Mbude

[mozo]

2 hours ago, Galley is our king said:

He's become a "pathway blocker" which I thought we didn't want anymore.

Bring on one of our own wasn't it?

I think it's a big deal for Yeboah and possibly others from the academy.

What's that noise?..... oh it's one of the 5 pillars crashing to the ground....

 

 

I don't think Yeboah, who also isn't good enough for the first team yet, was going to see any benefits of sitting on our bench. We're better off putting a loanee there and letting Yeboah get Men's football elsewhere.

[BCFCGav]

2 hours ago, GrahamC said:

Why would we do that?

He’s not our player & it was blindingly obvious from the QPR game he’s a million miles away from the required standard. 

He’s only on the bench now because we don’t have anyone else & we are trying to minimise the embarrassment of signing him.

The person who mentioned Mehmeti has to be having a laugh. Even at his most inconsistent we are talking about a player who had a season at this level with Wycombe & had scored the winner at Stoke last season.

This lad has made 3 appearances in Belgian football & played 44 minutes for us.

There’s a good reason he’s not getting off the bench, he isn’t good enough.

See @Harry’s post just before yours for why I think ‘he’s a million miles away’ based on 44 minutes is very, very harsh.

[Unan]

2 hours ago, Harry said:

Let’s write off a 19 year old, shall we. 
 

Do you know what Conway was doing at the same age. He’s just come off of a loan at Bath City and was making an odd appearance here and there for us. 
Sam Bell at the same age had just come off of a loan at Grimsby. 
Let’s even go as far as Vyner. At the same age he was on loan at Accrington. 
I could go on. 
 

Some of the comments seem to suggest the kid can’t even play football and is some sort of competition winner! 
Somewhat disrespectful that chaps. 

I’m not gonna get caught up in any hype, but you don’t get voted Man City’s academy player of the year if you are shit. Nor do you get called up to national teams age groups 16’s, 19’s and 21’s. 
He actually has the same amount of Scotland u21 goals as Conway. And he’s 2 years younger. 
 

But yeah, let’s write him off because we’ve seen him play 40 minutes of football as a late substitute in a struggling team. 
 

Yeah ok. 

I get where you’re coming from on nurturing young talent and the paths taken by players like Conway, Vyner, and Bell within our own system. However, discussing a loan signing shifts the focus significantly. I’m not trying to be overly pessimistic personally, but from my perspective, this particular loan doesn’t strike me as a good move by the club.We’re in a competitive environment where the immediate contribution is key.

The investment in a loan—both in terms of the loan fee and the player’s wages—is meant for instant impact, something that’s crucial given Mannnigs position. This isn’t about the player’s potential or their long-term development; it’s about what they can bring to the table right now.It’s not that I don’t appreciate the value of bringing up young talents. That’s essential for the club’s future, obviously. But when we talk about a loan, we’re talking about a strategic decision made to fill a gap or strengthen a position immediately.

The harsh reality is that the senior level of football is a different beast, and not all young talents can make an instant impact.This isn’t to underestimate the achievements of any young player. Their success in youth leagues and at the international level speaks volumes about their potential (I'd argue I'm being too kind but alas). But there’s a big leap from potential to being a game-changer in professional matches, especially under the pressure and expectations that come with a loan.

So, while I respect the journeys of our own young players who have been integrated slowly and are seen as part of our long-term strategy, a loan player is expected to deliver right off the bat. Given the specifics of this loan and the immediate challenges we face, I’m hesitant to say it’s a good signing. It’s a matter of addressing our needs now, and I’m not convinced this move does that. Again, it’s not about being too pessimistic; it’s about being realistic with our expectations and how this particular loan fits into them.

Edited April 1 by Unan

[Red-Robbo]

Players all develop at different rates - and some that look world-beaters at 17 look like panel beaters at 20. (and vice versa of course). Let's remember Vardy might've been off form against us, but he's been a top pro yet in his early 20s he got turned down by Rotherham and Crewe whilst playing non-league.

Equally guys who looked like they'd set the world on fire ended up with damp squibs of careers. Best player (unplayable!) at my school never got beyond the Gas under -20s. 

It happens.  As a scout, you shouldn't get caught up in the hype of young prospects. You need to cooly assess. 

[BCFC31]

3 hours ago, Ziderarmy said:

Results aside what was the point in this loan. Since he’s joined we’ve played 11 games.

