New England Kit

[SecretSam]

2 hours ago, phantom said:

I'm sure this would help speed up the peace process

 

I thought the admin role involved moderation and keeping things civil? Not spreading hate

Edited March 22 by SecretSam

[ChippenhamRed]

1 minute ago, spudski said:

Perhaps the England flag means nothing to you. 

But yes really. It's our national shirt and represents us. It's our flag. 

With your mentality it gives the go ahead to interfere with flags of other nations as well. Before you know it, all flags will be changed in colours. 

It's red white and blue FFS.

And you describe everything that's wrong with this country, by bringing politics into it and mentioning culture wars. 

All people should be proud of the flag and it's colours. Regardless of politics and culture. 

Sadly anything like this is now seen as right wing and Tory driven. 

A ridiculous situation. 

Your statement is clearly made to provoke. 

Funnily it's Starmer asking Nike to re think. So you look a clown right now by saying it's Tory driven.

Are you saying the left aren't proud of their flag? 

 

 

Oh, so it’s only the colour that matters? Not the form? You think the stars aren’t an important part of the American flag?

I’m disappointed Starmer has said anything. He shouldn’t have risen to it. Doesn’t mean the root cause isn’t a right wing agenda.

And if you can’t see how the right wing press and Tories are driving a culture war, then I pity you. It’s literally all they have left now. I’m bringing politics into it because it’s relevant to the debate and it is the root of where this utterly mindless debate has come from.

Why “should” people be proud of a flag? Why can’t they just not care about stuff that makes no material difference to their lives?

[ChippenhamRed]

9 minutes ago, ChippenhamRed said:

Umbro England shirt, 2011.

If you weren’t bothered about that then, why are you bothered about this now? It’s because you’ve been told to by a right wing press desperate to stoke a culture war.

The whole debate is an absolute embarrassment. It’s pathetic.

Were you outraged in 2011 @spudski? If not why not? Was it because the press didn’t mention it maybe?

[Robbored]

We all know that the is the England flag. The cross that Nike have come up with is nothing like it. As a proud Englishman born and bred it’s a bloody disgrace that my flag should be disrespected in this manner in the name of ‘inclusion’……..jeez…….

If a person is born in England then they’re English no matter what your gender, sexuality or race is. That’s ‘inclusive’ enough for me.

[SecretSam]

Were you outraged in 2010?

[ChippenhamRed]

1 minute ago, Robbored said:

We all know that the is the England flag. The cross that Nike have come up with is nothing like it. As a proud Englishman born and bred it’s a bloody disgrace that my flag should be disrespected in this manner in the name of ‘inclusion’……..jeez…….

If a person is born in England then they’re English no matter what your gender, sexuality or race is. That’s ‘inclusive’ enough for me.

Nothing to do with “inclusion”. Just an artistic version to align with the design and colour palette on the shirt.

Linking it to “inclusion” is just your own projection.

[Redinthehead]

12 minutes ago, spudski said:

Perhaps the England flag means nothing to you. 

But yes really. It's our national shirt and represents us. It's our flag. 

With your mentality it gives the go ahead to interfere with flags of other nations as well. Before you know it, all flags will be changed in colours. 

 

 

No it doesn’t, 2 plus 2 does not equal 5.

[SecretSam]

19 minutes ago, spudski said:

But yes really. It's our national shirt and represents us. It's our flag. 

I don't feel my nation is represented by a piece of Chinese made cloth, designed by an American company.

I feel it is represented by the behaviours, values and actions of its people.

A tiny detail on a sport shirt I won't buy doesn't really affect my view.

Edited March 22 by SecretSam
"really", not "teally". Although oddly, that also works

[SecretSam]

6 minutes ago, Robbored said:

We all know that the is the England flag. The cross that Nike have come up with is nothing like it. As a proud Englishman born and bred it’s a bloody disgrace that my flag should be disrespected in this manner in the name of ‘inclusion’……..jeez…….

If a person is born in England then they’re English no matter what your gender, sexuality or race is. That’s ‘inclusive’ enough for me.

Don't you think those people you think are being "included" (who are they, BTW?) might also be proud to be English?

[spudski]

5 minutes ago, ChippenhamRed said:

Oh, so it’s only the colour that matters? Not the form? You think the stars aren’t an important part of the American flag?

I’m disappointed Starmer has said anything. He shouldn’t have risen to it. Doesn’t mean the root cause isn’t a right wing agenda.

And if you can’t see how the right wing press and Tories are driving a culture war, then I pity you. It’s literally all they have left now. I’m bringing politics into it because it’s relevant to the debate and it is the root of where this utterly mindless debate has come from.

Why “should” people be proud of a flag? Why can’t they just not care about stuff that makes no material difference to their lives?

