Lee Tomlin (Merged)

[Robbored]

26 minutes ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said:

Out of interest- why do you always refer to Mark Ashton as Mr Charisma? I suspect it's unlikely meant as a compliment.

Dare I ask what issue you have with him? He seems to be doing a fair job and a bit early days to come up with cynical pseudonym- even for you.

Nothing cynical about it at all MRR. It's a compliment.

I heard Mark Ashton speak and take part in a Q&A session at the Senior Reds not long after he'd joined the club. He was very entertaining and immediately in touch with us as fans, I liked him straight away. 

He spoke well and oozed charisma. He said he was the most senior employee at the club and when I asked him who his boss was he said "Steve Lansdown".

Im certainly cynical about the corporate speak and nature at City and of some of the "suits" within it. I also consider myself a top detector of bullshit but with Mark Ashton I detected none whatsoever. I think he's an impressive guy and I'm delighted he's essentially running our club. He seems to be doing a good job so far.

That said this summers transfer dealings will be a real test for him.

[Taz]

7 minutes ago, Robbored said:

Nothing cynical about it at all MRR. It's a compliment.

I heard Mark Ashton speak and take part in a Q&A session at the Senior Reds not long after he'd joined the club. He was very entertaining and immediately in touch with us as fans, I liked him straight away. 

He spoke well and oozed charisma. He said he was the most senior employee at the club and when I asked him who his boss was he said "Steve Lansdown".

Im certainly cynical about the corporate speak and nature at City and of some of the "suits" within it. I also consider myself a top detector of bullshit but with Mark Ashton I detected none whatsoever. I think he's an impressive guy and I'm delighted he's essentially running our club. He seems to be doing a good job so far.

That said this summers transfer dealings will be a real test for him.

Couldn't agree more. A good summer transfer wise, and Ashton and even the chap from Bournemouth (name escapes me) are hailed as the next best thing. A bad summer, and he's going to get a hell of a lot of abuse.

I personally think that we'll do well this summer. It is still early days at the moment, which some people seem to be forgetting. Saying that though, with last summers disastrous activity still fresh in the minds, I can understand why.

[JoeAman08]

32 minutes ago, Woodsy said:

Much better technical footballer, goes without saying - but would be on a par with Flint in his importance to the team

I get the point you're making, but if Tomlin comes in on £20k/wk (for example) and I'm Flint (lets agree with @GrahamC and I'm on £8k/wk)  then my agent is asking some serious questions of Mr Ashton and co

I'd love Tomlin back, but we have other areas than need help as well, it can't be all in on Tomlin and hope he can do it all on his own

Flint's importance to the team? He is getting the most out of himself our Flint but he's not near the worth of Tomlin. If we gave Flint 20k a week, and forget our wage structure, but he'd be one of the worst contracts in the league. He's a one dimensional player with a good motor. Tomlin was vastly more pivotal to us staying up than Flint. 

[cityloyal473]

Possibly another dynamic to the is he, isn't he, Lee Tomlinn saga; I believe he fell out with Eddie Howe which is why he's been out on loan, however, Howe is one of the favorites for the Saints job.  Wonder how likely it is he sticks around at Bournemouth if Howe leaves.  

[BRISTOL86]

3 minutes ago, cityloyal473 said:

Possibly another dynamic to the is he, isn't he, Lee Tomlinn saga; I believe he fell out with Eddie Howe which is why he's been out on loan, however, Howe is one of the favorites for the Saints job.  Wonder how likely it is he sticks around at Bournemouth if Howe leaves.  

I think he's made himself rather unpopular with the fans there too....

[Major Isewater]

7 minutes ago, BRISTOL86 said:

I think he's made himself rather unpopular with the fans there too....

Oh , the fans don't count .

[Roger Red Hat]

14 minutes ago, cityloyal473 said:

Possibly another dynamic to the is he, isn't he, Lee Tomlinn saga; I believe he fell out with Eddie Howe which is why he's been out on loan, however, Howe is one of the favorites for the Saints job.  Wonder how likely it is he sticks around at Bournemouth if Howe leaves.  

Apparently, Howe has said he isn't interested in the Saints job.

Cotts is the new favourite.

