Manning post match

[Robbored]

4 hours ago, Shauntaylor85 said:

Manning is another LJ in my view, likes a square peg in round hole and as yesterday demonstrated when options are available makes very strange decisions. Jury massively out and no way has this been the proposed upgrade Tinnion and Lansdown suggested 

Of course it’s out. LM has inherited his predecessors squad and it’ll take the summer’s activities during the window to enable Manning to start building his own squad.

He’ll also have a full preseason to implement his methods and strategies and hopefully he’ll stop complaining about the  busy fixture list………….

Hopefully we’ll also see what the playing strategies and method are - I can hardly wait……..

[BrizzleRed]

1 hour ago, Ashton Fete said:

I buy into what Manning is doing and I think after a summer turnover I think next season is going to be the best for some years

But yesterday he got pretty much everything key wrong from starters to subs to formation/tactics chasing the game

Hopefully he’ll learn a lot from it!!!

I really want to buy in to what Manning is doing, but I won’t be converted until I see what his solution is for teams who just park the bus. 

Until he can prove he has some answers to combat this problem, we really don’t have a reason to look up the table, as we won’t be occupying those places any time soon.

This is a big challenge for Manning and he doesn’t appear to have a solution so far.

[Floatn Over]

I’m pinning some hope that now LM has firmly hung up his hat in BS3, from his career viewpoint he needs to achieve something here.  Get us playing like v Southampton after recruiting in the summer but consistently then he and the club will be on the up.  Anything else will not help his CV

[Davefevs]

2 hours ago, italian dave said:

Could be both, SD!

If you take that 50 games above as the norm, then that equates to a game every 5.5 days over the course of a season.

Over the past 16 weeks we’ve played an average of one game every 4 days.

A combination of the Xmas period and our cup run have made the past few weeks unusually taxing. 

As I mentioned earlier, we played 4 FA Cup games last season by the end of Feb, with a much thinner squad.  Manning has rotated sufficiently for it not to be a huge issue physically.  It’s allowed him less time on the training pitches to work on new stuff though.  But there are several other “new” managers going through the same, not able to get time to drill their “way”.

[REDOXO]

13 minutes ago, BrizzleRed said:

I really want to buy in to what Manning is doing, but I won’t be converted until I see what his solution is for teams who just park the bus. 

Until he can prove he has some answers to combat this problem, we really don’t have a reason to look up the table, as we won’t be occupying those places any time soon.

This is a big challenge for Manning and he doesn’t appear to have a solution so far.

QPR played well. They are struggling with no money and a very mediocre squad. Nevertheless They should have beaten us 3/0 comfortably and looked very threatening in the latter stages so I don’t go along with “park the bus” syndrome. 

We could not/did not pass, compete or  show any individuality.
 

The players looked scared to try something/anything where we could possibly lose the ball in order to retain possession. This is the fourth or fifth time this has happened. The obsession with maintaining possession is costing us as teams will hunt down the player in possession and play on the break to counter act that, which is what happened.

We were served up the exact same rubbish against Leeds and no one accused them of parking the bus. The excuses on here after that game were mind blowing, we can’t compete against premier league parachute money outclassed by a premier league team in waiting etc etc etc were vomit making. We were just shit, like we were yesterday. 

Manning seems to put fear in the team by insisting we try to keep possession at all costs which inevitably leads to us losing the ball  

Unfortunately football match’s are not won by possession stats, they are won by skill and creating chances in order to score goals! 
 

I listened to the first twenty minutes of FBC this morning and after Ian got his obligatory dig in about Pearson, the young lad got it spot on. Fear is the key! Manning has created a team that is petrified of risk and is insistent that is the way he will play, regardless of whom he has available! This needs to change  

 

 

[Mr Popodopolous]

3 minutes ago, REDOXO said:

QPR played well. They are struggling with no money and a very mediocre squad. Nevertheless They should have beaten us 3/0 comfortably and looked very threatening in the latter stages so I don’t go along with “park the bus” syndrome. 

We could not/did not pass, compete or  show any individuality.
 

The players looked scared to try something/anything where we could possibly lose the ball in order to retain possession. This is the fourth or fifth time this has happened. The obsession with maintaining possession is costing us as teams will hunt down the player in possession and play on the break to counter act that, which is what happened.

