LJ in "The Times" today; 300th game as manager

[Robbored]

2 minutes ago, keynshamred said:

Johnson made both Reid and Bryan! Reid had numerous average seasons. Gave him the confidence and believed in his quality as a forward and it payed off (10 million pound player)  He also along with the coaches made Joe into a better defender and able to play full back in a 4, compared to cotts in a wing back system with no real defensive responsibility! 

I’m not debating whether LJ made Bryan a left back - I simply asked that if it wasn’t LJ then who was it?  Your reply seems to clarify what happened with Bryan and his development into a PL player.

Certain posters are suggesting  that LJ is making false claims..........

[Davefevs]

9 minutes ago, keynshamred said:

Johnson made both Reid and Bryan! Reid had numerous average seasons. Gave him the confidence and believed in his quality as a forward and it payed off (10 million pound player)  He also along with the coaches made Joe into a better defender and able to play full back in a 4, compared to cotts in a wing back system with no real defensive responsibility! 

In fairness, Cotts didn’t need to play him LB, he played a different style, one in which Joe thrived, during 14/15.  Joe started the season well until Darikwa whacked him twice at home to Burnley.

He was capable of playing LB, just Cotts rarely played with one.  Joe is a versatile left-sided player, has been throughout his time at City.  LJ/JM deserve a bit of credit for some of his development as a LB...but they didn’t turn him into one.

[exAtyeoMax]

5 hours ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

However , that doesn’t account for his ‘ I Would walk the Championship with a decent budget’ at the Forum

Not ‘ We would walk’

Is he saying our squad is rubbish?

[NickJ]

4 hours ago, Robbored said:

I’m not debating whether LJ made Bryan a left back - I simply asked that if it wasn’t LJ then who was it?  Your reply seems to clarify what happened with Bryan and his development into a PL player.

Certain posters are suggesting  that LJ is making false claims..........

Yes he is. As @Davefevssays, Bryan is a left sided player used by Cotts as a wing back in 3-5-2 and by Johnson as a left back in 4-4-2. 

Bryan was in the League One 2014/15 team of the season as a wing back, so how Johnson can take all the credit for turning him into a £7m player defies belief. 

Bryan was developed at City for 10 years - I recall coaches raving about him even before he made his debut - and Johnson claims credit for tweaking the position he played an already very good footballer. And furthermore gives the person most likely to have improved Bryan’s defending- Jamie McCallister - no credit whatever.

Of many false claims in the interview, that is the most outrageous IMO. 

[JamesBCFC]

13 hours ago, North London Red said:

That's an enlightening interview.

Johnson used 'I' 68 times, and 'we' 4 times.

He used 'me' 6 times, and 'us' once.

He used 'my' 11 times, and 'our' once.

Perhaps I'm reading too much into it (and someone rightly pointed out above that it was an interview with him, and about him, as it was his 300th game), but it just comes over a little too much 'me, me, me....look at me, everyone' for my liking.

You are, and drastically.

In an interview about him, where he talks about his past (council estate in Newmarket, the bit about having police sent to his house when Oldham manager, who he has managed against among other things) "We" would be an unnecessary change to make.

Likewise the "in the mean time I've got to get promoted" is after he is talking about one of the assistants trying to get him to meditate "I'll meditate when I'm dead. In the mean time I've got to get promoted".

In its fuller context it's shown someone who wants to manage at the highest level, but knows he will need to make it happen (can't remember exact quote from later in the article, but along the lines of "I know a Premier League team won't take a risk on me so I need to get promotion").

 

[Bristol Oil Services]

8 hours ago, lenred said:

Yep it’s a fair point you make. However there is a big big difference imho in being positive about yourself, which I’m all for (it’s a great trait to have as long as it’s measured) and some of the cringeworthy, delusional stuff that he comes out with. 

Yes, there's a fine line, or at least a line, between healthy self-regard and someone just fooling themselves, and others. It's interesting to note that people have varying opinions on LJ and his readiness to blow his own trumpet.

