Fans forum 27th November - Hen and Chicken

[Ian M]

1 hour ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

I was a little surprised to hear this too

However having watched it back if you listen very carefully JL very quietly mentions that AG is part of Bristol Citu holdings. 

My recollection is that he handed it over to "Group CEO" Gavin Marshall to explain better but when Gavin was not really answering the question asked, JL questioned "it's under Bristol City Holdings right?".

I don't know whether he was being subservient to the group CEO in his tone or whether I am more sure of our corporate structure more than our chairman is. To be honest I'm not sure which I'd prefer it to be.

[lenred]

7 minutes ago, bcfc01 said:

Its exactly what I am saying.

And I agree with you.

I think a lot of this is down to the clumsy and unprofessional way that the NP issue was handled, if it was done respectfully with a bit of recognition of the job that NP did and an explanation of their thinking, it may have been received a bit differently.

Undoubtedly.  If there was a cohesive plan. If there was respect shown. If there was a true explanation given as opposed to the bullshit we were fed. Etc etc. But there still hasn’t been.  Even last night according to our Chairman apparently, it’s just the fans overreacting to how our club is run.  So it continues………

 

[bcfc01]

Just now, lenred said:

Undoubtedly.  If there was a cohesive plan. If there was respect shown. If there was a true explanation given as opposed to the bullshit we were fed. Etc etc. But there still hasn’t been.  Even last night according to our Chairman apparently, it’s just the fans overreacting to how our club is run.  So it continues………

 

Indeed.

Tone deaf.

[Sheltons Army]

10 minutes ago, lenred said:

I definitely get the point that some of us on here should’ve made more of an effort to be there, me included.

But if you’re saying that last nights attendees are representative of the majority then I’m very very happy to be part of the minority on here that’s for sure.  99% a complete waste and let JL and BT off the hook regards a lot of areas already discussed on here.  
 

 

I think the forum (this forum) gives a pretty good picture of the fanbase , different views and standpoints with people who are deep rooted supporters

Ive been to forums before , and Phantom made the point that a lot of the audience with attend any Bristol City event , and that’s to be admired and respected and they are very much diehard fans

But a high percentage who take most of the seats , are Bristol City pissed , will accept without any moans , whatever they are given football wise and anything else wise and sorry , but a lot of them will be the ones who when a new shirt or horrendous piece of leisurewear comes out and someone says ‘Who the hell is going to buy that ?’ - Well it’s them

Absolutely City diehard supporters , but , but , but ..... If anyone had even tried to challenge the panel last night and say anything critical about the club or infer so , I promise you they would have been unpopular within the room with open dissent to them - It would be as if you were berating their children

The fans forum ticks a box , allows the Club to say they’ve engaged , but ultimately It is what it is

[W-S-M Seagull]

This question was one of my favourites. Really difficult for Brian to answer (with a straight face) 

"My question is for Brian, you said we've got a 16 year old the Premier League are looking at, can we hide him so they can't find him please" 

[Open End Numb Legs]

Thanks to whoever posted the YouTube link. I have watched some of it but it is a bit painful and I gave up quite quickly.

I think these opportunities are definitely the right thing to do and I applaud those taking part from club and fan base for doing so.

Next time, it just needs someone to host the event in such a way that they take the nervously asked question, re present it or re word it to the panel and challenge them to give a proper answer.

Edited November 28, 2023 by Open End Numb Legs

[Sheltons Army]

2 minutes ago, Open End Numb Legs said:

Thanks to whoever posted the YouTube link. I have watched some of it but it is a bit painful and I gave up quite quickly.

I think these opportunities are definitely the right thing to do and I applaud those taking part from club and fan base for doing so.

Next time, it just needs someone to host the event in such a way that they take the nervously asked question, re present it or re word it to the panel and challenge them to give a proper answer.

A lot of it is painful , and embarrassing in terms of fumbling answers

But - I’d encourage you to fast forward it all , to any point Liam Manning is talking - it is worth listening to

[W-S-M Seagull]

2 minutes ago, Sheltons Army said:

A lot of it is painful , and embarrassing in terms of fumbling answers

But - I’d encourage you to fast forward it all , to any point Liam Manning is talking - it is worth listening to

I've been quite ambivalent to Manning up until now. I've watched and listened to all his interviews with us and a lot from his Oxford days. I hadn't warmed to him. It was all quite dull and repetitive.

Last night I did slightly tho. It just felt different to his other interviews. Maybe the more relaxed environment helped. Or maybe it was just the stupidness of the questions asked and the people sat alongside him that made me appreciate listening to someone who was able to speak articulately. 

