Sid Out

[P'head Red]

I've been a long term supporter of what Steve has done for this club, but it's these recent months which has changed my stance, and probably for good. There's no doubt the man has done fantastic things for our club off the field, but he hasn't got a clue on how to create a winning ethos. Results on the field are the most important, and his history of decision making hasn't been good enough. For the first time I'm actually looking forward to the day we get sold, it's time to roll the dice. 

[Numero Uno]

1 hour ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

We've all spoken about this before but being promoted to tecknical director was one promotion too much for him. 

Can't fault him at all for his work in the academy or as loans manager. 

He does know how to spot a decent player. Maybe a chief scout role would have been better for him. But to basically put him in charge of all footballing operations was a ridiculous promotion. 

 

Sorry Seagull, I can't be as reasonable towards Sid as you. I don't give a shit what he did for us in the Third Division and the odd Championship relegation season. The club want me to part with nigh on a grand for season tickets next season, which I will unless we totally bomb this season, barely get another point and the unthinkable happens, and yet the hierarchy have shown a complete disregard and utter contempt for fans. We have a Technical Director who has no tangible qualifications that make it a compelling argument for a Championship club to employ him in that role and his inexperience is coming back to bite us on the arse quite honestly. The only people that hurts is THE PAYING FANS (or customers, whatever the latest BS terminology is).

Sid is an integral cog in a decision making engine that deemed Nigel Pearson was not delivering clubs aims (that part is fair whether you agree with it or not, it's their opinion, their decision and SHOULD, but won't be, their cock on the block) and yet have managed to replace him with a manager who is inexperienced, wet behind the ears tactically at the level and is currently delivering WORSE than the bloke they canned. The football is just as uninspiring eight games out of ten and a current form return of nine points in ten games is absolute litter and unacceptable .  Due to Sid and Jon's rhetoric around Manning's appointment the inexperienced manager is trying to find excuses each week in order to justify the latest dismal result and avoid a fanbase meltdown. Liam, your excuses are getting worse so might be best to keep schtum.

Unfortunately I think @Son of Fred is not far off the mark when he/she says Manning might well be history before 2024 is out. If that is the case I do feel a bit of sympathy for Liam Manning as he was handed a "grenade in a locked telephone box" to manage by Jon and SID. Tinnion has got to go..............and as soon as possible too.

[W-S-M Seagull]

2 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

Sorry Seagull, I can't be as reasonable towards Sid as you. I don't give a shit what he did for us in the Third Division and the odd Championship relegation season. The club want me to part with nigh on a grand for season tickets next season, which I will unless we totally bomb this season, barely get another point and the unthinkable happens, and yet the hierarchy have shown a complete disregard and utter contempt for fans. We have a Technical Director who has no tangible qualifications that make it a compelling argument for a Championship club to employ him in that role and his inexperience is coming back to bite us on the arse quite honestly. The only people that hurts is THE PAYING FANS (or customers, whatever the latest BS terminology is).

Sid is an integral cog in a decision making engine that deemed Nigel Pearson was not delivering clubs aims (that part is fair whether you agree with it or not, it's their opinion, their decision and SHOULD, but won't be, their cock on the block) and yet have managed to replace him with a manager who is inexperienced, wet behind the ears tactically at the level and is currently delivering WORSE than the bloke they canned. The football is just as uninspiring eight games out of ten and a current form return of nine points in ten games is absolute litter and unacceptable .  Due to Sid and Jon's rhetoric around Manning's appointment the inexperienced manager is trying to find excuses each week in order to justify the latest dismal result and avoid a fanbase meltdown. Liam, your excuses are getting worse so might be best to keep schtum.

Unfortunately I think @Son of Fred is not far off the mark when he/she says Manning might well be history before 2024 is out. If that is the case I do feel a bit of sympathy for Liam Manning as he was handed a "grenade in a locked telephone box" to manage by Jon and SID. Tinnion has got to go..............and as soon as possible too.

I absolutely totally agree with you. 

And your post is absolutely brilliant but a very depressing read because you've hit the nail on the head with every single point. 

Tins is well out of his depth. The fact that Jon said he's being primed for the CEO role just makes me want to puke up. 

