim Percy knows nothing and/or is making it up.  They don't seem to understand that journalists have sources, they just don't go around telling the world who those sources are.

They do the same with the likes of Matt Slater and Kieran Maguire.

Still, Morris may yet come to the rescue and regain hero status perhaps. Which would be a case of "ok, I burned your house down but look, here's a caravan to live in".

[Port Said Red]

5 hours ago, downendcity said:

No - it’s all Mr Popodopolous’s fault!

 

4 hours ago, chinapig said:

You mean they have sussed that we are the secret masterminds behind the global conspiracy against plucky Derby County and that Morris was just our front man?

Don't mention that Quantuma are actually working to our orders. I mentioned it once but I think I got away with it.

@Mr Popodopolous in his secret lair 

 

[downendcity]

21 minutes ago, Port Said Red said:

 

@Mr Popodopolous in his secret lair 

 

 

Perhaps he’s more Dr Evil!

 

[GreedyHarry]

3 hours ago, SBB said:

 

What I don’t get about this, is the tweet perpetuates the idea that the EFL are responsible and need to sort things out. If WRDCFC had stuck to the financial rules put in place by the EFL then it is unlikely they would have got into such a deep financial mess that they end up on the brink of extinction. Their old owner needs to be held accountable. Nobody else in my view.

Edited March 30, 2022 by GreedyHarry

[chinapig]

27 minutes ago, Port Said Red said:

 

@Mr Popodopolous in his secret lair 

 

Under Bemmy Down with a secret entrance via Parson Street station.

[Mr Popodopolous]

The usual swipe at OTIB by old man Gee Screamer II on there.

Shame he couldn't distinguish between 'there' and 'their' in the correct context, ha.

Edited March 30, 2022 by Mr Popodopolous

[Davefevs]

1 minute ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

The usual swipe at OTIB by old man Gee Screamer II on there.

Shame he couldn't distinguish between 'there' and 'their' in the correct context, ha.

For some reason they banned me.  All I said was that piece of halibut was good enough for Jehovah!

[Mr Popodopolous]

On a side note, someone I know who has worked in football security up North told me a while back that as away fans go, Derby seem alright but can get pissy or difficult when things aren't going their way.

The take on the current situation by a chunk of them proves it in spades. Although I shouldn't generalise.

Wonder if our game there will be our last in some time, I still might be going in any event.

Edited March 30, 2022 by Mr Popodopolous

[CyderInACan]

2 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

For some reason they banned me.  All I said was that piece of halibut was good enough for Jehovah!

Now that has made me chuckle ! Blessed are the cheesemakers etc

[Mr Popodopolous]

4 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

For some reason they banned me.  All I said was that piece of halibut was good enough for Jehovah!

You did well, me and HXJ were banned before we could even post! 

[Davefevs]

17 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

You did well, me and HXJ were banned before we could even post! 

They’ve blocked my iPad from accessing the website, but not my phone.  It’s an interesting read for sure.

[REDOXO]

They banned me too. Bless them! 

[REDOXO]

2 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

On a side note, someone I know who has worked in football security up North told me a while back that as away fans go, Derby seem alright but can get pissy or difficult when things aren't going their way.

The take on the current situation by a chunk of them proves it in spades. Although I shouldn't generalise.

Wonder if our game there will be our last in some time, I still might be going in any event.

There was talk of it kicking off on their forum. 1000 I’m popodopolous t shirts need to be made! 

[Mr Popodopolous]

12 minutes ago, REDOXO said:

There was talk of it kicking off on their forum. 1000 I’m popodopolous t shirts need to be made! 

Or I'm NOT Popodopolous if we wish to defuse.

I get the impression that some of them, I dunno the EFL blaming is fairly astonishing, they're merely upholding the rules as required and represent all 72 not just one.

However and yes a minority are terrible winners too, the Mel has EFL on strings has gone down in folklore, the sheer outpouring of joy and loud jubilation when it seemed Mel had the upper hand vs the sleeping and red faced EFL, I've not seen anything comparable at Championship or am I overstating my case, misremembering? 

All clubs have fans who might gloat but the sheer noise and scale in 2018, 2019 and even to an extent when the mythical Revaluation Reserve salvation arrived on the scene to seemingly save them to 2021 was something else.

Edited March 31, 2022 by Mr Popodopolous

[REDOXO]

7 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Or I'm NOT Popodopolous if we wish to defuse.

I get the impression that some of them, I dunno the EFL blaming is fairly astonishing, they're merely upholding the rules as required and represent all 72 not just one.

However and yes a minority are terrible winners too, the Mel has EFL on strings has gone down in folklore, the sheer outpouring of joy and loud jubilation when it seemed Mel had the upper hand vs the sleeping and red faced EFL, I've not seen anything comparable at Championship or am I overstating my case, misremembering? 

All clubs have fans who might gloat but the sheer noise and scale in 2018, 2019 and even to an extent when the mythical Revaluation Reserve salvation arrived on the scene to seemingly save them to 2021 was something else.

Yes you are right. I’m not Popodopolous might be better. But you really need to get some hospitality and a bottle of Moët 

They have some terrible supporters who thought it was great and hilarious when MM was giving people the run around that many have only just come to terms with. 

[Mr Popodopolous]

22 minutes ago, REDOXO said:

Yes you are right. I’m not Popodopolous might be better. But you really need to get some hospitality and a bottle of Moët 

They have some terrible supporters who thought it was great and hilarious when MM was giving people the run around that many have only just come to terms with. 

Have been mulling over looking into hospitality for that game I must admit. Otoh, you can't really do what you do as a fan in hospitality- pros and cons each way tbh!

They did, some anyway- I remember the hilarious takes on social media, I posted a few of them from DCFCTalk or whatever the Twitter account was! Keyword searches make it easy. Yet for all that, their side were one game from glory and vindication 3 years back.

[Mr Popodopolous]

How about- to the tune of bounce around the ground:

"Pearson says, Derby's bouncing down,

Derby's bouncing down

Derby's bouncing down"

Repeat a few times.

Better songwriters than me of course but that's an opening offer!

On a financial note, barring anything in the next few days or so:

Derby County FC

No accounts by due date in the public domain for 2019, 2020, 2021. Although a 3 month extension for Covid may hold, taking 2021 accounts to end of June 2022.

Club DCFC

No accounts by due date in the public domain for 2019, 2020 and 2021. Although the Covid extension may hold as above.

Stadia DCFC

No accounts by due date in the public domain for 2019, 2020 and 2021. Although the Covid extension may still hold as above.

Derby County FC Academy

No accounts in the public domain for 2019, 2020 and 2021 although the Covid extension may hold as above.

Sevco 5112

No accounts in the public domain for 2019, 2020 and 2021 although the Covid extension may hold as above.

Gellaw Newco 203

No accounts in the public domain for 2019, 2020 and 2021 although the Covid extension might take matters to June 18th 2022 for the 2021 accounts.

Astonishing list all told, and raises a question as to whether it'd even be possible for the EFL to lift the Embargo until all this is satisfied-the EFL rules on public disclosure of accounts are fairly clear.