 

4 minutes ago, ChippenhamRed said:

Were you outraged in 2011 @spudski? If not why not? Was it because the press didn’t mention it maybe?

If you'd read my posts you'd understand I'm not ' outraged'. 

And you've proved my point. You aren't proud of the flag and that it represents us as a nation.

What's even sadder...for every topic like this, people like you and others, get so wound up and triggered by other people who have minds of their own who express an opinion. You go out of your way to find examples and spout your hatred to anything considered nationalistic as Tory, media and culture war led. 

It's the likes of yourself that gets the most triggered. 

I dislike the Tories. It has nothing to do with politics. 

I feel sorry for people like you.

[LondonBristolian]

To be honest, I'm fed up of the usual easily-offended outrage-seekers constantly trying to find things to whinge about and spoil things for everyone else.

It's a tiny cross in a relatively hidden area the kit in a slightly different colour FFS and it's not even the first time someone's played around a bit with a national flag. (Team GB in 2012, for example). It's a minor design choice. And frankly, if someone is so insecure in their sense of national identity that a slightly different flag sends them into a panic then that says far more about them than anything else. I suspect the vast majority of us are secure enough in our sense of Englishness to not need to treat a minor change in the colour of one small cross as an issue. I feel pretty confident that - on Saturday, Tuesday and any other England game - there will be more than enough St George Crosses to compensate.

As ever, it's a tiny number of people constantly trying to undermine our sense of national cohesion and pretending they own the concept of Englishness in the way the rest of us somehow do not. I'm frankly sick of the neediness, attention-seeking and attempts to divide England as a nation. 

Edited March 22 by LondonBristolian

[Curr Avon]

11 minutes ago, SecretSam said:

Were you outraged in 2010?

Can you be outraged, retrospectively? Asking on behalf of Colin, from Portsmouth.

[SecretSam]

1 minute ago, spudski said:

You aren't proud of the flag and that it represents us as a nation.

I feel sorry for people like you.

I feel sorry for someone prepared to get that upset about a detail on a football shirt, smaller than a postage stamp.

And who thinks a symbol is what makes a nation, and gives it pride.

[Curr Avon]

13 minutes ago, Robbored said:

We all know that the is the England flag. The cross that Nike have come up with is nothing like it. As a proud Englishman born and bred it’s a bloody disgrace that my flag should be disrespected in this manner in the name of ‘inclusion’……..jeez…….

If a person is born in England then they’re English no matter what your gender, sexuality or race is. That’s ‘inclusive’ enough for me.

I agree with her.

[spudski]

46 minutes ago, SecretSam said:

I don't feel my nation is represented by a piece of Chinese made cloth, designed by an American company.

I feel it is represented by the behaviours, values and actions of its people.

A tiny detail on a sport shirt I won't buy doesn't really affect my view.

...Manning has jerked his behaviours over you as well. ' Behaviours'...behave. Talk about brainwashed.

Might as well get rid of the City badge as well then on our shirts. As it represents us. But no...you want the team represented by it's fans behaviours..

Edited March 22 by phantom
Offensive language removed

[SecretSam]

39 minutes ago, spudski said:

...Manning has jerked his behaviours over you as well. ' Behaviours'...behave. Talk about brainwashed.

Might as well get rid of the City badge as well then on our shirts. As it represents us. But no...you want the team represented by it's fans behaviours..

What a reasonable argument. True colours shown, oh the irony.

Edited March 22 by phantom
Offensive language removed

[exAtyeoMax]

1 minute ago, LondonBristolian said:

To be honest, I'm fed up of the usual easily-offended outrage-seekers constantly trying to find things to whinge about and spoil things for everyone else.

It's a tiny cross in a relatively hidden area the kit in a slightly different colour FFS and it's not even the first time someone's played around a bit with a national flag. (Team GB in 2012, for example). It's a minor design choice. And frankly, if someone is so insecure in their sense of national identity that a slightly different flag sends them into a panic then that says far more about them than anything else. I suspect the vast majority of us are secure enough in our sense of Englishness to not need to treat a minor change in the colour of one small cross as an issue. I feel pretty confident that - on Saturday, Tuesday and any other England game - there will be more than enough St George Crosses to compensate.

As ever, it's a tiny number of people constantly trying to undermine our sense of national cohesion and pretending they own the concept of Englishness in the way the rest of us somehow do not. I'm frankly sick of the neediness, attention-seeking and attempts to divide England as a nation. 

Who Nike?

The George Cross is the symbol of national cohesion. That's why people take George Cross flags to Wembley.

I'm fed up of people branding anybody who disagrees as right-wing idiots. It's so reductive. 

Probably time to move this topic to the politics forum

[Stortz]

12 minutes ago, spudski said:

Perhaps the England flag means nothing to you. 