1 game he didn’t make the squad 

7 times he’s sat on the bench and not got off it.

3 times he’s come off the bench for a grand total of 44 minutes. 

He’s not played since Cardiff away where he got 8 minutes on February 2nd.

Now we’re safe surely we either give him game time or bring some of our own youth players in who we think could step up.

Baffling loan so far. 

Again like most of our signings the club see him as one for the future the loan is also with the obligation to buy. I don't think the club even expected him to play much I think its a case of " bringing business forward " etc all that crap.

Edited April 1 by BCFC31

[astrondrew]

It's hard to imagine him being less effective than one particular contributor to the left wing today.

[Davefevs]

9 hours ago, BCFC31 said:

Again like most of our signings the club see him as one for the future the loan is also with the obligation to buy. I don't think the club even expected him to play much I think its a case of " bringing business forward " etc all that crap.

It’s an option to buy, not an obligation in Mebude’s case.

Do you think we will exercise that option?

[Northern Red]

25 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

It’s an option to buy, not an obligation in Mebude’s case.

Do you think we will exercise that option?

Of course not, but it's another thing for people to whine about so the forum will run with it.

[Sir Geoff]

14 hours ago, Harry said:

Let’s write off a 19 year old, shall we. 
 

Do you know what Conway was doing at the same age. He’s just come off of a loan at Bath City and was making an odd appearance here and there for us. 
Sam Bell at the same age had just come off of a loan at Grimsby. 
Let’s even go as far as Vyner. At the same age he was on loan at Accrington. 
I could go on. 
 

Some of the comments seem to suggest the kid can’t even play football and is some sort of competition winner! 
Somewhat disrespectful that chaps. 

I’m not gonna get caught up in any hype, but you don’t get voted Man City’s academy player of the year if you are shit. Nor do you get called up to national teams age groups 16’s, 19’s and 21’s. 
He actually has the same amount of Scotland u21 goals as Conway. And he’s 2 years younger. 
 

But yeah, let’s write him off because we’ve seen him play 40 minutes of football as a late substitute in a struggling team. 
 

Yeah ok. 

None of those mentioned cost £1.75 million, though.

[Glasgow Red]

15 hours ago, mozo said:

He was a punt that didn't work out but it's not really a big deal.

This. There are fine margins in football and sometimes these gambles pay off and other times they dont. I don't think the club should stop taking punts on loans because other clubs have definitely used loans to help them get out the champ.

[REDOXO]

12 hours ago, mozo said:

I don't think Yeboah, who also isn't good enough for the first team yet, was going to see any benefits of sitting on our bench. We're better off putting a loanee there and letting Yeboah get Men's football elsewhere.

Is Yeboah not playing today (if selected) or am I completely mistaken?

[Lorenzos Only Goal]

14 hours ago, Harry said:

Let’s write off a 19 year old, shall we. 
 

Do you know what Conway was doing at the same age. He’s just come off of a loan at Bath City and was making an odd appearance here and there for us. 
Sam Bell at the same age had just come off of a loan at Grimsby. 
Let’s even go as far as Vyner. At the same age he was on loan at Accrington. 
I could go on. 
 

Some of the comments seem to suggest the kid can’t even play football and is some sort of competition winner! 
Somewhat disrespectful that chaps. 

I’m not gonna get caught up in any hype, but you don’t get voted Man City’s academy player of the year if you are shit. Nor do you get called up to national teams age groups 16’s, 19’s and 21’s. 
He actually has the same amount of Scotland u21 goals as Conway. And he’s 2 years younger. 
 

But yeah, let’s write him off because we’ve seen him play 40 minutes of football as a late substitute in a struggling team. 
 

Yeah ok. 

I'm sure he's got potential at some point, I think the problem is he's come in as a loan to bolster the squad.  Development wise he might be ahead of Bell and Conway at the same age but not Tammy for example which is what I think people expect when the club loan in a ex Man City player.  If his loan was with a view to taking him in the summer and developing him the club could communicate that better.  But I get the feeling they've just signed a raw kid at the wrong time, might even have damaged him.

[And Its Smith]

12 hours ago, Unan said:

I get where you’re coming from on nurturing young talent and the paths taken by players like Conway, Vyner, and Bell within our own system. However, discussing a loan signing shifts the focus significantly. I’m not trying to be overly pessimistic personally, but from my perspective, this particular loan doesn’t strike me as a good move by the club.We’re in a competitive environment where the immediate contribution is key.

