Aston Villa's Allocation/Sold (Merged)

[Stortz]

13 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Another sanctimonious tosspot Villa fan. Quelle surprise.

Seriously, they must have a production line. Self entitled, arrogant shithouses the lot of them- in particular the 14 year old giving it the big potatoes on here now. Off you **** brummie.

[anotherdayins**thole]

2 minutes ago, Rapax said:

People are going to want to go to games that are closer and more attractive. That's the same for most clubs in would say.

 

 

 

So we’re supposed to bend over backwards to accommodate these people?  Do you think free drinks at half time would be a good idea as well?  How about leather padded seats?

[Nogbad the Bad]

48 minutes ago, anotherdayinparadise said:

OK, one last time.  After this, you are on your own.

Villa did not reduce your allocation - The police did.

The capacity of our ground in the Championship is 36000, not 43000.  It is not cost effective to open the top tier of the Trinity so the away allocation is actually bigger percentage wise than you would get at other grounds - Not that you’d know as there is not the scramble for tickets from you for these games and you never sell out.  I don’t see you moaning about Leeds only giving you 2K tickets for example but because we dare to be situated only 2 hours away, we are deemed to be satan.

Both City and Villa have capacities over 20k so by EFL rules must give 2k away allocations, but neither are obliged to give more than that.

I've no huge issue with Villa keeping to that allocation - it's their right to maximise home advantage imo. - but if they only give City around the minimum, for whatever reason, then I do have an issue with BCFC then giving Villa about an extra 75% in return.

If Villa are going to keep fairly strictly to the rules there's no reason for City not do the same.

Far from having an extra allocation on what, at 2,700, was already an excessive allocation, City should have simply offered the standard 2k, and kept to it.

To increase it was overly generous and reaches numbers where home advantage at any ground is very likely to be adversely affected.

Btw, out of interest what was Villa's average away following last season and how many Championship clubs offer Villa 3.4k or more?

 

[ChippenhamRed]

49 minutes ago, anotherdayinparadise said:

1.3k means that every one of your away fans will be guaranteed a ticket for Villa with several hundred more still available.

You also have empty seats because you cannot sell them.  The difference is that yours are in the existing away section.  We have a section of the ground that remains closed for cost cutting purposes.  Are you seriously suggesting that Villa should go to the expense of opening that section, moving our own ST holders just to accommodate a handful of day trippers who fancy a once a year away game?

As for the %, as I previously explained, the away allocations average at around 2600 out of 36000.  If you received 2100, it was on the say so of the police, not Villa.  Hence it makes no difference how much the ground holds, the police only want the minimum amount of away fans there in your case.

It’s very simple. We’re suggesting that both sets of supporters should be treated equally and given just as much chance of attending the away game as the other - irrespective of whose fault it is.

We have given you more tickets than we needed to, whereas we have not been granted the same generosity - even when we’ve sold out our allocation.

And you can’t summarily choose to declare a reduced capacity because you choose not to open a section of the ground. The point is Villa are being given decent allocations whilst not being willing to make any effort to make more tickets available to visiting supporters themselves - despite having 10,000 empty seats. We’ve moved season ticket holders all over the place in recent years during our redevelopment, you could similarly make a few amendments to your setup.

Oh and your Wigan example is clearly unfair - a Friday night game on Sky miles away will always result in a disproportionately low turnout. Our club is equally capable of taking 4-5k to away games, as we have done in recent years (Coventry, MK Dons, Reading for example).

[JBFC II]

27 minutes ago, anotherdayinparadise said:

Better to be hated than to be insignificant no marks.

You do realise we have one of the top 3 wealthiest owners in the country?  There is more chance of your selling out at Wigan than there is of us going into administration.

So insignificant that you've signed up to our forum and started posting? Right... 

Oh and having a wealthy owner means nothing, he can only put a certain amount into the club before FFP comes knocking, which won't be too long the way you've been spending... 

[anotherdayins**thole]

2 minutes ago, Nogbad the Bad said:

Both City and Villa have capacities over 20k so by EFL rules must give 2k away allocations, but neither are obliged to give more than that.

I've no huge issue with Villa keeping to that allocation - it's their right to maximise home advantage imo. - but if they only give City around the minimum, for whatever reason, then I do have an issue with BCFC then giving Villa about an extra 75% in return.

