Lansdown

[Galley is our king]

2 minutes ago, Cidre Monita said:

Much of the debts he has had to underwrite have been down to his own bad decisions. 

I don’t believe he has any intentions of selling the club (still in talks, Steve?). We are in the position now where our major shareholder and owner has effectively stated that he will no longer fund the club with no buyers on the horizon. I think the rot is slowly setting in and we are in a managed decline going backwards. Perhaps you may soon realise the reason for the criticism of SL. 

Ah, is that the same owner that's just ploughed 70 odd million pounds into the club??????

[Northern Red]

1 hour ago, Cidre Monita said:

I think SL has had a remarkably easy ride tbh. I don’t condone violence or threats whatsoever but consider the abuse that the Everton, West Ham and Man U owners have been on the end of (whilst playing premier league football) I.e. death threats, told to keep away from the ground by police and various ongoing action by the Man U green &  gold lot. I think we can all agree the aforementioned clubs have enjoyed a bit more success than us over the years. 

What has SL done that would be worthy of that sort of action?

[Mr Popodopolous]

7 minutes ago, Cidre Monita said:

Much of the debts he has had to underwrite have been down to his own bad decisions. 

I don’t believe he has any intentions of selling the club (still in talks, Steve?). We are in the position now where our major shareholder and owner has effectively stated that he will no longer fund the club with no buyers on the horizon. I think the rot is slowly setting in and we are in a managed decline going backwards. Perhaps you may soon realise the reason for the criticism of SL. 

Only some of them IMO, remember you need to lose and pour in £x just to function as a Championship club in most cases.. some of the sums are farcical across the board.

Sure we could have less debt but might we be League One.

Definitely an air of stagnation however sadly.

[Mr Popodopolous]

44 minutes ago, Clutton Caveman said:

I really am at a loss regarding the criticism of SL. He has poured lots of his own money into the club writing off huge sums. We are still not profitable and so each year he has to write a cheque. Who of us if we won the Euro millions would take on a club where after 5 years we would be broke. Clearly people of this wealth become involved in sport as a hobby. A very expensive one at that. It seems he has played enough with the toy and wants to sell it, quite understandably but is not pitching it to every low life in a baseball cap. Clearly we are now more saleable than we were under Ashton and LJ. And hopefully we will reduce our losses to the point where a good buyer can be found.

I ask 2 questions. What other owner since Harry Dolman has done a better job?

Given a lottery win of £150 million would you plough this into BCFC?

I'm somewhere in the middle tbh.

Is there a strong infrastructure now? Yes.

Are we producing lots from the academy? Yes and we should be proud.

The club is more saleable from a loss reduction position and a solid base from which to build.. Then of course the question arises of SL and his asking price.

The here and now, after 2 years of fairly necessary austerity, downsizing and restraint it is so frustrating that more of the Scott money has not gone back in, add to that so frustrating that NP has not received the contract offer he richly deserves. 2-3 years IMO.

Injuries are biting still but some of that is due to the mostly but not entirely necessarily calls made over the last 2 years. Baker, Cundy, Kalas, Klose out, Dickie in between summer 2022 and now as pure CBs. One light I think. You could argue Naismith too but see him as more of a midfielder or into a back 3.

A creative spark on loan could assist, a bit more of the Scott money is required.

The Euro millions point is somewhat indicative of a broken system but that's for another thread along with the Parachute system. However the key number there is cashflow and or equity not headline loss.

[Davefevs]

12 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Sure we could have less debt but might we be League One.

Definitely an air of stagnation however sadly.

Agree with your overall post.  We could of course have less debt and be in the Premier League, playing Devil’s advocate.

Stagnation in football (and many businesses) means you end up going backwards., 

[Mr Popodopolous]

12 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Agree with your overall post.  We could of course have less debt and be in the Premier League, playing Devil’s advocate.

Stagnation in football (and many businesses) means you end up going backwards., 

That could also have happened! Appointing a better manager, a more focused transfer policy...A combination of youth and more targeted signings.

Agreed yes. Part of me is hoping there is some kind of bigger plan at play maybe a new deal for NP and a big push next season with the £28m disappearing from view, maybe this time next year SL will have sold and it'll be full steam ahead on a promotion push with headroom galore. Struggling to get optimistic right now though..although Vyner, Pring, Bell new deals is heartening .