The point I was trying to make is that BT does have some good qualities in youth development/scouting. But he certainly does not have the qualities important the role he has been placed in. 

Him Jon and Manning all need to go and we need to bring in proper football people.

What's the one thing Jon, BT and Manning all have in common? They have all fluked their way into these positions without any merit. 

[Davefevs]

Part of the problem for me is that the club do not appear to have put key parts of the structure in place:

- football strategy

- football management

We’ve got people in the structure trying to cover role titles, but not job description / responsibilities.

[Sheltons Army]

3 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Part of the problem for me is that the club do not appear to have put key parts of the structure in place:

- football strategy

- football management

We’ve got people in the structure trying to cover role titles, but not job description / responsibilities.

When BT made repeated noises about a playing philosophy and they type of profile players we were going to be recruiting from now on , I actually thought it was one of the best and most promising sound bites to come out from the Club in years (I know you’ve posted and explained before that this philosophy was drawn up by RG & NP) 

Its what any Club should do and what we needed to do for decades - great

 

Then we appoint Liam and it is abundantly clear that he is nothing about ‘front football’ and his philosophies and ideal player profile , don’t well fit with the one we had finally established and were following and recruiting too

Mind Boggling 

[RedM]

10 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Part of the problem for me is that the club do not appear to have put key parts of the structure in place:

- football strategy

- football management

We’ve got people in the structure trying to cover role titles, but not job description / responsibilities.

There is a lot of 'jobs for mates' throughout the whole lot. Bristol Sport, the football, the rugby, the foundation, community trust, stewards, in fact every department. Not necessarily the right people with the right experience but who knows who. There are some 'outsiders' who try to do a good job but they really are swimming against the tide.

I was in a situation where I was able to have a long chat with Tinnion when he was manager. He was a hero of mine having been at Liverpool and witnessed THAT moment. But after my chat with him he gave me the impression he was a bit dim, or to be even blunter a bit thick. But hell what do I know, seems he is cleverer than I thought getting in with the right people and working his way right up.

[Numero Uno]

6 minutes ago, Sheltons Army said:

When BT made repeated noises about a playing philosophy and they type of profile players we were going to be recruiting from now on , I actually thought it was one of the best and most promising sound bites to come out from the Club in years (I know you’ve posted and explained before that this philosophy was drawn up by RG & NP) 

Its what any Club should do and what we needed to do for decades - great

 

Then we appoint Liam and it is abundantly clear that he is nothing about ‘front football’ and his philosophies and ideal player profile , don’t well fit with the one we had finally established and were following and recruiting too

Mind Boggling 

Sound bites are the only thing Jon and Sid can deliver. Literally the only thing.

[Galley is our king]

37 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

Sound bites are the only thing Jon and Sid can deliver. Literally the only thing.

Lying sound bites at that....

[Red-Robbo]

48 minutes ago, RedM said:

There is a lot of 'jobs for mates' throughout the whole lot. Bristol Sport, the football, the rugby, the foundation, community trust, stewards, in fact every department. Not necessarily the right people with the right experience but who knows who. There are some 'outsiders' who try to do a good job but they really are swimming against the tide.

I was in a situation where I was able to have a long chat with Tinnion when he was manager. He was a hero of mine having been at Liverpool and witnessed THAT moment. But after my chat with him he gave me the impression he was a bit dim, or to be even blunter a bit thick. But hell what do I know, seems he is cleverer than I thought getting in with the right people and working his way right up.

 

TBH it's like that at the vast majority of league clubs. That said, it becomes a big problem when you get the wrong person doing the wrong job.

For example, when you have a largely absent chairman, who, although a fan of the club, isn't very good at decision making and allows personality likes and dislikes to cloud his judgement. Especially if he has only one nodding dog as a fellow director.

Or, if you appointed a bloke who was an abject failure as a manager - albeit he enjoyed some success afterwards as a youth coach - as an unofficial "director of football" and chief recruitment advisor.