The investment in a loan—both in terms of the loan fee and the player’s wages—is meant for instant impact, something that’s crucial given Mannnigs position. This isn’t about the player’s potential or their long-term development; it’s about what they can bring to the table right now.It’s not that I don’t appreciate the value of bringing up young talents. That’s essential for the club’s future, obviously. But when we talk about a loan, we’re talking about a strategic decision made to fill a gap or strengthen a position immediately.

The harsh reality is that the senior level of football is a different beast, and not all young talents can make an instant impact.This isn’t to underestimate the achievements of any young player. Their success in youth leagues and at the international level speaks volumes about their potential (I'd argue I'm being too kind but alas). But there’s a big leap from potential to being a game-changer in professional matches, especially under the pressure and expectations that come with a loan.

So, while I respect the journeys of our own young players who have been integrated slowly and are seen as part of our long-term strategy, a loan player is expected to deliver right off the bat. Given the specifics of this loan and the immediate challenges we face, I’m hesitant to say it’s a good signing. It’s a matter of addressing our needs now, and I’m not convinced this move does that. Again, it’s not about being too pessimistic; it’s about being realistic with our expectations and how this particular loan fits into them.

You are looking at loans from one angle. Here we have a player whose pedigree is undoubtedly impressive. He’s available for an affordable fee in the summer but his career is on a downward trajectory.  If you are given the opportunity to pay a smallish fee to have a proper look at him, in house, for 6 months why would you turn it down simply because it’s unusual?  

[Davefevs]

Still wonder why the lure of Westerlo was so big?  Other than his brother was in Belgium.

[Sir Geoff]

21 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Still wonder why the lure of Westerlo was so big?  Other than his brother was in Belgium.

Agree. Seems a very strange situation all round and one I think we should be steering well clear of.

[Super]

Maybe we'll unleash him against Rotherham.

[Jazzy]

16 hours ago, Galley is our king said:

He's become a "pathway blocker" which I thought we didn't want anymore.

Bring on one of our own wasn't it?

I think it's a big deal for Yeboah and possibly others from the academy.

What's that noise?..... oh it's one of the 5 pillars crashing to the ground....

 

 

Youth pathway is crumbling to the ground despite academy graduates playing 30% of all available minutes this season, which is happens to be the joint highest in the Championship

[Natchfever]

1 hour ago, Glasgow Red said:

This. There are fine margins in football and sometimes these gambles pay off and other times they dont. I don't think the club should stop taking punts on loans because other clubs have definitely used loans to help them get out the champ.

But what do you think the club saw that prompted the loan and inclusion into matchday squads ?

Loans are for the here and now like Twine not the future imo.

[And Its Smith]

34 minutes ago, Natchfever said:

But what do you think the club saw that prompted the loan and inclusion into matchday squads ?

Loans are for the here and now like Twine not the future imo.

Loans can be for both. A try before you buy is not a bad thing 

[MarcusX]

17 hours ago, Harry said:

Let’s write off a 19 year old, shall we. 
 

Do you know what Conway was doing at the same age. He’s just come off of a loan at Bath City and was making an odd appearance here and there for us. 
Sam Bell at the same age had just come off of a loan at Grimsby. 
Let’s even go as far as Vyner. At the same age he was on loan at Accrington. 
I could go on. 
 

Some of the comments seem to suggest the kid can’t even play football and is some sort of competition winner! 
Somewhat disrespectful that chaps. 

I’m not gonna get caught up in any hype, but you don’t get voted Man City’s academy player of the year if you are shit. Nor do you get called up to national teams age groups 16’s, 19’s and 21’s. 
He actually has the same amount of Scotland u21 goals as Conway. And he’s 2 years younger. 
 

But yeah, let’s write him off because we’ve seen him play 40 minutes of football as a late substitute in a struggling team. 
 

Yeah ok. 

You make a good point, although I think it's rather different. They were all our players going off to other teams to get experience and none of them had a decision coming up regarding a transfer fee.

We're talking about 6 more games for a player who isn't ours to make an impact.

Or, we could give those 6 games to one of our own young lads.

I say this as someone who thought in the brief minutes against Southampton he looked like he had a bit about him. and certainly haven't written him off - but I could see why people would rather not bother, especially given that we're going to have to pay for him.