[Ian M]

13 hours ago, Davefevs said:

He was a LB, LWB, LM, LW, before LJ got him, before Cotts got him too.  Played a bit of CM too.

You could argue Cotts converted him into a LWB, from a LB?  Possibly his best position???

LJ did not turn him into a LB.  He may well feel he is entitled to claim credit for improving him as a LB.  i don’t have an issue with that.  I suspect Macca might want of that credit?  Turned him into a LB, but played him LW?

The way I read that comment was in a similar vain to Reid, I.e. totally changed his position.  That did not happen.

Am I the only one noticing a touch of "Rovers' travelling support" about the quoted £7m fee? 

 

 

[Davefevs]

41 minutes ago, Ian M said:

Am I the only one noticing a touch of "Rovers' travelling support" about the quoted £7m fee? 

 

 

£6.4m for Bryan

£9m + £1m addons for Reid

 

[Davefevs]

35 minutes ago, ReggyRed said:

Last time i checked LWB and LB were different positions?

They are indeed. But it wasn’t as if Joe had never played LB before and LJ had an epiphany one night is it?

Had Joe carried on playing RB after the Brum game and earned a transfer as a RB then LJ’s claims would be fine.  

[NickJ]

6 hours ago, ReggyRed said:

Last time i checked LWB and LB were different positions?

Yes and he had played both before Johnson came along. 

Bryan had 10-12 years of development under many dedicated unrecognised coaches and 2 or 3 experienced managers. 

To repeat, he was recognised as one of the best 11 players in League one in 2014/15. 

Johnson’s claim that he then made him into a £7m player Is worthy of challenge for what it is - a false claim. 

[Robbored]

19 minutes ago, NickJ said:

Johnson’s claim that he then made him into a £7m player Is worthy of challenge for what it is - a false claim. 

Rather than slag LJ off or call him a liar I’d like to hear him explain his rationale behind the claim he made Bryan into a £7m player.

[Davefevs]

41 minutes ago, Robbored said:

Rather than slag LJ off or call him a liar I’d like to hear him explain his rationale behind the claim he made Bryan into a £7m player.

He probably improved his value....I can give him that, although as before, Macca might get sone credit...and maybe / probably Joe himself.  But not to anywhere near the scale of Reid’s turnaround though.

[spudski]

I really find it hard to swallow...when fans pick apart comments from a written article.

If we heard the full interview and not just parts of it, maybe the gist of comments would be understood better.

For example...we don't know everything said about Bryan. He may well have said other things about the development before him.

Bryan was sold whilst under LJ's tenure...no other team in the Prem has come in and bought him whilst under other managers.

Perhaps he wasn't ready for the Prem then and worth the 7 million. Perhaps LJ did make him Prem quality.

We just don't know.

All written articles take quotes...and often don't reflect the true reflection of what was being said.

It happens in all media. I'm really not sure why the general populous often don't see through this.

[Davefevs]

@spudski and often the person interviewed gets to read the article before it’s published

Pretty much all of us respect Henry Winter as a top journo, not one to sensationalise stuff for effect, so we might take his work as being more true than some of the other “hacks”.  I accept he has to sell column inches though.

Swings and Roundabouts.

You are right that we haven’t heard / read the whole interview, but it’s not as if any of us haven’t heard LJ talk himself up before is it?

[spudski]

14 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

@spudski and often the person interviewed gets to read the article before it’s published

Pretty much all of us respect Henry Winter as a top journo, not one to sensationalise stuff for effect, so we might take his work as being more true than some of the other “hacks”.  I accept he has to sell column inches though.

Swings and Roundabouts.

You are right that we haven’t heard / read the whole interview, but it’s not as if any of us haven’t heard LJ talk himself up before is it?

Agree @Davefevs Interviews tend to go one of two ways...one to big up a person or to talk negatively about them.

Henry Winter is a fine journalist. I don't think he would write something if he thought it fantasy.