[Shauntaylor85]

3 hours ago, P'head Red said:

I've been a long term supporter of what Steve has done for this club, but it's these recent months which has changed my stance, and probably for good. There's no doubt the man has done fantastic things for our club off the field, but he hasn't got a clue on how to create a winning ethos. Results on the field are the most important, and his history of decision making hasn't been good enough. For the first time I'm actually looking forward to the day we get sold, it's time to roll the dice. 

But who is going to come in? Clearly nobody is interested or it is being made difficult. Hopefully a reform of parachute money happens to assist FFP competition. 

[cidercity1987]

The funniest thing about the incompetence at the top is:

(And I will set aside the pure nastiness of not trying to replace Scott in any way and the other nonsense from them)

At the time of Pearsons sacking I would say 70% of fans wanted him to get a new contract as they could see the progress being made, albeit at a slower than hoped for rate.

25% would have wanted to wait till the end of the season.

5% and no more than 5% if even that would have wanted him sacked at the time he was

ALL THEY HAD TO DO WAS NOTHING. Ride out the new contract speculation, see how the season pans out. We are either challenging for the play offs right about now and happy days. OR we aren't, we are where we are now, and any decision to sack is probably rightfully made due to no progress. New man has 10 games to get his feet under the table ahead of next season. Fanbase more on board with any sacking decision.

 

They just could not bear the thought of Pearson doing well. ONLY possible reason for their actions.

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, RedM said:

There is a lot of 'jobs for mates' throughout the whole lot. Bristol Sport, the football, the rugby, the foundation, community trust, stewards, in fact every department. Not necessarily the right people with the right experience but who knows who. There are some 'outsiders' who try to do a good job but they really are swimming against the tide.

I was in a situation where I was able to have a long chat with Tinnion when he was manager. He was a hero of mine having been at Liverpool and witnessed THAT moment. But after my chat with him he gave me the impression he was a bit dim, or to be even blunter a bit thick. But hell what do I know, seems he is cleverer than I thought getting in with the right people and working his way right up.

Para 1 - yep, it’s what I’ve heard from a couple of people working there.  And also a lot of people pushing themselves forward, or their bosses pushing them forward to make themselves look better, ie if their junior is getting promoted, it reflects well on them.

Para 2 - I’ve never spoken to Tins.  He strikes me as enthusiastic, bullish…but a bit misguided.  I think in an Academy role you want to be bullish about your young-uns, but he’s in a different role now.

[RedM]

1 minute ago, Davefevs said:

Para 1 - yep, it’s what I’ve heard from a couple of people working there.  And also a lot of people pushing themselves forward, or their bosses pushing them forward to make themselves look better, ie if their junior is getting promoted, it reflects well on them.

Para 2 - I’ve never spoken to Tins.  He strikes me as enthusiastic, bullish…but a bit misguided.  I think in an Academy role you want to be bullish about your young-uns, but he’s in a different role now.

Obviously it was quite a while ago now when he was manager. He seemed quite easy to get info from, he enjoyed sharing stuff, I don't think that's changed.

[RedM]

26 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

TBH it's like that at the vast majority of league clubs. That said, it becomes a big problem when you get the wrong person doing the wrong job.

For example, when you have a largely absent chairman, who, although a fan of the club, isn't very good at decision making and allows personality likes and dislikes to cloud his judgement. Especially if he has only one nodding dog as a fellow director.

Or, if you appointed a bloke who was an abject failure as a manager - albeit he enjoyed some success afterwards as a youth coach - as an unofficial "director of football" and chief recruitment advisor.

I agree. Obviously in most things it's either who you trust or who you can manipulate. It's telling though how some 'outsiders' quickly depart.

[lenred]

31 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

TBH it's like that at the vast majority of league clubs.

Is it? 

[Red-Robbo]

1 minute ago, lenred said:

Is it? 

Yes. Many owners have their relatives on the board, sometimes as chairmen. Ex-players often return to clubs in all sorts of roles. Minor admin and stewarding roles are often filled by relatives of those already employed by the club.

Not suggesting it's a great model, but it's widespread. 

[Sir Geoff]

26 minutes ago, cidercity1987 said:

The funniest thing about the incompetence at the top is:

(And I will set aside the pure nastiness of not trying to replace Scott in any way and the other nonsense from them)

At the time of Pearsons sacking I would say 70% of fans wanted him to get a new contract as they could see the progress being made, albeit at a slower than hoped for rate.