[Major Isewater]

54 minutes ago, NeilS said:

Well I guess £50m is a sizable sum, but peanuts for the like of Chelsea Arsenal, Man U etc, who spent at least four times as much on their squads, which really prove my point that it was team work that got them there, I understand you like a flippant quote but surely even you might want to concede this.

' A sizeable sum ' , indeed , I take your point In comparison to some other clubs but let's not pretend that they are some ' Ragass Rovers ' of kids , journeymen and cast offs .

[Major Isewater]

6 minutes ago, Roger Red Hat said:

Apparently, Howe has said he isn't interested in the Saints job.

Cotts is the new favourite.

with SOD as his number 2 .

['Orns]

39 minutes ago, JoeAman08 said:

Flint's importance to the team? He is getting the most out of himself our Flint but he's not near the worth of Tomlin. If we gave Flint 20k a week, and forget our wage structure, but he'd be one of the worst contracts in the league. He's a one dimensional player with a good motor. Tomlin was vastly more pivotal to us staying up than Flint. 

I'm not suggesting we pay Flint £20k/wk

'one of the worst contracts in the league' - I agree with, and is the point I'm trying to make

Do you question the importance of Flint in our team? He's a centre half, he doesn't need to have more than one dimension to me. He's there to do his job, which is to break up / destroy / get his body in the way, all of which he does. The fact he chips in with goals is an added extra

It's a team game. Tomlin certainly gave the team a massive boost, but there were more than Tomlin playing out of their skins at points from February onwards

If the figures work out, and we can afford it then I'm all over it. But lads like Flint, Smith, Pack (I could go on) deserve recognition too. From what I saw last season they were just as important. If they aren't doing what they are paid to do then it doesn't matter what Tomlin does......

 

['Orns]

2 minutes ago, NeilS said:

So you are replying for him, he understood, kind of, but also disagreed a little, odd. 

Not replying for anyone, poppet. It's a forum and I can comment as I see fit

Just find your replies more than a little condescending and rude

[Super]

2 minutes ago, Woodsy said:

Not replying for anyone, poppet. It's a forum and I can comment as I see fit

Just find your replies more than a little condescending and rude

Pipe down Ginge!

['Orns]

3 minutes ago, Super said:

Pipe down Ginge!

Jeez, how many more times.....

[JoeAman08]

25 minutes ago, Woodsy said:

I'm not suggesting we pay Flint £20k/wk

'one of the worst contracts in the league' - I agree with, and is the point I'm trying to make

Do you question the importance of Flint in our team? He's a centre half, he doesn't need to have more than one dimension to me. He's there to do his job, which is to break up / destroy / get his body in the way, all of which he does. The fact he chips in with goals is an added extra

It's a team game. Tomlin certainly gave the team a massive boost, but there were more than Tomlin playing out of their skins at points from February onwards

If the figures work out, and we can afford it then I'm all over it. But lads like Flint, Smith, Pack (I could go on) deserve recognition too. From what I saw last season they were just as important. If they aren't doing what they are paid to do then it doesn't matter what Tomlin does......

 

I got your point but he's quite average. He's one dimensional in that he's tall and does well against teams that kick it long. When teams played the ball quick and on the ground, Flint looked quite poor. I don't think Flint is as important in the squad as many others do. I love him but think we can do much better at both CB spots. Tomlin even when having a quiet game can pop up and win it. Even if he doesn't pop up, his presence is opening up space for others. He's worth double anyone on this squad apart from Kodjia who probably deserves a pay rise. If this was an argument about Matthews being on 20k a week I'd be more inclined to agree but Tomlin is arguably the best player in the division. 

['Orns]

3 minutes ago, JoeAman08 said:

I got your point but he's quite average. He's one dimensional in that he's tall and does well against teams that kick it long. When teams played the ball quick and on the ground, Flint looked quite poor. I don't think Flint is as important in the squad as many others do. I love him but think we can do much better at both CB spots. Tomlin even when having a quiet game can pop up and win it. Even if he doesn't pop up, his presence is opening up space for others. He's worth double anyone on this squad apart from Kodjia who probably deserves a pay rise. If this was an argument about Matthews being on 20k a week I'd be more inclined to agree but Tomlin is arguably the best player in the division. 