We were served up the exact same rubbish against Leeds and no one accused them of parking the bus. The excuses on here after that game were mind blowing, we can’t compete against premier league parachute money outclassed by a premier league team in waiting etc etc etc were vomit making. We were just shit, like we were yesterday. 

Manning seems to put fear in the team by insisting we try to keep possession at all costs which inevitably leads to us losing the ball  

Unfortunately football match’s are not won by possession stats, they are won by skill and creating chances in order to score goals! 
 

I listened to the first twenty minutes of FBC this morning and after Ian got his obligatory dig in about Pearson, the young lad got it spot on. Fear is the key! Manning has created a team that is petrified of risk and is insistent that is the way he will play, regardless of whom he has available! This needs to change  

 

 

Chair, Willock, multiple PL loanees or recent players. Don't think they are as bad as the League table suggests, under Cifuentes they are on 24 from 19..under Ainsworth 8 from 14.

Extrapolated over a season that is midtable or lower midtable. Albeit yesterday still wasn't acceptable.

Edited February 18 by Mr Popodopolous

[REDOXO]

Just now, Mr Popodopolous said:

Chair, Willock, multiple PL loanees or recent players. Don't think they are as bad as the League table suggests, under Cifuentes they are on 24 from 19..under Ainsworth 8 from 14.

Extrapolated over a season that is midtable or lower midtable.

Some of my oldest mates are Rangers season ticket holders and they were petrified about this season. However since they got rid of Ainsworth and what they described as Stone Age football they have given themselves a chance. 
 

I got the impression they are in FFP deduction territory as I will always bow to your superior knowledge on that, what’s their current status any ideas?

 

[Mr Popodopolous]

9 minutes ago, REDOXO said:

Some of my oldest mates are Rangers season ticket holders and they were petrified about this season. However since they got rid of Ainsworth and what they described as Stone Age football they have given themselves a chance. 
 

I got the impression they are in FFP deduction territory as I will always bow to your superior knowledge on that, what’s their current status any ideas?

 

Under Ainsworth they seemed to be sunk. I reckon but your friends may have a better insight, that Cifuentes is a better fit to their style than Ainsworth and Critchley.

I noticed e.g. that Willock and Chair were notably more productive (Goals and Assists) under Beale and Cifuentes vs Ainsworth and probably Critchley.

I have thought this too, plus that any or all of Birmingham, Cardiff and Leicester could be of interest but QPR seem to think they are fine..I see no notable evidence of significant player sales, and clearly as of 2021-22 a higher than income cost base, managerial changes over the last 2 years.

Dickie and Dieng gross fee for the pair was £4m tops.

Edited February 18 by Mr Popodopolous

[italian dave]

1 hour ago, Silvio Dante said:

That would be a totally valid argument if the first time he moaned about it wasn’t pre the first West Ham game…!

Ahh, but he’s a meticulous planner…… he knew what was coming

[Silvio Dante]

3 minutes ago, italian dave said:

Ahh, but he’s a meticulous planner…… he knew what was coming

Trust the process…of bullshitting

[BrizzleRed]

5 minutes ago, REDOXO said:

QPR played well. They are struggling with no money and a very mediocre squad. Nevertheless They should have beaten us 3/0 comfortably and looked very threatening in the latter stages so I don’t go along with “park the bus” syndrome. 

We could not/did not pass, compete or  show any individuality.
 

The players looked scared to try something/anything where we could possibly lose the ball in order to retain possession. This is the fourth or fifth time this has happened. The obsession with maintaining possession is costing us as teams will hunt down the player in possession and play on the break to counter act that, which is what happened.

We were served up the exact same rubbish against Leeds and no one accused them of parking the bus. The excuses on here after that game were mind blowing, we can’t compete against premier league parachute money outclassed by a premier league team in waiting etc etc etc were vomit making. We were just shit, like we were yesterday. 

Manning seems to put fear in the team by insisting we try to keep possession at all costs which inevitably leads to us losing the ball  

Unfortunately football match’s are not won by possession stats, they are won by skill and creating chances in order to score goals! 
 