Trying to reflect that LJ is a young British coach doing well....and respected amongst his peers.

Maybe it has been over played...no more than anyone else upping their profile or CV in normal work.

Football is all about bigging yourself or the Club up.

Just a case of reading between the lines and not taking every word as gospel imo.

[Davefevs]

2 minutes ago, spudski said:

Agree @Davefevs Interviews tend to go one of two ways...one to big up a person or to talk negatively about them.

Henry Winter is a fine journalist. I don't think he would write something if he thought it fantasy.

Trying to reflect that LJ is a young British coach doing well....and respected amongst his peers.

Maybe it has been over played...no more than anyone else upping their profile or CV in normal work.

Football is all about bigging yourself or the Club up.

Just a case of reading between the lines and not taking every word as gospel imo.

Agree, although I’d like a bit more balance given to the players, especially post-match.

Pre-match he is complimentary, e.g. Eliasson a £10m 7-aside Player (even if I find that far too gushing personally - rather he toned it down a bit).

But post-match he does like to give himself a bit too much praise when things have gone well.  Not always, but a bit too often for my liking.

Just a bit of toning down on both sides and I could listen to him all-day....well, a lot anyway! 

[AppyDAZE]

5 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Agree, although I’d like a bit more balance given to the players, especially post-match.

Pre-match he is complimentary, e.g. Eliasson a £10m 7-aside Player (even if I find that far too gushing personally - rather he toned it down a bit).

But post-match he does like to give himself a bit too much praise when things have gone well.  Not always, but a bit too often for my liking.

Just a bit of toning down on both sides and I could listen to him all-day....well, a lot anyway! 

This, or the sort of "you fans wouldn't quite understand because you are just the fans" tone he uses at times

Don't get me wrong, i like the guy as a bloke...

Just still worried about these long runs of poor results and dips in form that turn up a lot

But credit where it is due, it looked like the better BCFC on Saturday

 

[Robbored]

3 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

But post-match he does like to give himself a bit too much praise when things have gone well.  Not always, but a bit too often for my liking.

Just a bit of toning down on both sides and I could listen to him all-day....well, a lot anyway! 

There are psychological reason for that Spudski - largely about trying to prove himself.

[Robbored]

1 minute ago, Robbored said:

There are psychological reason for that Spudski - largely about trying to prove himself.

If you can separate the psychobabble from this article - much of it is pertinent to LJ

https://www.psychalive.org/psychology-behind-strained-father-son-relationships/

[Davefevs]

2 minutes ago, AppyDAZE said:

This, or the sort of "you fans wouldn't quite understand because you are only fans" impression.

Don't get me wrong, i like the guy as a bloke...

Just still worried about these long runs of poor results and dips in form that urn up a lot

But credit where it is due, it looked like the better BCFC on Saturday

 

I like him too....been in his company at CHSW and was nice to chat to him about Joe and non-football stuff.

I’m pleased we’ve gone 4 unbeaten.  He’s weathered a storm (ifonly from us opinionated posters on OTIB....I’m obviously including myself in this).  Having to replace him is not great for City....it virtually always costs  to replace a manager, not just in their pay-off, but compensation for bringing someone in, and ultimately they want to bring in their own players.

Thats not to say you shouldn’t replace if it’s the right thing to do.

The last 4 games have shown consistency in selection.

The last 4 games have started to show a bit of belief in the style.

The last 4 games have started to show a bit of understanding and awareness of the style from the players, and a a return to form, or at least better performances from certain players....from familiarity.

We can go to Derby and two home games following with a bit of momentum, under less pressure.

I’m still mellow!!!

[AppyDAZE]

1 minute ago, Davefevs said:

I like him too....been in his company at CHSW and was nice to chat to him about Joe and non-football stuff.