COULD be the best, on his day, that's for sure

[Guest]

27 minutes ago, NeilS said:

So you are replying for him, he understood, kind of, but also disagreed a little, odd. 

How could you disagree with something if you've not understood it?

['Orns]

5 minutes ago, 29AR said:

How could you disagree with something if you've not understood it?

Odd

[Marina's Rolls Royce]

1 hour ago, Robbored said:

Nothing cynical about it at all MRR. It's a compliment.

I heard Mark Ashton speak and take part in a Q&A session at the Senior Reds not long after he'd joined the club. He was very entertaining and immediately in touch with us as fans, I liked him straight away. 

He spoke well and oozed charisma. He said he was the most senior employee at the club and when I asked him who his boss was he said "Steve Lansdown".

Im certainly cynical about the corporate speak and nature at City and of some of the "suits" within it. I also consider myself a top detector of bullshit but with Mark Ashton I detected none whatsoever. I think he's an impressive guy and I'm delighted he's essentially running our club. He seems to be doing a good job so far.

That said this summers transfer dealings will be a real test for him.

Blimey.

 

Well said & well explained.

[JoeAman08]

45 minutes ago, billywedlock said:

But he would be paid triple more than anyone, and whilst a premium for goal scorers and game changers is accepted in football, 3 times more than any other player in a team game is not. As for Flint, well his goals alone were more than the whole midfield put together (if you see LT as a forward) , yes he has to improve, he made too many errors, but he has made substantial progress and if he can improve the 20 to 30 per cent LJ thinks he can, then he will be a top flight defender without any question. Some if's there, but what we do know is that LT did not make it in the Prem when he had the chance. So, is he really worth destroying squad harmony for ? For City to compete at the right end of the league it is clear we need players of the level of LT, but it has to work for the squad , or yet again we return to the bad examples of recent past when it all went wrong and wage issues caused us to make some daft contract offers and created a lot of squad tension. Best player in the division? now that is stretching it a bit far. If he was that good, he would not be looking at a transfer to BCFC this summer. He is a very good Championship player yes, and has moments of brilliance that can change games. If he can be signed and the club can harmonise the other key players within the wage structure great, well more than great. But if we lose the tight team spirit that got us promoted and avoided relegation, then it is a cost too high to pay. 

I want to sign him within limits. I've always said that but if he still happens to be 2-3 times higher paid then so be it. If we could get him on 22k(rumours have it at 27-30k) then I'd do it. That's still probably triple many players but I think 1 Tomlin is worth having over 3 squad players. In Tomlin you get a top attacking player. They don't come cheap. Maybe can get lucky like we did with Kodjia for less money(lucky that he adapted well not lucky with talent). It's a gamble. We know we've got 12-15 goals and plenty of assists in Tomlin if he puts on the shirt tomorrow. It's a risk either way but at least I know what Tomlin is bringing to the table. Sign Dack for half but we don't know if we will get half the production. If you're comfortable with that gamble, OK, but I wouldn't be. Dack just an example btw. 

[slartibartfast]

23 minutes ago, cynic said:

Players understand the concept of a pecking order.

They will have no problem with Tomlins wages - as long as he lives up to it.

Without that sort of quality they, and the club, will not progress - obvious really.

He's worth it to both.

No, I don't want my win bonus.....cos he's on more than me.... BAAW ! 

[Ivorguy]

No one is irreplaceable from the team that saw us heading back down to division 1, with exception of Kodjia.

I have said before that at Championship level we have had far better centre halves at City than Flint.  To pick up a better centre half is relatively easy as compared to a goal scoring forward at this level. If we have to sacrifice Flint in order to strengthen the squad then it is a big yes from me.

 

[deadredfred]

...annndddddd chill folks.

I agree with the argument put forward from both perspectives:

Mega wages, up to three times that of anyone else could well upset the harmony in the team.

But on the flip side, there are players in sides across the world that are on less than their team mates. Someone mentioned Pique/Suarez. Darmian/Falcao at United? Both equally useless as it turns out, both commanding rediculous wages, but I'd guess Falcao was on at least 4 times Darmian?

When earning as much as the players do, are they that bothered? 2 weeks wages to buy a brand new Range Rover or 6 weeks wages? Does it matter?