 

 

[And Its Smith]

6 minutes ago, MarcusX said:

You make a good point, although I think it's rather different. They were all our players going off to other teams to get experience and none of them had a decision coming up regarding a transfer fee.

We're talking about 6 more games for a player who isn't ours to make an impact.

Or, we could give those 6 games to one of our own young lads.

I say this as someone who thought in the brief minutes against Southampton he looked like he had a bit about him. and certainly haven't written him off - but I could see why people would rather not bother, especially given that we're going to have to pay for him.

 

 

I think we have to trust in those at the club to see if there is potential there. They know his personality and ability a lot better now than they did 3 months ago.  So if they decide to sign him, I think we have to assume for the time being it’s the right decision despite his lack of playing time.  There is no way that fans will be able to have an opinion on it really. Not an informed one, anyway. 

[Redrascal2]

18 hours ago, Ziderarmy said:

Results aside what was the point in this loan. Since he’s joined we’ve played 11 games.

1 game he didn’t make the squad 

7 times he’s sat on the bench and not got off it.

3 times he’s come off the bench for a grand total of 44 minutes. 

He’s not played since Cardiff away where he got 8 minutes on February 2nd.

Now we’re safe surely we either give him game time or bring some of our own youth players in who we think could step up.

Baffling loan so far. 

Taking a place that one of own academy players could have.

[Silvio Dante]

There’s a few bottom lines with Mebude, and a lot of it lies in how things are handled:

- Firstly, you have to look at how the signing was presented initially. Tinnions tweets and the signing on videos suggested this was a ready made first team player who could make an impact. It wasn’t, and he isn’t, but the expectations from the club were as such

- Then people started digging into his time in Belgium - why was someone signed for a big fee and highly rated in Man City’s academy not playing at a level below us (for a team who escaped relegation controversially). The club put out a totally fabricated story around work permits, when they could have framed it as he couldn’t settle or whatever. It was bizarre and I don’t understand it now.

- So he plays as sub against Soton. Does fine, nothing world beating, highlight being a run where he was fouled on halfway. QPR comes and he’s abysmal, to a point where it seems teammates don’t want to pass to him. Since then, despite the team having needed inspiration at times Liam hasn’t wanted to turn to a “game changer” suggesting he doesn’t think he’s ready for this level - and the question is if he ever will be

- You then come to moving forward. Westerlo paid £1.5m for him (their fifth biggest fee). It’s likely they’ll want a fair chunk of that back (and you’d have to question the wisdom of paying it), and if they are prepared to cut their losses majorly, you’d have to question the wisdom of taking DM based on what we’ve seen (or haven’t seen) to date

So, where we are is that we have a player who isn’t ready for the first team and has been deemed as such at his last club as well. Paying a fee seems unwise and if his club would let him go for nothing it just raises more questions.

I agree with the observation that had he come on trial that things wouldn’t be as pronounced (but it wasn’t framed as such), and I also agree there is nothing wrong with a try before you buy - I prefer them - but to have got it so spectacularly wrong that you won’t play him really doesn’t look good.

It’ll go down as one of the most bizarre transfers in our history. But the main fault is in how it was framed/structured. If the positioning was “He’s come over so we can have a look as he hadn’t settled in Belgium. May or may not be involved with the first team but it gives an idea where he is”, I don’t think the conversation - in the way it’s being had - happens.

[Natchfever]

39 minutes ago, And Its Smith said:

Loans can be for both. A try before you buy is not a bad thing 

Understood, although hes clearly off the pace and therefore hasnt really been tried.

Has he turned out for the u21s ? not sure.

[Curr Avon]

2 hours ago, Davefevs said:

Still wonder why the lure of Westerlo was so big?  Other than his brother was in Belgium.

This is worth revisiting with my journalist contact. I'll message him and get back to you.

[IAmNick]

2 hours ago, Jazzy said:

Youth pathway is crumbling to the ground despite academy graduates playing 30% of all available minutes this season, which is happens to be the joint highest in the Championship

Isn't that going to primarily be due to O'Leary, Pring, and Vyner who are 27, 26, and 26 respectively playing almost every game?

I think the meaning behind "the pathway" is a route into the first team, rather than just having lots of academy players play for the team in their mid/late twenties, right?

Personally I'd look more at debut/breakthrough seasons.

Edited April 2 by IAmNick

[Northern Red]

45 minutes ago, Natchfever said:

Understood, although hes clearly off the pace and therefore hasnt really been tried.

Has he turned out for the u21s ? not sure.

He hasn't, which I do find a bit puzzling. It would appear that he isn't anywhere near Championship standard at present but surely it's worth a look at how he compares to our other prospects of a similar age.

[Selred]

Feels like we didn't do our due diligence to be honest. Isn't there an online market place where you can basically court clubs to sign your players? I'm sure that's what happened with someone like Semenyo to Bournemouth?

For me it feels like a panic signing. Westerlo wanted him gone, we saw Man City history and snapped him up. 

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, And Its Smith said:

I think we have to trust in those at the club to see if there is potential there. They know his personality and ability a lot better now than they did 3 months ago.  So if they decide to sign him, I think we have to assume for the time being it’s the right decision despite his lack of playing time.  There is no way that fans will be able to have an opinion on it really. Not an informed one, anyway. 

Fair.

Although “trust” I might tweak to “accept”!

1 hour ago, Silvio Dante said:

There’s a few bottom lines with Mebude, and a lot of it lies in how things are handled:

- Firstly, you have to look at how the signing was presented initially. Tinnions tweets and the signing on videos suggested this was a ready made first team player who could make an impact. It wasn’t, and he isn’t, but the expectations from the club were as such

- Then people started digging into his time in Belgium - why was someone signed for a big fee and highly rated in Man City’s academy not playing at a level below us (for a team who escaped relegation controversially). The club put out a totally fabricated story around work permits, when they could have framed it as he couldn’t settle or whatever. It was bizarre and I don’t understand it now.

- So he plays as sub against Soton. Does fine, nothing world beating, highlight being a run where he was fouled on halfway. QPR comes and he’s abysmal, to a point where it seems teammates don’t want to pass to him. Since then, despite the team having needed inspiration at times Liam hasn’t wanted to turn to a “game changer” suggesting he doesn’t think he’s ready for this level - and the question is if he ever will be

- You then come to moving forward. Westerlo paid £1.5m for him (their fifth biggest fee). It’s likely they’ll want a fair chunk of that back (and you’d have to question the wisdom of paying it), and if they are prepared to cut their losses majorly, you’d have to question the wisdom of taking DM based on what we’ve seen (or haven’t seen) to date

So, where we are is that we have a player who isn’t ready for the first team and has been deemed as such at his last club as well. Paying a fee seems unwise and if his club would let him go for nothing it just raises more questions.

I agree with the observation that had he come on trial that things wouldn’t be as pronounced (but it wasn’t framed as such), and I also agree there is nothing wrong with a try before you buy - I prefer them - but to have got it so spectacularly wrong that you won’t play him really doesn’t look good.

It’ll go down as one of the most bizarre transfers in our history. But the main fault is in how it was framed/structured. If the positioning was “He’s come over so we can have a look as he hadn’t settled in Belgium. May or may not be involved with the first team but it gives an idea where he is”, I don’t think the conversation - in the way it’s being had - happens.

Taking each dash in turn:

- you have to question what it was based on!  The video (on Wyscout) I watched of his matches at Westerlo (inc friendlies) did not show a player to support the claims.  If they’d based it on tracking him at Man City, and had become aware of his availability or wondered why he wasn’t getting any minutes and checked his availability, then say so.

- no need to be Poirot was there!  They over-egged the travel visa issue and we saw through it!  @And Its Smith hence why I am loathe to use the word “trust”.

- LM certainly not being forced to play players he doesn’t want to (not malleable).

- unless the fee agreed is ridiculously low, you pass this opportunity.

Yep, framed wrongly.  Typical bullish Tinnion, he bugs up pretty much everyone.  I like his enthusiasm, but his arse must look like a Titleist pro V1 with the amount of times he’s had it bitten!

[Davefevs]

14 minutes ago, Selred said:

Feels like we didn't do our due diligence to be honest. Isn't there an online market place where you can basically court clubs to sign your players? I'm sure that's what happened with someone like Semenyo to Bournemouth?

For me it feels like a panic signing. Westerlo wanted him gone, we saw Man City history and snapped him up. 

TransferRoom.

Its how we “swiped right” with Bajic.

(I had to Google the swipe direction)