If Villa are going to keep fairly strictly to the rules there's no reason for City not do the same.

Far from having an extra allocation on what, at 2,700, was already an excessive allocation, City should have simply offered the standard 2k, and kept to it.

To increase it was overly generous and reaches numbers where home advantage is very likely to be adversely affected.

Btw, out of interest what was Villa's average away following last season and how many Championship clubs offer Villa 3.4k or more?

 

Correct.  Some clubs in this division offer away fans more tickets (Wigan, Sheffield Wed, Bristol, Bolton, Blackburn etc). Some don’t (Villa, Leeds, Sheffield U, Ipswich etc).

The issue is with your own club, not Villa.  You have decided that you want the extra revenue from the added 800 tickets which is your prerogative.  It doesn’t give you carte Blanche to start demanding that we open up closed areas or that we move season ticket holders just to accommodate once a year day trippers.

We averaged around 3000 away.  Cardiff, Bolton gave us around 4500 tickets, Millwall, Ipswich, Sheffield U only 2000 tickets.

[anotherdayins**thole]

2 minutes ago, JBFC II said:

So insignificant that you've signed up to our forum and started posting? Right... 

Oh and having a wealthy owner means nothing, he can only put a certain amount into the club before FFP comes knocking, which won't be too long the way you've been spending... 

FFP will not put us into administration.  If we were that desperate, we’d give you the extra allocation that you think you have a divine right to.

[JBFC II]

2 minutes ago, anotherdayinparadise said:

FFP will not put us into administration.  If we were that desperate, we’d give you the extra allocation that you think you have a divine right to.

Ffp won't, but the points deduction you'll get will lead to you staying down in this league. Which will in turn lead to your owners getting bored and then in turn the club going bust... 

And I hardly think the 30k you'd get from giving us a decent allocation would help sort out your financial problems 

[PooPants]

36 minutes ago, anotherdayinparadise said:

Better to be hated than to be insignificant no marks.

You do realise we have one of the top 3 wealthiest owners in the country?  There is more chance of your selling out at Wigan than there is of us going into administration.

Carry on the way you’re going and you’ll be ‘insignificant no marks’ soon as well.

36 minutes ago, anotherdayinparadise said:

Better to be hated than to be insignificant no marks.

You do realise we have one of the top 3 wealthiest owners in the country?  There is more chance of your selling out at Wigan than there is of us going into administration.

Carry on the way you’re going and you’ll be ‘insignificant no marks’ soon as well.

[Harry]

1 hour ago, anotherdayinparadise said:

We have a section of the ground that remains closed for cost cutting purposes.

 

58 minutes ago, anotherdayinparadise said:

The capacity of our ground in the Championship is 36000, not 43000.  It is not cost effective to open the top tier of the Trinity.

 

34 minutes ago, anotherdayinparadise said:

You do realise we have one of the top 3 wealthiest owners in the country? 

 

6 minutes ago, anotherdayinparadise said:

We averaged around 3000 away.

Ha ha. Does this guy even realise what he’s saying? 

Ooh ooh look at us, we’re the 3rd richest club in the country. Oh, but we don’t open 16% of our seats cuz we can’t afford it. 

Belter. 

Average of 3,000 away last season is lies. It was 2,780. Is this guy using gaslogic when calculating his attendances? 

[Rapax]

To be fair only Leeds averaged more than them and the year before they averaged more than Leeds and Newcastle.

Villa are easily one of the best supported clubs in the league. Plenty to hate about them, but their support numbers isn't something to knock.

35,500 last Saturday is good for a mid-table 2nd division club!

 

[Harry]

3 minutes ago, Rapax said:

To be fair only Leeds averaged more than them and the year before they averaged more than Leeds and Newcastle.

Villa are easily one of the best supported clubs in the league. Plenty to hate about them, but their support numbers isn't something to knock.

35,500 last Saturday is good for a mid-table 2nd division club!

 

I don’t think anyone is knocking their ability to take a good following. We’re more knocking this sanctimonious idiot for being, well, a sanctimonious idiot. 

[TETBURY MASSIVE]

Another  away fan.....

Who wants to guess the time he tells us...... we are only going to see the villa..... and there will be thousands of villa fans in the home end because they are massive and famous.... 