Also, do players discuss wages? Does the fella you sit next to at work know what you earn? Mine sure as hell doesn't, and I'm not inclined to tell him.

I understand this is different in public sector where pay scales are clear, but it's not conversations we openly have. Perhaps the same amongst the team?

I'd love to see Tomlin sign, but not to the detriment of our wage cap/FFP. Break it now to gamble for promotion and it'll be broken again and then we're back where we were. Pointless. 

LJ and MA will be doing all they can to get him here. We have all sorts of leads that other interested  teams don't have and so it all comes down to money. I trust them to offer and present the most enticing package possible that will not risk us financially now, or moving forward. 

If he's not bothered about money as he hints, then he'll be here. 

If it is about money, then let's put our efforts into another Flint or Kodjia.

After last summer, I have a good feeling this time around that this is exactly what's happening, so I'm happy to sit back and see what unfolds.

 

 

[Major Isewater]

5 hours ago, NeilS said:

Don't detract from their achievements, from the bottom to the top, in the Prem is outstanding, why would you not think so? 

If you wrote In English perhaps I could understand you ,

[Kodjias Wrist]

If tomlin reads this forum he must be absolutely pissing himself. Not only have some city fans taken the bait on his twitter comments but hes actually managed to cause some arguments between city fans haha what a hero!

[Lanterne Rouge]

5 minutes ago, Kodjias Wrist said:

If tomlin reads this forum he must be absolutely pissing himself. Not only have some city fans taken the bait on his twitter comments but hes actually managed to cause some arguments between city fans haha what a hero!

It wouldn`t surprise me if he did TBH, he does seem to like his interaction. Mind you, his missus might not be that happy if he`s on OTIB on his honeymoon!

[Marina's Rolls Royce]

43 minutes ago, Red Right Hand said:

It wouldn`t surprise me if he did TBH, he does seem to like his interaction. Mind you, his missus might not be that happy if he`s on OTIB on his honeymoon!

My ex wife thought the same.

['Orns]

4 hours ago, NeilS said:

Poppet? and you call me condescending and rude, I am sure your little like minded followers will rush to 'like'..oh wait  

You replied to a comment I made to another member, stating how he is to feel about the matter, and now you get defensive and churlish, I understand you predicament, I really do. 

Can't believe I'm about to do this....your condescending comment 0 likes, my response 3. Good, I love being vindicated by my 'little like minded followers'. Makes me feel alive

I didn't speak for the other fella, I just called you out for being an obnoxious *****, there's a difference 

4 hours ago, NeilS said:

Woodsy talks for him apparently, that is odd.

I'll also speak for my 'little like minded followers' when I see fit too 

And what's wrong with 'poppet', I use it a lot, it's easier than**** and it really winds people up. It's kind of a win/win

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, Woodsy said:

Can't believe I'm about to do this....your condescending comment 0 likes, my response 3. Good, I love being vindicated by my 'little like minded followers'. Makes me feel alive

I didn't speak for the other fella, I just called you out for being an obnoxious *****, there's a difference 

I'll also speak for my 'little like minded followers' when I see fit too 

And what's wrong with 'poppet', I use it a lot, it's easier than**** and it really winds people up. It's kind of a win/win

You shouldn't have taken the bait. I doubt anyone else needed your justification and I would wager it will simply fall on deaf ears in only one instance.  

['Orns]

3 minutes ago, 29AR said:

You shouldn't have taken the bait. I doubt anyone else needed your justification and it will simply fall on deaf ears. 

I know, but having sorted out a ranting 13 year old tonight I couldn't resist

I sometimes prefer this make believe world we've created on here, a hormonal 13 year old is way trickier to deal with. Unless Neil is also a hormonal 13 year old, he/she is certainly as rude.....

[Marina's Rolls Royce]

3 minutes ago, Woodsy said:

I know, but having sorted out a ranting 13 year old tonight I couldn't resist

I sometimes prefer this make believe world we've created on here, a hormonal 13 year old is way trickier to deal with. Unless Neil is also a hormonal 13 year old, he/she is certainly as rude.....

Woodsy, the use of a comma between 'tonight' and 'I' in your post is pretty crucial on this occasion.