Edited October 10, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[Steve Watts]

On 06/10/2023 at 18:32, CodeRed said:

Very true,  Simon Jordan summed up SL in one off the cuff remark when Jim White - trying to wind him up about SL & Jordan not getting along - said " Steve Lansdown's much wealthier than you" 

Jordan "yeah he is very wealthy......but he still can't get his club into the Premier League"

Whatever your view on Jordan he promised when he bought Palace he get into the PL within 5 years and he did it in 4. 

He did indeed do it in 4...but they were then relegated the following season and in Administration a few seasons after that, twice avoiding relegation to League 1 by a small margin.  I'm not sure he's really the poster boy on how to achieve it..

[Hxj]

3 hours ago, Cidre Monita said:

I don’t condone violence or threats whatsoever

So what would you condone?

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Galley is our king said:

Ah, is that the same owner that's just ploughed 70 odd million pounds into the club??????

Sorry missed that, what did he buy us? and when you say club do you mean us, or Bristol Sport?

[Hxj]

2 hours ago, Davefevs said:

Sorry, but my overall tone is negative…because there is an incorrect view that SL has given us £200m…he hasn’t, nor will he in future.

I fully understand what you are saying and why.

However the alternative view is that cash wise SL/Pula at 31 May 2022 had lent the group £77 million in undeniably 'soft loans' and invested about £87 million in share capital. 

As to what he gets back, that will be no where near that amount, at least not based upon the current position.

So I reckon that can easily be considered that he has 'given' the club £164 million.

[Simple Red]

I think that Mr Lansdown has put the club in a great position to strengthen and progress as we go forward. Just look at how many basket cases of clubs there are, we are not among them. Hopefully the academy will continue to produce our future stars and we will become a top Championship club. I’m not sure that I want to see City as a Premier club until we are at a stage where we could go up and stay up.

[phantom]

2 hours ago, Galley is our king said:

Ah, is that the same owner that's just ploughed 70 odd million pounds into the club??????

How much of that £70m do you think he will get back when he sells up?

It will be at least DOUBLE that . . . . 

[EmersonsKev]

33 minutes ago, phantom said:

How much of that £70m do you think he will get back when he sells up?

It will be at least DOUBLE that . . . . 

 

I'm a little confused, why do you think Bristol City Holdings Limited as going concern is worth £140m?

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, Hxj said:

I fully understand what you are saying and why.

However the alternative view is that cash wise SL/Pula at 31 May 2022 had lent the group £77 million in undeniably 'soft loans' and invested about £87 million in share capital. 

As to what he gets back, that will be no where near that amount, at least not based upon the current position.

So I reckon that can easily be considered that he has 'given' the club £164 million.

Thanks.

He (Pula) is earning interest on the loan though isn’t he?

[EmersonsKev]

7 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Thanks.

He (Pula) is earning interest on the loan though isn’t he?

He is indeed, just "thumbing" through the notes on the account.  Though Pula isn't charging a fortune for lending to a Football club it's still 2% above "Barclays Base Rate" which looks to be BofE base rate of 5.25%.

[REDOXO]

8 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Thanks.

He (Pula) is earning interest on the loan though isn’t he?

Company’s need to make money in order to sustain themselves, which would include charging interest on loans, filing returns employing people and paying wages, NI etc. 

Thus unless someone is saying the interest rate is out of whack/excessive Im not sure why it would be an issue. 
 

Are the loans at excessive rates?

[Davefevs]

2 minutes ago, EmersonsKev said:

He is indeed, just "thumbing" through the notes on the account.  Though Pula isn't charging a fortune for lending to a Football club it's still 2% above "Barclays Base Rate" which looks to be BofE base rate of 5.25%.

1 minute ago, REDOXO said:

Company’s need to make money in order to sustain themselves, which would include charging interest on loans, filing returns employing people and paying wages, NI etc. 

Thus unless someone is saying the interest rate is out of whack/excessive Im not sure why it would be an issue. 
 

Are the loans at excessive rates?

All I’m trying to show is that it’s not “free-money”, because that is what some are suggesting, ie he’s just given us the money - he hasn’t. 

Nor do I begrudge him (Pula) charging us interest either. I know from other clubs taking out loans with Macquarie Bank, the rates we are charged are favourable, but nor is it “interest free”.

I’m not totally anti-SL, but when some suggest we can’t criticise him because of the “money” he’s “given away”, that’s bonkers and winds me up.