I’m pleased we’ve gone 4 unbeaten.  He’s weathered a storm (ifonly from us opinionated posters on OTIB....I’m obviously including myself in this).  Having to replace him is not great for City....it virtually always costs  to replace a manager, not just in their pay-off, but compensation for bringing someone in, and ultimately they want to bring in their own players.

Thats not to say you shouldn’t replace if it’s the right thing to do.

The last 4 games have shown consistency in selection.

The last 4 games have started to show a bit of belief in the style.

The last 4 games have started to show a bit of understanding and awareness of the style from the players, and a a return to form, or at least better performances from certain players....from familiarity.

We can go to Derby and two home games following with a bit of momentum, under less pressure.

I’m still mellow!!!

I'm stupidly optimistic that we are actually gong to beat them on their own tump on Saturday.

Mad, but this sort of just sums up our time since LJ has been boss at AG.

Got to like the guy , even though he drives you mad at times !!!!!!!

 

 

[Ashtonwurzel]

On 15/12/2018 at 12:41, bcfc01 said:

Always a problem, reading an article where the editing may sometimes cause the content to have a lack of context.

But he does come across as someone who has a firm belief in himself which some may say is arrogance but if it was just arrogance or conceit with no substance he wouldn't have lasted this long doing what he is doing. I would think that self belief is a very important attribute to have doing his job, especially after a run of poor results and thousands of people giving you stick. Same for players. I'd hate to have a shrinking violet as a head coach/manager, or players for that matter.

I'll temper that by saying he doesn't do himself any favours with things like "I think I'm doing a great job", he'd be better saying "I think I'm doing a good job."  That may come in time.

Nothing wrong with strong self belief as long as there is a bit of humility chucked in, without the humility I can see why some call it arrogance. Its an article which has obviously been edited for publication and maybe some humble bits have been left out..

I'll give him the benefit of the doubt.

Always think about the editing. Certain things are easily over stated for affect and "we" can become "I" very easily. 

[exAtyeoMax]

I suppose what I think is funny, is that a lot of us thought JB should be playing in midfield and not left back at all! 

[Robinabank]

On 16/12/2018 at 21:34, JBFC II said:

To be honest, if someone part of Leicester city had said the same 7 years ago, they’d have had exactly the same response.

Yes, it does seem ridiculous but it’s not impossible

Is this the same Leicester that has spent 51 seasons in the top flight? The same Leicester that has spent just one season as low as the third tier (and they finished that season as champions)?

Sure, people didn't expect Leicester to win the Premier League but people are used to seeing them in the division at least.

I find it remarkable that LJ, despite his strengths, can't get us near promotion yet is talking even hypothetically about winning the Premier League. And why was he also hypothetically linking himself to the Espanyol job? 

So much psychobabble, not enough in the way of results. Anyone believe we'll actually kick on after Saturday? I don't.

[JBFC II]

12 minutes ago, Robinabank said:

Is this the same Leicester that has spent 51 seasons in the top flight? The same Leicester that has spent just one season as low as the third tier (and they finished that season as champions)?

Sure, people didn't expect Leicester to win the Premier League but people are used to seeing them in the division at least.

I find it remarkable that LJ, despite his strengths, can't get us near promotion yet is talking even hypothetically about winning the Premier League. And why was he also hypothetically linking himself to the Espanyol job? 

So much psychobabble, not enough in the way of results. Anyone believe we'll actually kick on after Saturday? I don't.

Being unbeaten in our last 4, I think we have 'kicked on', then again I'd also say being mid table in the championship is about where we should be, so the fact we are talking about kicking on says a lot. 

Yes, Leicester had history but history means nothing, they've shown success can be achieved through persevering with a structure, something that we finally have under SL and LJ. 

Winning the premiership does seem pretty impossible now but promotion certainly isn't and after that anything is possible

[Robinabank]

1 minute ago, JBFC II said:

Being unbeaten in our last 4, I think we have 'kicked on', then again I'd also say being mid table in the championship is about where we should be, so the fact we are talking about kicking on says a lot. 