[CyderInACan]

2 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

I've been quite ambivalent to Manning up until now. I've watched and listened to all his interviews with us and a lot from his Oxford days. I hadn't warmed to him. It was all quite dull and repetitive.

Last night I did slightly tho. It just felt different to his other interviews. Maybe the more relaxed environment helped. Or maybe it was just the stupidness of the questions asked and the people sat alongside him that made me appreciate listening to someone who was able to speak articulately. 

Thought he came across as the only one who was coherent and easy to understand. I quite warmed to him. 

[Sheltons Army]

10 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

I've been quite ambivalent to Manning up until now. I've watched and listened to all his interviews with us and a lot from his Oxford days. I hadn't warmed to him. It was all quite dull and repetitive.

Last night I did slightly tho. It just felt different to his other interviews. Maybe the more relaxed environment helped. Or maybe it was just the stupidness of the questions asked and the people sat alongside him that made me appreciate listening to someone who was able to speak articulately. 

The contrast in professionalism and polish was stark 

 

But (And my views will never change about NP ,those involved,  and what was done , and the way they did it - particularly the total lack of respect or genuine appreciation)

It’s clear Manning is a decent bloke , highly focused and driven , very well ‘read’ in terms of coaching study and extremely bright and intelligent.

I thought the relaxed  ease he answered questions without having to think or stumble , was very revealing, no bull**** , just clear explanation set out

He is clearly very clear in his own ideas , but also very open to adaptation of that

So he certainly ticks a lot of boxes in terms of how he comes across , to us and the bits we get to see as we await to see what happens on the grass and in recruitment

How he comes across , not to us , but to players is of course the important thing , and ultimately how good he is overall will start to emerge / unfold.

Besides coaching and tactical nous , For me the relationship , trust he , or any other can foster with players is always key and we , or very few of us will ever have any idea how good or otherwise these areas are , other than interpreting from the 90 mins football 

 

 

Edited November 28, 2023 by Sheltons Army

[nebristolred]

1 hour ago, Davefevs said:

I think the problem with his public speaking skills is he doesn’t have experience to fall back on, to think on his feet, because he’s not had the real-world business exposure someone in his position would have.  His dad, although arrogant at times, has been there and done it and can draw upon what he’s been through to word his way around a tricky question.

JL just comes across as awkward.  He shouldn’t need to flounder at a simple question from Christine about engaging with fans.

This is absolutely spot on but on my side I don't really think it's a negative. Whether intentional or not, I'd rather have someone who is either being too truthful or incapable of being anything other than transparent, over another Mark Ashton type character or whatever the alternative would be. Not that I think SL is the latter for one second, but I think JL being unable to fumble his way around a tricky question is not necessarily a bad thing for us as a club.

Maybe I find myself being too quick to jump to his defence after some of the battering he got on here, I'm not sure, and I have absolutely no idea of his actual competence in role, I can only go on what people say. I suppose I'm saying that I'd take his method of communication over a smooth talker who ultimately says nothing. I think the only reason JL basically said nothing yesterday is because the questions didn't really demand anything of interest.

Edited November 28, 2023 by nebristolred

[exAtyeoMax]

41 minutes ago, CyderInACan said:

Thought he came across as the only one who was coherent and easy to understand. I quite warmed to him. 

BT looks lost and comes across a bit of a donut.

[Davefevs]

made me laugh!

[exAtyeoMax]

21 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

made me laugh!

:laugh:!

[Lrrr]

12 hours ago, DCT10 said:

Don't they film the games for analysis reasons? More often than not we see goal highlights. For u21 on Robins TV I'd be more than happy with a single camera set up, but you'd expect they already have a better set up than that for the analysis team. I guess the expense comes in needing some kind of "director" for what gets televised.

 

The way you film for broadcast and the way you film for analysis is different, you want to keep different things in picture/level of zoom etc. Its also likely difficult as the output from the video footage from the camera is fed into the laptop for the live analysis. I don't know much about broadcast feeds etc but its probably then difficult to separate it for a stream as well. The analysis team will more than likely just be a single camera set up (albeit an extremely nice camera by analysis standards), there's no IP camera system around the training ground, that idea was chucked out not long before it opened up properly. There wouldn't really be an 'expense' for someone to lead the broadcast stuff as you'd just use the people who do Robins TV as I expect they're salaried anyway. 