I listened to the first twenty minutes of FBC this morning and after Ian got his obligatory dig in about Pearson, the young lad got it spot on. Fear is the key! Manning has created a team that is petrified of risk and is insistent that is the way he will play, regardless of whom he has available! This needs to change  

 

 

Completely with you.  QPR played well, but we certainly aided their cause.  They were understandably a bit cagey early on, but in the second half in particular, they could see we offered no threat and pushed on and could and should have scored more.  

That was the worry for me, as with them going forward more, we should then have been looking to get behind them, but we offered bugger all.

Our performance really was dogshit and there was no excuse whatsoever.  I can’t believe after 60 years of following this lot, I stupidly allowed myself to get a little optimistic prior to the game, even though experience taught me me we were more likely to follow up the Southampton performance with crap like this.  

I’ll definitely go back to keeping any misplaced optimism in check in future, as it makes the inevitable let-downs more bearable!!!

[Robbored]

1 hour ago, BrizzleRed said:

I really want to buy in to what Manning is doing, but I won’t be converted until I see what his solution is for teams who just park the bus. 

This is a big challenge 

Do you know what he’s trying to do?…….nobody on here seems to know including those who are students of the game.

[italian dave]

27 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

As I mentioned earlier, we played 4 FA Cup games last season by the end of Feb, with a much thinner squad.  Manning has rotated sufficiently for it not to be a huge issue physically.  It’s allowed him less time on the training pitches to work on new stuff though.  But there are several other “new” managers going through the same, not able to get time to drill their “way”.

Fewer league games though, Dave.

Same 16 weeks, last season we average a game every 4.8 days (3.93 this season). And extend that an extra 2 weeks to include the 5th round cup last season, and it’s still one every 4.8.

It begs the question why we agreed to play the Coventry game when we did. 

[Davefevs]

29 minutes ago, REDOXO said:

QPR played well. They are struggling with no money and a very mediocre squad. Nevertheless They should have beaten us 3/0 comfortably and looked very threatening in the latter stages so I don’t go along with “park the bus” syndrome. 

We could not/did not pass, compete or  show any individuality.
 

The players looked scared to try something/anything where we could possibly lose the ball in order to retain possession. This is the fourth or fifth time this has happened. The obsession with maintaining possession is costing us as teams will hunt down the player in possession and play on the break to counter act that, which is what happened.

We were served up the exact same rubbish against Leeds and no one accused them of parking the bus. The excuses on here after that game were mind blowing, we can’t compete against premier league parachute money outclassed by a premier league team in waiting etc etc etc were vomit making. We were just shit, like we were yesterday. 

Manning seems to put fear in the team by insisting we try to keep possession at all costs which inevitably leads to us losing the ball  

Unfortunately football match’s are not won by possession stats, they are won by skill and creating chances in order to score goals! 
 

I listened to the first twenty minutes of FBC this morning and after Ian got his obligatory dig in about Pearson, the young lad got it spot on. Fear is the key! Manning has created a team that is petrified of risk and is insistent that is the way he will play, regardless of whom he has available! This needs to change  

 

 

I don’t agree they parked the bus either.  Any team with Willock and Chair don’t just sit them behind the ball, especially when there is an out-ball to Dykes to get close too.

They were physical, intense, and played within the laws of the game pretty much.  They weren’t hugely expansive.  But were we?  Nope.

An away side reserve the right to a cautious start, to try to silence the crowd.  But they sensed they could get at us too.  Field mis-kicking in the box had a good chance before they eventually scored.

[Davefevs]

7 minutes ago, italian dave said:

Fewer league games though, Dave.

Same 16 weeks, last season we average a game every 4.8 days (3.93 this season). And extend that an extra 2 weeks to include the 5th round cup last season, and it’s still one every 4.8.

It begs the question why we agreed to play the Coventry game when we did. 

I’m on about in the Boxing Day to end of Feb run.  How many different (16 v 14 - 2 more)?  Do you make that a significant or insignificant difference, coupled with the squad availability for LM?

Fine if you do.

I just think it creates excuses.

 

[REDOXO]

36 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Under Ainsworth they seemed to be sunk. I reckon but your friends may have a better insight, that Cifuentes is a better fit to their style than Ainsworth and Critchley.

I noticed e.g. that Willock and Chair were notably more productive (Goals and Assists) under Beale and Cifuentes vs Ainsworth and probably Critchley.