25% would have wanted to wait till the end of the season.

5% and no more than 5% if even that would have wanted him sacked at the time he was

ALL THEY HAD TO DO WAS NOTHING. Ride out the new contract speculation, see how the season pans out. We are either challenging for the play offs right about now and happy days. OR we aren't, we are where we are now, and any decision to sack is probably rightfully made due to no progress. New man has 10 games to get his feet under the table ahead of next season. Fanbase more on board with any sacking decision.

 

They just could not bear the thought of Pearson doing well. ONLY possible reason for their actions.

Absolutely this. The timing was extraordinary. I honestly think they had totally mis read the fan base and thought it would be a popular decision.

[lenred]

2 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

Yes. Many owners have their relatives on the board, sometimes as chairmen. Ex-players often return to clubs in all sorts of roles. Minor admin and stewarding roles are often filled by relatives of those already employed by the club.

Not suggesting it's a great model, but it's widespread. 

With respect, Admin, stewarding etc aren’t really relevant to how I read your point.
 

I can’t think of any successful clubs that have an ex ‘legend’ and failed manager as their DOF? 

[1960maaan]

1 hour ago, RedM said:

I was in a situation where I was able to have a long chat with Tinnion when he was manager. He was a hero of mine having been at Liverpool and witnessed THAT moment. But after my chat with him he gave me the impression he was a bit dim, or to be even blunter a bit thick. But hell what do I know, seems he is cleverer than I thought getting in with the right people and working his way right up.

I have never spoken to him , but I have had chats with a couple of players around the end of his playing time here. They were not complimentary about him , not saying he was dim, but the word was he was quite conniving . Going behind peoples backs and trying to get jobs. Stating loyalty while applying for things elsewhere . 
THF this is no more than office gossip from employees , well, bar room after golf but it's the same thing. I don't think there was much love from a lot of the players , he was a work colleague no more , and it didn't seem he was well like by some. Though I think it was a poisoned chalice getting the Managers job, promoted above his ability level, quite like now I'd say.

 

[cidercity1987]

KNOCK KNOCK

Is there anyone out there (except the Lansdown's and Mr Gay) who want Tinnion in??

[Red-Robbo]

3 minutes ago, lenred said:

With respect, Admin, stewarding etc aren’t really relevant to how I read your point.
 

I can’t think of any successful clubs that have an ex ‘legend’ and failed manager as their DOF? 

 

Well, what makes it worse in Tinnion's case is he isn't officially DOF. He's just a sort of eminence grise who we've gleaned is fulfilling that role. A bit like a consigliere in a Mafia family!  

To make matters worse, we haven't got a defined CEO either.  

I'm sure if I looked hard enough though I'd find some other ex-players not to mention failed managers (most managers fail somewhere) acting as DOF.  In fact, aren't the 15ers appointing their retiring 36-year-old defender as just such?  (OK, I know, you said 'successful clubs')

[petehinton]

1 hour ago, Davefevs said:

Part of the problem for me is that the club do not appear to have put key parts of the structure in place:

- football strategy

- football management

We’ve got people in the structure trying to cover role titles, but not job description / responsibilities.

It amazes me that people think we ‘covered that’ by Tinnion becoming Tech Director. One person. Doing/overseeing the lot. 
 

They seemingly miss out that we lost Gould, and now apparently a football club of this size doesn’t need a CEO because we have a technical Director. 
 

It’s borderline mental. 

[spudski]

Just now, petehinton said:

It amazes me that people think we ‘covered that’ by Tinnion becoming Tech Director. One person. Doing/overseeing the lot. 
 

They seemingly miss out that we lost Gould, and now apparently a football club of this size doesn’t need a CEO because we have a technical Director. 
 

It’s borderline mental. 

Totally agree.

Tins should be Academy director only imo.

 

[BarnzFM]

4 minutes ago, spudski said:

Totally agree.

Tins should be Academy director only imo.

 

It’s all the talk of what is wrong at Man United at the moment and what they are now working so furiously to fix, they don’t have the right people in the back office positions for a football club to work correctly, and neither do we. 