Yes, Leicester had history but history means nothing, they've shown success can be achieved through persevering with a structure, something that we finally have under SL and LJ. 

Winning the premiership does seem pretty impossible now but promotion certainly isn't and after that anything is possible

I say kick on because we spent so much time in the top 6 and faded away. It doesn't feel like we're close to that top 6 this season.

Windows of opportunity don't stay open for very long, especially for a club of our size. The likes of Cardiff and Huddersfield saw an opening and took it. And we couldn't. That might be the best chance we get for a long time. If anything this division is becoming harder because the teams that come down have the parachute payments. If (when?) the aforementioned Cardiff and Huddersfield come down at the end of the season they'll be stronger than when they left. LJ might be the reason we spent so long in the top 6 and the reason we dropped out. I don't really enjoy hearing him hype himself up.

[JBFC II]

29 minutes ago, Robinabank said:

I say kick on because we spent so much time in the top 6 and faded away. It doesn't feel like we're close to that top 6 this season.

Windows of opportunity don't stay open for very long, especially for a club of our size. The likes of Cardiff and Huddersfield saw an opening and took it. And we couldn't. That might be the best chance we get for a long time. If anything this division is becoming harder because the teams that come down have the parachute payments. If (when?) the aforementioned Cardiff and Huddersfield come down at the end of the season they'll be stronger than when they left. LJ might be the reason we spent so long in the top 6 and the reason we dropped out. I don't really enjoy hearing him hype himself up.

It's good a young manager, who faces a lot of unnecessary abuse from our fan base, show confidence. He could so easily go the other way and hide away from the press etc. 

Last season was ruined by a poor January, whether that's LJ's fault or not, only those in the club know. However this year was going to be a season of transition, especially when we lose our three most valuable assets and so the fact we are 3 points off 9th is very impressive in my opinion. 

[Robinabank]

1 minute ago, JBFC II said:

It's good a young manager, who faces a lot of unnecessary abuse from our fan base, show confidence. He could so easily go the other way and hide away from the press etc. 

Last season was ruined by a poor January, whether that's LJ's fault or not, only those in the club know. However this year was going to be a season of transition, especially when we lose our three most valuable assets and so the fact we are 3 points off 9th is very impressive in my opinion. 

Don't get me wrong, I think we're punching above our weight being where we are. I don't think there's any club in the PL who we are 'bigger' than or is taking 'our' place. I just feel a better manager would not have let the team stall like it did. I think he believed his own hype after Man U. And I do feel that he thinks he can do better than us. The comment about PL clubs won't hire him because he's English. Surely the reason is he's not actually achieved anything?

[JBFC II]

4 minutes ago, Robinabank said:

Don't get me wrong, I think we're punching above our weight being where we are. I don't think there's any club in the PL who we are 'bigger' than or is taking 'our' place. I just feel a better manager would not have let the team stall like it did. I think he believed his own hype after Man U. And I do feel that he thinks he can do better than us. The comment about PL clubs won't hire him because he's English. Surely the reason is he's not actually achieved anything?

I doubt many managers at 37 had achieved anything. He will go on to better things I don't doubt that. 

Can he be blamed for last season? Maybe in part, but as I said a failed January transfer window ruined us and he can't soley take responsibility for that. We had a small squad last season, which wasn't strengthened in January and I doubt many managers could have kept up our promotion tilt. 

[Ashtonwurzel]

1 hour ago, Robinabank said:

Is this the same Leicester that has spent 51 seasons in the top flight? The same Leicester that has spent just one season as low as the third tier (and they finished that season as champions)?

Sure, people didn't expect Leicester to win the Premier League but people are used to seeing them in the division at least.

I find it remarkable that LJ, despite his strengths, can't get us near promotion yet is talking even hypothetically about winning the Premier League. And why was he also hypothetically linking himself to the Espanyol job? 

So much psychobabble, not enough in the way of results. Anyone believe we'll actually kick on after Saturday? I don't.

Fun sponge !