I have thought this too, plus that any or all of Birmingham, Cardiff and Leicester could be of interest but QPR seem to think they are fine..I see no notable evidence of significant player sales, and clearly as of 2021-22 a higher than income cost base, managerial changes over the last 2 years.

Dickie and Dieng gross fee for the pair was £4m tops.

Thanks Pop! What the chances of you going to Derby away next season?

29 minutes ago, BrizzleRed said:

Completely with you.  QPR played well, but we certainly aided their cause.  They were understandably a bit cagey early on, but in the second half in particular, they could see we offered no threat and pushed on and could and should have scored more.  

That was the worry for me, as with them going forward more, we should then have been looking to get behind them, but we offered bugger all.

Our performance really was dogshit and there was no excuse whatsoever.  I can’t believe after 60 years of following this lot, I stupidly allowed myself to get a little optimistic prior to the game, even though experience taught me me we were more likely to follow up the Southampton performance with crap like this.  

I’ll definitely go back to keeping any misplaced optimism in check in future, as it makes the inevitable let-downs more bearable!!!

You and I are about the same age. I’m a season ticket holder but watch the vast majority of games via BCTV as I live in North America. 
 

I was exactly the same. I thought aye aye we may have turned the corner, but no back to being utter crap.
 

Getting beat is something as City fans we are well used to but the way our top six squad keeps losing all belief in their individual skill set and descends into indescribably excruciating performances is something that Mr Manning has taken to a wholly new level. 

You know when it’s become really bad when posters you have never heard of cant be bothered to come on here and post supportive messages!
 

I just wonder how Mr Manning explains that to Brian and Jon. 

Edited February 18 by REDOXO

[BrizzleRed]

7 minutes ago, Robbored said:

Do you know what he’s trying to do?…….nobody on here seems to know including those who are students of the game.

No I really don’t know RR.  I’m just hoping he’s trying to find a way of bringing some kind of consistency of performance, but there’s certainly no sign of him achieving that so far.

Who knows what City will turn up at any game and the only clue we have is if a team are going to attack us, we’re probably more likely to give them a game ….. unless they’re called Leeds obviously!

[REDOXO]

10 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I don’t agree they parked the bus either.  Any team with Willock and Chair don’t just sit them behind the ball, especially when there is an out-ball to Dykes to get close too.

They were physical, intense, and played within the laws of the game pretty much.  They weren’t hugely expansive.  But were we?  Nope.

An away side reserve the right to a cautious start, to try to silence the crowd.  But they sensed they could get at us too.  Field mis-kicking in the box had a good chance before they eventually scored.

Pretty much how I saw it Dave. We were crap but to what extent that was down to them is debatable. 
 

My thought is They really didn’t do much to upset any rhythm of a team full of fear!

[REDOXO]

26 minutes ago, Robbored said:

Do you know what he’s trying to do?…….nobody on here seems to know including those who are students of the game.

I agree. And so do most of the players I reckon!

[BrizzleRed]

3 minutes ago, REDOXO said:

Thanks Pop! What the chances of you going to Derby away next season?

You and I are about the same age. I’m a season ticket holder but watch the vast majority of games via BCTV as I live in North America. 
 

I was exactly the same. I thought aye aye we may have turned the corner, but no back to being utter crap.
 

Getting beat is something as City fans we are well used to but the way our top six squad keeps losing all belief in their individual skill set and descends into indescribably excruciating performances is something that Mr Manning has taken to a wholly new level. 

You know when it’s become really bad when posters you have never heard of cant be bothered to come on here. 
 

I just wonder how Mr Manning explains that to Brian and Jon. 

I wish I lived in North America mate, as I wouldn’t keep buying ST’s to watch this shit!!!  I’ll be honest and say I suspected a bad result yesterday, but I hadn’t anticipated quite the depths of shitness we were actually capable of achieving.

We keep getting threads on here about lack of atmosphere at the Gate, but I’m not surprised by it at all.  Obviously younger fans are more optimistic, as they haven’t had the decades of let-downs we’ve had.  Even on the rare occasions we get a bit of a run of results going, I can’t get past the thoughts of WHEN, rather than WILL we balls it all up.  

It’s hard to get excited when you know what’s just around the corner ….. we’re Bristol City and it’s what we do!!!