[Lrrr]

3 hours ago, petehinton said:

They were asked, bumbled along a bit about giving the department more resource hence splitting Rennie’s old role into two, and just said it was based on numerous data points that will now also be used in recruitment moving forward - maybe partly the role of Krause?

 

3 hours ago, Davefevs said:

Krause is gonna be focused on game plan / opposition analysis, not recruitment or injuries per se…and translating that onto the grass and back again.  That’s a good concept imho.

FWIW they already have tonnes of “performance” / medical data, the players get it each day / match.  It’s probably why we’ve seen less soft tissue / fatigue injuries over time.  Players themselves taking ownership for understanding their own data.

Physical data already used in Recruitment.  I was trying to get Gilhespy to give me access to it and Statsbomb when we were doing the Scouting stuff, but he said there were license issues.  Would’vehelped us filter the players @Harry etc were looking at.  So that’s been embedded in recruitment for best part of two years (if not longer).

My guess is its really just referring to the club gets so much data from physical testing now and if you want to increase the levels of the squad we need players who hit x in specific tests or in match day physical data and players who hit below that won't improve us so the physical now becomes more important then the technical in a lot of cases. You can almost predict the winner of a football match 80% of the time based off the games physical data as English football (particularly the PL) and swung way towards physical over technical, if you can outrun your opponent in many different areas you standard a better chance of winning. Not to be confused by how many old school coaches will just look at the data and say 'we need everyone to hit 10k to win games'. Its more you need players who are capable of hitting a threshold so they can do it when they need to, obviously if you're sat in a block defending a lead your numbers won't be high. So many people were shocked by the price of Gordon's move to Newcastle and said 'he's not even that good', well the reason he was worth that much to Newcastle (and Everton) is because the level of his physical data is freakish even compared to PL standard. Its where the money is now players who can combine the physical with the technical, if you have one or the other you'll get so far but really now only those with both make it to the very top. 

[maxjak]

2 hours ago, CyderInACan said:

Thought he came across as the only one who was coherent and easy to understand. I quite warmed to him. 

I am in no way a happy clapper, and i was angry and frustrated at the way NP was dismissed, and believe it was dealt with extremely poorly, and showed a distinct lack of respect for what NP achieved, and the foundations he has laid.

Having said that, I am very optimistic about LM's appointment.  For me he is exactly what is needed right now at City.  As he states, he lives and breaths football, and is an obsessive perfectionist.  He comes over as an articulate, intelligent and determined individual who seems highly motivated.  He has seems to have learnt a great deal at such a comparitively young age, and has been coaching for nearly 20 years!  

The combination of his  ambitious and humble attitude, and the obvious way that he seems to communicate his ideas across to our young team, gives me a lot of hope for our future.  I am really looking forward to the rest of the season......and given sufficient opportunity, for the first time in ages,  i can realistically see us in the next year or two achieving promotion.....if only?

[Bazooka Joe]

18 hours ago, One Team said:

The last thing I was expecting was a round of applause for the Lansdown’s! 

Maybe we were watching a happy-clappers convention.

[shahanshahan]

On 16/11/2023 at 12:37, ExiledAjax said:

"What impact do you believe the independent regulator for English Football will have on Bristol City Football Club?"

Am glad I got to ask a similar question!

[Bazooka Joe]

5 hours ago, RedM said:

1. I got the vibe that in Manning we have an ambitious Manager that seems to know his stuff and deserves more credit than many gave him when he arrived. He doesn't come across as a 'yes' man and is clearly working hard on progressing his career and has more experience than people realise.

2. I thought the questions were at best lame. Boring and repetitive and went off at a tangent. People were too quick to heap praise on the Board etc too, too gushy. 

1. If you're right, and I honestly hope you are, he'll probably suffer the same fate as poor Pearson. I will back him because I want City to do well.  Because of what Lansdown and Tinnion have done and said, there is no honeymoon period. Many fans will rightfully expect Manning to start delivering good results immediately.

2. Too many sycophants (aka sycofans) in attendance. Far too cosy (and somewhat preditable). Were they all incapable of asking Lansdown or Tinnion a hard-hitting question (politely)? I found it boring and embarrassing to watch. I am concerned that outsiders watching this, will think this small cohort is a true refelection of our wider fan base.

[bcfc01]

6 minutes ago, Bazooka Joe said:

1. If you're right, and I honestly hope you are, he'll probably suffer the same fate as poor Pearson. I will back him because I want City to do well.  Because of what Lansdown and Tinnion have done and said, there is no honeymoon period. Many fans will rightfully expect Manning to start delivering good results immediately.