[lenred]

2 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

Well, what makes it worse in Tinnion's case is he isn't officially DOF. He's just a sort of eminence grise who we've gleaned is fulfilling that role. A bit like a consigliere in a Mafia family!  

To make matters worse, we haven't got a defined CEO either.  

I'm sure if I looked hard enough though I'd find some other ex-players not to mention failed managers (most managers fail somewhere) acting as DOF.  In fact, aren't the 15ers appointing their retiring 36-year-old defender as just such?  (OK, I know, you said 'successful clubs')

Yeah - key word was successful .  Something I just don’t ever see us becoming under this regime unfortunately,  they don’t have the self awareness, the ability to admit mistakes or the footballing intellect (or any intellect in the case of BT and JL) for it to happen under their watch. 

[1960maaan]

4 minutes ago, Sir Geoff said:

Absolutely this. The timing was extraordinary. I honestly think they had totally mis read the fan base and thought it would be a popular decision.

In my opinion they saw an opportunity approaching . When we had just had defeats during the peak of our injury crisis , there was talk of several players coming back all within a week or so of each other. Just my view but , they wanted Pearson gone and it looked the ideal time . New man in , with a nearly fit squad and a run of winnable games coming up ( I think it was Weds (H) & a hopeless QPR (A) )
Fit players+Easy games= Good start for "our man" QED !
As it worked out I think he was appointed after SW and his first game at QPR Cifuentes had just taken over and that was the worst game of Football I've seen for a while.

For those that love a conspiracy theory . It did seem like they didn't want Pearson in charge as players came back , may be they didn't want to take the risk of him having a good run and so make it harder to not renew his contract. 
 

[Red-Robbo]

6 minutes ago, lenred said:

Yeah - key word was successful .  Something I just don’t ever see us becoming under this regime unfortunately,  they don’t have the self awareness, the ability to admit mistakes or the footballing intellect (or any intellect in the case of BT and JL) for it to happen under their watch. 

If you remember Brian's disastrous reign as manager, I felt one of his major failings was being too loyal to his old mates he'd played with and too unwilling to try new people, new ideas out. 

Ironic then that his over-promotion to have some sort of shadowy dominance above the chief coach's head then is the result of the Lansdown family also adopting a jobs-for-the-boys approach. 

[Davefevs]

9 minutes ago, 1960maaan said:

In my opinion they saw an opportunity approaching . When we had just had defeats during the peak of our injury crisis , there was talk of several players coming back all within a week or so of each other. Just my view but , they wanted Pearson gone and it looked the ideal time . New man in , with a nearly fit squad and a run of winnable games coming up ( I think it was Weds (H) & a hopeless QPR (A) )
Fit players+Easy games= Good start for "our man" QED !
As it worked out I think he was appointed after SW and his first game at QPR Cifuentes had just taken over and that was the worst game of Football I've seen for a while.

For those that love a conspiracy theory . It did seem like they didn't want Pearson in charge as players came back , may be they didn't want to take the risk of him having a good run and so make it harder to not renew his contract. 
 

They wanted Nige to resign after the Leeds game.

Can you remember the rumours of the emergency board meeting on that Sunday?

In fairness, Nige even admitted he’d had a chat with Tom and one other (was it JL, BT or GM?). so the board meeting wasn’t a board meeting but it was a meeting, which at least gives some credibility to both sides of that rumour.

[1960maaan]

2 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

They wanted Nige to resign after the Leeds game.

Can you remember the rumours of the emergency board meeting on that Sunday?

In fairness, Nige even admitted he’d had a chat with Tom and one other (was it JL, BT or GM?). so the board meeting wasn’t a board meeting but it was a meeting, which at least gives some credibility to both sides of that rumour.

I'd forgotten that .
I would love to know the real reasons why they wanted him out , I wonder if Nige will be doing a book , there would be plenty of stories for a couple of them.

[Davefevs]

3 minutes ago, 1960maaan said:

I'd forgotten that .
I would love to know the real reasons why they wanted him out , I wonder if Nige will be doing a book , there would be plenty of stories for a couple of them.

Combo of outspokenness against the summer window and his contract situation.  There were better ways to handle it.