[REDOXO]

14 minutes ago, BrizzleRed said:

I wish I lived in North America mate, as I wouldn’t keep buying ST’s to watch this shit!!!  I’ll be honest and say I suspected a bad result yesterday, but I hadn’t anticipated quite the depths of shitness we were actually capable of achieving.

We keep getting threads on here about lack of atmosphere at the Gate, but I’m not surprised by it at all.  Obviously younger fans are more optimistic, as they haven’t had the decades of let-downs we’ve had.  Even on the rare occasions we get a bit of a run of results going, I can’t get past the thoughts of WHEN, rather than WILL we balls it all up.  

It’s hard to get excited when you know what’s just around the corner ….. we’re Bristol City and it’s what we do!!!

Hadn’t anticipated quite the depths of shiteness we were actually capable of achieving! QUOTE OF THE DAY SIR!

Unfortunately I’m filled with anticipation for the future!
 

 

[BrizzleRed]

31 minutes ago, REDOXO said:

Hadn’t anticipated quite the depths of shiteness we were actually capable of achieving! QUOTE OF THE DAY SIR!

Unfortunately I’m filled with anticipation for the future!
 

 

At least we’ve got a new, low level benchmark to anticipate by now!

[italian dave]

2 hours ago, Davefevs said:

I’m on about in the Boxing Day to end of Feb run.  How many different (16 v 14 - 2 more)?  Do you make that a significant or insignificant difference, coupled with the squad availability for LM?

Fine if you do.

I just think it creates excuses.

 

My 16 weeks was the Sat before Xmas programme through to yesterday (plus the extra 2 weeks as noted).

Much the same.

I’m not making a judgement on whether that’s a significant difference or not. Nor am I making excuses. Just stating the facts - which are that we’re playing more games than you’d normally anticipate, and more than the teams we’re playing.

I know I should have put it on a spreadsheet

[Davefevs]

25 minutes ago, italian dave said:

I’m not making a judgement on whether that’s a significant difference or not. Nor am I making excuses. Just stating the facts - which are that we’re playing more games than you’d normally anticipate, and more than the teams we’re playing.

Yeah, appreciate that is what you’re saying.  Just think for some it’s being used as an excuse after a defeat.

As one manager said “give a player an excuse not to run and they won’t run”.

[JP Hampton]

He said yesterday “you talk about tactics but they (the team) didn’t even get the basics right”.

 There’s no self reflection there. As my OH said, maybe it’s the manager who didn’t get the basics right?

[fgrsimon]

Don't buy the physical fatigue thing, QPR played and travelled away on Wed for a real 6 pointer. Surely this would have more effect than the fact that we'd played 3 games the previous week? I can't believe that games 7+ days prior would have any effect on yesterday's game for either team. I'm 60 and can run 10km in consecutive days and with one day off I'm ready to go again on day 4. In fact it's time for my run now!

[Natchfever]

1 hour ago, JP Hampton said:

He said yesterday “you talk about tactics but they (the team) didn’t even get the basics right”.

 There’s no self reflection there. As my OH said, maybe it’s the manager who didn’t get the basics right?

Blimey did he say that?

LJ trait that not a good look.

[Mr Popodopolous]

The physical fatigue thing.

Injuries steadily clearing, fatigue doesn't half feel less acute when the side are at the beginning of a run.

By which I mean Nottingham Forest away we should've won, the Middlesbrough first half moreso than the second and Southampton game..

In other words it feels a sketchy excuse. We weren't very good and we were flat, after the triple substitution our shape and cohesion went entirely but it doesn't feel like fatigue.

[pillred]

11 hours ago, Natchfever said:

Matty James is probably Matthew

 

 

 By that token shouldn't we call Adedire Ady then?

Edited February 18 by pillred

[pillred]

3 hours ago, fgrsimon said:

Don't buy the physical fatigue thing, QPR played and travelled away on Wed for a real 6 pointer. Surely this would have more effect than the fact that we'd played 3 games the previous week? I can't believe that games 7+ days prior would have any effect on yesterday's game for either team. I'm 60 and can run 10km in consecutive days and with one day off I'm ready to go again on day 4. In fact it's time for my run now!

Men in their 20s and 30s are tired after a couple of hours running about, and then 3 days off, I feel for them.