The Office (UK): Ipswich Town edition

[Mr Popodopolous]

2 minutes ago, Redrascal2 said:

It would seem to me that Ashton is managed at Ipswich as opposed to the lack of oversight  when he  was here .Jon Lansdown  was playing with crayons all day and Steve had turned his back on the running of the club. At Ipswich they use Ashton's talents but control it and ensure he follows their plan. 

He does seem on a tight leash there.

Jon Lansdown and Lee Johnson as a fellow top team is a horrendous lack of oversight.

[Dan11]

1 hour ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

I do hope Ipswich start to slip and slide, lose in the playoffs and then the fun could begin. Their position looks a very strong one though and they have a budget as per Nixon of £3m for a striker in January, wage up to £15k per week.

I'm intrigued as to how they complied with the SCMP because their wages exceeded turnover in 2021-22. Was limited to football wages as 60% wasn't it...or was it owner input at that level.

McKenna though seems a brilliant acquisition. Some of Ashton and his worse traits seem to have been forcibly reined in but it defies many many rational sets of analysis looking at the Ipswich squad and seeing 52 pts from 22 games at this level.

Slight bitterness aside, they are player for player overachieving somewhat for the level IMO. Momentum and confidence can be a powerful factor too of course.

"However the Football League use a is broader definition of Turnover. Crucially, the FL Turnover figure includes donations from the owners to the club and injections of equity. Loans from club owners are understandably not included in the Turnover figure as these would result in growing club debts. up club debts."

All of the money put into ITFC is equity funding rather than debt. We built a side we thought could compete in the Championship whilst we were still in L1. It's impossible not to comply with SCMP as it is far more interactive/monitored in real time than FFP in the Championship. 

I don't know where this idea we are spending well beyond our means comes from. We have plenty of headroom and if we don't go up this season Leif Davis will go for huge money in the summer. 

Edited December 19, 2023 by Dan11

[Mr Popodopolous]

Just now, Dan11 said:

"However the Football League use a is broader definition of Turnover. Crucially, the FL Turnover figure includes donations from the owners to the club and injections of equity. Loans from club owners are understandably not included in the Turnover figure as these would result in growing club debts. up club debts."

All of the money put into ITFC is equity funding rather than debt. We built a side we thought could compete in the Championship whilst we were still in L1. It's impossible not to comply with SCMP as it is far more interactive/monitored in real time than FFP in the Championship. 

Right thanks. Seems a bit daft that all 4 divisions have differing systems but that's life I guess. Possibly reflects club income somewhat.

The equity funding...That doesn't count towards income post promotion, how it works between the 2 divisions is an oddity but the last 2 League 1 and current Championship £39m plus allowables..3 years, equity takes to the £39m but doesn't count as income as such.

[Davefevs]

17 minutes ago, Redrascal2 said:

It would seem to me that Ashton is managed at Ipswich as opposed to the lack of oversight  when he  was here .Jon Lansdown  was playing with crayons all day and Steve had turned his back on the running of the club. At Ipswich they use Ashton's talents but control it and ensure he follows their plan. 

Yep, I never doubted Ashton was a decent “administrator”, but interfering in recruitment was my biggest complaint.

4 minutes ago, Dan11 said:

"However the Football League use a is broader definition of Turnover. Crucially, the FL Turnover figure includes donations from the owners to the club and injections of equity. Loans from club owners are understandably not included in the Turnover figure as these would result in growing club debts. up club debts."

All of the money put into ITFC is equity funding rather than debt. We built a side we thought could compete in the Championship whilst we were still in L1. It's impossible not to comply with SCMP as it is far more interactive/monitored in real time than FFP in the Championship. 

I don't know where this idea we are spending well beyond our means comes from. We have plenty of headroom and if we don't go up this season Leif Davis will go for huge money in the summer. 

Not spending beyond your means, because your losses are backed (like SL does here) by Gamechanger / Arizona.  And you have certain players you can sell.

But your losses for last season will be interesting when announced.  They doubled in 21/22 from 20/21.  I expect similar losses last season, circa £12m mark.  And this season plus 22/23 and 21/22 will be used for FFP.  You’ll be fine, and if you go up it all becomes a bit irrelevant!!  If you don’t, you probably have next season to push again…and then you’ll be into relying on strong “trading” to keep you up there.  If that makes sense?

Totally agree that you used SCMP to your advantage, to avoid you having to spend big the summer just gone.

[Tim Monaghan]

6 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Yep, I never doubted Ashton was a decent “administrator”,

[Dan11]

12 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Yep, I never doubted Ashton was a decent “administrator”, but interfering in recruitment was my biggest complaint.

Not spending beyond your means, because your losses are backed (like SL does here) by Gamechanger / Arizona.  And you have certain players you can sell.

But your losses for last season will be interesting when announced.  They doubled in 21/22 from 20/21.  I expect similar losses last season, circa £12m mark.  And this season plus 22/23 and 21/22 will be used for FFP.  You’ll be fine, and if you go up it all becomes a bit irrelevant!!  If you don’t, you probably have next season to push again…and then you’ll be into relying on strong “trading” to keep you up there.  If that makes sense?

Totally agree that you used SCMP to your advantage, to avoid you having to spend big the summer just gone.

Yes, that doubling of losses was reflective of the fact Marcus Evans ran the entire club on skeleton staff and had invested in nothing for years! Spending on every aspect of the club increased (and in 22/23) - players wages, staff wages, women's team, infrastructure etc. Some of that is going to be capital expenditure, some of it allowable for FFP and some of it not. We spent very little in the summer really. We've also obviously got increased income this year from TV etc too.

I suspect we are going to spend a decent chunk of change on another striker this January and there will probably be another couple of ins and outs. There's already interest in Davis around the £15m mark so we've got that as a safety valve this summer. We'd be really daft not to have a push this window when we will sit somewhere between 7-13 points clear of 3rd come January 1st. We will never be in a better position going into a mid season transfer window.

Edited December 19, 2023 by Dan11

[Mr Popodopolous]

5 minutes ago, Dan11 said:

Yes, that doubling of losses was reflective of the fact Marcus Evans ran the entire club on skeleton staff and had invested in nothing for years! Spending on every aspect of the club increased (and in 22/23) - players wages, staff wages, women's team, infrastructure etc. Some of that is going to be capital expenditure, some of it allowable for FFP and some of it not. We spent very little in the summer really. We've also obviously got increased income this year from TV etc too.

I suspect we are going to spend a decent chunk of change on another striker this January and there will probably be another couple of ins and outs. There's already interest in Davis around the £15m mark so we've got that as a safety valve this summer. We'd be really daft not to have a push this window when we will sit somewhere between 7-13 points clear of 3rd come January 1st. We will never be in a better position going into a mid season transfer window.

Would be an opportune time to give it a bit of a go in January yeah.

We made a similar mistake in January 2008 prior to any kind of FFP.

Leeds must be kicking themselves to have let Davis go albeit I guess they were PL at the time? How much did he cost.

The income excluding donations in 2021-22 was £14.439m.

[Dan11]

10 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Would be an opportune time to give it a bit of a go in January yeah.

We made a similar mistake in January 2008 prior to any kind of FFP.

Leeds must be kicking themselves to have let Davis go albeit I guess they were PL at the time? How much did he cost.

The income excluding donations in 2021-22 was £14.439m.

Davis was around £1.25m + add ons. An absolute steal. Although Broadhead and Hirst at £1.5m + add ons each don't look bad either!

 

 

[Mr Popodopolous]

8 minutes ago, Dan11 said:

Davis was around £1.25m + add ons. An absolute steal. Although Broadhead and Hirst at £1.5m + add ons each don't look bad either!

 

 

Very much a steal yeah.

Ipswich normal income.now my best guess would be in the range of £20-25m factoring in on-field success, TV money rise, £15-20m for last season given the on pitch success, probably increased commercial activity- the cost base increase will also be interesting last season moreso.

If Leeds didn't put a sell on clause on Davis more fool them. Albeit with PL revenue a sell on clause for Davis maybe didn't figure highly in their thinking? Who knows.

[Mr Popodopolous]

[Mr Popodopolous]

Morsy could also miss a range of games via the AFCON and Hirst seems to have a hamstring.

Let's see if they get some injuries and suspensions let alone at our level of injuries how they do.

Also think Broadhead was lucky not to get a red v Leeds..

Edited December 28, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[Davefevs]

3 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Morsy could also miss a range of games via the AFCON AND Hirst seems to have a hamstring.

Let's see if they get some injuries and suspensions let alone at our level of injuries how they do.

Also think Broadhead was lucky not to get a red v Leeds..

Morsy has announced he isn’t going to AFCON.

Hirst is out for a while though.

[Mr Popodopolous]

Make you right Dave.

https://www.eadt.co.uk/sport/24014753.ipswich-town-sam-morsy-makes-unavailable-egypt-afcon/

Luongo likewise it seems for some kinda international duty..there was a rule at a time of refusing call ups and ineligibility but Idk if it holds here.

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Make you right Dave.

https://www.eadt.co.uk/sport/24014753.ipswich-town-sam-morsy-makes-unavailable-egypt-afcon/

Luongo likewise it seems for some kinda international duty..there was a rule at a time of refusing call ups and ineligibility but Idk if it holds here.

Luongo has retired from international footie…so that’s different.

[Mr Popodopolous]

Thanks. Morsy seemingly binning off international duty is a timely and lucky..they will lose Burgess for a bit though.

They are reportedly interested in Diallo, presumably on loan..that would be a blockbuster signing and short of McKenna getting some mates rates absolutely not cheap.

[Mr Popodopolous]

This is from an article about Onana but could apply here maybe.. 

"A player who has been called up by his association for one of its representative teams is, unless otherwise agreed by the relevant association, not entitled to play for the club with which he is registered during the period for which he has been released or should have been released… plus an additional period of five days.'"

TL:DR.

If Egypt insist then Morsy could maybe be banned for the period plus says..unless they give Ipswich special dispensation.

[Dan11]

45 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

This is from an article about Onana but could apply here maybe.. 

"A player who has been called up by his association for one of its representative teams is, unless otherwise agreed by the relevant association, not entitled to play for the club with which he is registered during the period for which he has been released or should have been released… plus an additional period of five days.'"

TL:DR.

If Egypt insist then Morsy could maybe be banned for the period plus says..unless they give Ipswich special dispensation.

I suspect the leak about him saying he’s not going to AFCON is a bit of a PR stunt for us fans. He’s only got 9 caps and only been in one squad in the two and a bit years he’s been here so doubt he’d have made the final cut anyway. Either way I doubt Egypt will lose sleep or kick off about him not being in the squad!

Hirst will be a big loss. We are fortunate this didn’t happen a month or two ago or we’d have been in bother. January is going to be our biggest transfer window in as long as I can remember!

[Mr Popodopolous]

3 minutes ago, Dan11 said:

I suspect the leak about him saying he’s not going to AFCON is a bit of a PR stunt for us fans. He’s only got 9 caps and only been in one squad in the two and a bit years he’s been here so doubt he’d have made the final cut anyway. Either way I doubt Egypt will lose sleep or kick off about him not being in the squad!

Hirst will be a big loss. We are fortunate this didn’t happen a month or two ago or we’d have been in bother. January is going to be our biggest transfer window in as long as I can remember!

It will be interesting to see, still in a great position.

Diallo would be major, won't come cheap..Nixon said £3m for a afrkker on £15k per week, that could easily be extrapolated into say a Diallo loan cost permitting.

[Dan11]

13 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

It will be interesting to see, still in a great position.

Diallo would be major, won't come cheap..Nixon said £3m for a afrkker on £15k per week, that could easily be extrapolated into say a Diallo loan cost permitting.