2. Too many sycophants (aka sycofans) in attendance. Far too cosy (and somewhat preditable). Were they all incapable of asking Lansdown or Tinnion a hard-hitting question (politely)? I found it boring and embarrassing to watch. I am concerned that outsiders watching this, will think this small cohort is a true refelection of our wider fan base.

Not sure why you think LM needs to deliver good results immediately ?

I think last night was a true reflection of our wider supporter base rather than a fans forum.  Interested in why you would be concerned what outsiders may think ?

Genuine questions, not stirring it.

[Eddie Hitler]

8 hours ago, exAtyeoMax said:

Shame there wasn’t a way to ask questions from those online. At uni we have someone monitoring the chat on zoom, or YouTube. 

 

You would think but this was brought in at a conference I regularly attended.

Previously you had to out your hand up and it worked well.

When they went to questions on an App, mostly from those in the room but also some remotely, the various Chairs without exception picked the easy, bleedin' obvious questions and ignored the hard ones.

It ruined the Q&A part of each session to be frank. I was surprised by how bad it was.

[GrahamC]

1 hour ago, bcfc01 said:

Not sure why you think LM needs to deliver good results immediately ?

I think last night was a true reflection of our wider supporter base rather than a fans forum.  Interested in why you would be concerned what outsiders may think ?

Genuine questions, not stirring it.

I don’t know, is the honest answer as to whether it is a wider reflection, after all it was only 200 people, so definitely not a larger sample size than OTIB.

I’ll be honest I’m bemused at present, nothing Manning has said worries me but the rest of the set up, plus the frankly bizarre forum last night has made me wonder if what I thought about our fanbase was right.

[1960maaan]

8 hours ago, ExiledAjax said:

Two a season, although there's some flexibility in the format required. As @petehinton says, it's in the regs. EFL regulation 128. 

 

It is included in our "Club Charter" (although that refers to old regulation 111).

Say supporters or their representatives. I guess they could use the SCAT meetings as a get out if they want.

9 hours ago, exAtyeoMax said:

safe standing in both corners? Across the back of the SS? 
away fans up in the gods, families down in the Atyeo or corner?

Don’t know it will take a lot of rejigging 

 

The only way I can see things moving around.

Away fans go into the Dolman at the Atyeo end Blocks. 
A wall / separation is put into the concourse and the turnstyles are away only.

This would give us back the Atyeo, but the  facilities aren't the best and you can't get access to the main concourse or mix with other fans.  It would give us fans behind both goals ( LJ would be ecstatic ) . 
Possibly reduces seats lost to segregation too.
It also solves some moans with the smallest of cost IMO. 

Edited November 28, 2023 by 1960maaan

[Mr Popodopolous]

1 hour ago, bcfc01 said:

Not sure why you think LM needs to deliver good results immediately ?

I think last night was a true reflection of our wider supporter base rather than a fans forum.  Interested in why you would be concerned what outsiders may think ?

Genuine questions, not stirring it.

It's hard to say really isn't it.

Thought fans were a bit restive at times Saturday, first half hour or so, the ground didn't feel like the expected levels of excitement or enthusiasm for a new manager, felt subdued for good periods, much of the first half especially.

Hoping Manning and his team do well, certainly will back him and the team as we should but if we go a goal down playing a more patient gsme crowd could turn, at the hierarchy moreso.

If we go on a bad run, ditto.

[transfer reader]

9 hours ago, Pezo said:

Had another watch this morning and he certainly says overreaction. It's at 1h1m and 43 seconds for about 10 seconds. People can make there own minds up.

I would normally give him the benefit of doubt but I'm struggling to give him the benefit of doubt with how much disdain Steve had for fans opinions.

there's clearly another sound between "over" and "reaction"

So what logically is more likely?

He uses the word "overreaction" in a context where it doesn't make as much sense and in a way where its going to clearly upset a few people (many of which go out of their way to mock him regardless) and where it clashes with what he's saying in the rest of his answer

Or a person who clearly has anxiety about doing these types of talks trips over their words a bit because he's talking very quickly

[Pezo]

5 minutes ago, transfer reader said:

there's clearly another sound between "over" and "reaction"

So what logically is more likely?

He uses the word "overreaction" in a context where it doesn't make as much sense and in a way where its going to clearly upset a few people (many of which go out of their way to mock him regardless) and where it clashes with what he's saying in the rest of his answer

Or a person who clearly has anxiety about doing these types of talks trips over their words a bit because he's talking very quickly

Both fit in the sentence equally IMHO.