 

[Bris Red]

9 hours ago, Daniro said:

Personally I have no interest in hearing from the Lansdowns unless they have something of significance to report.  Jon, bless him, is totally out of his depth ( viz ...

)

and I've heard so many different fantasy futures from Steve over the years about how we're going to be the next Brighton, Bournemouth, Brentford, Luton or whatever other small town or city's club has made it to the top.

So unless there is something of serious note, let them languish in their tax free havens while the rest of us struggle and make do with the mid table mediocrity weve got used to under their reign.

**** me what a time to be alive that was. What a disgrace, just listening to JL and MA makes my skin crawl.

Edited October 10, 2023 by Bris Red

[REDOXO]

2 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

All I’m trying to show is that it’s not “free-money”, because that is what some are suggesting, ie he’s just given us the money - he hasn’t. 

Nor do I begrudge him (Pula) charging us interest either. I know from other clubs taking out loans with Macquarie Bank, the rates we are charged are favourable, but nor is it “interest free”.

I’m not totally anti-SL, but when some suggest we can’t criticise him because of the “money” he’s “given away”, that’s bonkers and winds me up.

 

Who else would lend that sort of money at those rates to a backwater football club? What were Derby paying for example  

SL is overwhelmingly the major shareholder (I refuse to sell mine) of the football club, thus any money flows toward him (money flows toward ownership) no matter what! I can’t imagine the meltdown if a dividend was paid to shareholders, but I’ll take mine mine you!
 

As a lender that money gets repaid first, thus it’s a hedge against disaster as the shareholders who take the risk of losing the entire value of their shareholding. 
 

Lansdown takes the risk on the funds he has put in, in debt and shares. So there is a perfectly salient argument to suggest he might not get it all back if he sells. Then we will know what he put in above the value of the FC, Bristol Rugby, Bristol Sport, Ashton Vale, the high performance center, the jobs provided and the future jobs provided for expanding the stadium. 
 

Im not sure why anyone would get upset with anyone else saying he’s given money away on the basis of some loan debt. We will probably never know what BCFC has cost him and if he walks away with a profit after everything we have then I say good for him. 
 

 

 

 

[Davefevs]

16 minutes ago, REDOXO said:

Who else would lend that sort of money at those rates to a backwater football club? What were Derby paying for example  

SL is overwhelmingly the major shareholder (I refuse to sell mine) of the football club, thus any money flows toward him (money flows toward ownership) no matter what! I can’t imagine the meltdown if a dividend was paid to shareholders, but I’ll take mine mine you!
 

As a lender that money gets repaid first, thus it’s a hedge against disaster as the shareholders who take the risk of losing the entire value of their shareholding. 
 

Lansdown takes the risk on the funds he has put in, in debt and shares. So there is a perfectly salient argument to suggest he might not get it all back if he sells. Then we will know what he put in above the value of the FC, Bristol Rugby, Bristol Sport, Ashton Vale, the high performance center, the jobs provided and the future jobs provided for expanding the stadium. 
 

Im not sure why anyone would get upset with anyone else saying he’s given money away on the basis of some loan debt. We will probably never know what BCFC has cost him and if he walks away with a profit after everything we have then I say good for him. 

Who else would run up £200m losses in the P&L in a backwater football club!

I’m not upset by someone saying he’s given his money away, I’m annoyed by some people saying that means I am not allowed to have an opinion on his ownership.  It’s a bit “how dare you criticise SL”.

As you’ve probably guessed it won’t stop me having my say, and I will question why others think I shouldn’t.

 

[Daniro]

29 minutes ago, Bris Red said:

**** me what a time to be alive that was. What a disgrace, just listening to JL and MA makes my skin crawl.

Must admit I didn't watch it again before posting it - the memory of that sh!t show is still way too strong in my memory!!

[Mr Popodopolous]

The problem is IMO anyway, SL is kidding himself if he thinks he'll get a big price or even a fair slug back while we are at this level.

There Is granted a right club, Flyers and all the facilities but WBA could be up for sale for £20-30, more of a distressed sale in some ways but he will surely need to eat a big loss of be wishes to sell at Championship level or put some more cash in to go for winning the playoffs and sell in the PL at something more but wholly to his probable liking.

[phantom]

2 hours ago, EmersonsKev said:

 

I'm a little confused, why do you think Bristol City Holdings Limited as going concern is worth £140m?