We will be spending more than £3m this January, I’m certain of that. Talk down here is that Stansfield is being recalled from Birmingham and coming here (not sure if loan or permanent). Suspect there will be 2/3 more as well. Diallo would obviously be excellent if he’s fit and is well known to McKenna and the coaching team. 

[Mr Popodopolous]

1 minute ago, Dan11 said:

We will be spending more than £3m this January, I’m certain of that. Talk down here is that Stansfield is being recalled from Birmingham and coming here (not sure if loan or permanent). Suspect there will be 2/3 more as well. Diallo would obviously be excellent if he’s fit and is well known to McKenna and the coaching team. 

Oh yeah, the Nixon report was solely on a striker.. McKenna did quite rightly state the need to comply with P&S though.

That £39m plus allowables still is a thing.

[Davefevs]

Lois Diony was spotted at the Salthouse Harbour Hotel earlier today.  

[Mr Popodopolous]

https://www.twtd.co.uk/ipswich-town-news/46305/mckenna-we-know-the-owners-will-support-us-if-we-find-a-suitable-player

Sensible words by McKenna.

[Dan11]

1 minute ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

https://www.twtd.co.uk/ipswich-town-news/46305/mckenna-we-know-the-owners-will-support-us-if-we-find-a-suitable-player

Sensible words by McKenna.

Yeah, you can be sure with McKenna we won’t be signing players for the sake of it. And our owners are equally sensible. We will be having a go as far as we can do given our current position. 

[Midred]

8 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Lois Diony was spotted at the Salthouse Harbour Hotel earlier today.  

Was he talking to Liam Walsh and Ryan Kent? 

[Jose]

I think WBA are a team that may suffer due to AFCON. 

[Mr Popodopolous]

Just now, Jose said:

I think WBA are a team that may suffer due to AFCON. 

They may also suffer owing to their financial position, John Percy said month, maybe 6 weeks ago that a takeover was vital.

January has come around the corner..takeover has gone quiet.

[Mr Popodopolous]

6 minutes ago, Midred said:

Was he talking to Liam Walsh and Ryan Kent? 

The lesser spotted Walsh actually played, has been playing periodically for Swansea!

Shame he was injury hit, different circs could have done okay..a Stoke 2nd Half in 2018 showed glimpses, he was fantastic.

[Mr Popodopolous]

As for Ipswich, in a sense it shouldn't actually be possible to breach P&S if a club aren't already forecast to do so.

Given that there are powers of monitoring both real time and future with a foundation of the past etc, the EFL or CFRP can intervene early if expenditure will push beyond limits.

If a club are set to breach unless x or y done and..

A plan I've seen floated of selling Davis or spending bigger on this proviso seems a bit chancy..he could sprain his ankle tomorrow and get a long term injury, would the EFL accept such a speculative concept.

Of course if Davis was to be sold after June 30th that would be a different scenario.

Edited December 28, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[Sleepy1968]

1 hour ago, Davefevs said:

Lois Diony was spotted at the Salthouse Harbour Hotel earlier today.  

According to transfer market he's having a purple patch. 10 goal and 5 assists in 19 games so far this season in ligue 2 for Angers.

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

As for Ipswich, in a sense it shouldn't actually be possible to breach P&S if a club aren't already forecast to do so.

Given that there are powers of monitoring both real time and future with a foundation of the past etc, the EFL or CFRP can intervene early if expenditure will push beyond limits.

If a club are set to breach unless x or y done and..

A plan I've seen floated of selling Davis or spending bigger on this proviso seems a bit chancy..he could sprain his ankle tomorrow and get a long term injury, would the EFL accept such a speculative concept.

Of course if Davis was to be sold after June 30th that would be a different scenario.

Don’t forget, any player Ipswich sign permanently, they can spread fee over contract length, so 2x £5m players over 4 years would only cost them £2.5m p.a (ignore the half year for sake of simplicity).  £2.5m isn’t gonna rock the FFP boat.