[Nogbad the Bad]

6 minutes ago, anotherdayinparadise said:

Correct.  Some clubs in this division offer away fans more tickets (Wigan, Sheffield Wed, Bristol, Bolton, Blackburn etc). Some don’t (Villa, Leeds, Sheffield U, Ipswich etc).

The issue is with your own club, not Villa.  You have decided that you want the extra revenue from the added 800 tickets which is your prerogative.  It doesn’t give you carte Blanche to start demanding that we open up closed areas or that we move season ticket holders just to accommodate once a year day trippers.

We averaged around 3000 away.  Cardiff, Bolton gave us around 4500 tickets, Millwall, Ipswich, Sheffield U only 2000 tickets.

Indeed, in my case - and I'm probably on my own - it is.

It really pisses me off that City are willing to put our home advantage at risk by giving excessive away allocations, but particularly galling to further increase an away allocation to a club that keeps so strictly to the rules as far as BCFC is concerned.

Especially as BCFC continue to let away fans completely take over a stand behind a goal - an area from which Villa, and many other clubs, have realised large away followings detrimentally affected home advantage so took action to push away fans out to the sidelines and populate both ends with home fans.

[Mr Popodopolous]

28 minutes ago, anotherdayinparadise said:

Correct.  Some clubs in this division offer away fans more tickets (Wigan, Sheffield Wed, Bristol, Bolton, Blackburn etc). Some don’t (Villa, Leeds, Sheffield U, Ipswich etc).

 The issue is with your own club, not Villa.  You have decided that you want the extra revenue from the added 800 tickets which is your prerogative.  It doesn’t give you carte Blanche to start demanding that we open up closed areas or that we move season ticket holders just to accommodate once a year day trippers.

 We averaged around 3000 away.  Cardiff, Bolton gave us around 4500 tickets, Millwall, Ipswich, Sheffield U only 2000 tickets.

Don't know if you're aware but this season we have given 2,600-2,700 to away fans- so around 10% of capacity. I assumed for the League games it was a hard and fast policy.

For some reason, we have opened up part of the Atyeo for you- more so than usual. While I don't think Sheffield United necessarily, Blackburn or Middlesborough would have sold out bigger than 2,700 as indeed they didn't, Nottingham Forest would have. 

It COULD be possible that there are fears of a lot of Villa fans in home ends, so more of the Atyeo opened up for your fans than usual- I don't consider it likely but it's not impossible either.

My question therefore, would be why Villa and not Forest? Both could have sold in excess of 2,700- definitely. We don't need the cash too much as we're comfortable FFP wise.

Why are your police insistent on a low allocation to us at Villa Park too? Yes City and the WMP have a well documented history, but we got as @harrys rightly pointed out, in excess of that at WBA midweek- or are Villa WMP particularly pissy/ or seperate to WBA WMP?

[Mr Popodopolous]

19 minutes ago, TETBURY MASSIVE said:

Another  away fan.....

Who wants to guess the time he tells us...... we are only going to see the villa..... and there will be thousands of villa fans in the home end because they are massive and famous.... 

You're obviously using poetic license, but Aston Villa have a big geographical reach despite being a non-giant club (bit like Leeds) and therefore fans who are not necessarily from Birmingham- as @BobBobSuperBob rightly pointed out on another thread.

Add in geographical mobility, and people from Birmingham etc having a particular liking for WSM- and it's not terribly far fetched that away fans and certainly more than say v Blackburn or Middlesbrough will be in home ends! That would create a headache for the club, so lance the boil with a bigger away allocation.

It's not an ideal scenario but it's a realistic one!

[BobBobSuperBob]

@anotherdayinparadise 

In the Championship it’s interesting of the attitude of the supporters of those Clubs that

#OMG

#ONLYTHECHAMPIONSHIP

#DISASTER

..........get relegated 

Some are sensible ,(  like their clubs get their heads down and go straight back up and good luck to them)

Villa fans , of which you appear a prime example have more or less sealed the award for the most deluded , arrogant, cry baby fans with a laughable sense of entitlement that I think I’ve witnessed

It's this arrogance that will continue to fuel the pleasure of Clubs like ours p*****g on your promotion plans ,as and when we can

You will , eventually escape purely because you’ve had a massive stroke of fortune in new rich owners

In the meantime you continue to be the laughing stock of the Championship for the ridiculous sums you’ve spent trying to return to a Premier League relegation fight and your arrogant dickead fans who seem to spend most of their time fighting each other

 

 

[NOTBLUE]

53 minutes ago, anotherdayinparadise said:

Correct.  Some clubs in this division offer away fans more tickets (Wigan, Sheffield Wed, Bristol, Bolton, Blackburn etc). Some don’t (Villa, Leeds, Sheffield U, Ipswich etc).

The issue is with your own club, not Villa.  You have decided that you want the extra revenue from the added 800 tickets which is your prerogative.  It doesn’t give you carte Blanche to start demanding that we open up closed areas or that we move season ticket holders just to accommodate once a year day trippers.

We averaged around 3000 away.  Cardiff, Bolton gave us around 4500 tickets, Millwall, Ipswich, Sheffield U only 2000 tickets.

Ark at he mind !

[Bristol Oil Services]

54 minutes ago, Diddlydonkey said:

 

Carry on the way you’re going and you’ll be ‘insignificant no marks’ soon as well.

That's what Aston Villa are, now, in the Premier League. Or will be again, if/when they get back there. 

[ChippenhamRed]

18 hours ago, ChippenhamRed said:

The point is we don't know what our allocation is going to be at Villa this season.  If it is going to be limited to a small % and a smaller absolute number than we've given them, then I absolutely agree we shouldn't be doing it.

The trick is for clubs to agree these things in advance, but that never seems to happen.  Last season we were fighting Cardiff for more tickets for the return, months after we'd already given them a more generous allocation at Ashton Gate.

 

A question for @Matt Parsons BCFCSLO - given the size of Villa's allocation, can we expect an equivalent allocation for the return fixture?  Has this even been discussed yet?  If not, why not?  I don't like tit-for-tat, but I do think we should be agreeing reciprocal arrangements in advance to ensure both clubs benefit equally from the support in the stands, across both fixtures.

I note @Matt Parsons BCFCSLO has not yet responded to this.

For me, whether we’re handing out increased allocations with or without any assurances about the return fixture is key to the whole debate.

[Bar BS3]

2 hours ago, anotherdayinparadise said:

In our case, 3400 covers our hard core regular away supporters, not our day trippers  

Come on..! 

Your away support is fantastic, nobody is questioning that, so there’s no need to “do a Bristol Rovers” on this. 

Your average away following this season is 2,246 (as at 11th September)

So it’s not like you need 3,400 to satisfy your regulars. 

Having said that, I’m all for selling away teams as many tickets as they can sell, in the Atyeo stand. 

It generates more revenue, creates a better atmosphere & that creates a bigger occasion. 

If having big numbers backing the team each week made that much difference, shouldn’t you really be back in the Premier league already..?! 

Enjoy your trip to our wonderful city. Commiserations on then having to return to Birmingham..!

[lenred]

1 hour ago, anotherdayinparadise said:

Better to be hated than to be insignificant no marks.

You do realise we have one of the top 3 wealthiest owners in the country?  There is more chance of your selling out at Wigan than there is of us going into administration.

 

[Bar BS3]

32 minutes ago, ChippenhamRed said:

I note @Matt Parsons BCFCSLO has not yet responded to this.

For me, whether we’re handing out increased allocations with or without any assurances about the return fixture is key to the whole debate.

It’s not really. 

We have 4,200? Seats available in the Atyeo stand. Less the amount that can’t be sold by law/legislation, why not sell as many as we can, especially at £30+ a pop. 

I agree that it’s nonsense that the WMP restrict our allocation at Villa Park, but whatever they allocate us is irrelivent to us opening up more seats for sale, in a stand that would otherwise be vastly under populated. 

 

[Bar BS3]

2 hours ago, anotherdayinparadise said:

OK, one last time.  After this, you are on your own.

Villa did not reduce your allocation - The police did.

The capacity of our ground in the Championship is 36000, not 43000.  It is not cost effective to open the top tier of the Trinity so the away allocation is actually bigger percentage wise than you would get at other grounds - Not that you’d know as there is not the scramble for tickets from you for these games and you never sell out.  I don’t see you moaning about Leeds only giving you 2K tickets for example but because we dare to be situated only 2 hours away, we are deemed to be satan.

Complete bollocks, sorry. 

Your capacity is 43k? Not 36k. 

Your club choose not to open the top tier because you can’t fill it (generally)

You opened it for the game Vs Derby when you had a crowd of 41k, so it’s not that it CAN’T be used, it’s just not usually needed. 

 

[Matt Parsons]

40 minutes ago, ChippenhamRed said:

I note @Matt Parsons BCFCSLO has not yet responded to this.

For me, whether we’re handing out increased allocations with or without any assurances about the return fixture is key to the whole debate.

Hello,

I have asked Supporter Services (who manage the ticket allocations) to confirm what conversation have been had with their counterpart at Villa, and will update as soon as I hear back from them. 

Matt 

[Carey 6]

2 hours ago, anotherdayinparadise said:

I think that comparing Wigan is perfect.  It shows that all your regular away fans will be guaranteed tickets for Villa and only the day trippers will miss out.  In our case, 3400 covers our hard core regular away supporters, not our day trippers.

Comparing Wigan away isn't a good comparison at all. 

It was on Sky for starters, no matter what you say, I'd say almost every sky league game won't attract as many fans as it would do if it wasn't on TV. 

Wigan was also on a Friday night. Unless retired, you'd have to book at least a half day off of work (reason I couldn't get there despite wanting to go) this will also obviously impact away attendances. 

Until the limit is removed for our fans at Villa Park, if we're in the same division next year, I hope we limit your allocation here. Maybe the fans on both sides pressuring the clubs/police to stop limiting us at Villa Park is what's needed. 

[Bar BS3]

13 minutes ago, Carey 6 said:

Comparing Wigan away isn't a good comparison at all. 

It was on Sky for starters, no matter what you say, I'd say almost every sky league game won't attract as many fans as it would do if it wasn't on TV. 

Wigan was also on a Friday night. Unless retired, you'd have to book at least a half day off of work (reason I couldn't get there despite wanting to go) this will also obviously impact away attendances. 

Until the limit is removed for our fans at Villa Park, if we're in the same division next year, I hope we limit your allocation here. Maybe the fans on both sides pressuring the clubs/police to stop limiting us at Villa Park is what's needed. 

Bristol to Wigan is also over 170 miles, each way. 

Aston Villa never have to travel that distance/time due to their advantageous geographical location. 

Their average away day is 99 miles, where as ours is 160!

Swansea have the furthest to travel, at an average of 208 miles per away game. 

[Red Army 75]

I absolutely despise Aston ******* villa and there arrogant tosspot fans. 

Hope they don’t go up . And hope the shit hits the fan . Tossers 

[Rapax]

I can't say I have any feeling one way or the other. They've never really done anything to make me hate them. Got battered last year but that's football for you.

What I don't get is why the club have taken a point to give them more. Fair enough if everybody is allowed more but  they're not and I wager that only them and Leeds get this.

If that is the case then perhaps it's because their away followings pose the most risk of trouble and so it's better to make sure none get in the home end, as has been said, then I get that. But it seems odd that the police on this thread stated "they will only get 2600" when they have a history of misbehaving and last year got on the pitch.

[ChippenhamRed]

1 hour ago, Bar BS3 said:

It’s not really. 

We have 4,200? Seats available in the Atyeo stand. Less the amount that can’t be sold by law/legislation, why not sell as many as we can, especially at £30+ a pop. 

I agree that it’s nonsense that the WMP restrict our allocation at Villa Park, but whatever they allocate us is irrelivent to us opening up more seats for sale, in a stand that would otherwise be vastly under populated. 

 

No it’s not irrelevant. If we are handing over 4,000 tickets in a 27,000 seater stadium, when Villa/WMP are giving us an allocation half the size in a stadium not far off twice the size, and therefore denying our supporters the opportunity to attend, then we are handing them the unfair advantage of substantially more support across the two games. Even if it only affects performance on the pitch by 1%, it could make a critical difference.

I really think the club should be taking a stand on this on behalf of supporters.

Generally I agree with the broad notion of giving away fans a decent allocation for all the reasons I’ve already identified in this thread. The club makes more money and the atmosphere improves. But it’s only fair if there is a reciprocal arrangement.