Logically I wouldn't be surprised if he has been talking about it behind closed doors as an overreaction as a defence mechanism for his own mental health if nothing else, dismissing it as a lunatic fringe (certainly looks that way from the fans forum last night). He just took that language into this fans forum at the end of a statement.

[maxjak]

1 hour ago, Bazooka Joe said:

1. If you're right, and I honestly hope you are, he'll probably suffer the same fate as poor Pearson. I will back him because I want City to do well.  Because of what Lansdown and Tinnion have done and said, there is no honeymoon period. Many fans will rightfully expect Manning to start delivering good results immediately.

2. Too many sycophants (aka sycofans) in attendance. Far too cosy (and somewhat preditable). Were they all incapable of asking Lansdown or Tinnion a hard-hitting question (politely)? I found it boring and embarrassing to watch. I am concerned that outsiders watching this, will think this small cohort is a true refelection of our wider fan base.

The general consensus within the world of Championship football seems to indicate and portray Bristol City FC. as a   Comfortable Cosy club........and that was exactly what yesterday's forum illustrated?   A  comfortable  cosy environment?  I just hope that LM shakes it up a bit?......Here's wishing? 

[Bristol Rob]

45 minutes ago, 1960maaan said:

Say supporters or their representatives. I guess they could use the SCAT meetings as a get out if they want.

The only way I can see things moving around.

Away fans go into the Dolman at the Atyeo end Blocks. 
A wall / separation is put into the concourse and the turnstyles are away only.

This would give us back the Atyeo, but the  facilities aren't the best and you can't get access to the main concourse or mix with other fans.  It would give us fans behind both goals ( LJ would be ecstatic ) . 
Possibly reduces seats lost to segregation too.
It also solves some moans with the smallest of cost IMO. 

I just don't see how it could be done, not without a major internal modelling change potentially costing a fortune and adding nothing in terms of revenue generated.

We can't 'share' turnstiles with away fans, so they'd need to establish a way to safely exit fans from Block B, C D etc in the event of an emergency, or just to get them in and out of the ground without asking them to do a lap of the stadium. The Lansdown only (I think) has one internal staircase to the upper tier, so that would be a major undertaking and remodel.

Add to the fact that with the women and bears playing there as well and not needing to be seg'd, it wouldn't be worth the spend - unless S82 was to expand to the entire Atyeo (which, when a more relaxed approach was given to those in that stand, it rarely sold out, there were complaints about the acoustics and the facilities) and it would mean that for home games, a small minority of fans would be gathered in a largely empty stand trying to generate a bit of atmosphere that would be lost across the stadium, especially if an away crowd was in the Dolman.

Get that things aren't perfect, but of what might be 50 games a season at Ashton Gate, the only possible benefit would be for less than half of those. 

I sat in the Atyeo for a rugby match earlier this year and the stadium does look intimidating compared to that stand, you feel small. Just need those who want to sing to make themselves heard by belting out noise for 90 minutes and hope that the performances on the pitch encourage others to join in. 

[sh1t_ref_again]

2 hours ago, Bazooka Joe said:

1. If you're right, and I honestly hope you are, he'll probably suffer the same fate as poor Pearson. I will back him because I want City to do well.  Because of what Lansdown and Tinnion have done and said, there is no honeymoon period. Many fans will rightfully expect Manning to start delivering good results immediately.

2. Too many sycophants (aka sycofans) in attendance. Far too cosy (and somewhat preditable). Were they all incapable of asking Lansdown or Tinnion a hard-hitting question (politely)? I found it boring and embarrassing to watch. I am concerned that outsiders watching this, will think this small cohort is a true refelection of our wider fan base.

It seems the fans not happy with recent events prefer to vent their spline and whip up anti Lansdown hysteria from behind a keyboard, rather than making the effort to go, but then moan afterwards the questions were not the ones they would have asked. Tickets were freely available and whilst I accept not everyone can make it or things crop up, none of the more outspoken with the most posts recently seem to have been in attendance.

So after not bothering, instead prefer to attack and belittle the fans who did bother to attend and label them as sycophants or as others have called them Bristol Sport employees, BS bots, coach 1, happy clappers and a whole range of other insults and claim they are not representative of the fan base, as the views expressed last night do not match the mouthy few who dominate the post count on this forum. Perhaps its this forum that is not representative, whilst it may have 20k members, not that many regularly post and people I ask if they come on here, say can't be bothered as its so negative.