But yes really. It's our national shirt and represents us. It's our flag. 

With your mentality it gives the go ahead to interfere with flags of other nations as well. Before you know it, all flags will be changed in colours. 

It's red white and blue FFS.

And you describe everything that's wrong with this country, by bringing politics into it and mentioning culture wars. 

All people should be proud of the flag and it's colours. Regardless of politics and culture. 

Sadly anything like this is now seen as right wing and Tory driven. 

A ridiculous situation. 

Your statement is clearly made to provoke. 

Funnily it's Starmer asking Nike to re think. So you look a clown right now by saying it's Tory driven.

Are you saying the left aren't proud of their flag? 

 

 

Starmer embarrassing himself by even responding to it doesn't mean it isn't driven by the usual suspects.

Certain sections of the media have been desperate for a way to tear Southgate and the side down since the Dear England letter, and they've finally found something.

[Fordy62]

Forget the whole flag outrage. 

That purple kit is the most beautiful England football kit I think I’ve ever seen.  Part of me wants to buy one. Then I remember the price and the fact that I’m 43. But it very nearly had me. 

[Davefevs]

Just now, Fordy62 said:

Forget the whole flag outrage. 

That purple kit is the most beautiful England football kit I think I’ve ever seen.  Part of me wants to buy one. Then I remember the price and the fact that I’m 43. But it very nearly had me. 

Sell your car to pay for it!

(nice motor btw)

[SecretSam]

2 minutes ago, exAtyeoMax said:

I'm fed up of people branding anybody who disagrees as right-wing idiots. It's so reductive. 

And where did I use the term "right-wing idiots"?

[Curr Avon]

2 minutes ago, Fordy62 said:

Forget the whole flag outrage. 

That purple kit is the most beautiful England football kit I think I’ve ever seen.  Part of me wants to buy one. Then I remember the price and the fact that I’m 43. But it very nearly had me. 

Deep Purple, Fordy. Any other explanation is just smoke (on the water) and mirrors.

[spudski]

38 minutes ago, SecretSam said:

What a reasonable argument. True colours shown, oh the irony.

Mate...you are fully triggered. How many posts on the subject. ...did someone shit on your falafel this morning. Kinnel...reminds me of a screaming unicorn... It's all the Tories fault..it's the media...the culture wars. 

Edited March 22 by phantom
Offensive language removed

[exAtyeoMax]

Just now, SecretSam said:

And where did I use the term "right-wing idiots"?

Was I directly quoting you? No.

[SecretSam]

33 minutes ago, spudski said:

Mate...you are fully triggered. How many posts on the subject. ...did someone shit on your falafel this morning. Kinnel...reminds me of a screaming unicorn... It's all the Tories fault..it's the media...the culture wars. 

Maybe take a moment.

[spudski]

Just now, SecretSam said:

Maybe take a moment.

He's still going ...

[SecretSam]

2 minutes ago, exAtyeoMax said:

Was I directly quoting you? No.

Fair comment. I'm so easily offended

[Stortz]

4 minutes ago, spudski said:

Mate...you are fully triggered. How many posts on the subject. **** me...did someone shit on your falafel this morning. Kinnel...reminds me of a screaming unicorn... It's all the Tories fault..it's the media...the culture wars. **** off you absolute melt. 

There's only one person on this thread coming across as even slightly 'triggered' at the moment I'm afraid.

p.s, falafels are lovely.

Edited March 22 by Stortz

[LondonBristolian]

9 minutes ago, exAtyeoMax said:

Who Nike?

The George Cross is the symbol of national cohesion. That's why people take George Cross flags to Wembley.

I'm fed up of people branding anybody who disagrees as right-wing idiots. It's so reductive. 

Probably time to move this topic to the politics forum

The George Cross hasn't suddenly ceased to exist though. It's not banned, it's not no longer going to be displayed in any way at other matches or anything else. And it's not as if literally every England kit ever has prominently featured a George Cross and this one does not. The sudden existence of a cross in a new colour doesn't suddenly invalidate very George Cross in existence. And people will still take it to Wembley.

As you'll see from my post, I've not branded anyone a right wing idiot so that's a little bit of an odd projection on your part.

What I would say is that England is a nation of 55 million and I object to a tiny minority of those people claiming they are somehow the authority of what is or is not "English" and that their sense of what it means to be English is somehow more valid or relevant than anyone else's.

If someone doesn't like the new kit, that's fine. If someone demands the kit be redesigned because they don't like it, that's a rather entitled view to take. 

Edited March 22 by LondonBristolian

[SecretSam]

1 minute ago, Stortz said:

 

p.s, falafels are lovely.

Yeah, but not for breakfast. That's so offensive. You're literally forcing me to eat them.