It's quite well known what the asking price is and it's much more than above. 

The point I was making is £70m was quoted as being invested but much more will be repaid if the sale goes through 

[phantom]

14 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

The problem is IMO anyway, SL is kidding himself if he thinks he'll get a big price or even a fair slug back while we are at this level.

There Is granted a right club, Flyers and all the facilities but WBA could be up for sale for £20-30, more of a distressed sale in some ways but he will surely need to eat a big loss of be wishes to sell at Championship level or put some more cash in to go for winning the playoffs and sell in the PL at something more but wholly to his probable liking.

I'm guessing "tight" club is a typo and you meant rugby club? 

I'm not sure there's much money in rugby at the moment, four clubs have folded recently and sadly not likely to be the last. 

I can't believe there's any real value in British basketball either. 

Interesting the amount you quote above is what is rumoured to be the starting amount for discussions at another Championship club 

[Garland-sweden]

Big boss have put more money that I can think of in Bristol City. I dont blame him for that we not playing in pl. He is not manager or player, he is a bissniessman.

[Tim Monaghan]

@Bris Red @Bristol Oil Services you pair of rats. I don’t give a **** if I’m banned for that. Scum.

 

I am utterly and unequivocally disgusted by the post, which depicts our owner, Steve Lansdown, as Hitler. ******* Hitler!!! This comparison is not just disrespectful; it’s ******* sick.

Hitler as you ******* know, was responsible for the deaths of millions during the Holocaust and the horrors of World War II. He stands as a symbol of hatred, intolerance, and the worst aspects of human nature. Making light of his actions, even in a satirical or humorous context, is not only tasteless but morally abhorrent.

What's even more disheartening is the fact that some of our fellow fans found this picture amusing. How can anyone find humor in something that diminishes the gravity of the Holocaust and the unimaginable suffering of its victims and the millions of deaths caused by WW2? How have the MODS even left the picture there????????

Steve’s dedication and financial support have transformed our club, taking us to new heights in terms of infrastructure, player development, and community engagement. Under his leadership, we’ve seen significant progress, from our stadium redevelopment to our youth academy’s success. He has invested not only in the team but also in the city itself, contributing positively to our community. Yes, we may not be where we want to be, but to compare him to Hitler, are you actually ******* kidding me? And for other fans to be laughing.

we really don’t deserve it success, we are such a bunch of boneheaded knuckle draggers. 
 

 

 

[ashton_fan]

I remember what it was like before he took over, stuck in the 3rd division, 10k gates, hardly any young players coming through, stadium falling apart and no decent training facilities. This is the first time we've been established at this level since the 70's, gates have doubled and we have brilliant facilities. Some people have short memories.

[Topper 123]

Look the topman is overseeing this club and only has its best interests at heart and I’m sure when the time is right will only sale to the correct consortium who also want the best for the club , in the mean time until ffp rules change his hands are a little tied , so get behind a great owner who deserves a statue and support the club BRISTOLS TOP CLUB for over god knows how many years 

the red red robin 

[Hxj]

2 hours ago, Davefevs said:

He (Pula) is earning interest on the loan though isn’t he?

I agree 

However any interest paid forms part of the cash flowing out of the group. So currently Pula would need to hand over a demand for say £3 million in interest with one hand and a cheque for £3 million to pay the bill with the other.

So overall (and at that time) Pula, asset wise, is no better off.

Edited October 10, 2023 by Hxj

[Mr Popodopolous]

1 hour ago, phantom said:

I'm guessing "tight" club is a typo and you meant rugby club? 

I'm not sure there's much money in rugby at the moment, four clubs have folded recently and sadly not likely to be the last. 

I can't believe there's any real value in British basketball either. 

Interesting the amount you quote above is what is rumoured to be the starting amount for discussions at another Championship club 

Ah yes I meant rugby club, I'll pay closer attention to predictive text.

I suppose rugby to a degree may have an increased interest in USA and we know of basketball and USA but I tend to agree, just looking for possible areas.

I will try and find the article, Kieran Maguire thinks that WBA at £50m is toppy. Found £20m for Hull, still seeking the Birmingham and Coventry asking price. Found £30m for Hull too.

https://www.footballinsider247.com/kieran-maguire-guochuan-lai-living-in-a-fantasy-world-as-west-brom-takeover-update-revealed/

Edited October 10, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous