FNQ Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 19 minutes ago, Tony Tootle said: Non issue. Hope it works out well for him and he scores a load of goals at that level. Didn’t do Bobby Zamora any harm! Ahhh… When you’re sat in row z and the ball hits your head… that’s Zamora Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sturny Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 (edited) 1 hour ago, lenred said: So why wasn’t he loaned out during the window then? It’s piss poor planning from our DOF amd management team. That’s not ‘beating with a stick’ it’s just plain common sense planning. We don't know do we, so we can't really claim it's poor management about this loan. Maybe Yeboah didn't want to go on loan? Maybe Bath didn't want him until now? Some awfully dramatic posts on this thread Edited February 27 by Sturny 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Betty Swallocks Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 Was there this much of an overreaction when we sent a young Tommy Conway out on loan to Bath? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon bristol Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 3 hours ago, bearded_red said: Didn’t Tinnion say at the start of the season that Pearson had promoted him into the first team squad and he now wouldn’t leave that level? ..On loan in the Conference South. I think some of our first team squad are actually conference south level. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Brent Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 16 minutes ago, Betty Swallocks said: Was there this much of an overreaction when we sent a young Tommy Conway out on loan to Bath? Different 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Betty Swallocks Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 Just now, David Brent said: Different How so? Ephraim looks a million miles off being a Championship player, currently. Playing regularly against men will help him improve more so than playing for the U21’s, much like Tommys loans did. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonBristolian Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 (edited) 4 hours ago, Fjmcity said: Is there really a story here? Yeboah was surely only ever involved due to a pretty serious injury crisis and showed himself to be raw and not ready for championship football. I'd say that's slightly revisionist. A lot of our injuries at the time were in defence. We had 5 forwards available (Wells, Sykes, Cornick, Bell and Mehmeti) as well as Knight who could have played higher up the pitch in an emergency. At times Yeboah was getting on the pitch ahead of Mehmeti and possibly Cornick. I'd agree he was raw but he wasn't just there to make up the numbers. 3 hours ago, Silvio Dante said: And yet on another thread a respected poster is swearing blind that Pearson didn’t have to cope with more injuries than Manning. Both arguments can’t be true. Pearson obviously had more injuries than Manning but injuries are still disrupting us somewhat. Worrying difference though is Manning seems happier to just not put players on the bench. I can get why sending Yeboah on loan is better than being in the Under-18s but I do find it worrying how many young players seem to be further away than they were a year or six months ago and I can't name a single one that's any closer to the first team since Manning took over. Edited February 27 by LondonBristolian 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sleepy1968 Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 40 minutes ago, phantom said: Apart from running around very fast and closing people down does he really bring anything to the first team at the moment? He hasn't yet. He's got bags of potential, and some competitive football will be very useful. So I don't really see the downside. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Brent Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 4 minutes ago, Betty Swallocks said: How so? Ephraim looks a million miles off being a Championship player, currently. Playing regularly against men will help him improve more so than playing for the U21’s, much like Tommys loans did. Tommy hadn’t made his debut by that point. It’s been suggested by the club previously that Yeboah’s development would be better suited by him staying with the first team squad. I appreciate that can change. He’ll also improve by getting minutes for the first team. It will give Liam some brownie points too. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Betty Swallocks Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 (edited) 4 minutes ago, David Brent said: Tommy hadn’t made his debut by that point. It’s been suggested by the club previously that Yeboah’s development would be better suited by him staying with the first team squad. I appreciate that can change. He’ll also improve by getting minutes for the first team. It will give Liam some brownie points too. Tommy not making his first team debut has no bearing on this. Tommy wasn’t ready to play for the 1st team at the point he was sent out on loan to Bath and neither is EY. Going on loan to Bath doesn’t stop him training with City or the 1st team. He can still do both whilst gaining the experience of playing against adults on a regular basis which having watched him, he looks like he needs. Edited February 27 by Betty Swallocks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Brent Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 6 minutes ago, Betty Swallocks said: Tommy not making his first team debut has no bearing on this. Tommy wasn’t ready to play for the 1st team at the point he was sent out on loan to Bath and neither is EY. Going on loan to Bath doesn’t stop him training with City or the 1st team. He can still do both whilst gaining the experience of playing against adults on a regular basis which having watched him, he looks like he needs. Of course it has no bearing, it’s a different player. But it’s still relevant to how the situation is different to Yeboah’s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Betty Swallocks Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 Just now, David Brent said: Of course it has no bearing, it’s a different player. But it’s still relevant to how the situation is different to Yeboah’s. It’s still not a situation that needs an over reaction though. Young player needs regular game time against adults to gain experience. Who out of our celebrated academy players currently playing for 1st team hasn’t gone down this path before becoming a regular? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvio Dante Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 5 minutes ago, Betty Swallocks said: Tommy not making his first team debut has no bearing on this. Tommy wasn’t ready to play for the 1st team at the point he was sent out on loan to Bath and neither is EY. Going on loan to Bath doesn’t stop him training with City or the 1st team. He can still do both whilst gaining the experience of playing against adults on a regular basis which having watched him, he looks like he needs. I think the thing that’s being missed here is twofold: - This isn’t a loan to Yate Town. This is going into a conference south promotion race with two games a week. Bath also train twice a week, and EY will be involved in the U18s Youth Cup. With that schedule there is no chance in hell that he’s training with the first team. I’m not denying the loan may be beneficial, but for people to say he can/will still train with us on a first team level - at anywhere near the point to accurately gauge/coach him is just manifestly incorrect. - And the second thing that’s being missed is very early in his reign, Liam cut down the training groups. The first team squad are training as the first team squad - there is less of the U21s or suitable 18s training (IIRC a poster who would know posted that here) - and a lot of it is patterns etc with extra lines on the training pitch. Want to know why less academy are involved on matchday? Because they’re getting less exposure in the week. No reason why that will change. On balance it is a good move for him - because he’ll be playing. But this isn’t “beef him up and let him train with the first team as well” - it’s out of sight, out of mind. 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big C Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 2 minutes ago, Silvio Dante said: I think the thing that’s being missed here is twofold: - This isn’t a loan to Yate Town. This is going into a conference south promotion race with two games a week. Bath also train twice a week, and EY will be involved in the U18s Youth Cup. With that schedule there is no chance in hell that he’s training with the first team. I’m not denying the loan may be beneficial, but for people to say he can/will still train with us on a first team level - at anywhere near the point to accurately gauge/coach him is just manifestly incorrect. - And the second thing that’s being missed is very early in his reign, Liam cut down the training groups. The first team squad are training as the first team squad - there is less of the U21s or suitable 18s training (IIRC a poster who would know posted that here) - and a lot of it is patterns etc with extra lines on the training pitch. Want to know why less academy are involved on matchday? Because they’re getting less exposure in the week. No reason why that will change. On balance it is a good move for him - because he’ll be playing. But this isn’t “beef him up and let him train with the first team as well” - it’s out of sight, out of mind. Rubbish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvio Dante Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 2 minutes ago, Big C said: Rubbish Thanks for that. Always welcome reasoned and structured debate. You could possibly say which bits were rubbish and show your workings? Or is that, y’know, a bit more difficult than facepalms and single words because you don’t have anything constructive to say…. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonBristolian Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 4 minutes ago, Big C said: Rubbish Which bit? I might be wrong but I think the fact that Yeboah in particular - and young players in general - are training less with the first team is something that has been reported by more than one poster with genuine insight into what's going on on the training ground. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 3 hours ago, Silvio Dante said: Without turning this into a Medube thread, I think they were surprised he was so way off the standard against QPR. Genuinely looked like a competition winner out there. So I think the intent was here and now but they didn’t do due diligence or scout properly to see if he could cut it. And again, when your teammates - who haven’t just seen you in that game but seen you in training - actively don’t pass to you, it’s a bit of a sign. I would love to know if anyone in our recruitment process looked at his Wyscout clips from the friendly for Westerlo v Bucharesti. By all means track him from Man City u21 scouting against his peers, but perhaps more relevant is how he did in senior football. I ain’t writing Mebude off, far from him, but I dampened my expectations upon signing. He was no Jonathan Leko 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big C Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Silvio Dante said: Thanks for that. Always welcome reasoned and structured debate. You could possibly say which bits were rubbish and show your workings? Or is that, y’know, a bit more difficult than facepalms and single words because you don’t have anything constructive to say…. Bath are semi-pro so when do you think they will be training? As opposed to a professional team like say Bristol City. Also with two games a week do you think they will be training 2 evenings a week also?/ Finally whilst Ephram is waitng for training/games to start in the evenings do you think he will be shut up in a room in Bath on his own all day? And your statement that players refused to pass to Medube is just laughable Edited February 27 by Big C Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lrrr Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 27 minutes ago, David Brent said: Tommy hadn’t made his debut by that point. It’s been suggested by the club previously that Yeboah’s development would be better suited by him staying with the first team squad. I appreciate that can change. He’ll also improve by getting minutes for the first team. It will give Liam some brownie points too. He won’t get minutes for our first team in any game where we don’t use wingers so you kill the amount of minutes he may get instantly anyway Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swede Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 Says it all really. He may be young and a bit raw but he has valuable first team experience at Championship level and with Sam Bell's injury surely he would have more opportunities? Now binned off to Bath City never to be seen again until he pops up and scores a hattrick for Cardiff against us. I thought we hired a bright young enthusiastic coach? Try telling that to the likes of Roberts and Yeboah. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid in the Riot Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 Heading to the game this evening at Twerton so interesting to see if he gets some minutes... big game against Braintree. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvio Dante Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 1 minute ago, Big C said: Bath are semi-pro so when do you think they will be training? As opposed to a professional team like say Bristol City. Also with two games a week do you think they will be training 2 evenings a week also?/ Finally whilst Ephram is waitng for training/games to start in the evenings do you think he will be shut up in a room in Bath on his own all day? I think you’ll find teams like Bath do train twice a week. And although they may not sometimes when they have games, in the current schedule, when up against Fulltime teams for promotion, they will certainly be doing so currently. Teams at Southern League train once a week. Conference South - undoubtedly twice as they need it for the fitness levels. But let’s say you’re right. And Ephraim is playing two games a week for Bath and one game for the U18s. He’s then got one training session with Bath and one with the U18s. So he’s got 5 days of football, three of which are intense and typically need a rest day after - so we’re already one day over. He may not be sat in a room. But if you think he’s training with the first team when he hasn’t been for the last 3 months with that schedule considered, I’ve got some beans I’d like to sell you. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 9 minutes ago, Swede said: Says it all really. He may be young and a bit raw but he has valuable first team experience at Championship level and with Sam Bell's injury surely he would have more opportunities? Now binned off to Bath City never to be seen again until he pops up and scores a hattrick for Cardiff against us. I thought we hired a bright young enthusiastic coach? Try telling that to the likes of Roberts and Yeboah. I’ve not really got too much of an opinion on the Yeboah loan - pros and cons….but the point I would’ve made is exactly yours….the injury to Bell creates a spot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big C Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Davefevs said: I’ve not really got too much of an opinion on the Yeboah loan - pros and cons….but the point I would’ve made is exactly yours….the injury to Bell creates a spot. but Sykes and Twine (hopefully) are back only OTIB can go into meltdown about loaning out a 17 year old who can't get in the squad Edited February 27 by Big C 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shuffle Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 (edited) Games all about opinions but just because Yeboah got fast tracked this season, I’m not sure what anyone saw to warrant the disappointment that he’s going to play senior football at Bath. This is a 17 year old who beyond being quick certainly didn’t pull up any trees in his cameos. He’s dropped down the pecking order recently to the extent that he no longer trains with first team or is even a starter with the 21s. He’s 17 & Scott’s emergence has set expectations too high as we clamour to find the next one and it puts pressure on the young lads unnecessarily. Good decision to get him use to physicality of senior football & come back stronger for next season. Everything doesn’t have to be sinister as simply manager who frankly needs results hasn’t seen enough to warrant a place in first team & allows him to develop elsewhere. Edited February 27 by Shuffle 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkeh Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 This is a none story Would rather him play uncompetitive under 18 or under 21 football, or competitive men's football at a decent level in a team fighting for promotion, Going out on loan to the likes of Bath didn't do Joe Bryan, Bobby Reid, Tommy Conway any harm, in fact it greatly aided their development, There are many things to beat manning, the club and tinnion with, this is not one of them 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petehinton Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 4 minutes ago, Big C said: but Sykes and Twine (hopefully) are back only OTIB can go into meltdown about loaning out a 17 year old who can't get in the squad I don’t think it’s a meltdown at all. With the season done, think it’s more than fair to be a bit miffed that we now won’t get another minute out probably the most exciting player, who could’ve been blooded more into the first team, this season. Need something to get a bit excited over. For me the main issue is the precedent vs what we’ve been used to recently & that the HPC was ‘designed to give us’ The next best for me is Rae Nelson, who, again, in and around the first team & making squads, wasn’t even able to make a bench with a space left free on Saturday. Writing for this was on the wall when Medube came in, but him coming as a loan player for 4 months and taking the spaces of the two most exciting wide players out of the academy for the remaining, pretty dud, 2 months of the season (perfect time to give more game time to academy players). If it’s to be believed, Ephraim has been banished from the first team set up since his last minutes against Blackburn, and Raek is starting to be with the first team less and less. “we’ll always look academy first when recruiting”, it is not. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merrick's Marvels Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 (edited) 18 minutes ago, Big C said: but Sykes and Twine (hopefully) are back If we play Twine as a wide left attacker, someone needs shooting. Because he made his name as an ACM, an ACM is exactly what we're missing (a technical creative player in the centre of the pitch) and LM himself said even though that's where Hull played him that wasn't his best position. Just don't start your reply by saying - Yeah but that's where LM picked him against Watford. Because that's just one more baffling, head scratching decision to add to a baffling, head scratching season. Edited February 27 by Merrick's Marvels Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shelts Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 Think he’s a decent player . Can’t tell if he’s championship quality yet but seen some nice stuff for a young lad . Hope the loan deal works out for him and the Romans Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvio Dante Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 9 minutes ago, petehinton said: I don’t think it’s a meltdown at all. With the season done, think it’s more than fair to be a bit miffed that we now won’t get another minute out probably the most exciting player, who could’ve been blooded more into the first team, this season. Need something to get a bit excited over. For me the main issue is the precedent vs what we’ve been used to recently & that the HPC was ‘designed to give us’ The next best for me is Rae Nelson, who, again, in and around the first team & making squads, wasn’t even able to make a bench with a space left free on Saturday. Writing for this was on the wall when Medube came in, but him coming as a loan player for 4 months and taking the spaces of the two most exciting wide players out of the academy for the remaining, pretty dud, 2 months of the season (perfect time to give more game time to academy players). If it’s to be believed, Ephraim has been banished from the first team set up since his last minutes against Blackburn, and Raek is starting to be with the first team less and less. “we’ll always look academy first when recruiting”, it is not. Thats the nail on head isn’t it Pete? I think practically everyone acknowledges that if EY isn’t going to be involved then a loan to Bath is fine. The three points that people are raising: - Firstly, and most crucially, what it says about the pathway - particularly when you consider the first team/youth changed split since Liam took over, and his record to date of bringing youth through - That he physically won’t be able to train with the first team - despite some gloss that some are putting on it - because of the recovery time needed from his Bath and U18 commitments - That, from the admittedly small cameo, people don’t understand keeping Medube over him. All of those are totally valid. You can think it’s a good move for Ephraim in the scenario he’s in but at the same time express concerns over the bigger picture. But people are jumping to defend the club and not seeing that totally valid bigger picture. Not a meltdown. And if the (collective) forum is going to be accused of that every time we lay a bit of nuance on a situation then people need to think what a meltdown actually means! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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